The Great Jim Benning Debate!

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Re: The Great Jim Benning Debate!

Postby RoyalDude » Sat May 20, 2017 8:40 am

ESQ wrote:
Compare that to the Canucks, who only had Schroeder, Rodin and Connauton picked in the first 3 rounds of those
2 years


Holy Hell, how awful is that? Not sure what's a worse statement, the draft where we didn't get a pick until the 4th round( the infamous Ballard trade Draft) only having 4 picks in that draft or that juicy bit of info? At least we got Derek Roy for a month for our 2nd round pick and Connauton(3rd rounder)
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Re: The Great Jim Benning Debate!

Postby RoyalDude » Sat May 20, 2017 9:13 am

Gillis first 3 drafts with the Canucks

2008
1st round - Hodgson
2nd round - Sauve
5th round - Rai
6th round - Froshaug
7th round - Clark

2009
1st round - Schroeder
2nd round - Rodin
3rd round - Connauton
4th round - Price
5th round - Andersson
6th round - Canata
7th round - Anthony

2010
1st round - nobody
2nd round - nobody
3rd round - nobody
4th round - McNally
5th round - Polasek
6th round - Friesen
7th round - Hannah

Bennings first 3 drafts with the Canucks

2014
1st round - Virtanen
1st round - McCann
2nd round - Demko
3rd round - Tryamkin
5th round - Forsling
6th round - Petit
7th round - Stewart

2015
1st round - Boeser
3rd round - Brisebios
4th round - Zhukenov
5th round - Neil
5th round - Gaudette
6th round - Jasek
7th round - Olson

2016
1st round - Juolevi
3rd round - Lockwood
5th round - Candella
6th round - Stukel
7th round - Abols
7th round - McKenzie
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Re: The Great Jim Benning Debate!

Postby Ronning's Ghost » Sat May 20, 2017 11:29 am

You keep losing the plot, RD. The thread is not 'The Great Mike Gillis Debate'. Whether or not Mike Gillis was any good is no longer relevant, and of very limited interest.

You're not even helping your argument for Jim Benning's competence. If you insist that Mike Gillis was an absolutely terrible GM, and then argue that Jim Benning is better, then there's still room for Benning to be pretty bad, if the best thing you can say about him is that he's better than a GM you consider to be terrible.

How about comparing Benning to Sam Pollock ?
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Re: The Great Jim Benning Debate!

Postby SKYO » Sat May 20, 2017 12:59 pm

Well what I think we can all agree is on even from the media analysts is Benning trading and contracts have been mediocre, but his drafting has been his bread and butter.....yes sans Virtanen(still a work in progress though), I'd like to see how Virtanen is playing when he's 22, 23 years old, that's probably when he's flying around like a Evander Kane style, a fast/gritty/shooter.
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Re: The Great Jim Benning Debate!

Postby Lancer » Sat May 20, 2017 1:24 pm

SKYO wrote:I'd like to see how Virtanen is playing when he's 22, 23 years old, that's probably when he's flying around like a Evander Kane style, a fast/gritty/shooter.


You could argue that if Kane hadn't been rushed into Atlanta, and put in some time to learn to be a pro on and off the ice in the AHL, he may not have developed the troubling traits that make him virtually untradeable. He didn't put up the same numbers in his rookie year as Keith Jr. did this year, but you hope Keith Jr. doesn't get too big of a head and develop Kane-like tendencies if you're a Flamers fan.

Maybe that was a bit of the calculus behind sending Virtanen to the minors. I recall stories about how he made the Canucks because management didn't want him going back to Calgary, and it was NHL of CHL for the kid, so they bit the bullet that one year hoping he could learn on the fly. I dunno, speculation on my part but it would make sense.

I agree, SKYO, I think Benning's pick of Virtanen needs a couple more years before a judgement is made.
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Re: The Great Jim Benning Debate!

Postby Blob Mckenzie » Sat May 20, 2017 1:27 pm

Ronning's Ghost wrote:You keep losing the plot, RD. The thread is not 'The Great Mike Gillis Debate'. Whether or not Mike Gillis was any good is no longer relevant, and of very limited interest.

You're not even helping your argument for Jim Benning's competence. If you insist that Mike Gillis was an absolutely terrible GM, and then argue that Jim Benning is better, then there's still room for Benning to be pretty bad, if the best thing you can say about him is that he's better than a GM you consider to be terrible.

How about comparing Benning to Sam Pollock ?

Lol at RG. The dude covers himself with piss about Gillis in every thread every day. He's a big hairy moose with a bladder the size of an aphid
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Re: The Great Jim Benning Debate!

Postby RoyalDude » Sat May 20, 2017 5:50 pm

Ronning's Ghost wrote:You keep losing the plot, RD. The thread is not 'The Great Mike Gillis Debate'. Whether or not Mike Gillis was any good is no longer relevant, and of very limited interest.

You're not even helping your argument for Jim Benning's competence. If you insist that Mike Gillis was an absolutely terrible GM, and then argue that Jim Benning is better, then there's still room for Benning to be pretty bad, if the best thing you can say about him is that he's better than a GM you consider to be terrible.

How about comparing Benning to Sam Pollock ?


Listen RG Bunker did ya dig Gilleye's first 3 years at the draft table or were you not cool with it? Shit I don't know how anyone in their right mind could be cool with it, maybe the mad Sicilian - Roberto Macenzzi but that is just about it. The Canucks have zilch from Gilleyes first 3 years at the draft table! Zilch! Hell, Benning did better in the 2nd and 3rd round of his first draft than Gilleye did in ALL the rounds of his first 3 drafts. Gawd fucking awful I tell ya.
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Re: The Great Jim Benning Debate!

Postby Ronning's Ghost » Sun May 21, 2017 12:03 am

RoyalDude wrote:
Ronning's Ghost wrote:You keep losing the plot, RD. The thread is not 'The Great Mike Gillis Debate'. Whether or not Mike Gillis was any good is no longer relevant, and of very limited interest.

You're not even helping your argument for Jim Benning's competence. If you insist that Mike Gillis was an absolutely terrible GM, and then argue that Jim Benning is better, then there's still room for Benning to be pretty bad, if the best thing you can say about him is that he's better than a GM you consider to be terrible.

How about comparing Benning to Sam Pollock ?


Listen RG Bunker did ya dig Gilleye's first 3 years at the draft table or were you not cool with it? Shit I don't know how anyone in their right mind could be cool with it, maybe the mad Sicilian - Roberto Macenzzi but that is just about it. The Canucks have zilch from Gilleyes first 3 years at the draft table! Zilch! Hell, Benning did better in the 2nd and 3rd round of his first draft than Gilleye did in ALL the rounds of his first 3 drafts. Gawd fucking awful I tell ya.


If, as a long-time Benning skeptic, I concede that Benning started in a disadvantageous position, can we just move on from there and keep this thread about how good a job he has done of managing his way forward out of that position ?
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Re: The Great Jim Benning Debate!

Postby RoyalDude » Sun May 21, 2017 8:16 am

Ronning's Ghost wrote:
If, as a long-time Benning skeptic, I concede that Benning started in a disadvantageous position?


I am stunned, RG Bunker!

They are finally admitting it, my mission may be over. Doc you see this?

What an admission, thank you, RG
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Re: The Great Jim Benning Debate!

Postby micky107 » Sun May 21, 2017 8:33 am

Ronning's Ghost wrote:
RoyalDude wrote:
Ronning's Ghost wrote:You keep losing the plot, RD. The thread is not 'The Great Mike Gillis Debate'. Whether or not Mike Gillis was any good is no longer relevant, and of very limited interest.

You're not even helping your argument for Jim Benning's competence. If you insist that Mike Gillis was an absolutely terrible GM, and then argue that Jim Benning is better, then there's still room for Benning to be pretty bad, if the best thing you can say about him is that he's better than a GM you consider to be terrible.

How about comparing Benning to Sam Pollock ?


Listen RG Bunker did ya dig Gilleye's first 3 years at the draft table or were you not cool with it? Shit I don't know how anyone in their right mind could be cool with it, maybe the mad Sicilian - Roberto Macenzzi but that is just about it. The Canucks have zilch from Gilleyes first 3 years at the draft table! Zilch! Hell, Benning did better in the 2nd and 3rd round of his first draft than Gilleye did in ALL the rounds of his first 3 drafts. Gawd fucking awful I tell ya.


If, as a long-time Benning skeptic, I concede that Benning started in a disadvantageous position, can we just move on from there and keep this thread about how good a job he has done of managing his way forward out of that position ?


If that means; Let's stop dwelling in the past and move forward, HOORAY !!!

If not, let's start connecting ALL the dots and keep going in reverse; Nonis left? Burke left? Quinn left? and go all the back to 1970.
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Re: The Great Jim Benning Debate!

Postby Blob Mckenzie » Sun May 21, 2017 8:40 am

RoyalDude wrote:
Ronning's Ghost wrote:
If, as a long-time Benning skeptic, I concede that Benning started in a disadvantageous position?


I am stunned, RG Bunker!

They are finally admitting it, my mission may be over. Doc you see this?

What an admission, thank you, RG



I think we all know that Elmer walked into a situation that wasn't ideal and the team was barren of young talent. It doesn't excuse some of the blunders he has made in his three years here.
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Re: The Great Jim Benning Debate!

Postby RoyalDude » Sun May 21, 2017 8:50 am

Blob Mckenzie wrote:
RoyalDude wrote:
Ronning's Ghost wrote:
If, as a long-time Benning skeptic, I concede that Benning started in a disadvantageous position?


I am stunned, RG Bunker!

They are finally admitting it, my mission may be over. Doc you see this?

What an admission, thank you, RG



I think we all know that Elmer walked into a situation that wasn't ideal and the team was barren of young talent. It doesn't excuse some of the blunders he has made in his three years here.


Your two cents on Bennings drafting in his first 3 years compared to Gillis first 3 years? Listen Blob, when you are stealing the Demkos, Tryamkins, Gaudettes, Lockwoods, Brisebios, way outside the first round that is nothing short of genius. Do you feel that drafting well is key to the Canucks getting back to its former glory? The glory that Gillis single handedly destroyed!!!
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Re: The Great Jim Benning Debate!

Postby Blob Mckenzie » Sun May 21, 2017 9:16 am

Every team has Gaudette , Lockwood and Brisebois type prospects. None of these guys has proven a thing. Tryamkin was a good pick but he wants nothing to do with this organization.Elmer will be judged on Boeser, Juolevi, Virtanen, McCann and this years pick.
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Re: The Great Jim Benning Debate!

Postby rats19 » Sun May 21, 2017 9:34 am

Gillis was in a do or die situation with aging vets his window was "now" so to speak. A lot like Dallas right now, in that scenario you don't protect your pics as hard as maybe they should. To me that's why gillis drafting sucked he put it all out there for the ... now.

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Re: The Great Jim Benning Debate!

Postby RoyalDude » Sun May 21, 2017 9:37 am

Blob Mckenzie wrote:Every team has Gaudette , Lockwood and Brisebois type prospects. None of these guys has proven a thing. Tryamkin was a good pick but he wants nothing to do with this organization.Elmer will be judged on Boeser, Juolevi, Virtanen, McCann and this years pick.


Gaudette ranked 40th on Craig Buttons Top 50 prospects list. Pierre MaGuire drools over Gaudette but that don't matter, just McCann matters who never made the top 50 list, whom the Panthers are not happy with but we got Gudbranson for? Boeser drafted 23rd overall was ranked 15th if memory serves. How'd you like Boesers play when
We signed him? Demko made the list as well, but that don't matter
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