Cooke for Ouellet?

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Would you pull the trigger on this trade if you were the GM?

Yes, in a heartbeat
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58%
No, not in a million years
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Total votes : 24

Postby Harold » Wed Aug 23, 2006 1:36 pm

If trading away Cooke nets both Oullette and Dumont, then I say go for it. If it is just for Oullette, then I would pass.
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Postby Meerschaum » Wed Aug 23, 2006 5:22 pm

Cookie for Oullette? No.

Cookie salary dump for cap room to sign Carter? Yes.

But with our cap room dwindling, I just can't see the latter realistically happening.
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Postby orts » Wed Aug 23, 2006 7:06 pm

MinnesotaCanuck wrote:VHF has put together a very impressive website dedicated to the Canucks roster.
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Seconded re: the awesomeness of VHF's site; but are the salary numbers correct for Linden? Thought it came in at 950 or 900 or somewhat. Or has that still not been made official yet?
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Postby gobi » Wed Aug 23, 2006 7:08 pm

Wow, that's an awesome webpage of Canucks's roster, VHF!

I am hesistant to let go of Cooke as he's one player that I think we need. But if we can get something good in return then I will to swallow the lump. I am not sure if Ouellet is an equivalent trade though.
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Postby Canuck-One » Wed Aug 23, 2006 7:38 pm

Oulette it would seem is on the verge of a breakout season and could potentially be a 30 to 40 goal scorer. He has all the tools except he is a bit light and needs to bulk up a bit as he is being beaten along the boards. He can skate, shoot, pass and also has the sense, so why wouldn't you make this trade? Cooke has been a servicable 3rd line banger who in his own mind can play up on the top two lines. Well I hope he can but if not this trade would suit both teams. The fact that it gives us 1 mil more is also an incentive whether it brings in Dumont or not, though that would be my wish as I have liked his play since he was with Chicago. Speed, attitude and soft hands...sign DUMONT!!!
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Postby gobi » Wed Aug 23, 2006 11:25 pm

If the rumour about Kesler's salary demands is true I would think DN will be more inclined to shop Kesler than Cooke.
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Postby tantalum » Thu Aug 24, 2006 7:32 am

MinnesotaCanuck wrote:
levelheaded wrote:What exactly would be the point of that trade? Sure Ouellet is young and a million dollars cheaper, but for a reason. Our team is severely lacking in grit and energy. Cooke brings both of those things, and can chip in a goal or two when needed. I really want to see Cooke on the top line, just because he was so good with Nazzy and Mo at the end of the 03/04 season and playoffs. Oullet is young and completely unproven. This trade would be a pretty big step backwards, just for the sake of a million dollars cap space.


Ouellet's pro stats are pretty impressive:
NHL
05-06 50 games...16/16/32...-13 (including 18 points on the powerplay)
AHL
05-06 19 games...10/20/30...+12
04-05 80 games...31/32/63...+15
03-04 79 games...30/19/49...E

I believe Cooke has more offensive ability than some people give him credit for, but Ouellet has the potential to be a 40 goal scorer at the NHL level. I don't think Cooke is capable of putting up those kind of numbers.

I also like what this move would do for the forward lines:
Naslund-Morrison-Bulis/($2M+ free agent)
Sedin-Sedin-Bulis/($2M+ free agent)
Pyatt-Kesler-Ouellet
Burrows-Chouinard-Linden
call-ups: King, Rypien, Bouck, Santala, Dwyer?

If the team gets hit by injury, King and/or Ouellet could move up to the top lines.


I'd agree. if Nonis is making this deal, he's making for a reason. That reason would be to free up $1 mil. I can't see him just letting that money sit. It would be earmarked for a legit top 6 guy I think.

If it makes the team better it makes the team better. Think of it as Cooke for Oullet + someone else thanks to the extra money. The end result would depend on what that something else is. I can certainly see the team better. Bbut i can't help but wonder why Pittsburgh would do it. Why give up a young player with good potential?
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Postby MinnesotaCanuck » Thu Aug 24, 2006 8:31 am

Bbut i can't help but wonder why Pittsburgh would do it. Why give up a young player with good potential?


I was wondering that same thing myself. Maybe they feel that Cooke has a mix of skill and scrappiness that their lineup is in need of. At this point in their careers, Cooke is a better player. It's also possible that they figure they will be unable to resign Ouellet for a reasonable price after this season.

More importantly, their current payroll is pretty low (~$30M I believe), so they need to take on some extra salary. Cooke would help in that department.
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Postby jchockey » Thu Aug 24, 2006 10:01 am

MinnesotaCanuck wrote:
Bbut i can't help but wonder why Pittsburgh would do it. Why give up a young player with good potential?


I was wondering that same thing myself. Maybe they feel that Cooke has a mix of skill and scrappiness that their lineup is in need of. At this point in their careers, Cooke is a better player. It's also possible that they figure they will be unable to resign Ouellet for a reasonable price after this season.

More importantly, their current payroll is pretty low (~$30M I believe), so they need to take on some extra salary. Cooke would help in that department.


I think it might be because Pitts has to reach the cap ceiling by the start of the season. Matt Cooke could be a Michel Therrien type player - he works hard and agitates. God knows what would happen when you have Ruutu, Ronald Petrovicky, Eric Cairns, Andre Roy, and Cooke on your team.
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Postby tantalum » Thu Aug 24, 2006 10:25 am

MinnesotaCanuck wrote:
Bbut i can't help but wonder why Pittsburgh would do it. Why give up a young player with good potential?


I was wondering that same thing myself. Maybe they feel that Cooke has a mix of skill and scrappiness that their lineup is in need of. At this point in their careers, Cooke is a better player. It's also possible that they figure they will be unable to resign Ouellet for a reasonable price after this season.

More importantly, their current payroll is pretty low (~$30M I believe), so they need to take on some extra salary. Cooke would help in that department.


I guess I should have phrased it a bit better. I understand the desire for Pittsburgh to add some grit and good bottom 6 depth. Bottom 6 depth that can step up when injuries occur. Cooke can do that.

I guess it was more why move a young talent like that when there are similar players that could be available or were available at the start of free agency? It could be as simple as "oops we didn't get what we needed so let's go out and get who we ideally want".

It may also be as simple as it being a complete BS rumour as most are.

Personally I'd lean towards doing the deal or one like it with the corollary that nonis aquires/signs a top 6 RWer (i.e. Dumont or preferably Carter) . I'm not as excited at seeing Cooke in the top 6 as many are. I don't look at his time with Morrison and Naslund as some sort of revelation to his skill. I see his time there as what he is...a very good third line player that has a job description that includes stepping up play when called upon to play in the top 6 due to injury (or suspension). He's a very good third liner but I don't think he's going to be anymore than a filler top 6 player. A player that no matter what team he plays on, that team will be looking to upgrade the position and get him back to where he is most effective (the third line). Maybe he becomes a Scott Walker but odds are at 28 years of age it isn't going to happen.

As much as i want to give Schultz and king a shot at this team I don't want to see either of them get handed a top 6 spot (perhaps both!), which really seems to be the situation right now. I think Nonis has done a good job stregthening the bottom six forwards and he may just be able to move a little of that depth to bolster the top 6 which I think is lacking at this point.
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Postby MarkMM » Thu Aug 24, 2006 12:23 pm

MinnesotaCanuck wrote:
Bbut i can't help but wonder why Pittsburgh would do it. Why give up a young player with good potential?


I was wondering that same thing myself. Maybe they feel that Cooke has a mix of skill and scrappiness that their lineup is in need of. At this point in their careers, Cooke is a better player. It's also possible that they figure they will be unable to resign Ouellet for a reasonable price after this season.

More importantly, their current payroll is pretty low (~$30M I believe), so they need to take on some extra salary. Cooke would help in that department.


I simply assumed that Pittsburgh feels they have enough young talent and need to add some experience that can play, they've also got plenty of offensive skill, so adding more grit at the same time doesn't hurt. Cooke is also the sort of player that brings enough offense that they don't completely lose out on the scoring when Oullet's moved.
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Postby MinnesotaCanuck » Thu Aug 24, 2006 1:38 pm

MarkMM wrote:
MinnesotaCanuck wrote:
Bbut i can't help but wonder why Pittsburgh would do it. Why give up a young player with good potential?


I was wondering that same thing myself. Maybe they feel that Cooke has a mix of skill and scrappiness that their lineup is in need of. At this point in their careers, Cooke is a better player. It's also possible that they figure they will be unable to resign Ouellet for a reasonable price after this season.

More importantly, their current payroll is pretty low (~$30M I believe), so they need to take on some extra salary. Cooke would help in that department.


I simply assumed that Pittsburgh feels they have enough young talent and need to add some experience that can play, they've also got plenty of offensive skill, so adding more grit at the same time doesn't hurt. Cooke is also the sort of player that brings enough offense that they don't completely lose out on the scoring when Oullet's moved.


I guess that's what I was trying to say with my first paragraph. I wasn't very specific.
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Postby BBQSAUCE » Thu Aug 24, 2006 3:22 pm

Oulette would be a good player but not for Cooke. He was amazing with Naslund and Morrison and by what I see with the lines you are putting together, I don't think that Naslund and Morrison will play well together without a guy who can hit. I think either cooke or pyatt can fill that role, but i think that naslund wants cooke to be the one by the comments that he made..
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Postby Bartman » Thu Aug 24, 2006 5:27 pm

Reading a couple of Penguin fan sites the feeling is that Ouellet isn't even a lock to make the team this season. The guy seems similar to a Jason King. Great guy to have in the system for depth scoring and maybe a future top 6 but not someone to move Cooke for unless there was more in the package comming our way.
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Postby tantalum » Fri Aug 25, 2006 4:53 am

Bartman wrote:Reading a couple of Penguin fan sites the feeling is that Ouellet isn't even a lock to make the team this season. The guy seems similar to a Jason King. Great guy to have in the system for depth scoring and maybe a future top 6 but not someone to move Cooke for unless there was more in the package comming our way.


I think you are looking at it in the wrong way. Oullet may not be a lock to make the team, but that doesn't really matter as the main idea behind such a deal is to free up about a million in cap space.. Oullet would provide scoring depth for atleast the Moose and perhaps develop into a player for the canucks. With the number of bottom 6 bodies Nonis has right now he can move someone else into Cooke's spot that makes considerably less and use the extra money to sign Carter or another legitimate top 6 forward. It eliminates a scoring question mark on the top two lines.

With Linden, Kesler, Santala, Pyatt, Bulis, Bouck, Chouinard, King, Schultz, Oullet you then have enough bodies to round out the lineup by plugging the other top 6 RW spot (i.e. Bulis, Pyatt, King or Schultz or some combination thereof) while rounding out a decent bottom 6.

Nonis has built up the bottom 6 depth. I think there is a reason for this beyond injury depth. It gives him flexibility to move a body and free up cap space if he sees a player on the UFA market or trade market that he thinks can help round out the top 6.
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