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Alright Canucks fans, its been a long fucker of an offseason but its looking like we are go for hockey Jan 13.

We've had months of arguing about Mick being Gohmert, does Chef look like the scorpion singer, is blobs bald spot bigger than a tea saucer, is SKYO throwing g*ys off of rooftops with UK but with all this in mind, here are 4 very important hockey questions/concerns for canucksland:

1-Will Schmidt and Juolevi/Rafferty be better than Tanev and Stetcher?

2-How much will losing Toffoli and Leivo affect the canucks ability to score and are there anywhere near enough internal assets available to promote and compensate for the losses? I read that Virtanen has been training with TM all offseason so he may be poised to prove some detractors wrong....finally

3-Goaltending. Obviously Demko had a great playoffs but his season was fairly average backing up JM. Holtby has had a couple of average seasons after his Stanley Cup win. Was he just lacking motivation or is it decline?

4-Will the 3 canuck super kids improve on their season's statistically? Will Boeser return to 30+ goals a year, will Hughes step into point per game territory, will pettersson flirt with 100 points? (obviously with the shortened season these stats need to be adjusted)

My answers are

1-Absolutely. Schmidt is so much better than Tanev that we will barely notice if the bottom pairing left sider struggles or not. Plus Juolevi has given us some serious optimism for his development

2-I fear the internal assets will not offset the losses up front (unless JV finally figures it out...not holding my breath) but answer #4 might

3-This one is tough for me but my gut is telling me the goaltending will be a step back. How far back is the next question

4-Here is where the most critical improvements will happen. My gut is telling me that EP will improve but Boeser and Hughes will only match their statistical output. How much is anybodys guess

The Brown Wizard wrote: ↑Wed Dec 09, 2020 7:35 am
I read that Virtanen has been training with TM all offseason so he may be poised to prove some detractors wrong....finally

Looks poised. TM has made a difference for sure..

Good post Wiz

One thing that will be very different is Nate Schmidt. Huge talent. Apparently good team-mate. Seemed like it in the recent playoffs.
Is seemingly very excitable, hyper. Seems like it when you listen to past interviews. Should put his locker right beside Elias Pettersson's

Tanev was a heart and soul guy who had average skill but Schmidt is a huge step up from CT IMO. Tanev spending a 3rd of every season hurt is another factor

The NS acquisition will dramatically improve the canucks glaring defensive zone deficiencies and have far more of a positive impact than the losses on D AND in net. Hes that good

Rumour has it Sutter and Beagle were singing at the anti mask rally too. If they can fire Donnelly, they should be able to fire anyone.

1-Will Schmidt and Juolevi/Rafferty be better than Tanev and Stetcher?

Yes - I believe the ability for WS to provide the additional offence is needed and more important that Tanev's defensive skills. Replacement for Stetcher does not seem hard to do.

2-How much will losing Toffoli and Leivo affect the canucks ability to score and are there anywhere near enough internal assets available to promote and compensate for the losses? I read that Virtanen has been training with TM all offseason so he may be poised to prove some detractors wrong....finally

No impact at all, TT was good but they have enough skill in the top end to make up the difference. We can also hope JV does enough to stay in the top 6 and get his 15 - 20 goals.

3-Goaltending. Obviously Demko had a great playoffs but his season was fairly average backing up JM. Holtby has had a couple of average seasons after his Stanley Cup win. Was he just lacking motivation or is it decline?

This is the Millions dollar question, is Demko ready? How will the team play in front of him. I am hopping they both play well enough for the team to win but I do not expect either to be as good as Markstrom.

4-Will the 3 canuck super kids improve on their season's statistically? Will Boeser return to 30+ goals a year, will Hughes step into point per game territory, will pettersson flirt with 100 points? (obviously with the shortened season these stats need to be adjusted)

I see EP/QH to be as equal this year, such a weird year and with each team playing each other so many times it will be easier to concentrate on them. I expect BB to what he was last year, this is what we have in him. Hope to be wrong and I understand everything about his wrist but we always try to find excuses to explain why a player declined. He is still a 2nd line player but do not see him getting 30 goals again.

The Brown Wizard wrote: ↑Wed Dec 09, 2020 7:35 am Alright Canucks fans, its been a long fucker of an offseason but its looking like we are go for hockey Jan 13.

We've had months of arguing about Mick being Gohmert, does Chef look like the scorpion singer, is blobs bald spot bigger than a tea saucer, is SKYO throwing g*ys off of rooftops with UK but with all this in mind, here are 4 very important hockey questions/concerns for canucksland:

1-Will Schmidt and Juolevi/Rafferty be better than Tanev and Stetcher?

2-How much will losing Toffoli and Leivo affect the canucks ability to score and are there anywhere near enough internal assets available to promote and compensate for the losses? I read that Virtanen has been training with TM all offseason so he may be poised to prove some detractors wrong....finally

3-Goaltending. Obviously Demko had a great playoffs but his season was fairly average backing up JM. Holtby has had a couple of average seasons after his Stanley Cup win. Was he just lacking motivation or is it decline?

4-Will the 3 canuck super kids improve on their season's statistically? Will Boeser return to 30+ goals a year, will Hughes step into point per game territory, will pettersson flirt with 100 points? (obviously with the shortened season these stats need to be adjusted)

My answers are

1-Absolutely. Schmidt is so much better than Tanev that we will barely notice if the bottom pairing left sider struggles or not. Plus Juolevi has given us some serious optimism for his development

2-I fear the internal assets will not offset the losses up front (unless JV finally figures it out...not holding my breath) but answer #4 might

3-This one is tough for me but my gut is telling me the goaltending will be a step back. How far back is the next question

4-Here is where the most critical improvements will happen. My gut is telling me that EP will improve but Boeser and Hughes will only match their statistical output. How much is anybodys guess

Now that the start of the season is in sight, and the WJC camps are underway, I can get excited again. Here's my early take:

1) Way better. In the spirit of the old saying, "the team getting the best player wins the trade", Schmidt is way better at this stage than Tanev and the gap will only increase IMO. In the short term Juolevi/Rafferty/Rathbone may seem like a downgrade over Stecher but that will change by the end of the season. Not to denigrate Tanev and Stecher, great guys I really liked having on the team, but you have to get over the veteran and local kid biases at some point.

2) Losing Toffoli will hurt short term but he only played 10 regular season and 7 playoff games and ultimately, Hog and Pod should replace what Toffoli brought. Why is Leivo even in the conversation though? He's an easily replaceable 27 year old player and I'd rather have a full season of MacEwen along with Hog, Pod, and Lind either available or on the way. If there's a developmental time gap, an equivalent placeholder is easy to find for a Leivo.

3) Demko won't be as good as his playoff run but better than he was in the regular season, Holtby will rebound working with Clark and getting out of an increasingly porous Cap defensive system, and Markstrom will be good but not as good as last season so at worst, I think the goaltending will be a wash.

4) Hughes and Pettersson will be better and I think Boeser is extremely motivated to be better and they will all benefit from the skating and puck moving upgrades on defense with Schmidt and Juolevi/Rafferty/Rathbone. The Hog addition and Pod joining later on will also ultimately enhance that IMO.

The window is opening rather quickly if it hasn't already.

2Fingers wrote: ↑Wed Dec 09, 2020 11:16 am 3-Goaltending. Holtby has had a couple of average seasons after his Stanley Cup win. Was he just lacking motivation or is it decline?

Caps Orpik - defensive specialist for the Cup champs Caps on Holtby;

Brooks Orpik:

Holtby is a super competitive guy, you won't meet a guy more competitive.

I think the change will be good for him. It rejuvenates you a little bit.

We don't win the Cup in Washington without him.

2Fingers wrote: ↑Wed Dec 09, 2020 11:16 am Obviously Demko had a great playoffs but his season was fairly average backing up JM.

This is the Millions dollar question, is Demko ready?

Demko just had his first full NHL season and had games where he was ice cold in his veins and that held true in the intense playoffs, just a straight shooter type, a very steady calm fella & it shows. He's proven at every level he improves every season.

“I think last year was a good year for me to go through some ups and downs and learn a little bit more about what it’s like to be (in the NHL) full time,” Demko said, according to Sportsnet’s Iain MacIntyre.

“I feel really confident going into this year. I’m right where I want to be in my career right now. I think there’s a lot on the table, and I’m just really excited to get the opportunity (to) take that next step. I want to be in Vancouver as long as I can. I want to be the guy. This is the next step in that direction.”

Demko is entering the final year of his current contract, and is hoping he can put together a strong season. Demko will likely be splitting time with Bradn Holtby, whom the Canucks inked to a two-year contract during this offseason.

“When that second opportunity came around in the playoffs, it was like: OK, I’ve been in this situation before. I learned a ton the first time around and now these games are even bigger,” Demko said. “I was able to kind of settle in and just be a lot more confident in myself after learning from my failures. I knew the second time around, I wasn’t going to make the same mistakes.”

https://sportsrants.com/2020/11/canucks ... rformance/

2Fingers wrote: ↑Wed Dec 09, 2020 11:16 am I am hopping they both play well enough for the team to win but I do not expect either to be as good as Markstrom.

Everyone is underrating both Holtby and Demko imo, which is good - less pressure from the fan base, but I bet this duo surprises in a good way, Holtby felt that Cup hangover in Washington - as that team ages, that team was all partying it up a lot in the edmonton bubble weren't they? not taking the seasons serious. A much needed change of scenery was needed for Holt's and should feed off the young hungry talent here on the rise. While Demko keeps improving to be a #1 keeper in the league + contract year!

I really wanted Marky back because he was a known clutch keeper but have to say, if you are going to replace him there was only one other goalie i would feel comfortable replacing him with and that was Braden Holtby. The guy is a game changer back there and the absolute perfect mentor for young Demko.

The canucks are in good shape with jimbro's steady hand on the tiller

The Brown Wizard wrote: ↑Wed Dec 09, 2020 12:47 pm I really wanted Marky back because he was a known clutch keeper but have to say, if you are going to replace him there was only one other goalie i would feel comfortable replacing him with and that was Braden Holtby. The guy is a game changer back there and the absolute perfect mentor for young Demko.

The canucks are in good shape with jimbro's steady hand on the tiller

Holtby really only had one sucky year, last one and that wasn't horrific. No reason to think he wont shine with a little refresher help from Clark.
It's fine because if this season does happen, alternating net minders successfully will help a heap. Matter a fact, I think this will be a key to future success on a permanent basis.

The Brown Wizard wrote: ↑Wed Dec 09, 2020 7:35 am Alright Canucks fans, its been a long fucker of an offseason but its looking like we are go for hockey Jan 13.

We've had months of arguing about Mick being Gohmert, does Chef look like the scorpion singer, is blobs bald spot bigger than a tea saucer, is SKYO throwing g*ys off of rooftops with UK but with all this in mind, here are 4 very important hockey questions/concerns for canucksland:

1-Will Schmidt and Juolevi/Rafferty be better than Tanev and Stetcher?

I think so, but Tanev was a far better player (when healthy) than most give him credit for. Schmidt is better, but only by a little. Schmidt is like Tanev but with more resiliency and slightly more flexibility (can play both sides). He's good transitioning the puck (so was Tanev), he's positions and angles as opposed to power in the D zone (same with Tanev), and as a finisher, he's a "C" instead of a "D." I really like the pick up, and am glad the Canucks are going for this model of a player and not guys with Gudbrandson-type profiles. But people should also understand, Schmidt slots in as a solid top 4 player, not more.

As for Stecher, we knew his floor and we know that his ceiling wasn't going to grow much, if at all. I am 100% behind going into the season with a prospect having to make the team and show his stuff. The prospect D pool is an exercise in safety in numbers of near NHL ready types; no one player is a sure thing, but one has to emerge as being as good as Stecher, right? And maybe better, even much better. Only problem is that impact of losing a couple points is greater in a short season if we get out of the gate with the wrong horse.

2-How much will losing Toffoli and Leivo affect the canucks ability to score and are there anywhere near enough internal assets available to promote and compensate for the losses? I read that Virtanen has been training with TM all offseason so he may be poised to prove some detractors wrong....finally

Losing Toffoli and Leivo will affect the overall scoring very little. If the Canucks stay healthy, they will score goals with the current group. As for relying on Virtanen to compensate for the losses, it would be great, but I actually think the Canucks are far better off if Virtanen is helping do this from the bottom six. Some counterpunch is needed in that group.

3-Goaltending. Obviously Demko had a great playoffs but his season was fairly average backing up JM. Holtby has had a couple of average seasons after his Stanley Cup win. Was he just lacking motivation or is it decline?

Last year, the Canucks entered the season with a goalie who had had one good NHL season and a few okay ones. He was likable, the team wanted to play for him. But it was only in the last year that Marky bailed out the team more than he needed to be bailed out. The Canucks backup last year spend a grand total of half a season in the league.

Now the Canucks have a goalie coming off two of years -- the first of which was no worse than the season you might have expected from Marky. Before that, he had a long track record of being well above average. If he's in decline as opposed to just an off year, I don't think its not age-related. I think there's a very good chance that Holtby bounces back, and if he doesn't, well who isn't far more confident in Demko than a year ago? To be sure, he's not going to repeat the playoff performance. But having done what he did, I am sure that he's increased his confidence and his teammates have more confidence in him. As a goalie, psychology is a lot, and things are trending up for Demko.

At the end of the day, there are teams with goaltending holes that are very likely the difference between inside the playoffs and outside the playoffs. The Canucks are not one of them.

4-Will the 3 canuck super kids improve on their season's statistically? Will Boeser return to 30+ goals a year, will Hughes step into point per game territory, will pettersson flirt with 100 points? (obviously with the shortened season these stats need to be adjusted)

I think that all will improve on their statistics (pro-rated). Pettersson is going to be better, Boeser is going to get luckier, and Hughes is going to get even more ice time. He will average 2 and a half minutes per power play, and this team will draw a lot of penalties.

I'm also optimistic that the Captain has another level of offense.

Overall, I am bullish on the Canucks coming into the season. The bottom 6 is poor, the 3d pairing is an unknown, I think the Canucks are very exposed if more than one of their best players are simultaneously out for any stretch that lasts more than a week. But if you are going to weak, ultimately those are the areas of weakness you'd rather have than a lack of offensive talent or bottom pairing caliber defensemen masquerading in the top 4.

UWSaint wrote: ↑Thu Dec 10, 2020 9:46 am

The Brown Wizard wrote: ↑Wed Dec 09, 2020 7:35 am Alright Canucks fans, its been a long fucker of an offseason but its looking like we are go for hockey Jan 13.

We've had months of arguing about Mick being Gohmert, does Chef look like the scorpion singer, is blobs bald spot bigger than a tea saucer, is SKYO throwing g*ys off of rooftops with UK but with all this in mind, here are 4 very important hockey questions/concerns for canucksland:

1-Will Schmidt and Juolevi/Rafferty be better than Tanev and Stetcher?

I think so, but Tanev was a far better player (when healthy) than most give him credit for. Schmidt is better, but only by a little. Schmidt is like Tanev but with more resiliency and slightly more flexibility (can play both sides). He's good transitioning the puck (so was Tanev), he's positions and angles as opposed to power in the D zone (same with Tanev), and as a finisher, he's a "C" instead of a "D." I really like the pick up, and am glad the Canucks are going for this model of a player and not guys with Gudbrandson-type profiles. But people should also understand, Schmidt slots in as a solid top 4 player, not more.

This point is the most subject to perspective and opinion but I will respectfully counter with this:

I feel you aren't recognizing that Nate Schmidt is one of the very best skating d-men in the league. He is a legitimate 2-way stud back there whereas Tanev was quite one dimensional and the versatility of adding a talent like NS to a group that was sorely lacking in this specific area will have a dramatically positive impact on their ability to graduate from darkhorse to contender.

If you couple the above with Tanev's durability issues, I am firmly in the dramatically improved camp

Nice analysis btw ewe-dub! I cannot wait for hockey man....winter without hockey on the tube sucks it turns out

Curmudgeon wrote: ↑Wed Dec 09, 2020 11:38 am

1) Way better. In the spirit of the old saying, "the team getting the best player wins the trade", Schmidt is way better at this stage than Tanev and the gap will only increase IMO. In the short term Juolevi/Rafferty/Rathbone may seem like a downgrade over Stecher but that will change by the end of the season. Not to denigrate Tanev and Stecher, great guys I really liked having on the team, but you have to get over the veteran and local kid biases at some point.

I have to agree. And , even if Schmidt is not way better, than Tanev, he cannot be worse. We have been saying for years that our defense was the biggest weakness. QH is the future. Edler is still OK. Meyers is Meyers. The only way to get better is to get a few new deck chairs into the shuffle. There is a chance our defense will be worse, but, imo, Schmidt is better than Tanev, and if we get the puck out of our zone faster, we will have fewer shots to block. And, as Stetcher is only a serviceable #6 guy (I like that he handles extra minutes pretty well when Tanev is injured), it isn't a stetch that any one of our Utes will be on par with him, and have some upside. I think we'll see the biggest improvement in the team being their defense this year. And, even if it isn't, it will be good to know for next season that our defense needs work

The Brown Wizard wrote: ↑Thu Dec 10, 2020 10:09 am I feel you aren't recognizing that Nate Schmidt is one of the very best skating d-men in the league. He is a legitimate 2-way stud back there whereas Tanev was quite one dimensional and the versatility of adding a talent like NS to a group that was sorely lacking in this specific area will have a dramatically positive impact on their ability to graduate from darkhorse to contender.

If you couple the above with Tanev's durability issues, I am firmly in the dramatically improved camp

Nice analysis btw ewe-dub! I cannot wait for hockey man....winter without hockey on the tube sucks it turns out

I think you are modestly overstating Schmidt's skating (which is very good to excellent, but I wouldn't say "one of the very best"), but more importantly, I don't think his skating leads to offense near as much as some other plus-plus skaters. I also think that nearly everyone underestimates Tanev's ability to flip the team from playing defense to going on offense. His passing from his own zone was really good -- to the right players, in stride, who aren't going to get blown up. And he carried a bit too, making him harder to defend. He had no shot, and his o-zone work wasn't anything great otherwise, but in getting from D to O, he is underrated.

But yes, Schmidt's better overall -- I just think not by as much as many think because they are overrating Schmidt somewhat and underrating Tanev somewhat. But there is a difference in Schmidt's favor, and Tanev's durability issue compounds the difference.

Nate Schmidt is a top two on most teams in this league. A good passer and playmaker. Is a real rah rah dude in the room and on the ice. We needed
that to be sure. One thing that stands out, (other than his impressive point total), is he doesn't hurt you with bad penalties. It's a great acquisition,
looking forward to seeing him donning the whale.
Not going to say "way" better than Tanev, Chris put in some tremendous work for this franchise. The type that doesn't necessarily show on a player
profile. We "will" miss him. Would have been tremendous to have them both. frickin air thief/ CT did a great job with Hughes.Really allowed him to flourish.
As mentioned, no question it's time to see a defense man from within the organization make the show on a permanent basis this next campaign.

UWSaint wrote: ↑Thu Dec 10, 2020 11:35 am

The Brown Wizard wrote: ↑Thu Dec 10, 2020 10:09 am I feel you aren't recognizing that Nate Schmidt is one of the very best skating d-men in the league. He is a legitimate 2-way stud back there whereas Tanev was quite one dimensional and the versatility of adding a talent like NS to a group that was sorely lacking in this specific area will have a dramatically positive impact on their ability to graduate from darkhorse to contender.

If you couple the above with Tanev's durability issues, I am firmly in the dramatically improved camp

Nice analysis btw ewe-dub! I cannot wait for hockey man....winter without hockey on the tube sucks it turns out

I think you are modestly overstating Schmidt's skating (which is very good to excellent, but I wouldn't say "one of the very best"), but more importantly, I don't think his skating leads to offense near as much as some other plus-plus skaters. I also think that nearly everyone underestimates Tanev's ability to flip the team from playing defense to going on offense. His passing from his own zone was really good -- to the right players, in stride, who aren't going to get blown up. And he carried a bit too, making him harder to defend. He had no shot, and his o-zone work wasn't anything great otherwise, but in getting from D to O, he is underrated.

But yes, Schmidt's better overall -- I just think not by as much as many think because they are overrating Schmidt somewhat and underrating Tanev somewhat. But there is a difference in Schmidt's favor, and Tanev's durability issue compounds the difference.

Tanev is/was criminally underrated on this board. That said I wouldn’t have signed him for four years with the current cap mess we have. I’d take Nate 10/10 times but that doesn’t mean Tanev is a poor player or soon to be bottom pairing guy that some folks like to crow about. Imagine if one or two of the millstones aren’t here and they could have afforded to keep Tanev and Toffoli or sign another forward. Pretty damn decent team.