Back in 2014/15. Out in 2014/15

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Re: Back in 2014/15. Out in 2014/15

Postby nuckster » Sun Mar 30, 2014 7:08 pm

Hockey Widow wrote:.


Good, sensible response/input... as per usual.
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Re: Back in 2014/15. Out in 2014/15

Postby Blob Mckenzie » Sun Mar 30, 2014 8:06 pm

These are just who I hope is back/out.

Back
Henrik
Daniel
Kassian
Higgins
Santorelli
Mathias
Jensen ( if he's ready)
Sestito
Richardson

Hamhuis
Garrison
Bieksa
Tanev
Stanton

Weber as a 7 or 8

Lack
Markstrom

I hope they guillotine the coaching staff.

Out
Kesler
Edler
Booth
Burrows
Hansen
Dalpe
Schroeder


In reality Torts comes back and probably Booth, Edler and Burrows as well. The wops are too cheap to fire the coach and buyout Booth. And Gillis is too stupid/scared to deal the biter. Edler won't waive . I can see Tanev being dealt for help up front. maybe Gillis should scare a few of these players at seasons end meetings and tell them Torts isn't going anywhere. Perhaps a couple of players may waive their ntc.

If you want my prediction it will only be Kesler, Hansen and Tanev and a couple of scrubs moved. It will be up to Eye Bags to obtain value for these players.
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Re: Back in 2014/15. Out in 2014/15

Postby dbr » Mon Mar 31, 2014 6:37 am

I don't know who's going to go. We certainly have a lot of bodies at this point, regardless of anyone's feelings about them..

I'd guess Booth is inevitable - at this point roster spots are dearer than cap space but in any event buying him out saves us both.

Even still a buy out there leaves us with pretty much a full roster; assuming we re-sign Kassian (hardly going out on a limb there) and Jensen makes the team next year that's 12 guys.

A Kesler trade would blow things wide open and probably necessitate shopping for a center in free agency but barring that we're either going to see the team look to move one or two out of that middle group of wingers (Burrows, Booth, Higgins, Hansen, Matthias) or we're going to see a baby step towards a youth movement next year.

The blueline is a similar situation of course. Re-sign Tanev and you're returning all of your top six. Who goes from there? Probably depends entirely on who, if anyone, is willing to waive their no trade clause.
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Re: Back in 2014/15. Out in 2014/15

Postby herb » Mon Mar 31, 2014 12:29 pm

Watching the guy in person on Saturday night, I couldn't help but feel that a Kesler trade seems inevitable now.

Edler seems like the other inevitability now. Hopefully he waives.

Booth pretty much has to go just for the roster space.

I have seen enough of Hansen that I would be OK with moving him.

Personally, I don't know how you can advocate trading Higgins with the value he provides. We couldn't replace his production in free agency IMO.

It's not like we're going to be competing for the cup, so I don't see much point in buying out a guy like Burrows. There is pretty much no way he can't be better next year, barring he gets run over by a truck or something.

Santorelli showed more than enough to earn another shot here.

IMO you move Kesler and Edler and try to get the best possible young players in return. I wouldn't worry too much about what positions they play, I would worry about getting the most bang for our buck back in terms of talent. We can always plug holes in free agency as they arise.

That would leave us with a first line coming off their worse season in a decade, a mediocre bottom six and no second line, but at least it would leave positions available to give our young players legitimate shots at playing here next year.
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Re: Back in 2014/15. Out in 2014/15

Postby Island Nucklehead » Mon Mar 31, 2014 3:25 pm

herb wrote:IMO you move Kesler and Edler and try to get the best possible young players in return. I wouldn't worry too much about what positions they play, I would worry about getting the most bang for our buck back in terms of talent. We can always plug holes in free agency as they arise.

That would leave us with a first line coming off their worse season in a decade, a mediocre bottom six and no second line, but at least it would leave positions available to give our young players legitimate shots at playing here next year.


The other option is to Tank it right to the bottom of the standings next year, pick up one of the studs (McDavid, Ecihel, Barzal) in the 2015 draft, and rebound nicely with cash/prospects/youth after that.

We've got the Sedins for another 4 years, I don't think we need to be in any rush to become elite in year 1.

Move Kesler and Edler for youth this summer, don't bother filling the holes with long-term UFA's. Re-up Santorelli, Schroeder etc., let the kids play their way into the lineup and go through the ups and downs of an NHL season. Tell Aquaman it's a "rebuilding year" and to pocket his money for the big push in 2017. Once we draft the 2015 Stud the fans will come back in time for the turnaround. :lol:

Seriously though, with the Sedins tying up $7M per, we're going to need some youth on ELC's in our top-6 by the end of their deals if we plan on being competitive within that window. If (or when) we suck, they can be the lightening rods for criticism, while the youth get used to playing in this insane market. By the time the Sedins hoist the Cup in Vancouver (2017/2018), everyone will be talking about their veteran leadership in guiding the youthful and clutch scoring of guys like Horvat and Barzal to the promised land.

OR we can just sign some UFA's and hope for the best.
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Re: Back in 2014/15. Out in 2014/15

Postby herb » Mon Mar 31, 2014 3:49 pm

Island Nucklehead wrote:Seriously though, with the Sedins tying up $7M per, we're going to need some youth on ELC's in our top-6 by the end of their deals if we plan on being competitive within that window. If (or when) we suck, they can be the lightening rods for criticism, while the youth get used to playing in this insane market. By the time the Sedins hoist the Cup in Vancouver (2017/2018), everyone will be talking about their veteran leadership in guiding the youthful and clutch scoring of guys like Horvat and Barzal to the promised land.

OR we can just sign some UFA's and hope for the best.


I think we would need to dismantle the team to have a good shot at the #1 pick in 2015. I don't think that's realistic, or necessarily even the best strategy.

Absolutely we need lots of youth to step up, starting next year.

I'm willing to take a wait and see approach. Wait and see what Gillis does with Kesler and Edler. Wait for free agency and see if we can get a decent forward vet on a reasonable contract. The team will have cap space this off season to spend a bit. Wait and see how the kids look in camp. And go from there.

As you say, there is no rush. The team is no good now so we have time on our side. :mex:
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Re: Back in 2014/15. Out in 2014/15

Postby Meds » Mon Mar 31, 2014 4:51 pm

Who I hope is back next year.....

(I'm excluding the Sedins because apparently they are the only guarantees to be here)

Kesler - heart and soul top 6 talent on a good contract.
Kassian - showing he belongs, young and starting use his size for something other than getting suspended.
Mathias - big, enthusiastic, and definitely looks to be a guy who can play in multiple situations.
Burrows - heart and soul guy who I hope retires here.
Jensen - a goal scorer, young, good skater, good shooter, not afraid of traffic or being creative.
Hansen - great checking winger who can chip in offensively at times.....but out if he's going to play top-6 ever.
Sestito - decent 4th line player with size and attitude, also showing a modicum of hockey smarts.

Hamhuis - solid top-4 defenseman with smarts and good skating ability.
Bieksa - attitude, good skater, wants to die a Canuck.
Tanev - you top-4 defenseman who makes the smart plays and shows signs of contributing offensively.
Stanton - solid young stay home defenseman with grit.

Lack - future starting goaltender somewhere in the NHL.
Markstrom - possible trade bait if he re-finds his game and begins to live up to expectations.


Who I want out.....

Higgins - he's replaceable and doesn't belong in the top-6 on a regular basis, can bring a return via trade.
Dalpe - has shown nothing.
Schroeder - proving to be too small and not fast enough or creative enough.
Edler - minus-30 and doing nothing to suggest he is going to put it together.....ever.
Booth - would love to see him stay if he was making $2M or less.
Garrison - not producing as hoped and probably a piece that nets a decent return in trade.

The addition of a top-6 forward is critical to this team.

I'm not overly optimistic that we see both of Shinkaruk and Horvat, I think BoHo gets a longer look. Would love to see a line of Jensen - Horvat - Kassian.
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Re: Back in 2014/15. Out in 2014/15

Postby RoyalDude » Mon Mar 31, 2014 5:39 pm

Heard an interesting stat on Higgins today, he has 1 point in his last 19 playoff games. The guy is not a big game player. Nice guy, but we need more players who are not fun to play against, just too soft as a forward group, this mix, he needs to go
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Re: Back in 2014/15. Out in 2014/15

Postby Island Nucklehead » Mon Mar 31, 2014 5:42 pm

RoyalDude wrote:Heard an interesting stat on Higgins today, he has 1 point in his last 19 playoff games. The guy is not a big game player. Nice guy, but we need more players who are not fun to play against, just too soft as a forward group, this mix, he needs to go


If that's true, we might as well keep him for another year, seeing as he won't be adding to that total anytime soon.
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Re: Back in 2014/15. Out in 2014/15

Postby Strangelove » Mon Mar 31, 2014 6:42 pm

Island Nucklehead wrote:The other option is to Tank it right to the bottom of the standings next year, pick up one of the studs (McDavid, Ecihel, Barzal) in the 2015 draft....


Image

Usually you have at least one foot firmly planted on the ground IN, but now....

Ummm... say hi to Bryzgalov!
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Re: Back in 2014/15. Out in 2014/15

Postby Island Nucklehead » Mon Mar 31, 2014 6:53 pm

Strangelove wrote:
Island Nucklehead wrote:The other option is to Tank it right to the bottom of the standings next year, pick up one of the studs (McDavid, Ecihel, Barzal) in the 2015 draft....


Image

Usually you have at least one foot firmly planted on the ground IN, but now....

Ummm... say hi to Bryzgalov!


I didn't mean to scare you Doc. I only meant to say that I don't want to replace guys like Kesler and Edler with overpriced UFA's in an attempt to short-circuit TheProcess. I would rather develop our talent internally, give the kids a shot, and let the chips fall as they may. If our current crew isn't good enough, the best place to find long-term success is through the draft.
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Re: Back in 2014/15. Out in 2014/15

Postby Strangelove » Mon Mar 31, 2014 8:06 pm

Island Nucklehead wrote:I didn't mean to scare you Doc. I only meant to say that I don't want to replace guys like Kesler and Edler with overpriced UFA's in an attempt to short-circuit TheProcess. I would rather develop our talent internally, give the kids a shot, and let the chips fall as they may. If our current crew isn't good enough, the best place to find long-term success is through the draft.


Now, as you are no doubt aware, I prefer to talk about off-season moves... in the off-season.

Call me crazy. :roll:

Obviously we have a nice crop of kids, especially forwards.

Obviously there is a transition going on.

That FULL transition will take what... four years to complete?

There is no reason for this team to be anything less than a cap-max team in the meantime.

No reason not to try to compete in the meantime.

Guys like Burrows/Higgins/Hansen/Richardson/Santorelli are perfect for moulding the kids

... and for sliding down the lineup as the kids climb up

.... and for jettisoning away as the kids eventually take their jobs.

IF Kesler wants out, I prefer getting back a young forward who is presently establishing himself as a top-6.

I'd rather get say a 22-year-old than an 18-year-old (wouldn't want a high draft pick).

I'd also prefer to do a Kesler+ for quality type of deal, if possible.

That kind of trade, plus the Booth buyout, plus the rising cap, and going with Lack/Markstrom (?)

... would create a lot of cap space.

I don't see any reason not to bring in a star UFA top-6 forward (not gonna hurt TheProcess).

Bridge the transition gap, compete in the meantime.

I'm not completely sure what UFAs will be available and I don't wanna know until the off-season.

Now I hate myself for talking about off-season moves while we are involved in an epic struggle for the Cup.

Hope you're happy. :evil:

And for all you guys talking about throwing away next season

... why aren't you screaming for some superassholes to be brought in to give us something worth watching?
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Re: Back in 2014/15. Out in 2014/15

Postby Island Nucklehead » Mon Mar 31, 2014 8:39 pm

Strangelove wrote:Now I hate myself for talking about off-season moves while we are involved in an epic struggle for the Cup.

Hope you're happy. :evil:

And for all you guys talking about throwing away next season

... why aren't you screaming for some superassholes to be brought in to give us something worth watching?


Quite pleased with that response, thank you.

Oh I'm all for retaining the Sestito's and Kassians of the league. Gotta keep the kids safe and let them develop without being bullied. I also agree that I would rather have youth vs draft picks if we're trading Kesler and Edler.

As far as something worth watching, the development of the youth WILL be worth watching. Unlike the Oilers, this team will still have a strong leadership group that won't stand for bullshit. The thing for us fans to realize is that we will most likely get stretches of great play out of guys like Jensen and Horvat, and then some stretches of frustrated youth. I'm fine with that, as it gives us GLIMPSES of FUTURE GREATNESS.

It's not about throwing away the season... it's about the PROCESS of reBUILDING A WINNER.
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Re: Back in 2014/15. Out in 2014/15

Postby nuckster » Mon Mar 31, 2014 11:03 pm

Jeesus, where's the pom poms to go with the rose coloured glasses? Glory glory hallelujah, the brilliant leadership that was demonstrated this season will lead us to the promised land. Oh Doc can't ya just feel it!? GOOD GRIEF.
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Re: Back in 2014/15. Out in 2014/15

Postby Strangelove » Tue Apr 01, 2014 12:45 pm

nuckster wrote:Jeesus, where's the pom poms to go with the rose coloured glasses? Glory glory hallelujah, the brilliant leadership that was demonstrated this season will lead us to the promised land. Oh Doc can't ya just feel it!? GOOD GRIEF.


One rough season, get over it.

I expect a full apology when you are proven wrong.

Thanks in advance.
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