Around the league (signings, RFAs injuries)

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Re: Around the league (signings, RFAs injuries)

Postby Mondi » Wed Jun 25, 2014 12:07 pm

Is it only if you sign after 35 that all those penalties kick in? Or is it just if you are over 35 and you retire?

So many stupid rules to deal with the cap.
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Re: Around the league (signings, RFAs injuries)

Postby Betamax » Wed Jun 25, 2014 1:00 pm

Mondi wrote:Is it only if you sign after 35 that all those penalties kick in? Or is it just if you are over 35 and you retire?

So many stupid rules to deal with the cap.


I think it is if you're 35 or over when the new contract comes into effect, the remainder counts even if you retire. So if Gaborik retires before the end of deal, the Kings will be off the hook because he will be 32 when the contract comes into effect. :mex:
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Re: Around the league (signings, RFAs injuries)

Postby dbr » Wed Jun 25, 2014 1:29 pm

black ace wrote:
dbr wrote:
Island Nucklehead wrote:Probably the "going rate" for Callahan, but I don't like it in term or dollars.


Speaking of the going rate.. with the cap increase already falling slightly this year, if revenue stagnates and the Canadian dollar gets weaker it'd probably be better for the long term interests of this franchise to mostly stay out of UFA and keep their space for future offseasons where inflation is much less of a factor.


Not going to happen. The cap is going to continue to rise and quite quickly.


The cap is going to continue to rise but will we see it jump roughly 10% like it is going to this season? I don't think so. Even with the players 5% increase option I have a hard time seeing average annual increases like this one over any sustained period.

If the increases slow down significantly, teams spending like that's not going to happen are going to be hurting. Teams that have more cap space will get better value for those cap dollars, and even with an average or mediocre UFA class a team with more space will be better able to get good value due to smaller amounts of inflation.

Don't get me wrong, there is no way the Canucks sit out of UFA in a year where they desperately need to improve and have a passable product to sell to the fans. I just think that if they're not going to contend next year, if the players in UFA are worse (as a whole) than ever and prices are higher than ever, there's no sense making long term commitments.

But yeah if the cap's going to jump 10% every year then give Vanek and Stastny $70m 7 year deals and be done with it. By the back half of those contracts they'll look great under a $95m (then $103m, then $114m, then $125m) cap ceiling!
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Re: Around the league (signings, RFAs injuries)

Postby Betamax » Wed Jun 25, 2014 1:35 pm

dbr wrote:
black ace wrote:
dbr wrote:
Island Nucklehead wrote:Probably the "going rate" for Callahan, but I don't like it in term or dollars.


Speaking of the going rate.. with the cap increase already falling slightly this year, if revenue stagnates and the Canadian dollar gets weaker it'd probably be better for the long term interests of this franchise to mostly stay out of UFA and keep their space for future offseasons where inflation is much less of a factor.


Not going to happen. The cap is going to continue to rise and quite quickly.


The cap is going to continue to rise but will we see it jump roughly 10% like it is going to this season? I don't think so. Even with the players 5% increase option I have a hard time seeing average annual increases like this one over any sustained period.

If the increases slow down significantly, teams spending like that's not going to happen are going to be hurting. Teams that have more cap space will get better value for those cap dollars, and even with an average or mediocre UFA class a team with more space will be better able to get good value due to smaller amounts of inflation.


Let's see the new Canadian Television Deal comes into effect next season, teams with old arenas like the Oilers and NYI will be moving to high revenue generating new arenas within the next couple of years, and we will likely see an expansion of two teams within 5 years, IMO. :mex:


Don't get me wrong, there is no way the Canucks sit out of UFA in a year where they desperately need to improve and have a passable product to sell to the fans. I just think that if they're not going to contend next year, if the players in UFA are worse (as a whole) than ever and prices are higher than ever, there's no sense making long term commitments.


Well, I agree with you on this point. Just go after secondary players on short term contracts to fill the roster ... guys like Mike Santorelli and see how things end up being. I mean missing the playoffs isn't the worst thing that can happen to the team long term (at least on ice) as it gives them a better chance to draft a potential generational talent. :mex:
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Re: Around the league (signings, RFAs injuries)

Postby dbr » Wed Jun 25, 2014 1:44 pm

Betamax wrote:Let's see the new Canadian Television Deal comes into effect next season, teams with old arenas like the Oilers and NYI will be moving to high revenue generating new arenas within the next couple of years, and we will likely see an expansion of two teams within 5 years, IMO. :mex:


This year's cap increase comes after an artificially set cap number for two consecutive seasons, it does not reflect year over year growth and expecting future growth based on it would be foolhardy.

The Canadian TV deal comes into effect and then no new TV deal for 12 years.

Expansion will lead to an overall increase in HRR but as the expansion fees are not included in that sum the two new franchises would have to immediately become above average revenue teams to drive up the cap number (HRR / # of contracts on the books - any expansion team increases both values).

And none of this touches the most important variable of all, the Canadian dollar: based on some Forbes figures and some quick scratch math, about 27% of league revenues (and 61% of its operating income) are from franchises in Canada. Devaluing the currency is seen as one of a small number of ways to stimulate economic growth and most are predicting its value in comparison to the USD to remain poor for quite some time.
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Re: Around the league (signings, RFAs injuries)

Postby Topper » Wed Jun 25, 2014 3:27 pm

dbr wrote:
Island Nucklehead wrote:Probably the "going rate" for Callahan, but I don't like it in term or dollars.


Speaking of the going rate.. with the cap increase already falling slightly this year, if revenue stagnates and the Canadian dollar gets weaker it'd probably be better for the long term interests of this franchise to mostly stay out of UFA and keep their space for future offseasons where inflation is much less of a factor.

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Re: Around the league (signings, RFAs injuries)

Postby Strangelove » Wed Jun 25, 2014 3:32 pm

Jovocop wrote:I hate Bolland. I don't know I will cheer for the Canucks anymore....

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The Bolland camp won't do anything with Vancouver until they resolve the Ryan Kesler situation.


I think Bolland is the kind of player you like when he's on YOUR team. :D

It's funny, I was thinking this morning that Bolland might be the target if Kes is traded for prospects/picks.

7 year front-loaded with a $4.5m cap hit.

He and Santo in a 2a/2b situation?

(Santo signed for 2 years at $1.5m per)

Don't think alotta posters here are gonna be in favour but it might be the best way to partially fill the hole.

Bolland is an asshole!!

EDIT: oh fuck, just saw the Bolland thread, SWEAR I was thinking about him before the news came out!
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Re: Around the league (signings, RFAs injuries)

Postby Betamax » Wed Jun 25, 2014 5:25 pm

dbr wrote:
Betamax wrote:Let's see the new Canadian Television Deal comes into effect next season, teams with old arenas like the Oilers and NYI will be moving to high revenue generating new arenas within the next couple of years, and we will likely see an expansion of two teams within 5 years, IMO. :mex:


This year's cap increase comes after an artificially set cap number for two consecutive seasons, it does not reflect year over year growth and expecting future growth based on it would be foolhardy.

The Canadian TV deal comes into effect and then no new TV deal for 12 years.


Uh, don't also forget regional deals have or will increase in value significantly than in the past.

Via my beloved hfboards:

http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showt ... ?t=1613865

liveschedules wrote:Hi, guys.

I'm trying to put together a list of how much each NHL team earns from its local TV contract, or at least find out the league average. There have been previous attempts to do this here (link) and there (link), but the info on the old threads is somewhat dated now. As most of you know, the NHL recently signed vastly improved national rights deals in both Canada and the US. It stands to reason that the size of local TV agreements has gone up a bit too.

The best data I've found is from this Forbes article (link), published in Nov 2013. Unfortunately, it only shows the ten teams with the highest-value contracts*:

*Update: new contracts added.

1. Montreal Canadiens - $61m/year ($68m CAD) (RDS); runs through 2025-26; (new deal starts next season; up from $33/year)
2. Toronto Maple Leafs - $41m/year (Sportsnet, TSN, Leafs TV); through 2014-15.
3. New York Rangers - $35m (MSG Network)
4. Ottawa Senators - $30m ($33m CAD) (TSN/RDS); through 2025-26; (deal starts next season: up from $10/yr)
5. Detroit Red Wings - $30m (Fox Sports Detroit); through 2018-19 or 19-20 (not sure)
6. Vancouver Canucks - $25m (Sportsnet Pacific, Sportsnet One); through 22-23 season
7. New York Islanders - $24m (MSG Network); through 2030-31
8. New Jersey Devils - $24m (MSG Network); through 2024-25
9. Dallas Stars - $20m (Fox Sports Southwest); ends this season
10. Los Angeles Kings - $20m (Fox Sports West); through 23-24
11. Pittsburgh Penguins - $18m (Root Sports); through 28-29

The annual average for those teams is $29.8m USD* (updated since original post). However, I've had a hard time finding reliable numbers for the other nineteen. In news articles and press releases about contract signings and extensions, dollar amounts are often not mentioned. For example, the Coyotes announced the signing of a 12-year deal with Fox Sports Arizona last November, but were conspicuously mum on how much they were going to be paid.

We all know that the smallest teams in the NHL don't make much from local TV deals. However, it would be nice to know whether teams at the very bottom make only a little less than other teams in the bottom third, or are extreme outliers that depress the league average. If any of you happen to remember hearing or reading about your teams' local TV contract, please post here. (PS: This is my first post. Thanks for bearing with me so far.)


Expansion will lead to an overall increase in HRR but as the expansion fees are not included in that sum the two new franchises would have to immediately become above average revenue teams to drive up the cap number (HRR / # of contracts on the books - any expansion team increases both values).


Well, look at the cities they are looking to put a team in. Quebec City (Canadian team) with a brand new state of the art rink and Seattle. I don't think any expansion city will be below average performers especially with the buzz of having a new expansion franchise and the obligatory "honeymoon period" like we've seen with the return of hockey in Winnipeg.

And none of this touches the most important variable of all, the Canadian dollar: based on some Forbes figures and some quick scratch math, about 27% of league revenues (and 61% of its operating income) are from franchises in Canada. Devaluing the currency is seen as one of a small number of ways to stimulate economic growth and most are predicting its value in comparison to the USD to remain poor for quite some time.


I agree that is definitely an x-factor but interest in the the NHL game as at an all-time high in the United States, their biggest markets have had recent success, add those annual Winter Classic and Stadium Series Games and future World Cup of Hockey tournament ...... they are always finding ways to generate more HRR. :mex:
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Re: Around the league (signings, RFAs injuries)

Postby dbr » Wed Jun 25, 2014 10:56 pm

I don't think the regional TV deals will be that big a deal.

Montreal and Toronto may add $30m to the pot each and others will surely add some as well but divide that by 30 franchises and then half it and see what it does to the salary cap midpoint.. not much.

I'm not sure why Seattle is such a sure bet to be an above average revenue franchise - right now they have no building, they don't have much of a pro hockey tradition to speak of and any NHL franchise will be directly competing with an NBA franchise in addition to virtually every other major sport as well. Quebec, sure, that's one franchise. Other than that (since we're extremely unlikely to see another southern Ontario franchise) I don't see any other no brainer potential locations out there. And if the dollar falls even Quebec isn't a sure thing.
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Re: Around the league (signings, RFAs injuries)

Postby BigTuna » Wed Jun 25, 2014 11:26 pm

Mondi wrote:LA finally has a bad contract on the books!

7 years for Gabby is not best, not at 33.

But, he did earn it.


Are you kidding? They have lots. They were dumb to not buy-out Richards.
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Re: Around the league (signings, RFAs injuries)

Postby Hockey Widow » Thu Jun 26, 2014 5:19 pm

Flyers have given Vinny camp permission to speak to other teams to try and secure a trade. The Flyers have been unable to move him so the feeling is his agent may be able to put something together. If a trade is worked out it will be a salary dump for the Flyers, they want to be done with his contract but have used their two compliance buyouts.
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Re: Around the league (signings, RFAs injuries)

Postby Todd Bersnoozi » Thu Jun 26, 2014 5:36 pm

Hockey Widow wrote:Flyers have given Vinny camp permission to speak to other teams to try and secure a trade. The Flyers have been unable to move him so the feeling is his agent may be able to put something together. If a trade is worked out it will be a salary dump for the Flyers, they want to be done with his contract but have used their two compliance buyouts.


Wow, Phillie throws money around like toilet paper. Didn't they just sign Vinny last year? They bought out a couple of other guys with fat contracts as well (Bryzgalov and another guy).
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Re: Around the league (signings, RFAs injuries)

Postby Meds » Thu Jun 26, 2014 8:12 pm

Todd Bersnoozi wrote:
Hockey Widow wrote:Flyers have given Vinny camp permission to speak to other teams to try and secure a trade. The Flyers have been unable to move him so the feeling is his agent may be able to put something together. If a trade is worked out it will be a salary dump for the Flyers, they want to be done with his contract but have used their two compliance buyouts.


Wow, Phillie throws money around like toilet paper. Didn't they just sign Vinny last year? They bought out a couple of other guys with fat contracts as well (Bryzgalov and another guy).


No doubt. I wonder if anyone will be interested in Lecavalier at this point. Bought out, signed, then shopped.....brutal.
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Re: Around the league (signings, RFAs injuries)

Postby Island Nucklehead » Thu Jun 26, 2014 8:22 pm

Todd Bersnoozi wrote:
Hockey Widow wrote:Flyers have given Vinny camp permission to speak to other teams to try and secure a trade. The Flyers have been unable to move him so the feeling is his agent may be able to put something together. If a trade is worked out it will be a salary dump for the Flyers, they want to be done with his contract but have used their two compliance buyouts.


Wow, Phillie throws money around like toilet paper. Didn't they just sign Vinny last year? They bought out a couple of other guys with fat contracts as well (Bryzgalov and another guy).


Briere was the other player they bought out.

I guess it depends on if they can find a trade. If they do, and they don't eat salary, then it's fine. They "rented" Lecavalier for a year. It definitely should give pause to people rushing to sign Richards to a 4-5 year deal...

I wonder if the Poster Formerly Known as Farhan Lalji still wants him?
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Re: Around the league (signings, RFAs injuries)

Postby Betamax » Mon Jun 30, 2014 6:39 pm

dbr wrote:I don't think the regional TV deals will be that big a deal.

Montreal and Toronto may add $30m to the pot each and others will surely add some as well but divide that by 30 franchises and then half it and see what it does to the salary cap midpoint.. not much.

I'm not sure why Seattle is such a sure bet to be an above average revenue franchise - right now they have no building, they don't have much of a pro hockey tradition to speak of and any NHL franchise will be directly competing with an NBA franchise in addition to virtually every other major sport as well. Quebec, sure, that's one franchise. Other than that (since we're extremely unlikely to see another southern Ontario franchise) I don't see any other no brainer potential locations out there. And if the dollar falls even Quebec isn't a sure thing.


via: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sports/h ... d/follows/


How the NHL salary cap got set at $69-million
James Mirtle
PHILADELPHIA — The Globe and Mail
Published Sunday, Jun. 29 2014, 10:31 PM EDT
Last updated Monday, Jun. 30 2014, 4:07 PM EDT

As it currently stands, the 2015-16 salary cap should now easily exceed $74-million.


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