Canucks News N Notes 24-25

[Cousin Strawberry]

We had a great season last year but until we string together several of those together it is just one more blimp on the radar. I have high hopes. But with a fragile starter and major changes the backend, we will see. If the new forwards gel and give us 4 good lines to roll, if our goaltending can hold up, if our D doesn't take a massive backwards step, we will see.

One thing we've gained is speed on the wings which has been holding them back from burying teams like the coilers when we have them by the throat.

Losing Lindholm was fine but not resigning Zadorov was not. He seemed like a good fit but I concede I have no clue if maybe that flamboyant loud personality was not accepted by the timid younguns we are building around.

These kids need to step up their intensity when the games matter (Pettersson obviously but also Hughes).

[Blob Mckenzie]

The BlobMeds Elmer Hate Club is still a thing after all these years, who woulda thunk it...

The mere measure of the previous administration triggers pages of mindless vitriol. It is hilarious.

The funniest part is the way Blob keeps swearing he won't let it happen again!

I just enjoy Doc defending his favorite hillbilly manager.

[Todd Bersnoozi]

Losing Lindholm was fine but not resigning Zadorov was not.

I really liked big Zaddy as well, but would u guys have given him $5M X 6? I think I would do 4 yrs, maybe 5, but I think mgmt made the right call to walk from that. That being said, I like what Zaddy brings to team more than Hronek and we gave him more $$$ and term. I guess he plays that coveted RS D and he's a bit younger, so mgmt thought he was more vital to the team.

[Hockey Widow]

I would have been tempted to give him that extra year. He brings an element we will miss. But word out there was that it wasn't about term. Something about not being happy with the way certain players were treated. Like fellow Russians. As well he was a big Lindholm fan andethought the Canucks could have tried harder to get him signed.

I guess we hope one of the kids steps up in the next 3 years to add that nasty streak on the backend. I like how the D contracts are staggered now. In two years we lose Soucy, three Myers and the new guys, one is here for 1 year and the other 2 years. So we have room every year to worry about additions.

[CrzyCanuck]

Him saying how he spoke with Boeser last offseason about not doing the DaBeauty league but actually working on his game in summer like the real stars of the game do. It seems like him coming in is what really taught our players how to be pros.

Many here had been saying that Da Beauty league was the stupidest thing for a pro player to do.

And Brock didn't seem to know how to train properly in offseasons too. Recall how he reported to camp "stronger, bulkier" but in reality just fatter and slower.

How many players actually had proper offseason trainings prior to Tocchet's arrival?

Management and Bo certainly weren't doing a good job leading the team, hence that "country club atmosphere" rumour.

[Meds]

Expecting fans to be patient for a rebuild is like expecting to keep a New Years resolution, its not a matter of will you break it, its just a matter of when you open the container of ice cream....

Complaining about contracts given out during lottery pick years misses the debate which is how valuable to a bottom feeder team are older, character type players?

If you feel that they have value, then sign them for more $ and more term than you would like to because how else do you persuade a veteran to sign on a bad team?

No need to argue amongst ourselves, argue with GM's who have publicly come out against rebuilds...

Take care....

Yes scrubs like Loui Ericksson, Brandon Sutter, Antoine Roussel and Jay Beagle were so valuable to the club.

You should take that on as a project Blob....

Do those type of players add value to the team beyond what they do on the ice? Given that regardless of how they perfomed on the ice the team was still going to suck, is the off ice value more important to the long term development of the organization than on ice performance is?

And like any good project you need to expand the scope so you can look at any team in a situation similar to where the Canucks were when they signed or traded for those players to find similar signings and trades...

Why is every team falling into your trap and signing and trading for washed up players and paying them too much money for too long a time?

Or are you saying that its a Canuck or Benning thing and the other teams are too smart to sign these type of players because beyond anything else cap space is vital?

Which means that when you have a bad team with very few really good players you should fill out the roster with JAG's or minor league quality kids?

Does that speed up the rebuilding process or give the team a better chance of re signing the few players on the team with high end upside when their contracts come due?

And why didn't quality free agent players choose to sign in Vancouver when it was obvious the team was willing to overpay?

Like I said, would make for a good investigative report...

Take care..

The only truly egregious signings were Loui Eriksson and one of Roussel or Beagle (didn't need both).

Benning's failure, and really I put it more on ownership's impatient mandate to the PoHO and GM, was that in a time when the mantra was to rebuild and restock and develop into a contender from within. The example most given at the time was the Detroit Red Wings, who had a solid decade or more of drafting well and icing a competitive team where the contributing depth was homegrown, and in some cases (Datsyuk/Zetterberg) blossoming into core skaters. To accomplish that when starting with a roster that was the Vancouver Canucks circa 2014, one needed to hold onto, and likely acquire more, draft picks in the top 3 rounds. Benning spent them erroneously.....however in an effort to execute what the Aquamen were directing (ice a playoff team) he did so by pursuing players that ultimately disappointed.

I do recall that more than a couple of us (myself included) said something to the effect of Benning's overpayment to get the player he wanted was refreshing after years of Gillis consistently not getting targeted players because "the price wasn't right" and not actually addressing a roster need.

As for quality FA's signing here (or not).....that's leaguewide, and in general those players sign where they see a chance to win in the now or near future. Nobody inside of the league was buying the line that the Canucks were about to turn the corner with a fast retool.

[rikster]

The only truly egregious signings were Loui Eriksson and one of Roussel or Beagle (didn't need both).

Benning's failure, and really I put it more on ownership's impatient mandate to the PoHO and GM, was that in a time when the mantra was to rebuild and restock and develop into a contender from within. The example most given at the time was the Detroit Red Wings, who had a solid decade or more of drafting well and icing a competitive team where the contributing depth was homegrown, and in some cases (Datsyuk/Zetterberg) blossoming into core skaters. To accomplish that when starting with a roster that was the Vancouver Canucks circa 2014, one needed to hold onto, and likely acquire more, draft picks in the top 3 rounds. Benning spent them erroneously.....however in an effort to execute what the Aquamen were directing (ice a playoff team) he did so by pursuing players that ultimately disappointed.

I do recall that more than a couple of us (myself included) said something to the effect of Benning's overpayment to get the player he wanted was refreshing after years of Gillis consistently not getting targeted players because "the price wasn't right" and not actually addressing a roster need.

As for quality FA's signing here (or not).....that's leaguewide, and in general those players sign where they see a chance to win in the now or near future. Nobody inside of the league was buying the line that the Canucks were about to turn the corner with a fast retool.

Would love to have been a fly on the wall during an ownership meeting to hear how divided or undivided the family was on the direction they wanted to take the team during those post Cup run teams...

Would also be curious to know if ownership tapped into the $1 Billion line of credit the league set up to help any franchise during the Covid years...

My guess is that things like bank account balances and p&l's had influence on many of those decisions...

Take care...

[Blob Mckenzie]

Expecting fans to be patient for a rebuild is like expecting to keep a New Years resolution, its not a matter of will you break it, its just a matter of when you open the container of ice cream....

Complaining about contracts given out during lottery pick years misses the debate which is how valuable to a bottom feeder team are older, character type players?

If you feel that they have value, then sign them for more $ and more term than you would like to because how else do you persuade a veteran to sign on a bad team?

No need to argue amongst ourselves, argue with GM's who have publicly come out against rebuilds...

Take care....

Yes scrubs like Loui Ericksson, Brandon Sutter, Antoine Roussel and Jay Beagle were so valuable to the club.

You should take that on as a project Blob....

Do those type of players add value to the team beyond what they do on the ice? Given that regardless of how they perfomed on the ice the team was still going to suck, is the off ice value more important to the long term development of the organization than on ice performance is?

And like any good project you need to expand the scope so you can look at any team in a situation similar to where the Canucks were when they signed or traded for those players to find similar signings and trades...

Why is every team falling into your trap and signing and trading for washed up players and paying them too much money for too long a time?

Or are you saying that its a Canuck or Benning thing and the other teams are too smart to sign these type of players because beyond anything else cap space is vital?

Which means that when you have a bad team with very few really good players you should fill out the roster with JAG's or minor league quality kids?

Does that speed up the rebuilding process or give the team a better chance of re signing the few players on the team with high end upside when their contracts come due?

And why didn't quality free agent players choose to sign in Vancouver when it was obvious the team was willing to overpay?

Like I said, would make for a good investigative report...

Take care..

The only truly egregious signings were Loui Eriksson and one of Roussel or Beagle (didn't need both).

Benning's failure, and really I put it more on ownership's impatient mandate to the PoHO and GM, was that in a time when the mantra was to rebuild and restock and develop into a contender from within. The example most given at the time was the Detroit Red Wings, who had a solid decade or more of drafting well and icing a competitive team where the contributing depth was homegrown, and in some cases (Datsyuk/Zetterberg) blossoming into core skaters. To accomplish that when starting with a roster that was the Vancouver Canucks circa 2014, one needed to hold onto, and likely acquire more, draft picks in the top 3 rounds. Benning spent them erroneously.....however in an effort to execute what the Aquamen were directing (ice a playoff team) he did so by pursuing players that ultimately disappointed.

I do recall that more than a couple of us (myself included) said something to the effect of Benning's overpayment to get the player he wanted was refreshing after years of Gillis consistently not getting targeted players because "the price wasn't right" and not actually addressing a roster need.

As for quality FA's signing here (or not).....that's leaguewide, and in general those players sign where they see a chance to win in the now or near future. Nobody inside of the league was buying the line that the Canucks were about to turn the corner with a fast retool.

I just took issue and always will, with the statement the fans were impatient and couldn't handle a rebuild. That's a cop out on the part of the owners, the management and fans that tend to believe both can walk on water.

We will know the answer if the current build/rebuild is a sustainable long term entity soon enough. Sorry if wasn't clear, but I did point out several teams that had long term sustainable success and they won cups and had finals appearances and generally gave their fans hope over a long period of time. I'm not sure we have that infrastructure in place.

Demko- 2 years left and usually hurt a good chunk of the year
Huggy- 3 years left- will command a Leon type deal
Hronek- locked up
Peter- locked up
Millsy- locked up
Debrusk- locked up


Is this good enough? It's pretty good but if the goalie gets hurt or a Smurf, we are hooped.

[Meds]

I just took issue and always will, with the statement the fans were impatient and couldn't handle a rebuild. That's a cop out on the part of the owners, the management and fans that tend to believe both can walk on water.

I didn't think ownership or management said that. I thought it was just something Doc and his fellow Benning defenders said to set you off.

We will know the answer if the current build/rebuild is a sustainable long term entity soon enough. Sorry if wasn't clear, but I did point out several teams that had long term sustainable success and they won cups and had finals appearances and generally gave their fans hope over a long period of time. I'm not sure we have that infrastructure in place.

Demko- 2 years left and usually hurt a good chunk of the year
Huggy- 3 years left- will command a Leon type deal
Hronek- locked up
Peter- locked up
Millsy- locked up
Debrusk- locked up


Is this good enough? It's pretty good but if the goalie gets hurt or a Smurf, we are hooped.

It's not good enough.

The oft injured Demko is the wrong age for the next half of the proposed window. You can't be extending him at 30 going 31 to a massive long term deal, and frankly I think we will get outbid in the free agency market because 8 years is out of the question and that extra year option is the real bargaining advantage that a team holds versus other organizations when it comes to pending UFA's. Silovs might be a successor.

Debrusk is a 2nd line winger.....I like the signing, but I'm indifferent on his long term presence here. I feel like we have a similar, and more talented, player in Boeser.

Miller will likely start to slow down a bit at the same time as we need to move on from Demko. I see him as the core leader in the forward group and nobody that looks like an in-house replacement in that area.

I don't think Pettersson has the leadership qualities to rally a group of lemmings to follow him over a cliff.

Hughes is a beauty, I do wonder if his next contract will be elsewhere though based upon his age and where the team will be in 3 years based on the above.

Hronek is a nice secondary piece on the blueline.

The overall spread of ages in our key group is a reason why we have argued that you need to horde draft picks in a rebuild.

[Strangelove]

I just took issue and always will, with the statement the fans were impatient and couldn't handle a rebuild. That's a cop out on the part of the owners, the management and fans that tend to believe both can walk on water.

I didn't think ownership or management said that. I thought it was just something Doc and his fellow Benning defenders said to set you off.

[Topper]

At the time, the Eriksson signing was not awful. Proven track record with the Sedins, decent scorer. Decent PK

No one saw that his play would suddenly fall of a cliff.

The criticism is based on hindsight.

[Blob Mckenzie]

I just took issue and always will, with the statement the fans were impatient and couldn't handle a rebuild. That's a cop out on the part of the owners, the management and fans that tend to believe both can walk on water.

I didn't think ownership or management said that. I thought it was just something Doc and his fellow Benning defenders said to set you off.

Ownership most definitely said it.

Yes Doc said it so often he believed it. He still does. Linden and Aquillini said it too and so did Benning. Hell so did I Mac, and a few other hand puppets like Kuzma etc.

We've beaten this to death.

I think the current core is good but they will need some big breaks to rip off a cup or two.

[BoS]

At the time, the Eriksson signing was not awful. Proven track record with the Sedins, decent scorer. Decent PK

No one saw that his play would suddenly fall of a cliff.

The criticism is based on hindsight.

I liked the Eriksson signing. I liked bringing in Gudbranson, the Sutter acquisition, and even applauded the Beartschi, Vey and Prust deals. The former two were proactive moves due to the lack of young talent in the pipeline.

The common denominator in these deals, like a vast majority of Benning’s acquisitions, was that they flat out bombed. The fact they were all brought in while over paying was just added salt in the wound.

It really was uncanny just how many players Benning acquired failed to contribute.

[Cousin Strawberry]

It really was uncanny just how many players Benning acquired failed to contribute.

I figure it has more to do with what was perceived to be this country club atmosphere and lack of structure to prepare in the offseasons and horrible coaching like twitchy and Green with the inexplicable retention of Jason King through multiple different coaching changes.

How did that guy stick around anyways????

Rutherford coming aboard has brought professionalism and elite preparation procedures to the fore and I think this has been a major factor (also getting the Aquasbros out of operations)

Enjoy my baked run on sentence

[Cornuck]

I figure it has more to do with what was perceived to be this country club atmosphere and lack of structure to prepare in the offseasons and horrible coaching like twitchy and Green with the inexplicable retention of Jason King through multiple different coaching changes.

I have to agree. I can't imagine that last year would have happened with any of the recent pre-Tocchet coaches we saw. As much as we all like Bruce, he wasn't going to get it done either.

WIth an actual system in place, we can bring in players and give them a role. Not just bring them in because they fit a certain age profile.