Not so deep thoughts by donlever

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Re: Not so deep thoughts by donlever

Post by UWSaint »

donlever wrote: Sun Jun 07, 2026 8:59 am Drafting and why do we suck....I will do this in 5 year spans and see what happens so I'm not wasting my time.


1999 - 2003

Outside of Burke doing a solid job in acquiring picks for the obvious twins selection and the hit on Bieksa late.

Not.

Fucking.

Good.
A few comments....

(1) No matter how many misses there were, in this cycle the Canucks drafted 3 core players and one just on the outside (Bieksa). The first two of those guys supplemented a competitive WCE team that was a piece or two away from being a legitimate Stanley Cup contender; then all 4 were key parts of the best performing Canucks teams -- a good 5 year crest that saw a SCF and 2 President's trophies. So yeah, lots of misses, and its nice to get average and decent NHL players in the draft, but really, anything lower than "good player(!)" can be acquired without terrible fuss by a good GM, which I think the AV years prove given that the prime age for those years would have been players drafted in this window (and a couple before and after). I think this shows that hitting well is far more important that missing less. Or to analogize, low average power hitters are better than high average punching Judys when it comes to team building.

(2) 1999 and 2000 were pretty bad drafts overall. It really puts in perspective how many misses there can be in a draft.

(3) Umberger wasn't a bad pick at 16 OA. He was a decent 2d line center caliber player for 6 or 7 years. The bad part for the Canucks wasn't the draft, it was what happened after when he refused to sign. Well, if memory serves, it started as the Canucks refusing to sign him, telling him to stay in college when he felt he was ready to come out. Then it was the battle of wills, Burkie and RJ, who was thought to be full of himself (or was that Burkie trying to build a narrative for why he was right to be stubborn with the player). Then Burkie immediately signs Umberger's teammate Kesler after the draft. Kes' (pre-draft) freshman year wasn't as productive on paper as Umberger's; and Umberger was Ohio State's top scorer every year he was there (this was RJ's third year).

I think that was the straw that broke the camel's back. RJ decides to sit out his senior year -- because he wants to be a pro and has decided he's not playing for the Canucks. Under the CBA in place at the time (or NCAA/NHL agreement), teams drafting an NCAA player had a full year after they left college to sign them. RJ decided he'd rather play video games -- fair enough....

He was traded after it was known he wasn't going to sign, during his video gaming year. If memory serves, Canucks would have received a sandwich pick between the 2d and 3d if they didn't trade him and then he signed with another team, and so that was really the value of the asset from their perspective. They used him because Bertuzzi cuddled Steve Moore and for whatever reason the NHL suspended Bert and the Canucks needed a wing badly. Umberger didn't sign with the Rangers, either, and signed with the Flyers as a FA.

Fun fact, the Flyers would trade Umberger and a 4th rounder to CBJ for a first and a third, taking advantage of RJ's very good playoff run that the Flyers correctly identified would be an outlier performance. That first was Luca Sbisa, 19th overall -- who would later be part of the Kesler deal.

(4) I think of Koltsov (Canucks first pick in 2002; 49th overall) as one that got away by virtue of misfortune. He spends a year in Manitoba; doesn't play poorly, and is developing as he should be. He's probably ready the next season for call ups when there are injuries, maybe he'd even have a shot at making the team in the Nolan Baumgartner spot. But that's the lockout season. Koltsov starts in Manitoba, but as the lockout grinds on, he decides to go back to Russia where he proceeds to have a very long and productive career in the KHL. For a few years, he's one of the best defensemen in that league, and he peaks as a player in that 5-6 year window where the Canucks were twin peaking. You have to wonder whether if the NHL had been playing games in 2004-2005, things might have been different. Blame Linden.
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Re: Not so deep thoughts by donlever

Post by donlever »

Novotny

As I am sure most of us did I undertook some research on this player which is summarized below.

Upon reviewing several (many) documented analysis his "consensus" draft ranking calculated out at 15th overall with a high of 13 and a low of 26 (Button).

A lever abridged version of notable commentaries is as follows:

Regarded as one of the more consistent players the 2026 class.

Operates with overall good pace throughout his game.

Can score and demonstrates an ability to create chances.

Easily the the best forechecker in the class, understands direct routes to the puck carrier & applying pressure while maintaining connectivity with teammates and not losing his defensive spacing.

Consistently creates turnovers which become offensive opportunites.

Is not mean nor does he play with the NA "edge" but accepts and plays through contact very well.

Understands his size and uses it to influence body position to win puck battles.

Kills penalites well.

Is not afraid to take the puck to the middle of the ice.

Elevates the play of those around him.

A two way player who's already defensively aware and reliable.

Plays his best when the games mean the most.

Reacts and responds well to "when the going gets tough" scenarios.

Some question his offensive ceiling but of note along those lines is the Pete's play a refined system that can mute offensive creativity yet he still scored mid 30 goals and mid 60 poimts in 50 some games.

Overall projection model of a GO TO mid 6 winger with a 3rd line floor and top end 2nd line player who will get you 30 and score in timely situations.

Low risk pick...NHL career at a solid level very likely with room for growth.

Was THE BEST player available at 24.

Megs indicated excitement when this choice was made.

I agree with him.

This is an A pick and may turn into an A+ over time in my estimation.

Good choice.

TNFG's got this one right.
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Re: Not so deep thoughts by donlever

Post by Meds »

And he’s not Swedish.

You forgot that part Donny.
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Re: Not so deep thoughts by donlever

Post by Cousin Strawberry »

Mëds wrote: Sat Jun 27, 2026 8:38 am And he’s not Swedish.

You forgot that part Donny.
:lol:

Stenberg will be dragging his long ballbag back and forth across the Canucks foreheads for the next decade while you continue to hold that line
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Re: Not so deep thoughts by donlever

Post by donlever »

We will never know what Stenbergs career path would have been here.

Playing with Celebrini certainly enhances his ballbag dragging opportunities.
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Re: Not so deep thoughts by donlever

Post by Cousin Strawberry »

donlever wrote: Sat Jun 27, 2026 8:47 am We will never know what Stenbergs career path would have been here.

Playing with Celebrini certainly enhances his ballbag dragging opportunities.
The kid will be a star that's for sure.

The Sharts just slayed the draft like I haven't seen in years. What a fantastic job they did. Imagine them getting both IS AND Verhoeff.

That's impressive

To contrast that, the Canucks are tracking in an uber conservative manner where risk is mitigated by taking the lower, safer roads. Boring
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Re: Not so deep thoughts by donlever

Post by donlever »

...and Lin Cuz.

The Sharks have:

Celebrini
Stenberg
Smith
Misa
Lin
Verhoeff
Dickinson
Chernyshov
Musty
Ravensburg
Ashkarov

...in their system.

This has potential Dynasty written all over it.
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Re: Not so deep thoughts by donlever

Post by Cousin Strawberry »

Definitely. Me thinks that embarrassing 9-1 beating the Canucks laid on a young sharts group 2 years ago will be paid back in spades shortly
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