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It sounds like Tocchet turned down a contract offer. It seems to me that Mr Aquilini wasn't comfortable with the number involved.

Or not comfortable with the way the coach let it play out in the dressing room?

Megaterio Llamas wrote: ↑Tue Apr 01, 2025 11:01 am It sounds like Tocchet turned down a contract offer. It seems to me that Mr Aquilini wasn't comfortable with the number involved.

So who turned down what?

Mëds wrote: ↑Tue Apr 01, 2025 5:35 pm

Megaterio Llamas wrote: ↑Tue Apr 01, 2025 11:01 am It sounds like Tocchet turned down a contract offer. It seems to me that Mr Aquilini wasn't comfortable with the number involved.

So who turned down what?

Donni and Dhali were talking about the fact that Tocchet had turned down a contract offer like it was a fact today. I think the source might have been Friedman.

What he has also said is that the Canucks have made it clear to other teams that they plan to exercise their option so back off. So if they can't reach a deal they are saying their plan is to exercise the option and he will be back for at least one season. Their ideal of course is to have an agreed new deal in place but they are using the option as leverage. I can't see that they would bring him back as a lame duck but who knows. I also can't see that they would want a real long deal as Manny is in the wings.

The guts of it is of course that if they lose Tocchet they could also lose all the assistant coaches. Those guys have done a great job on our young D.

Hockey Widow wrote: ↑Tue Apr 01, 2025 9:13 pm The guts of it is of course that if they lose Tocchet they could also lose all the assistant coaches. Those guys have done a great job on our young D.

I do believe Foote would be part of the deal, though Svejkovsky and Torenius - and possibly even Gonchar - seem more organizational hires. Even so, losing Foote along with Tocchet would set the team back - especially WRT the young defencemen.

If I was front office, I would try my hardest to get a deal done before next season. Tocchet's price will only go up if the team rebounds next season - something I would hope front office wants to see.

Lancer wrote: ↑Wed Apr 02, 2025 8:08 am If I was front office, I would try my hardest to get a deal done before next season. Tocchet's price will only go up if the team rebounds next season - something I would hope front office wants to see.

Well it’s more than the monetary price. If they don’t come to an agreement, and the team exercises its option, Tocchet has the choice to either coach the Canucks or quit coaching in the NHL for a season altogether.

Tocchet has made some interesting veiled statements the past few days, particularly in regards to the team and their performance this year. One such was in regards to the direction of the team, he wouldn’t comment. He just said that he’s focused right now on these last games and will have those conversations afterwards. He said that him, Allvin, Rutherford, go way back, and so they will talk about everything after the season is over.

What if Tocchet doesn’t like a couple of these players? What if he see’s Pettersson as being a guy that he remains unconvinced will ever “get there” and just doesn’t see the roster being competitive with him in that 1C role? What if he thinks Chytil will never play more than a 41 game season again but the team thinks he’s the next 2C? What if Hoglander is a player Tocchet just can’t do anything with but Allvin doesn’t want to move him out? What if Tocchet wants a different 1G than Demko because he finds it too hard to draw up a game plan when he doesn’t know if he will have HoF calibre goaltending one night and not the next?

Mëds wrote: ↑Wed Apr 02, 2025 11:16 am

Lancer wrote: ↑Wed Apr 02, 2025 8:08 am If I was front office, I would try my hardest to get a deal done before next season. Tocchet's price will only go up if the team rebounds next season - something I would hope front office wants to see.

Well it’s more than the monetary price. If they don’t come to an agreement, and the team exercises its option, Tocchet has the choice to either coach the Canucks or quit coaching in the NHL for a season altogether.

Tocchet has made some interesting veiled statements the past few days, particularly in regards to the team and their performance this year. One such was in regards to the direction of the team, he wouldn’t comment. He just said that he’s focused right now on these last games and will have those conversations afterwards. He said that him, Allvin, Rutherford, go way back, and so they will talk about everything after the season is over.

What if Tocchet doesn’t like a couple of these players? What if he see’s Pettersson as being a guy that he remains unconvinced will ever “get there” and just doesn’t see the roster being competitive with him in that 1C role? What if he thinks Chytil will never play more than a 41 game season again but the team thinks he’s the next 2C? What if Hoglander is a player Tocchet just can’t do anything with but Allvin doesn’t want to move him out? What if Tocchet wants a different 1G than Demko because he finds it too hard to draw up a game plan when he doesn’t know if he will have HoF calibre goaltending one night and not the next?

WRT Petey, I can't imagine management making such a decision without Tocchet's input. Same with the Miller situation. Not that they would be bound to follow that input, but I can't imagine this management group not taking Tocchet's opinion into account.

I don't see Tocchet as the type to bail on guaranteed income out of principle unless it was egregious. I've seen nothing that indicates that that's the case. He'll be back next year if the club picks up the option.

I don't doubt that the conversation will involve what went wrong this year and how they want to improve things moving forward. I don't think they're that far apart in terms of where they see the team heading and what they want to do to get the team where they want it. That said, I can understand Tocchet wanting to talk with management in the offseason to make sure they're in rough alignment.

Mëds wrote: ↑Wed Apr 02, 2025 11:16 am

Lancer wrote: ↑Wed Apr 02, 2025 8:08 am If I was front office, I would try my hardest to get a deal done before next season. Tocchet's price will only go up if the team rebounds next season - something I would hope front office wants to see.

Well it’s more than the monetary price. If they don’t come to an agreement, and the team exercises its option, Tocchet has the choice to either coach the Canucks or quit coaching in the NHL for a season altogether.

Tocchet has made some interesting veiled statements the past few days, particularly in regards to the team and their performance this year. One such was in regards to the direction of the team, he wouldn’t comment. He just said that he’s focused right now on these last games and will have those conversations afterwards. He said that him, Allvin, Rutherford, go way back, and so they will talk about everything after the season is over.

What if Tocchet doesn’t like a couple of these players? What if he see’s Pettersson as being a guy that he remains unconvinced will ever “get there” and just doesn’t see the roster being competitive with him in that 1C role? What if he thinks Chytil will never play more than a 41 game season again but the team thinks he’s the next 2C? What if Hoglander is a player Tocchet just can’t do anything with but Allvin doesn’t want to move him out? What if Tocchet wants a different 1G than Demko because he finds it too hard to draw up a game plan when he doesn’t know if he will have HoF calibre goaltending one night and not the next?

What if Tocc sees EP40 as the way forward as a 1C but Management has said behind closed doors that EP40 is getting traded??
What if Tocc thinks we need a 2C?
What if Tocc thinks Hogz is one of his greatest coaching achievements (taking a 25G scorer and teaching him to play D)
What if Tocc wants Demk to stay now that Lanks is a competent 1B goalie and wants a tandem goalie team??

sorry Mëds, but sometimes your constant negativity and hate on EP40 just feeds into the negativity that media rolls out. Try looking on the bright side once in a while, you'll live longer.

This team played something like a quarter of their games into OT. Yes, there was blown leads, wild comebacks, and points missed. When you look at the margin of error in the league, its very small. They are out of the playoffs by 3-4 wins. that's it. When you look at the number of times that this team played with a 60 million dollar payroll this season, and how this team never once played with a healthy team, and the injuries were primarily to top 6 forwards, top 3D and the top goalie, the fact we are even where we are is amazing... especially with the drama that ran rampant in the room this year.

Blaming one player who may or may not be overpaid by a million dollars is asinine. Using prospects and picks for trades for the sake of trades is silly. Trading away the depth that allowed us to overcome that adversity is also the wrong answer.

Winning teams are build from the net out, and have a system with depth in it, and gel/peak at the right time. Management flushed 1/2 the team last offseason, then flushed 1/2 of it again midseason. Personally, I hope they let them play, add a bit through free agency, and keep the player turnover to a minimum this year. The team only has a couple holes in it right now, but every team has a couple holes in it. Thats the league...

Lancer wrote: ↑Wed Apr 02, 2025 12:48 pm WRT Petey, I can't imagine management making such a decision without Tocchet's input. Same with the Miller situation. Not that they would be bound to follow that input, but I can't imagine this management group not taking Tocchet's opinion into account.

I don't see Tocchet as the type to bail on guaranteed income out of principle unless it was egregious. I've seen nothing that indicates that that's the case. He'll be back next year if the club picks up the option.

I don't doubt that the conversation will involve what went wrong this year and how they want to improve things moving forward. I don't think they're that far apart in terms of where they see the team heading and what they want to do to get the team where they want it. That said, I can understand Tocchet wanting to talk with management in the offseason to make sure they're in rough alignment.

If the club is forced to pick up the option, that almost makes Tocchet a "lame duck" coach. I can't see that being OK with him or the team. If he's back it will be under an extension.

Madcombinepilot wrote: ↑Wed Apr 02, 2025 12:54 pm

Mëds wrote: ↑Wed Apr 02, 2025 11:16 am

Lancer wrote: ↑Wed Apr 02, 2025 8:08 am If I was front office, I would try my hardest to get a deal done before next season. Tocchet's price will only go up if the team rebounds next season - something I would hope front office wants to see.

Well it’s more than the monetary price. If they don’t come to an agreement, and the team exercises its option, Tocchet has the choice to either coach the Canucks or quit coaching in the NHL for a season altogether.

Tocchet has made some interesting veiled statements the past few days, particularly in regards to the team and their performance this year. One such was in regards to the direction of the team, he wouldn’t comment. He just said that he’s focused right now on these last games and will have those conversations afterwards. He said that him, Allvin, Rutherford, go way back, and so they will talk about everything after the season is over.

What if Tocchet doesn’t like a couple of these players? What if he see’s Pettersson as being a guy that he remains unconvinced will ever “get there” and just doesn’t see the roster being competitive with him in that 1C role? What if he thinks Chytil will never play more than a 41 game season again but the team thinks he’s the next 2C? What if Hoglander is a player Tocchet just can’t do anything with but Allvin doesn’t want to move him out? What if Tocchet wants a different 1G than Demko because he finds it too hard to draw up a game plan when he doesn’t know if he will have HoF calibre goaltending one night and not the next?

What if Tocc sees EP40 as the way forward as a 1C but Management has said behind closed doors that EP40 is getting traded??
What if Tocc thinks we need a 2C?
What if Tocc thinks Hogz is one of his greatest coaching achievements (taking a 25G scorer and teaching him to play D)
What if Tocc wants Demk to stay now that Lanks is a competent 1B goalie and wants a tandem goalie team??

sorry Mëds, but sometimes your constant negativity and hate on EP40 just feeds into the negativity that media rolls out. Try looking on the bright side once in a while, you'll live longer.

This team played something like a quarter of their games into OT. Yes, there was blown leads, wild comebacks, and points missed. When you look at the margin of error in the league, its very small. They are out of the playoffs by 3-4 wins. that's it. When you look at the number of times that this team played with a 60 million dollar payroll this season, and how this team never once played with a healthy team, and the injuries were primarily to top 6 forwards, top 3D and the top goalie, the fact we are even where we are is amazing... especially with the drama that ran rampant in the room this year.

There was nothing inherently negative about my post. The primary issues we have all identified this year have been....

- The lack of top-6 centers (whether a performance issue or a lack of due to injury and trade and turmoil).
- The underperformance of depth in contrast to last year (Hoglander being one such example that has been brought up)
- Demko's health, the missing Vezina-nominee calibre goaltending we had last season, the possibility that he would rather play stateside.
- Chytil being too fragile and unreliable as a 2C (if indeed even talented enough)

So Tocchet and JR/PA have to be aligned here.

I do think that it is completely possible that Aqualini was involved in the decision on Pettersson, and his legendary impatience may have forced things rather than want to move on and try again on a key position. But it is not unheard of in this league for coaches to end up with players that management is high on when they themselves are not.

Blaming one player who may or may not be overpaid by a million dollars is asinine.

Scoring at a 57 point pace and making $11.6M is not a player who "may or may not" be over paid by "a million dollars". That's a player who is overpaid by $4M.

Using prospects and picks for trades for the sake of trades is silly. Trading away the depth that allowed us to overcome that adversity is also the wrong answer.

No one suggested trades for the sake of trades. That's a ridiculous assertion.

Nobody suggested trading away depth either. The suggested trade was Willander, a player who has not played a single NHL game for us to date.....unless you are now asserting that Pettersson is a depth player, in which case that was suggested, and that player is most certainly overpaid by far more than a million dollars.

Winning teams are build from the net out, and have a system with depth in it, and gel/peak at the right time. Management flushed 1/2 the team last offseason, then flushed 1/2 of it again midseason. Personally, I hope they let them play, add a bit through free agency, and keep the player turnover to a minimum this year. The team only has a couple holes in it right now, but every team has a couple holes in it. Thats the league...

Not exclusively true. Winning teams are built down the middle and back out. 1C, 1D, 1G.

Florida certainly doesn't win without Barkov.
Vegas definitely was not a win because of Hill.
Colorado did not have an elite goaltender, they had MacKinnon and Makar.
Tampa did indeed have Vassy, but where would they have been without their top forwards and Hedman?
St. Louis road a red hot Binnington, who has not been that level of goaltender since. See O'Relly and Pietrangelo there.
Holtby was good for Washington, but AO, Kuznetsov, Backstrom, and Carlson were the difference makers.
Pittsburgh x2? Crosby, Malkin.....a revolving door of goaltenders.
Chicago's cups were certainly not on the backs of Niemi or Crawford.
Detroit's win with Babcock as coach.....I don't even remember who the goaltender was. But I remember Datsyuk, Zetterberg and Lidstrom.

Anyways, enough said. You don't build from the net out. You build the 1C and 1D first.

Brandon Astle mentioned today that D Pettersson wasn't papered down to Abbotsford for the AHL playoffs. This tells us that management considers him graduated to the NHL, and that they consider even playoff games at the AHL level to be a waste of his time. As good as he's been, I find this a little surprising.

Megaterio Llamas wrote: ↑Wed Apr 02, 2025 4:06 pm As good as he's been, I find this a little surprising.

I can see both sides - maybe it's a 'prize' for graduating? Or maybe (based on your comments) they don't need him exposed to the AHL goonery in the playoffs?

Cornuck wrote: ↑Wed Apr 02, 2025 5:58 pm

Megaterio Llamas wrote: ↑Wed Apr 02, 2025 4:06 pm As good as he's been, I find this a little surprising.

I can see both sides - maybe it's a 'prize' for graduating? Or maybe (based on your comments) they don't need him exposed to the AHL goonery in the playoffs?

I think he can handle the goonery Corn, it's Lekkerimaki I sometimes worry about.

I think they must view it as a reward, as you say.

Cornuck wrote: ↑Wed Apr 02, 2025 5:58 pm

Megaterio Llamas wrote: ↑Wed Apr 02, 2025 4:06 pm As good as he's been, I find this a little surprising.

I can see both sides - maybe it's a 'prize' for graduating? Or maybe (based on your comments) they don't need him exposed to the AHL goonery in the playoffs?

He's really turned the corner as a prospect