What's your opinion on what's happening to this Canuck team?

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What is happening to the team right now?

Slump.
22
34%
Downward slope.
16
25%
Flu.
1
2%
Injuries.
8
13%
Fatigue.
7
11%
Other.
3
5%
Nothing fool! Now shut your yap.
7
11%
 
Total votes : 64

Re: What's your opinion on what's happening to this Canuck t

Postby mathonwy » Tue Jan 21, 2014 5:01 pm

Per wrote:
mathonwy wrote:I think GMMG's offseason priority is to

a) Stop trading away pieces for the future.
b) Get a trigger man for the Sedins. Somebody that's good at scoring goals.
Daniel Alfredsson!! Yes, he's old as dirt but...
- he's having a decent season on a bad Wings team
- he's swedish. The Sedins are swedish. I think swedish people like playing with other swedish people. :D
- he's a veteran player that can REALLY help with the powerplay. We don't need a young buck on the power play. We need a vet with a lot of experience that can help Hank figure shit out.

:thumbs:

Sure, that might work, but if you're looking for a Swede to play with the Sedins, Loui Eriksson should be at the top of the list. In the four games the Sedins played at the 2013 World Championship, they had him on their line. Over those four games (beat Denmark 4-2, beat Canada 3-2, beat Finland 3-0 and beat Switzerland in the final 5-1) this line combined for 22 points! :shock:

Henrik Sedin: 4 goals, 5 assists
Loui Eriksson: 4 goals, 3 assists
Daniel Sedin: 1 goal, 5 assists

Loui seemed like the perfect fit for them! He tends to score 25-30 goals on an NHL season, but I think he'd do even better with the twins. Unfortunately I think he has two years left on his contract with the Bruins. :(


I WAS actually looking for a swede to play with the Sedins. Yes, Eriksson was at the top of my list but you'd never be able to pry him from the B's which why I didn't bother listing him.

I think Alfy is a good fit because
- I think we wouldn't have to overpay as he would welcome the opportunity to play with the Sedins and vice versa.
- We need some veteran experience on this team.
- Alfy's edge might rub off on the Sedins.
- Mentorship for the Sedins. The one that the Sedins never had during their Canuck career is a mentor. They pretty much had to figure everything out on their own.

And again, I think the key to this current incarnation of the Canucks are the Sedins. Get the Sedins going and so go the Canucks.
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Re: What's your opinion on what's happening to this Canuck t

Postby SKYO » Tue Jan 21, 2014 5:52 pm

mathonwy wrote:
SKYO wrote:Having Vanek here could vault the new look 2nd line to 1st line status, giving the Sedins a break and make them the best 2nd line in the league.

I disagree.
Since the Sedins have come into their own, the Canucks have gone as the Sedins have gone. Sedins go cold, typically, nobody steps up and the team goes on a mini/major slump. For better or for worse, we've hooked our red wagon to the Sedin train so lets get them an elite right winger to play with.


A healthy Burrows with the twins should suffice, it's the lines that play after the Sedins that really need help imo.

One of the main problems with this team is that this core has been together for so long that there's gotta be a book out there on how to play and defeat this team, which the top tier teams can do with ease.

And that is basically to shut down the Sedins and that's it!!
as the Canucks have NO other lines that can score well.

Which is why I'm pro for upgrading our 2nd line more than making the Sedins even that much better.

This team has never had a dominant line after the Sedins, and that is in part due to bad trades that never panned out (Booth plus not having sure fire young guns to develop fast on this veteran like/contending team.


---

Here comes the TL;DR part....

Bad drafting and poor trades basically has made this team to what it is now, which is a team that cannot play with the big boys, however it still has a strong core of the Sedins, Kesler, Burrows, Edler, Bieksa, Luongo.

Mike Gillis has failed to surround them with talent to compete with the Kings, Ducks and Sharks.

And now we have to wait for the cap to go up, Booth to get bought out and hope Gillis can turn his fortune around with a couple of deft trades.
He really should hire a good senior advisor to help him with this.

But at least the drafting has gotten better with Shinks, Gaunce and Jensen,
and that Schneider trade landed us a future star center in Horvat.


----


Just for shits&gigz | drafting | trades | ufa signings.

2008: 1st rd pick Hodgson turned into Kassian

2009: 1st rd pick Ricky Schroeder has been a injury prone mini center whose never had a chance to crack this lineup till possibly this season, 5 years later.
Rodin: unknown
KCon +2nd traded for D. Roy, he played good with Higgins till Kesler back, and then AV didn't know where to put Roy to get chemistry with anyone else.

2010: 1st traded away in package for bust Ballard. If only we kept Willie Mitchell instead of trading away Quinten Howden (I mean 1st rounder), Grabner and Bernier who ironically could be a good fit on our 4th line next season if he reaches UFA this offseason, for Ballard another failed risk. Delorme and scouts f'in pissed with the first 3 picks traded away for scraps.

2011 MG/Scouts finally start to take this drafting serious and put some effort into their scouting.
2011: JENSEN! late bloomer draft, Corrado! 5th rounder!
2012: GAUNCE! future 2nd/3rd big two-way center.


MG's best moves has always been the UFA market, first one being Sundin and Demitra, which put this team on the map, and is credited to helping Kesler bump his game up.

Sammy was a solid pickup later riding shotgun on Kesler's line.
Manny, Torres, Hamhuis, Garrison.

trades: Bernier bust, Ballard bust, Booth bust.
Ehrhoff golden lotto winner trade, but really short lived.
Another good trade was to get 3rd liner Higgins and 4th liner Lappy.


NOTE: None of these moves ever really fixed the same fucking problem of not having any solid secondary scoring behind the Sedins!!! :mad:
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Re: What's your opinion on what's happening to this Canuck t

Postby Todd Bersnoozi » Wed Jan 22, 2014 12:51 am

mathonwy wrote:- Mentorship for the Sedins. The one that the Sedins never had during their Canuck career is a mentor. They pretty much had to figure everything out on their own.


I don't mind getting Alffie, but the Sedins need mentoring? First off, the Sedins are like 34 years old. Secondly, they have won some nice individual rewards (ie- Hart Trophy, Lester Pearson trophy and Art Ross trophies). Lastly, when the Sedins were green ass rookies and came to the Canucks, we had guys like Trevor Linden, Trent Klatt and fellow Sweedes Matty Ohlund and Captain Markus Naslund around to help break them into the NHL. If anything, the Sedins should be mentoring our young guys like Kellan Lain, BoHo, Gaunce, Shinkaruk, Jensen, etc. They would probably be better mentors to young sweedish players, but we have what we have. Eddie Lack No Panic Attack Pack I guess, although he's a goalie. :lol:
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Re: What's your opinion on what's happening to this Canuck t

Postby mathonwy » Wed Jan 22, 2014 9:29 am

Todd Bersnoozi wrote:
mathonwy wrote:- Mentorship for the Sedins. The one that the Sedins never had during their Canuck career is a mentor. They pretty much had to figure everything out on their own.


I don't mind getting Alffie, but the Sedins need mentoring? First off, the Sedins are like 34 years old. Secondly, they have won some nice individual rewards (ie- Hart Trophy, Lester Pearson trophy and Art Ross trophies). Lastly, when the Sedins were green ass rookies and came to the Canucks, we had guys like Trevor Linden, Trent Klatt and fellow Sweedes Matty Ohlund and Captain Markus Naslund around to help break them into the NHL. If anything, the Sedins should be mentoring our young guys like Kellan Lain, BoHo, Gaunce, Shinkaruk, Jensen, etc. They would probably be better mentors to young sweedish players, but we have what we have. Eddie Lack No Panic Attack Pack I guess, although he's a goalie. :lol:


Yep.. even at 34... you need mentoring.

Hell, I'm 37 and I could use a mentor in my field.

Just look at our sorry power play. You'd think that Hank with all his accomplishments and accolades would be able to figure it out. But nope.

You're always learning and there are two ways to learn. You can figure it out yourself or someone else can tell you.

It's ALWAYS easier to have someone else tell you. Easier, faster and cheaper.

I think Alfy would be very very good for the Sedins. As well, I think the dressing room needs a new voice as I don't see them getting it done right now.
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Re: What's your opinion on what's happening to this Canuck t

Postby Topper » Wed Jan 22, 2014 9:49 am

Year 14 of we need to find a winger to play with the Sedins. oh gawwwwwwd
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Re: What's your opinion on what's happening to this Canuck t

Postby Arachnid » Wed Jan 22, 2014 9:57 am

Topper wrote:Year 14 of we need to find a winger to play with the Sedins. oh gawwwwwwd


Or a fire hydrant...
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Re: What's your opinion on what's happening to this Canuck t

Postby dbr » Wed Jan 22, 2014 11:12 am

But who will mentor Alfie?
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Re: What's your opinion on what's happening to this Canuck t

Postby mathonwy » Wed Jan 22, 2014 11:37 am

:lol:

It's no less valid an idea than any other.

Veteran leadership, possible home country discount, alleviation of leadership pressures off of Hank, mentorship, asshole factor and past prime but still a definite point producer.

Last time I checked, we still haven't won a cup yet with this current core, the Sedins aren't getting any younger and Burr is having an absolute disastrous season. Even last season, the 3rd spot on the first line was a revolving door.

The Sedins have gotten stale and splitting them up is not a sustainable long term solution. So we can keep revolving players through that 3rd spot hoping someone will step up or we can go get someone that'll do the job.
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Re: What's your opinion on what's happening to this Canuck t

Postby Tciso » Wed Jan 22, 2014 11:49 am

mathonwy wrote:The Sedins have gotten stale and splitting them up is not a sustainable long term solution. So we can keep revolving players through that 3rd spot hoping someone will step up or we can go get someone that'll do the job.


I say split them up for 10 minutes a night for a few games. That means we have them on for over 30 minutes a night, and our 3rd line gets some time with better players, and defenses cannot focus on just one line. They do seem to benefit from being split up once in a while. It shakes them out of their rut.

Long term, we just need a better 3rd line, and either Burr to come back to his previous form, or a replacement for Burr ( I vote Lain :) )
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Re: What's your opinion on what's happening to this Canuck t

Postby BurningBeard » Wed Jan 22, 2014 9:08 pm

dbr wrote:But who will mentor Alfie?

Markus Naslund?
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Re: What's your opinion on what's happening to this Canuck t

Postby Todd Bersnoozi » Thu Jan 23, 2014 4:00 am

mathonwy wrote:Yep.. even at 34... you need mentoring.

Hell, I'm 37 and I could use a mentor in my field.

Just look at our sorry power play. You'd think that Hank with all his accomplishments and accolades would be able to figure it out. But nope.

You're always learning and there are two ways to learn. You can figure it out yourself or someone else can tell you.

It's ALWAYS easier to have someone else tell you. Easier, faster and cheaper.

I think Alfy would be very very good for the Sedins. As well, I think the dressing room needs a new voice as I don't see them getting it done right now.


I forgot to mention that the Nuck even brought in Captain Sweede Mr. Mats Sundin to serve as a "mentor" for the twins as well for half a season. I don't think the twins need a mentor, they just need a good player to help get them going. An elite sniper like Stamkos/Ovichkin would be nice, but we know it's not going to happen. :lol: I'm not sure if Burr is the guy right now, he's kind of snake bitten this year. I like Kes more as the #2 centre and I think Jannik isn't really a top liner. I'm hoping Kassassian will be the guy. :twisted:
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Re: What's your opinion on what's happening to this Canuck t

Postby Meds » Thu Jan 23, 2014 6:35 am

Todd Bersnoozi wrote:
mathonwy wrote:Yep.. even at 34... you need mentoring.

Hell, I'm 37 and I could use a mentor in my field.

Just look at our sorry power play. You'd think that Hank with all his accomplishments and accolades would be able to figure it out. But nope.

You're always learning and there are two ways to learn. You can figure it out yourself or someone else can tell you.

It's ALWAYS easier to have someone else tell you. Easier, faster and cheaper.

I think Alfy would be very very good for the Sedins. As well, I think the dressing room needs a new voice as I don't see them getting it done right now.


I forgot to mention that the Nuck even brought in Captain Sweede Mr. Mats Sundin to serve as a "mentor" for the twins as well for half a season. I don't think the twins need a mentor, they just need a good player to help get them going. An elite sniper like Stamkos/Ovichkin would be nice, but we know it's not going to happen. :lol: I'm not sure if Burr is the guy right now, he's kind of snake bitten this year. I like Kes more as the #2 centre and I think Jannik isn't really a top liner. I'm hoping Kassassian will be the guy. :twisted:


Sundin was brought in for two reasons, to give us a legitimate top 6 pivot, and for Gillis to set the tone that the Canucks would be competitive in the UFA market because they were serious about winning.

Sundin then became a mentor for Kesler.
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Re: What's your opinion on what's happening to this Canuck t

Postby dbr » Thu Jan 23, 2014 7:50 am

Topper wrote:GMMG's MO has been to target guys who want to play in Vancouver and are willing to settle for a discount to do so. i don't see that philosophy changing.


Serious question, what about Demitra, Malhotra, Samuelsson?

Malhotra's deal wasn't really viewed as a substantial discount and Samuelsson pretty much openly said he signed here because it was the best offer. I think there was a bunch of conjecture about why Demitra wanted to be here (had a kid with skiing ambitions? Didn't want to fly to the Olympics from a different city?) but I don't know what that adds up to.

In general - I don't see that philosophy changing either. But I don't really see any BC born high end forwards hitting UFA this year so the Hamhuis/Garrison analogy doesn't seem to be there.

And I do think the team has also identified needs and then gone out and addressed them before; the guys I mentioned above pro-rate to about $3-5m salaries under the current $71.1m cap (although I'd guess that given the inflation players of a similar calibre might go for slightly more).
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Re: What's your opinion on what's happening to this Canuck t

Postby Topper » Thu Jan 23, 2014 9:27 am

dbr wrote:
Topper wrote:GMMG's MO has been to target guys who want to play in Vancouver and are willing to settle for a discount to do so. i don't see that philosophy changing.


Serious question, what about Demitra, Malhotra, Samuelsson?

They were fair and reasonable deals that did not upset the payroll structure. I said nothing of GMMG limiting himself to guys willing to take a discount. Nor did I say anything about BC boys coming home.
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Re: What's your opinion on what's happening to this Canuck t

Postby mathonwy » Thu Jan 23, 2014 9:32 am

Todd Bersnoozi wrote:I forgot to mention that the Nuck even brought in Captain Sweede Mr. Mats Sundin to serve as a "mentor" for the twins as well for half a season. I don't think the twins need a mentor, they just need a good player to help get them going. An elite sniper like Stamkos/Ovichkin would be nice, but we know it's not going to happen. :lol: I'm not sure if Burr is the guy right now, he's kind of snake bitten this year. I like Kes more as the #2 centre and I think Jannik isn't really a top liner. I'm hoping Kassassian will be the guy. :twisted:


Ok, everyone seems to be hung up on the whole concept of a mentor. Seriously speaking, if you were at work and you were having a hard time, wouldn't you like to have someone with more experience come in to give you a few pointers to make your life a bit easier? Someone that you knew, spoke the language you did and has been to the Stanley Cup finals like you did only to fall short?

There's nothing wrong with having a mentor. The problem with your example is that Sundin came in half way through the season out of shape. Sundin could barely help himself let alone help the Sedins.

Markus Naslund was your typically introverted good guy swede and the WCE days are a very long time ago.

Absolutely, an elite sniper like Stamkos/Ovechkin/Carter/Hossa/Sharp/Benn would be ideal. However, I have next to zero trust in GMMG having what it takes to pull off a deal for a current elite sniper. Who knows. Prove me wrong bug eyes.

Your last statement is what I have the biggest problem with. "I'm hoping Kassassian will be the guy." Yeah, we only have so many more years with the Sedins playing at a high level and I'd like to solidify that 3rd spot with a bonafide sniper before their skills start declining in a serious way. Whether that be Alfy, or Eriksson or Ovie.

Another year of "hoping" Kassian will be the guy or "hoping" Burr bounces back is another year of wear and tear on the Sedins.
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