Canucks News and Notes

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Island Nucklehead
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Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by Island Nucklehead » Thu Mar 17, 2016 10:52 pm

Strangelove wrote:
micky107 wrote: This year the opportunity is there to have your future main stays to be going head to head with teams where every point matters.
Hate to say it but Babcock is doing it in TO and it's not bad to watch.
Just thought I'd interject a little perspective...
The Leaves are rebuilding through the draft and have 12 picks in the 2016 draft, and 8 in 2017. They had 5 top-90 picks last year. They have traded away their big contracts, and acquired Pittsburgh's 2014 1st round pick Kasperi Kappanen.

The Canucks are "transitioning while remaining competitive' and have 7 picks in the 2016 draft, and 5 in 2017. They had 3 top-90 picks last year. They traded away one of their 2013 first rounders and one of their most promising offensive prospects, for a more "NHL-ready" 2011 2nd rounder.

The big difference between the Maple Leaves and the Canucks it that the Leaves know they suck. Toronto brought in a pile of mediocre UFA's as real placeholders while the kids stayed under the radar and out of the pressure cooker in the minors. Once the deadline was over, kids come up and get their 20+ games in to prep for next year.

Another dose of perspective, the Leaves, with all their aggressive tanking, have won 3 fewer games than us. They also have more cap space heading into UFA season.

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Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by Arachnid » Fri Mar 18, 2016 12:14 am

Island Nucklehead wrote:
Strangelove wrote:
micky107 wrote: This year the opportunity is there to have your future main stays to be going head to head with teams where every point matters.
Hate to say it but Babcock is doing it in TO and it's not bad to watch.
Just thought I'd interject a little perspective...
The Leaves are rebuilding through the draft and have 12 picks in the 2016 draft, and 8 in 2017. They had 5 top-90 picks last year. They have traded away their big contracts, and acquired Pittsburgh's 2014 1st round pick Kasperi Kappanen.

The Canucks are "transitioning while remaining competitive' and have 7 picks in the 2016 draft, and 5 in 2017. They had 3 top-90 picks last year. They traded away one of their 2013 first rounders and one of their most promising offensive prospects, for a more "NHL-ready" 2011 2nd rounder.

The big difference between the Maple Leaves and the Canucks it that the Leaves know they suck. Toronto brought in a pile of mediocre UFA's as real placeholders while the kids stayed under the radar and out of the pressure cooker in the minors. Once the deadline was over, kids come up and get their 20+ games in to prep for next year.

Another dose of perspective, the Leaves, with all their aggressive tanking, have won 3 fewer games than us. They also have more cap space heading into UFA season.
Pffft wotta loada....

Tarrana....sells out seats to suits no matter how bad they are

Vanhover....fickle fans go boating instead of watching

That's the only difference.
Last edited by Arachnid on Fri Mar 18, 2016 7:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by Topper » Fri Mar 18, 2016 6:20 am

The leaves are at least a year behind the Vancouver process.

The the top end of their lineup was full of over inflated contracts. Personnel have been moved, but some of those contracts are still on the books. They are void of character vets to guide their youth.

First they tried to buy their way to being competitive because unlike Edmonton, FA's will go to TO. That didn't wok.

They tried to go through the season with junk castoffs and that didn't wok.

Now they have kids, and more coming, but no leadership.
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micky107
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Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by micky107 » Fri Mar 18, 2016 9:03 am

O.K. But has anyone thought of what to do with Alex Burrows. It's tough because I doubt, even if he waived his no trade, that we would get much.
Would you take a late second or third rounder?
Would you keep him around to help mentor the youngsters?
I don't know. What I would not do is just swap bad contracts.
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Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by Doyle Hargraves » Fri Mar 18, 2016 9:30 am

micky107 wrote:O.K. But has anyone thought of what to do with Alex Burrows. It's tough because I doubt, even if he waived his no trade, that we would get much.
Would you take a late second or third rounder?
Would you keep him around to help mentor the youngsters?
I don't know. What I would not do is just swap bad contracts.
The team is stuck with Burrows for one more year after this one. You won't be seeing any teams trading a second or third round pick to Elmer for the biter. Just let him walk next July 1 , the same as Miller.
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Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by micky107 » Fri Mar 18, 2016 10:08 am

Would like to see what JB could do throughout next year if we could manage to be 4 or 5 mill under the cap.
Been many years since we've had that.
At least he'd be able to talk turkey with other GMs on a more equal playing field.
"evolution"

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Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by DonCherry4PM » Fri Mar 18, 2016 10:19 am

Blob Mckenzie wrote:
micky107 wrote:O.K. But has anyone thought of what to do with Alex Burrows. It's tough because I doubt, even if he waived his no trade, that we would get much.
Would you take a late second or third rounder?
Would you keep him around to help mentor the youngsters?
I don't know. What I would not do is just swap bad contracts.
The team is stuck with Burrows for one more year after this one. You won't be seeing any teams trading a second or third round pick to Elmer for the biter. Just let him walk next July 1 , the same as Miller.

You could try to flog him next TDD as a playoff run acquisition, but without him having at least some resurgence from this terrible year, it might be difficult to get anything (assuming you had management that wanted to sell UFA's for assets).
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Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by Island Nucklehead » Fri Mar 18, 2016 10:41 am

Blob Mckenzie wrote:
micky107 wrote:O.K. But has anyone thought of what to do with Alex Burrows. It's tough because I doubt, even if he waived his no trade, that we would get much.
Would you take a late second or third rounder?
Would you keep him around to help mentor the youngsters?
I don't know. What I would not do is just swap bad contracts.
The team is stuck with Burrows for one more year after this one. You won't be seeing any teams trading a second or third round pick to Elmer for the biter. Just let him walk next July 1 , the same as Miller.
Yeah I don't think you're going to get anyone to bite on Burrows :lol: especially with his trade protection, tough sell unless we want to bring a bad contract back.

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Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by micky107 » Fri Mar 18, 2016 11:45 am

Talk him into being a color guy on some hockey panel
"evolution"

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Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by Meds » Fri Mar 18, 2016 11:50 am

Island Nucklehead wrote:
Blob Mckenzie wrote:
micky107 wrote:O.K. But has anyone thought of what to do with Alex Burrows. It's tough because I doubt, even if he waived his no trade, that we would get much.
Would you take a late second or third rounder?
Would you keep him around to help mentor the youngsters?
I don't know. What I would not do is just swap bad contracts.
The team is stuck with Burrows for one more year after this one. You won't be seeing any teams trading a second or third round pick to Elmer for the biter. Just let him walk next July 1 , the same as Miller.
Yeah I don't think you're going to get anyone to bite on Burrows :lol: especially with his trade protection, tough sell unless we want to bring a bad contract back.
If it's cap space we're looking for and also want a decent asset/pick coming back in return, you trade Hansen at the draft. His $2.5M is easily moved without retaining, and his value at that sticker price is worth a good return. Take a pick or two back, and have that extra cap, smart asset management because Hansen is soon to become a diminishing asset. His real value is to a team that is close to contender status, he brings leadership, experience, and the ability to move up and down the line-up and reliably play in most situations. He's also one of the better checking wingers in the league.

Moving Burrows is going to require retaining salary or taking a contract back in return. My guess is that the most you gain in cap space if you trade Burrows is $3M, and the return you get for him is likely significantly less than you get for Hansen. I figure if Hansen is worth a 2nd and a prospect, or a 2nd and a 3rd, Burrows gets you a 3rd and nothing else.....and best. Burrows can still move up and down our line-up, and his value is greater to the Canucks than another team because he can still play effectively with the Sedins, but he is also a team guy who won't gripe about 4th line duty. He's also still a very smart defensive forward, I would say he's smarter than Hansen, but has lost a step and a half.

Anyways, if it's a toss-up between those guys, I think you max out your return on a guy for a change and move on.

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Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by Strangelove » Fri Mar 18, 2016 11:55 am

Island Nucklehead wrote: The Leaves are rebuilding through the draft and have 12 picks in the 2016 draft, and 8 in 2017.
You are premature... this is always a very fluid situation.

We actually don't know how many selections the Leaves (or Canucks) will make in those drafts.

But yeah, so far the Leaves have traded away all their proven stars ('cept Rielly, JVR?) for magic beans

... and this ain't no fairy tale. :mrgreen:
Island Nucklehead wrote: They have traded away their big contracts stars and acquired Pittsburgh's 2014 1st round pick Kasperi Kappanen.
OMG Kapanen sucks!

I wonder if your Leaves tried to trade him for Granlund and the Flames said "FUCK OFF". :lol:
Island Nucklehead wrote: [Leaves] had 5 top-90 picks last year.

[Canucks] had 3 top-90 picks last year.
And in the previous 2 drafts:

Leaves had 4 total top-90 picks.

Canucks had 7 total top-90 picks.

:mex:
Island Nucklehead wrote: Toronto brought in a pile of mediocre UFA's as real placeholders while the kids stayed under the radar and out of the pressure cooker in the minors. Once the deadline was over, kids come up and get their 20+ games in to prep for next year.
The most "kids" that could fall into your "20+ games post-DL" fairy tale category is 4 at this point.

(and your buddy Kapanen is not one of them)

But once again you're premature, perhaps it ends up being zero...
Island Nucklehead wrote: Another dose of perspective, the Leaves, with all their aggressive tanking, have won 3 fewer games than us. They also have more cap space heading into UFA season.
Ummm... "they know they suck" and they want to continue sucking.... so they're going to splurge on UFAs? Image
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Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by ESQ » Fri Mar 18, 2016 12:20 pm

micky107 wrote:Would like to see what JB could do throughout next year if we could manage to be 4 or 5 mill under the cap.
Been many years since we've had that.
At least he'd be able to talk turkey with other GMs on a more equal playing field.
With the number of players on ELCs that I could see making the team next season, I would expect quite a bit of cap space.

The last times the Canucks went into a season with an abundance of cap space, they wound up with Mats Sundin and Ehrhoff while only giving up two failed prospects, so it would be great to have that flexibility again.

RFAs to be signed are Etem, Vey, Granlund and Baertschi. I could all of them returning, but I don't see huge raises for any of them.
Strangelove wrote:
Island Nucklehead wrote: [Leaves] had 5 top-90 picks last year.

[Canucks] had 3 top-90 picks last year.
And in the previous 2 drafts:

Leaves had 4 total top-90 picks.

Canucks had 7 total top-90 picks.

:mex:
Topper wrote:The leaves are at least a year behind the Vancouver process.
As the Topper has said.

I like the Canucks prospect pool more than Toronto's, mostly because the kids who made the team earned it, and forced out vets like Prust, Higgins, and Weber. Toronto's kids couldn't earn a spot out of camp, and instead are getting time because everybody got shipped out at the deadline.

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Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by Island Nucklehead » Fri Mar 18, 2016 12:43 pm

Strangelove wrote:
Ummm... "they know they suck" and they want to continue sucking.... so they're going to splurge on UFAs? Image
Isn't that what we plan on doing, despite being neck and neck with the Laughs for fewest wins in the NHL? That's been a big part of the farcical defense of our putrid deadline people have made 'round these parts lately: letting guys like Hamhuis walk for no return is actually a good thing because we get cap space and 20 games of invaluable mentorship. Image

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Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by micky107 » Fri Mar 18, 2016 12:48 pm

Question: Where is really the best place to develop your prospects.
Junior (if still eligible) ?
U.S. college (they would already have to be there) ?
Europe ?
A.H.L. (20 or older) ?
I would assume most would say A.H.L. I'm not one.
Back in my younger days, I got stuck in the old I.H.L. a couple of years and those dressing rooms are tough. You have way different age groups and major different agendas. The farm is rough. Really hard for young guys except that all they want to do is get the hell out and maybe that's good initiative.
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Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by ESQ » Fri Mar 18, 2016 1:02 pm

micky107 wrote:Question: Where is really the best place to develop your prospects.
Junior (if still eligible) ?
U.S. college (they would already have to be there) ?
Europe ?
A.H.L. (20 or older) ?
I would assume most would say A.H.L. I'm not one.
Back in my younger days, I got stuck in the old I.H.L. a couple of years and those dressing rooms are tough.
Opinions?
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