Canucks News N Notes 24-25

[Blob Mckenzie]

It's about building a competitive team for the long term and having sustainable success. Like being good for 8-12 years or more. See Detroit, Pittsburgh, Chicago, Boston. San Jose was close. LA won on the back of three studs and benefitted from some garbage officiating. The gods gave the Blues a cup for doing the right thing for 25 years.

Edmonton scummed their way to all those high picks and hopefully they will not see another cup.

I feel the Canucks window is 5-6 years. They have some very good pieces, but their cornerstone guys are 180 with all their gear. Miller is 31, Demko is injured annually. Hronek is a decent player. I'm not happy they didn't keep the big Russian. He ticked so many boxes. First thing this management did that really pissed me off.

The pinheads whining about Petterson's contract, which hasn't even started seem oblivious that a smart manager would have locked up the kids for eight years at 9 million annually instead of prioritizing a "retirement style" deal for Tanner Pearson.

The Canucks have never had a decade of sustainable success. 91-95, 01-05, 07-13.... that's it. The team has been an eyesore most of the rest of its existence. Usually due to stupid decisions by management and ownership, Neely, OEL, Sutter, Booth, Ballard, Potvin, putting the screws to Bure. Not protecting Igor in the waiver draft, fucking up the Gretzky deal, bringing Messier in, Krutov, this team can't sustain a coffee cup full of goodness, let alone greatness.

It starts at the top.

[UWSaint]

It's about building a competitive team for the long term and having sustainable success.

...

The Canucks have never had a decade of sustainable success. 91-95, 01-05, 07-13.... that's it.

I mean, I think that you can count 01-13 as a decade of sustainable success. To be sure, it was an underperforming playoff group, and they missed the playoffs a couple of times -- once in the final year of the WCE era and second in year 2 of the Sedin era, but overall, that was a pretty deft transition from the WCE era to the Sedin era. The Twins provided the continuity along with the vet that saw the transition past the nadir (Ohlund) and the young gun that wasn't a meaningful part of the WCE era (Kesler) but immediately contributed in the Sedin phase. Grade A coach helped a lot, so did Gillis' balls out stunt with Sundin, which probably had more of an impact on the psychology of the team than on ice performance.

This group would have had a great shot at a decade of success had they built on their bubble year instead of folded like Cloutier in April. They lost three years with a disorganized core that really should have done more.

[Topper]

It's about building a competitive team for the long term and having sustainable success.

...

The Canucks have never had a decade of sustainable success. 91-95, 01-05, 07-13.... that's it.

I mean, I think that you can count 01-13 as a decade of sustainable success. To be sure, it was an underperforming playoff group, and they missed the playoffs a couple of times -- once in the final year of the WCE era and second in year 2 of the Sedin era, but overall, that was a pretty deft transition from the WCE era to the Sedin era. The Twins provided the continuity along with the vet that saw the transition past the nadir (Ohlund) and the young gun that wasn't a meaningful part of the WCE era (Kesler) but immediately contributed in the Sedin phase. Grade A coach helped a lot, so did Gillis' balls out stunt with Sundin, which probably had more of an impact on the psychology of the team than on ice performance.

This group would have had a great shot at a decade of success had they built on their bubble year instead of folded like Cloutier in April. They lost three years with a disorganized core that really should have done more.

It was something the previous admin was working on after clearing out previous contracts and then establishing a ladder of aged players to develop along with character role players. It was, despite semantics, a full rebuild that owners and fans grew impatient with.

The new regime has fully abandoned the concept. Their model is to build around the high end talent from the rebuild with a revolving door of mix and match role players to supplement the lineup. It will be a continuous turn over of mid tier vets on short to mid term contracts acquired by either trade or FA signings. Rare will be the home grown development into the roster.

It was their MO with the Penguins, an inherited core of Crosby, Malkin, Letang Fleury, managed to develop an inherited Guetzel and filled out much of the rest of the line up with trades and FAS's.

[Cousin Strawberry]

It was their MO with the Penguins

What's encouraging is it worked for 2 cups

[Strangelove]

Now Dhaliwal is reporting Demko is skating and working out on the ice.

Also Silovs arrives in town tonight.

[Cousin Strawberry]

Now Dhaliwal is reporting Demko is skating and working out on the ice.

Also Silovs arrives in town tonight.

He got us all talking didn't he!

[Hockey Widow]

Dhaliwal may, or may not, be right.

I'd say no matter the status of Demko, Dhaliwal has set himself up to be right.

[Blob Mckenzie]

It's about building a competitive team for the long term and having sustainable success.

...

The Canucks have never had a decade of sustainable success. 91-95, 01-05, 07-13.... that's it.

I mean, I think that you can count 01-13 as a decade of sustainable success. To be sure, it was an underperforming playoff group, and they missed the playoffs a couple of times -- once in the final year of the WCE era and second in year 2 of the Sedin era, but overall, that was a pretty deft transition from the WCE era to the Sedin era. The Twins provided the continuity along with the vet that saw the transition past the nadir (Ohlund) and the young gun that wasn't a meaningful part of the WCE era (Kesler) but immediately contributed in the Sedin phase. Grade A coach helped a lot, so did Gillis' balls out stunt with Sundin, which probably had more of an impact on the psychology of the team than on ice performance.

This group would have had a great shot at a decade of success had they built on their bubble year instead of folded like Cloutier in April. They lost three years with a disorganized core that really should have done more.

It was something the previous admin was working on after clearing out previous contracts and then establishing a ladder of aged players to develop along with character role players. It was, despite semantics, a full rebuild that owners and fans grew impatient with.

The new regime has fully abandoned the concept. Their model is to build around the high end talent from the rebuild with a revolving door of mix and match role players to supplement the lineup. It will be a continuous turn over of mid tier vets on short to mid term contracts acquired by either trade or FA signings. Rare will be the home grown development into the roster.

It was their MO with the Penguins, an inherited core of Crosby, Malkin, Letang Fleury, managed to develop an inherited Guetzel and filled out much of the rest of the line up with trades and FAS's.

The new regime doesn't sign role players to six year bloated contracts (Air Thief, Birdbones). Role players should be on short term deals to keep them hungry.

It's the cycle that the team is in, to build around the core players that were left behind. Not rocket science.
It's funny you mention that the previous regime had a bunch of contracts to clear out. Other than the Biter, most of those guys were still effective players when Jowly Jim lumbered into town. And even Burrows was flipped for a decent prospect and they didn't have to retain salary. The twins, Hamhuis and Edler were solid placeholders and culture carriers. So was Hansen. Kevin Bieksa never wanted to leave here but he was run out of town.

The fans didn't get impatient with a rebuild. That is a myth. They got angry at poor trades, horrible signings and terrible top ten picks.

[Meds]

The fans didn't get impatient with a rebuild. That is a myth. They got angry at poor trades, horrible signings and terrible top ten picks.

Nailed it.

[Strangelove]

The fans didn't get impatient with a rebuild. That is a myth. They got angry at poor trades, horrible signings and terrible top ten picks.

Nailed it.

I strongly disagree... generally speaking, fans got impatient indeed.

[Meds]

The fans didn't get impatient with a rebuild. That is a myth. They got angry at poor trades, horrible signings and terrible top ten picks.

Nailed it.

I strongly disagree... generally speaking, fans got impatient indeed.

Yes and no.

Fans didn’t get impatient with a rebuild. Fans got impatient with spinning wheels and questionable decisions. Some whiffed picks and the lack of second round selections due to Benning’s obligatory addition of an outgoing 2nd rounder to any trade as a “thank you for doing business with us”…..

Ownership had no patience for the actual rebuild.

In a full rebuild fans should be ready for 5-7 years of losing hockey, with a couple of those being nigh unmitigated disasters on ice. Then the window opens.

In a retool fans should expect no more than 5 years until the window opens back up…..with one or two years of finishing in the bottom 10. Don’t expect playoffs, but you may see a regular season miracle that results in a first round exit or two. Ideally a retool begins after a team unexpectedly finishes in a position where they will draft in the top-5 (or higher) or when they find themselves somehow holding another teams 1st rounder and that team hits the skids in a hard way.

There is no question that Benning is responsible for acquiring what is currently our core. However, after 8 years of (mostly) futility I am in no way convinced that the team would have turned into what we saw this season had Benning remained at the helm. Quite likely not.

An 8 year “retool on the fly” is not anything that fans should expect to be patient with.

[Strangelove]

Yes and no.

Fans didn’t get impatient with a rebuild. Fans got impatient with spinning wheels and questionable decisions. Some whiffed picks

Yes well there are "questionable decisions and whiffed picks" in every rebuild.

Trust me, Vancouver fans got impatient.

and the lack of second round selections due to Benning’s obligatory addition of an outgoing 2nd rounder to any trade as a “thank you for doing business with us”…..

Vancouver fans have said the same thing about every GM in Canucks history.

I've posted about this before... in a Gillis vs Benning trade history post.

Plus, I have a long memory...

As a matter of fact, I have noticed fans of other teams complaining about the same thing.

(whilst searching for info at that other site)

Ownership had no patience for the actual rebuild.

I'll give you that one.

In a full rebuild fans should be ready for 5-7 years of losing hockey, with a couple of those being nigh unmitigated disasters on ice. Then the window opens.

Right again.

And yet many Canuck fans were complaining bitterly about all the losing.

Vancouver fans are an impatient bunch.

There is no question that Benning is responsible for acquiring what is currently our core. However, after 8 years of (mostly) futility I am in no way convinced that the team would have turned into what we saw this season had Benning remained at the helm. Quite likely not.

First you say "futility" is a necessity in a rebuild... then you complain about it.

Typical Canuck fan.

And who knows what would have happened if Benning remained at the helm.

Speculation, your honour!

An 8 year “retool on the fly” is not anything that fans should expect to be patient with.

Now you admit impatience was a thing and make excuses for said impatience.

"Oh, oh, it's because it was not actually a rebuild!" (semantics)

... after admitting a new young core was (somehow, magically?) built.

[BoS]

Fans got impatient with the foolish signings, piss poor trades and stupid 1st round selections . Sure Benning hit a couple of home runs and missed on a couple 1st rounds like many others, but his drafting beyond Boeser, Demko, Hughes and Pettersson was atrocious, while his personnel decisions when acquiring players were terrible outside of the Miller trade.

The summer of 2020 was one of the most poorly managed off seasons in decades.

I’d say the fans got impatient alright.

[Blob Mckenzie]

The fans didn't get impatient with a rebuild. That is a myth. They got angry at poor trades, horrible signings and terrible top ten picks.

Nailed it.

I strongly disagree... generally speaking, fans got impatient indeed.

3/5 of top ten picks duffed.

Hamstringing the team with putrid long term deals. Shitty trades can be glossed over to a point.

You just like to argue. The fans were irate when they took Olli in 2016. Is that impatience? Virtanen was a garbage pick and so was Podz. Elmer manglefucked the cap. We all know this.

I'm not sure if Allvin is the guy for the but I'm hoping so....as a fan of the team.

[Blob Mckenzie]

Fans got impatient with the foolish signings, piss poor trades and stupid 1st round selections . Sure Benning hit a couple of home runs and missed on a couple 1st rounds like many others, but his drafting beyond Boeser, Demko, Hughes and Pettersson was atrocious, while his personnel decisions when acquiring players were terrible outside of the Miller trade.

The summer of 2020 was one of the most poorly managed off seasons in decades.

I’d say the fans got impatient alright.

10/10