Handling the Prospects Correctly

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Handling the Prospects Correctly

Postby ClamRussel » Sun Jul 07, 2013 2:32 am

...unless one of our top youngest forward prospects (Gaunce, Horvat, Shinkaruk) absolutely steals a roster spot I'm hoping they are not used to fill out the roster spots...same goes for Jensen (if he's isn't totally ready). We don't need these guys playing limited minutes up here. What we do need is for those 3 to play for Canada at the World Juniors this year and be brought along as slow as need be. Its time for the older prospects like Schroeder to step up and fill that no. 3 center position. If he can't do it at this point then its most likely never going to happen. Jensen might be ready to step in soon but I see him needing more time in the AHL, perhaps be used for call-ups as the year goes on. In the unlikely event that any of those Canadians crack the roster I hope MG will release them for 2 weeks to play at the Worlds.
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Re: Handling the Prospects Correctly

Postby FAN » Sun Jul 07, 2013 3:48 am

I agree. I'm not in favor of rushing prospects with offensive upside and I would certainly send Horvat back unless he surprises at camp and in the preseason.

It's different with a guy like Gaunce who has had another year of development in the OHL. Will his offensive development really be hurt by not returning him to juniors? If Gaunce projects more of a 3rd line center and he's ready for the NHL, I say play him and release him for the WJC if he makes the team. If the team projects him as a 2nd line center, I'm more inclined to have the team take their time developing Gaunce and see if Gaunce can dominate offensively at every level.
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Re: Handling the Prospects Correctly

Postby Boston Canucker » Sun Jul 07, 2013 5:36 am

Gillis used to talk about the Detroit model, and Detroit does not rush prospects, and my sense with the new CBA they still won't, even thought that seems to be MG's reason for seemingly changing course on that now. I agree that unless I young guy really wins a spot, better to let him keep learning in junior/minors. I would love it if one or two guys did grab the reins, but pushing them into spots they are not ready for is not the way to go. We don't want a bunch of ruined Gilbert Brules on our hands (thanks Doug Mclean, good call!)
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Re: Handling the Prospects Correctly

Postby dbr » Sun Jul 07, 2013 7:43 am

My guess is that we see young NHLers like Tanev and Kassian and Schroeder given bigger roles, and a few guys given a chance at a roster spot (a no upside guy like Lain or one of the goaltenders, or Corrado who will still get 12-15 minutes even if his role is limited).

As for the third line, my guess is that Schroeder gets a long look this year and if he can't cut it they find a team interested in him that will give us a rental in exchange at the deadline.. then try to find someone on a 2 year deal in te offseason so Gaunce can play in Utica.

I think there's a pretty big grey area between "we need contributions from cheap young players" and "we're going to let junior-eligible players sink or swim in the NHL"..
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Re: Handling the Prospects Correctly

Postby Topper » Sun Jul 07, 2013 7:57 am

Happens every fucking year Clam. Folks on the boards put away their pencils and pull out their sharpies and make up line ups with the kids getting 2nd line ice time and in some cases 1st line time and a healthy dose of PP time all to nurture their great offensive potential.

And every year I laugh at them. Including laughing at you and several others over the salmon kid.
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Re: Handling the Prospects Correctly

Postby Blob Mckenzie » Sun Jul 07, 2013 8:51 am

As an asside who do you see making the team as a guy that can actually play some decent minutes. ? My guess would be Horvat. Maybe Corrado. Hunter isn't ready and Gaunce while a decent prospect doesn't have the wheels to step in at this level quite yet. I can't see Jensen making the team until at least next season.
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Re: Handling the Prospects Correctly

Postby Southern_Canuck » Sun Jul 07, 2013 8:53 am

If, for instance, Gaunce makes the WJC team and is successfully helping the Canucks win, then I wouldn't be in favour of making him available for the WJC (if he even makes the team)... what would be the point? He would already be getting first-hand experience in the NHL - why hurt the Canucks chances for an essentially inconsequential junior tournament?

Don't get me wrong, I love that tournament from an entertainment standpoint, however I think people put too much stock in players performances in such a short tournament against peers. Many "WJC stars" make no impact in the NHL, and many players that are not selected for the WJC team do. (I'm looking at you Corrado...)

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Re: Handling the Prospects Correctly

Postby coco_canuck » Sun Jul 07, 2013 8:56 am

The absolute best case scenario:

-One of Horvat or Gaunce to step in and play decent 3rd line minutes for the team.

-Jensen is good enough to stick as a decent top 9 winger after being called up 15-30 games into the season.

-Corrado starts the year in Utica and steps in on the blueline seamlessly and remains on the roster when a need arises.

-Lain is a physical, defensive C presence who steps in midway through the season and does an admirable job on the 4th line.

Anything more, IMO, is unrealistic.

Realistically, I see Jordan Schroeder getting the first crack as the 3rd line C out of training camp and Santorelli will be the 13th forward ready to step in for JS if he falters.

I think Jensen will shuffle between the AHL and NHL a few times but don't expect him to make much of a consistent impact until 2014-2015.

Haven't seen much of Lain, but I somehow doubt a player with minimal pro-experience will win an every-day job out of camp. It will probably be a transitional season for him with a couple call-ups, and hopefully he'll be trending in the right direction for 2014-2015.

Gaunce could probably benefit from dominating offensively in the OHL next season since he hasn't produced above a point-per-game clip at that level yet, but it's really too bad he can't play in the AHL next season. If the Canucks don't think he has much to gain from returning to the OHL, he has a realistic shot coming out of camp but he must impress in his 9 games if he's to stick. Not sure if he's ready yet.

Lots of talk that Horvat could step in and play in the NHL next season but if all the talk of his untapped offensive potential is true, it makes me think it's likely more beneficial for him to spend another year developing his skills and production before legitimately vying for an every-day role on this team.

Shinkaruk is probably the biggest dark-horse at camp. He's basically coming off back-to-back 40 goal seasons in the WHL, and other than having an Emerson Etem type year of scoring 60 goals there isn't much left for him to do at that level. What he needs to do is get stronger and refine his defensive game. He's another guy who would probably benefit from a year in the AHL rather than returning to Medicine Hat IF his body is ready for the physical toll of pro-hockey.

One big positive for Gaunce, Horvat and Shinkaruk if they all return to the minors is them playing together for Team Canada at the WJHC. It's a great primer for what to expect at the NHL level and having those three guys on the same team (hopefully) would be a great experience.
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Re: Handling the Prospects Correctly

Postby Diehard1 » Sun Jul 07, 2013 9:46 am

I don't see too many of the young guys making the team, maybe Corrado and one of the forwards at most. Gllis will sign a couple more 3rd and 4th line types, and likely another serviceable dman as well. If the kids are better than these signings they will make the team, but it won't be easy.
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Re: Handling the Prospects Correctly

Postby Aaronp18 » Sun Jul 07, 2013 10:00 am

While I don't expect much at the NHL level this year from the trio of Gaunce, Horvat and Shinkaruk it sure is nice to have some legitimate blue chip prospects to keep our eye on.

Because of Gaunce's two way play and versatility (I believe he played some wing this year IIRC) I can see him getting a good look and fighting Schroeder for some third line playing time. In no way should we rush any of these kids though, let them develop, let them have another year in junior if that's what's best. Let them play in the WJC and get some experience in a tourney with some high expectations.

London is hosting the 2014 Memorial Cup so letting Horvat have another crack at that would be great as well.

We also have Gaunce and Subban in Belleville, though I'm not sure how many returning players there will be so they may not be able to duplicate their success. Maybe we can orchestrate a trade between Belleville and London! :wink:

I'm hoping Jensen realized after his brief stint last season how much work he needs to do to be an NHL regular and is working hard in the offseason. If we could use him as a scoring option in the top 9 it would be a huge asset.

I think it's only realistic to expect these players to be making an impact at the NHL level in about 2-3 years.
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Re: Handling the Prospects Correctly

Postby Southern_Canuck » Sun Jul 07, 2013 10:24 am

As for making the Canada WJC roster - it will be tough for Horvat and Gaunce at center - here are the invites to summer camp:

GOALIES: Eric Comrie, Tri-City (WHL); Zachary Fucale, Halifax (QMJHL); Jake Paterson, Saginaw (OHL)

DEFENSEMEN: Mathew Dumba, Red Deer (WHL); Matt Finn, Guelph (OHL); Dillon Heatherington, Swift Current (WHL); Darnell Nurse, Sault Ste. Marie (OHL); Michael Matheson, Boston College (HE); Josh Morrissey, Prince Albert (WHL); Adam Pelech, Erie (OHL); Derrick Pouliot, Portland (WHL); Ryan Pulock, Brandon (WHL); Griffin Reinhart, Edmonton (WHL); Morgan Rielly, Moose Jaw (WHL); Damon Severson, Kelowna (WHL)

FORWARDS: Jonathan Drouin, Halifax (QMJHL); Max Domi, London (OHL); Brendan Gaunce, Belleville (OHL); Frédérik Gauthier, Rimouski (QMJHL); Félix Girard, Baie-Comeau (QMJHL); Bo Horvat, London (OHL); Charles Hudon, Chicoutimi (QMJHL); Scott Laughton, Oshawa (OHL); Curtis Lazar, Edmonton (WHL); Anthony Mantha, Val-d'Or (QMJHL); Connor McDavid, Erie (OHL); Nathan MacKinnon, Halifax (QMJHL); Sean Monahan, Ottawa (OHL); Nic Petan, Portland (WHL); Émile Poirier, Gatineau (QMJHL); Sam Reinhart, Kootenay (WHL); Ryan Rupert, London (OHL); Kerby Rychel, Windsor (OHL); Hunter Shinkaruk, Medicine Hat (WHL); Tom Wilson, Plymouth (OHL)

Who knows who will be made available - but with McDavid, possibly MacKinnon, Monahan, and Sam Reinhart to compete with, I don't see both Horvat and Gaunce getting a spot... however I believe Shinkaruk stands a better chance with more slots at wing.

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Re: Handling the Prospects Correctly

Postby Aaronp18 » Sun Jul 07, 2013 11:09 am

Southern_Canuck wrote:Who knows who will be made available - but with McDavid, possibly MacKinnon, Monahan, and Sam Reinhart to compete with, I don't see both Horvat and Gaunce getting a spot... however I believe Shinkaruk stands a better chance with more slots at wing.

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You'd have to think one or possibly both of MacKinnon and Monahan will be playing in the NHL this season.

I also believe both Horvat and Gaunce can play wing as well. Gaunce may be Canada's ideal third line centre though, he's shown he can match up against other teams best and play a strong defensive game.

We'll see, but I think it's a pretty outside shot that all three make the team but 1 or 2 of them should be there you'd have to think.
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Re: Handling the Prospects Correctly

Postby ClamRussel » Sun Jul 07, 2013 1:25 pm

Aaronp18 wrote:
Southern_Canuck wrote:Who knows who will be made available - but with McDavid, possibly MacKinnon, Monahan, and Sam Reinhart to compete with, I don't see both Horvat and Gaunce getting a spot... however I believe Shinkaruk stands a better chance with more slots at wing.

S_C


You'd have to think one or possibly both of MacKinnon and Monahan will be playing in the NHL this season.

I also believe both Horvat and Gaunce can play wing as well. Gaunce may be Canada's ideal third line centre though, he's shown he can match up against other teams best and play a strong defensive game.

We'll see, but I think it's a pretty outside shot that all three make the team but 1 or 2 of them should be there you'd have to think.


Keep in mind Canada is known to not select only offensive weapons but grinders and character guys as well. I'm thinking back to Kris Draper, players like that for the 3rd & 4th lines. I could see all 3 of them making the team but one of Horvat or Gaunce playing the wing.
I really think this is an important tournament and excellent experience for prospects. Even if one of them is on the big club what kind of minutes are they realistically going to get anyways? Much better off to get huge minutes in an intense tournament like this and then return afterwards w/ hopefully more confidence.
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Re: Handling the Prospects Correctly

Postby Meds » Sun Jul 07, 2013 1:41 pm

Southern_Canuck wrote:As for making the Canada WJC roster - it will be tough for Horvat and Gaunce at center - here are the invites to summer camp:

GOALIES: Eric Comrie, Tri-City (WHL); Zachary Fucale, Halifax (QMJHL); Jake Paterson, Saginaw (OHL)

DEFENSEMEN: Mathew Dumba, Red Deer (WHL); Matt Finn, Guelph (OHL); Dillon Heatherington, Swift Current (WHL); Darnell Nurse, Sault Ste. Marie (OHL); Michael Matheson, Boston College (HE); Josh Morrissey, Prince Albert (WHL); Adam Pelech, Erie (OHL); Derrick Pouliot, Portland (WHL); Ryan Pulock, Brandon (WHL); Griffin Reinhart, Edmonton (WHL); Morgan Rielly, Moose Jaw (WHL); Damon Severson, Kelowna (WHL)

FORWARDS: Jonathan Drouin, Halifax (QMJHL); Max Domi, London (OHL); Brendan Gaunce, Belleville (OHL); Frédérik Gauthier, Rimouski (QMJHL); Félix Girard, Baie-Comeau (QMJHL); Bo Horvat, London (OHL); Charles Hudon, Chicoutimi (QMJHL); Scott Laughton, Oshawa (OHL); Curtis Lazar, Edmonton (WHL); Anthony Mantha, Val-d'Or (QMJHL); Connor McDavid, Erie (OHL); Nathan MacKinnon, Halifax (QMJHL); Sean Monahan, Ottawa (OHL); Nic Petan, Portland (WHL); Émile Poirier, Gatineau (QMJHL); Sam Reinhart, Kootenay (WHL); Ryan Rupert, London (OHL); Kerby Rychel, Windsor (OHL); Hunter Shinkaruk, Medicine Hat (WHL); Tom Wilson, Plymouth (OHL)

Who knows who will be made available - but with McDavid, possibly MacKinnon, Monahan, and Sam Reinhart to compete with, I don't see both Horvat and Gaunce getting a spot... however I believe Shinkaruk stands a better chance with more slots at wing.

S_C


What a difference between east and west in the CHL, and the invitee list there sure highlights it. 8 of 12 defensemen invited are from the WHL. But only 4 of 20 forward positions are from the WHL.
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Re: Handling the Prospects Correctly

Postby Meds » Sun Jul 07, 2013 1:43 pm

Aaronp18 wrote:
Southern_Canuck wrote:Who knows who will be made available - but with McDavid, possibly MacKinnon, Monahan, and Sam Reinhart to compete with, I don't see both Horvat and Gaunce getting a spot... however I believe Shinkaruk stands a better chance with more slots at wing.

S_C


You'd have to think one or possibly both of MacKinnon and Monahan will be playing in the NHL this season.

I also believe both Horvat and Gaunce can play wing as well. Gaunce may be Canada's ideal third line centre though, he's shown he can match up against other teams best and play a strong defensive game.

We'll see, but I think it's a pretty outside shot that all three make the team but 1 or 2 of them should be there you'd have to think.


It would be quite something for us Canuck fans in all 3 of them made the team and at some point in the tournament all 3 of them were on the same line for a game or so..... :D
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