Re-booted SKYO approved pipe dreams and trade ideas

[Cousin Strawberry]

Dahlin might not be so untouchable. He's a stud but a desperate GM and franchise may want to go in another direction.

If I'm a GM looking at trading my #1 centre who has intermittently shown the magic, I'm looking at RD or none of the above and just fucking keeping him.

They're the losers grasping at straws, not us

[Raile]

who is going to play center in all this madness? play it well enough to win the cup, because that's why we're here of course.

I havn't seen one trade that didn't make me smell a rebuild around the corner (more likely spinning our wheels in the middle of the league with a bottom half of the league center depth).

I guess this is Skyo's pipe dreams and all that..

[donlever]

I didn't bring him up.

But....

Dylan Cozens plays centre.

[Carl Yagro]

True, you do need top offensive centers to play well enough to win a cup. But if people hadn't noticed, one of the reasons for last year's success was 6 actual NHL caliber dmen were in the lineup on most nights... something we haven't had in over a decade.

When mgmt recently said they needed to add more players, it was obviously due to injuries and having to dress anywhere from 1 to 3 AHL dmen every single night. That is not conducive to winning as they were barely in the wild card race after Saturday's game.

How do you add more quality NHL players? Well other than shipping off a bunch of picks and prospects which is already lacking in the system, one could cut some top end money and replace it with some more depth. That's one possibility that should be explored if this group wants to get back into the thick of the race.

Look (to paraphrase Friedman), maybe you never "win" a trade like this when you ship off the "better" player, but maybe you consistently "win" more regular and postseason games. Anyway, you know Raisin always plots these things early and is never afraid to pull the strings to target who he wants. That's both his strength and weakness.

[Raile]

True, you do need top offensive centers to play well enough to win a cup. But if people hadn't noticed, one of the reasons for last year's success was 6 actual NHL caliber dmen were in the lineup on most nights... something we haven't had in over a decade.

When mgmt recently said they needed to add more players, it was obviously due to injuries and having to dress anywhere from 1 to 3 AHL dmen every single night. That is not conducive to winning as they were barely in the wild card race after Saturday's game.

How do you add more quality NHL players? Well other than shipping off a bunch of picks and prospects which is already lacking in the system, one could cut some top end money and replace it with some more depth. That's one possibility that should be explored if this group wants to get back into the thick of the race.

Look (to paraphrase Friedman), maybe you never "win" a trade like this when you ship off the "better" player, but maybe you consistently "win" more regular and postseason games. Anyway, you know Raisin always plots these things early and is never afraid to pull the strings to target who he wants. That's both his strength and weakness.

Top end talent, in this case a 1C, is simply not available to trade for, or UFA sign. Eichel being a rare exception recently, but he came with a back issue that was a big gamble. If a UFA 1C even did luckily become available AND wanted to sign with us, they'd likely come in north of 11.6 and be Miller+ in age.
Depth players, while I'm not saying will be cheap, are available at times. Both Zadorov and Hronek came to us this way. There will be more out there.

I'm pretty surprised everyone is so willing to trade for a few middling-to-good players for a (potentially) game breaking talent that you'll never find on the market. We're talking about downgrading ourselves at C to also get a 3D, or maybe we trade for a 1D, which we don't even need.

Unless Petey has quit on the team, and we're in a "get the best you can for him", then I don't see how this improves the balance of the team.

[Raile]

2024 - Barkov
2023 - Eichel
2022 - Mackinnon
2021 - Point
2020 - Point
2019 - Schenn/O'Reilly
2018 - Kuznetsov
2017 - Crosby
2016 - Crosby

There's a dozen more centers in the league too who havn't even won a cup yet who'd be light years beyond what we have. All of them miles beyond what we'd be rolling out.

[rikster]

Dahlin is a big, solid, skilled, first overall pick who is a first pairing D man, a Captain and their leader.

That package is not happening theman.

You're dreaming.

Sorry.

People in the league see EP's performance issues better than we do (the critiquers (aic) that is.

Not sure about that Don, Tage Thompson and EP would be a pretty potent 1,2 down the middle and they would still have Power, Samulesen and Byram on the back end plus Willander...

And if you look at Dahlins stats, they don't scream an $11 million dollar player ...

On the deal presented, I see it as giving up too much from the Canucks side and between Dahlin and Cozens they take on almost $18 million in cap hit...

The picks and blue chip prospect are nice, but not of much value today given that the Canucks are entering their competitive window...

As I said earlier, if EP is going to Buffalo I'd want Tage Thompson coming to Vancouver because come playoffs I prefer his size and grit over Pettersson...

Not sure why the Sabres would do the deal, and I also wonder if the player the Sabres are targetting is Miller who would make better sense to me if something like Cozens and Dahlin are the return...

I see Cozens as more of a Miller type skill set than an EP so would make more sense to swap Cozens for Miller with the Sabres adding to even the deal out...

Take care...

[Chef Boi RD]

Petey played good hockey when Miller went on leave, as well did the team. I always come back to that. With Millers age, that is a few years above the core group of players, trading Miller to Buffalo is a possible scenario and exactly the punch the Sabres maybe looking for. Centre - Cozens would have to be part of the package returning along with a big add - top prospect/pick and a top pick.

You’re not getting Thompson and Dahlin in any package so stop fantasizing, no matter who of the two (Miller, Petey) we are offering. If you could get one of Huselius, Kulich or Benson added to Cozens that would huge. Also, I believe if trading one of our centres (Petey, Miller) for a D (Power) as a centre piece coming back that is not a wise move. You need a good one two punch down the middle. A centre replacement like Cozens would be where I’d start with and go from there.

Miller

for

Cozens
Benson
2025 1st pick

Then shop one of our firsts and Hoglander for D help. Benson replaces Hoglander.

[Chef Boi RD]

Once the pillowy soft and pretty arm chair fantasy clouds disappear you know damn we ain’t trading with Buffalo and it will be the standard typical rental trade we see prior to the deadline where we see the likes of Allvin pissing away more top picks and prospects for another Lindholm. It’s the Aqualini way.

[theman]

Once the pillowy soft and pretty arm chair fantasy clouds disappear you know damn we ain’t trading with Buffalo and it will be the standard typical rental trade we see prior to the deadline where we see the likes of Allvin pissing away more top picks and prospects for another Lindholm. It’s the Aqualini way.

It was Friedman who started this rumour after all.

[UWSaint]

2024 - Barkov
2023 - Eichel
2022 - Mackinnon
2021 - Point
2020 - Point
2019 - Schenn/O'Reilly
2018 - Kuznetsov
2017 - Crosby
2016 - Crosby

There's a dozen more centers in the league too who havn't even won a cup yet who'd be light years beyond what we have. All of them miles beyond what we'd be rolling out.

Those are a lot of very good players. And yet when EP40 or Miller are on their game, only Crosby circa '16-'17 and Mackinnon '22 are beyond their league -- maybe Barkov, too, though I think what separates Barkov is he is so consistently good game in and out.

[Ronning's Ghost]

where we see the likes of Allvin pissing away more top picks and prospects for another Lindholm. It’s the Aqualini way.

It's frustrating, but if you really believe that the Canucks are in a competitive window, it's pretty standard procedure.

The theory seems to be that an NHL team can only reach a championship peak by focussing their capability on a specific period of time. During a re-build, some teams sacrifice some of their present to build a better future (which it didn't seem Benning was willing to do -- yes, probably because the Little Eagles forbade it -- which is one of the things I found so frustrating), and then during a competitive window, most teams trade away some of their future to maximize their chances in the present.

If you disagree with that approach, and can think of some salary-cap era teams that won a Cup without doing that, I'd be interested to read about it.

[Chef Boi RD]

where we see the likes of Allvin pissing away more top picks and prospects for another Lindholm. It’s the Aqualini way.

It's frustrating, but if you really believe that the Canucks are in a competitive window, it's pretty standard procedure.

The theory seems to be that an NHL team can only reach a championship peak by focussing their capability on a specific period of time. During a re-build, some teams sacrifice some of their present to build a better future (which it didn't seem Benning was willing to do -- yes, probably because the Little Eagles forbade it -- which is one of the things I found so frustrating), and then during a competitive window, most teams trade away some of their future to maximize their chances in the present.

If you disagree with that approach, and can think of some salary-cap era teams that won a Cup without doing that, I'd be interested to read about it.

IMHO I don’t believe they are ready, and btw…what’s the rush? The window isn’t exactly closing, the core isn’t old and fading. The window is just opening. They need a few more horses, not exactly deep enough in a couple areas to swing for the fences. Aqualini’s managers all tend to jerk off early so I wouldn’t be surprised to see more future gutting for rentals. It’s the Aqualini way.

[Ronning's Ghost]

IMHO I don’t believe they are ready

Well, fair enough, and I'm not saying you're wrong, but it does seem that the ownership/management group thinks that they are as ready as they're going to get, and so that's going to affect their decision-making process.

and btw…what’s the rush? The window isn’t exactly closing, the core isn’t old and fading. The window is just opening.

I disagree with you there. The previous management (likely enough at the behest of ownership) accelerated the rebuild by trading a 1st round draft pick for a player who could help right away. The downside was that shortened the competitive window, as Miller has already reached the age when most forwards start to decline. There's no predicting the process, and Miller could age like Ovechkin, Selanne, or even Howe, but that's not a good bet. (I note that the ageless wonders I cited were all wingers, not centres. Don't know how relevant that might be.)

Demko was always a bit of gamble, as his physical integrity was compromised even in his draft year. He has provided stellar service (I would argue he was one of Benning's best draft picks), but the trade-off of drafting someone with known physical issues was the increased likelihood of a shorter career, and there are signs he could be getting near the end.

It takes a truly exceptional team to go all the way without top-tier goaltending (just ask the Oilers), and while the Canucks have done a good job of finding other goaltending talent capable enough to share the load, I don't think any of them have shown -- at least so far -- that he can bring what Demko brought at his best when it matters most.

It’s the Aqualini way.

And so, as I have argued in the past, Canucks fans are in only a slightly better position than Ballard-era leaves fans. I don't think they can achieve a championship until they can get an ownership group that would do better on the marshmallow test.

[UWSaint]

IMHO I don’t believe they are ready, and btw…what’s the rush? The window isn’t exactly closing, the core isn’t old and fading. The window is just opening.

There is no longer an expectation of internal improvement from the core, except maybe Hughes. They are in the peak seasons. Some seasons will be better or worse for them as individuals, but it is now. From an age perspective, Miller is past the typical peak -- though he also peaked late. 3 more years of him as a good player--where this seasons play is the floor--is all you can expect. Either Sushi becomes or pick/trade produces the next dangerous forward, or this maybe-maybe-not core becomes not so good.

There is no apparent next wave -- that's the rush. WCE transitioned to Sedins, which transitioned into a Sea of Granlunds (an attempt to extend the Sedins into their mid 30s) and transitioned into the 2013-2016 high first round picks -- but the best of that group were only good (Horvat, Boeser) and the Canucks missed on Virtanen, Juolevi, and McCann's trade return. So it transitioned to what remained of that group (the always slower to develop goalie) and one Boeser, and the 2017-19 draft classes built the one we have, with two hits (EP40 and QH43) and one miss (Podz). 2020 and 2021 picks were used to supplement that group -- one immediate hit (Miller) and one costly miss (OEL) (though also included a high quality complement in Garland).