The Goalie Market

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Re: The Goalie Market

Postby $lacker » Wed Jun 26, 2013 2:52 pm

SKYO wrote:
$lacker wrote:LeBrun now saying Isles not in the Luongo "sweepstakes" either anymore. Scratch another one off the long list.


Well what GM goes out and intentionally says YES we are very interested in acquiring this player that is still under contract.
We typically hear all about that AFTER a GM acquires that player.

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Talks between the #Isles and Nabokov have come to a standstill. The soon-to-be 38yo goalie with test the free agency market come July 5


Ah, yes, the old conspiracy theory :D

I too thought for a long time that we could get something in return for Lu (and still think there was probably a better deal on table last year, pre-lockout), I just don't see why any GM would give up assets for him at this point when everyone knows GIllis has to deal him or buy him out. Maybe one of you guys could give me a team and a reason why they would take on the contract and who would be realistically coming back. And don't tell me its a good contract, everyone knows it's not, including Gillis and Roberto “My contract sucks. That’s what the problem is. Unfortunately, it’s a big factor in trading me, and it’s probably why I’m still here” Luongo.
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Re: The Goalie Market

Postby ESQ » Wed Jun 26, 2013 3:00 pm

herb wrote:I see zero risk in going with Cory.

He is the better athlete. He’s younger. He has great size and athleticism. He is positionally a great goaltender, but he also has great anticipation and reflexes. When he is on, he is nearly unbeatable. His numbers have actually gotten better the more NHL games he has played. He actually wants to be the man in Vancouver (unlike Lalongo). He also doesn’t have history of choking in the biggest games of his career.

Biggest game of CS's career thus far is probably Game 6 against Chicago, and he had a panic attack and left after giving up the lead. He missed the start of the playoffs this year because (allegedly) he was having panic attacks again. He's since denied that it was panic attacks keeping him out this year, but who really knows?

Cory Schneider and his 1-5 playoff record is very much an unknown quantity. Luongo never lost a first-round series, but the Canucks haven't gotten out of the first round since CS took over. CS's upside is that he might become as great a goaltender as Luongo - I define greatness as consistently elite performance over an extended period of time.

There is YUGE risk in going with Cory, but that decision is out of MG's hands due to RL's request for a trade. The smart hockey move would clearly be trading Cory for the better return. but that's off the table. If there is any way to salvage RL in Vancouver I would be thrilled, but it won't happen.

I think the best time to trade Luongo will be after buyouts are completed and teams know how much cap space they'll have. Compliance buyout ends at 5:00PM July 4, Free Agency starts July 5 at 9:00AM. I'm thinking depending on other goalie buyouts, the best time will be after the few free agent big fish have signed and teams have to look to trade.
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Re: The Goalie Market

Postby Strangelove » Wed Jun 26, 2013 3:07 pm

$lacker wrote:I just don't see why any GM would give up assets for him at this point when everyone knows GIllis has to deal him


UMMM because there's a huge market for a Top 10 goaltender this off-season? :scowl:

(a bit of a bidding war is still possible at this point)

Because many GMs have had to deal big-contract star-players in the past and have received decent returns?

$lacker wrote:or buy him out.


Only rookies believe Gillis could be forced to buy out Luongo. :hmmm:

$lacker wrote:Maybe one of you guys could give me a team and a reason why they would take on the contract and who would be realistically coming back.


Sorry, not going to repeat myself for a rookie.

$lacker wrote:And don't tell me its a good contract, everyone knows it's not, including Gillis and Roberto “My contract sucks. That’s what the problem is. Unfortunately, it’s a big factor in trading me, and it’s probably why I’m still here” Luongo.


It's not a good contract MID-SEASON.

It's an acceptable contract in the OFF-SEASON.

Is any of this getting through? :evil:

Anyway, I've gotta drag my hungover ass outta here for the day...
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Re: The Goalie Market

Postby $lacker » Wed Jun 26, 2013 3:15 pm

Strangelove wrote:
$lacker wrote:I just don't see why any GM would give up assets for him at this point when everyone knows GIllis has to deal him


UMMM because there's a huge market for a Top 10 goaltender this off-season? :scowl:

(a bit of a bidding war is still possible at this point)

Because many GMs have had to deal big-contract star-players in the past and have received decent returns?

$lacker wrote:or buy him out.


Only rookies believe Gillis could be forced to buy out Luongo. :hmmm:

$lacker wrote:Maybe one of you guys could give me a team and a reason why they would take on the contract and who would be realistically coming back.


Sorry, not going to repeat myself for a rookie.

$lacker wrote:And don't tell me its a good contract, everyone knows it's not, including Gillis and Roberto “My contract sucks. That’s what the problem is. Unfortunately, it’s a big factor in trading me, and it’s probably why I’m still here” Luongo.


It's not a good contract MID-SEASON.

It's an acceptable contract in the OFF-SEASON.

Is any of this getting through? :evil:

Anyway, I've gotta drag my hungover ass outta here for the day...


Weak post for the Wiley ol vet. :wow:

There is no "bidding war" for RL, and never will be. You can't honestly tell me you serious?

YOU don't seem to get that it has nothing to do with his contract "MID-SEASON" vs. "OFF-SEASON", it's the LENGTH of term not the cap hit. If his contract were 5 years there WOULD be a bidding war, but no one wants to have him on the books until he's 41. It's a TERRIBLE contract to trade.

I still don't see what team takes him on in a true hockey trade... it's either going to be a buyout situation or GIllis will have to take back a contract/eat some of RL's salary.
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Re: The Goalie Market

Postby $lacker » Wed Jun 26, 2013 3:29 pm

Just to add to the conversation:

http://www.cbssports.com/nhl/blog/eye-on-hockey/22535756/nhl-rumors-islanders-are-not-in-on-roberto-luongo-sweepstakes
NHL rumors: Islanders are not in on Roberto Luongo sweepstakes
By Brian Stubits | Hockey writer
June 26, 2013 3:21 pm ET


Roberto Luongo remains under contract through 2022. (USATSI)
More NHL offseason: Rumors | Top 50 Free Agents | Top 50 Prospects | Mock Draft

The Roberto Luongo sweepstakes are ongoing after more than a year now and we still don't seem closer to an actual deal taking place. The problem is a lack of suitors; not a ton of teams need to fill No. 1 goaltender positions right now and even fewer have a need to fill it with a contract as cumbersome as Luongo's.

One of the teams that has become popular as a possibile destination for Luongo lately among those speculating was the New York Islanders. They still haven't signed Evgeni Nabokov and thus have an open spot for a No. 1 netminder, not to mention Luongo began his NHL career with the Isles.

You can forget about it as Brett Cyrgalis of the New York Post reports.


So it would seem that you can take the Islanders off the potential suitors list, joining the Maple Leafs after their acquisition of Jonathan Bernier. It had previously been suggested by Bob McKenzie that the Islanders might be interested.

LUONGO ON THE BLOCK
Canucks GM: 'Unlikely' Roberto Luongo returns
The question is what teams are left for Luongo to be traded to? GM Mike Gillis said it's unlikely Luongo returns next season but where would he go? The Flyers have a need for another goalie but GM Paul Holmgren already said they won't be in on Luongo, either. Luongo has been open about wanting to play for the Florida Panthers again but they have Jacob Markstrom ready to take over and would probably be very reluctant to take on the contract as well.

Maybe at some point the Canucks do have to consider biting the bullet and using one of their two amnesty buyouts on Luongo, either this year or next year.

Luongo's contract runs through the 2022 season with an annual cap hit of $5.33 million. He had a 2.56 goals against average and a .907 save percentage this season in 20 games, serving as the backup to Cory Schneider.
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Re: The Goalie Market

Postby Jovocop » Wed Jun 26, 2013 3:31 pm

$lacker wrote:Just to add to the conversation:

http://www.cbssports.com/nhl/blog/eye-on-hockey/22535756/nhl-rumors-islanders-are-not-in-on-roberto-luongo-sweepstakes
NHL rumors: Islanders are not in on Roberto Luongo sweepstakes
By Brian Stubits | Hockey writer
June 26, 2013 3:21 pm ET


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Re: The Goalie Market

Postby Jovocop » Wed Jun 26, 2013 3:38 pm

$lacker wrote:
Weak post for the Wiley ol vet. :wow:

There is no "bidding war" for RL, and never will be. You can't honestly tell me you serious?

YOU don't seem to get that it has nothing to do with his contract "MID-SEASON" vs. "OFF-SEASON", it's the LENGTH of term not the cap hit. If his contract were 5 years there WOULD be a bidding war, but no one wants to have him on the books until he's 41. It's a TERRIBLE contract to trade.

I still don't see what team takes him on in a true hockey trade... it's either going to be a buyout situation or GIllis will have to take back a contract/eat some of RL's salary.


Never say never... NHL GMs are similar to politicians, they hardly tell the truth or keep their promises...

Did one NHL GM ever come out and say that he will never ever trade for Luongo?? The medias speculate this and speculate that, especially the ones from the GTA. Nobody knows the truth for sure...
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Re: The Goalie Market

Postby $lacker » Wed Jun 26, 2013 3:42 pm

Jovocop wrote:
$lacker wrote:
Weak post for the Wiley ol vet. :wow:

There is no "bidding war" for RL, and never will be. You can't honestly tell me you serious?

YOU don't seem to get that it has nothing to do with his contract "MID-SEASON" vs. "OFF-SEASON", it's the LENGTH of term not the cap hit. If his contract were 5 years there WOULD be a bidding war, but no one wants to have him on the books until he's 41. It's a TERRIBLE contract to trade.

I still don't see what team takes him on in a true hockey trade... it's either going to be a buyout situation or GIllis will have to take back a contract/eat some of RL's salary.


Never say never... NHL GMs are similar to politicians, they hardly tell the truth or keep their promises...

Did one NHL GM ever come out and say that he will never ever trade for Luongo?? The medias speculate this and speculate that, especially the ones from the GTA. Nobody knows the truth for sure...


Oh I agree 100%... I hope I'm wrong. It's all for the banter at this point. What else is one supposed to do at work on a Wed afternoon? :D Long weekend can't come fast enough right now with the extra day off and the draft.
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Re: The Goalie Market

Postby RoyalDude » Wed Jun 26, 2013 4:23 pm

For Gillis to trade Luongo now for a good asset in return with the dwindling market it seems to me that he has no choice but to take back a big bad contract and hope that he can convince Aquamarine to buy it out or either Gillis will have to move a trade-able big contract out to make room like moving Edler. I just don't see a GM out there willing to throw Mikey a life line knowing how much pressure is on him to put an end to this.
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Re: The Goalie Market

Postby Hockey Widow » Wed Jun 26, 2013 4:26 pm

See here is the problem with: why would a team trade anything for him when MG will be forced to buy him out and they can sign him for nothing and get a better contract, talk. If Luongo is a FA he gets to go anywhere he wants to go. Those teams that are in a position to land a top 10 goalie with another 6-8 years of solid play ahead of him, under a very reasonable cap hit, can guarantee they get him if they trade for him. They cannot guarantee they get him if he is FA. So far we have the Islanders, the Flyers, Tampa, Florida, NJ all willing to sign him when he becomes a FA because suddenly he is one of the best in the world and he is available for the taking. Problem is only one team can get him. So this nonsense that GM's are lined up and ready to sign him as a FA is just that nonsense. If he is FA he will go to one of the Florida teams and he will sign a 5-6 year deal with a cap hit of around 4 million. So if a team wants him they need to trade for him. He will not chase the money if he is FA. He will stay in Florida.

The Flyers still make the best sense to me. They get a true number one who will give them a solid 6-8 years. The Canucks would have to take back one more bad contract but they could still get a decent return. Not a home run but a decent return. Same with the Islanders. But we have to see if common sense prevails. You listening common sense? I with you on this.

And from what I have heard, Luongo's agent has tried to explore the buy out option with MG but MG has told him he is not willing to buy him out. Posturing, perhaps.

At this point I too just want the saga over. If he does get bought out it will be unfortunate but I can live with it.
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Re: The Goalie Market

Postby Rumsfeld » Wed Jun 26, 2013 4:28 pm

What about Buffalo if/when they trade Miller?
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Re: The Goalie Market

Postby $lacker » Wed Jun 26, 2013 4:33 pm

Rumsfeld wrote:What about Buffalo if/when they trade Miller?

A 34 year old head case through to 2021 for a 32 Year old headcase? :lol:

They seem to be pretty high on Enroth.
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Re: The Goalie Market

Postby Strangelove » Wed Jun 26, 2013 8:26 pm

$lacker wrote:
Strangelove wrote:
$lacker wrote:And don't tell me its a good contract, everyone knows it's not, including Gillis and Roberto “My contract sucks. That’s what the problem is. Unfortunately, it’s a big factor in trading me, and it’s probably why I’m still here” Luongo.


It's not a good contract MID-SEASON.

It's an acceptable contract in the OFF-SEASON.

Is any of this getting through? :evil:

Anyway, I've gotta drag my hungover ass outta here for the day...


Weak post for the Wiley ol vet. :wow:


whoosh

$lacker wrote:There is no "bidding war" for RL, and never will be. You can't honestly tell me you serious?


I'm dead serious.

A bidding war (with the looong contract taken into account by the bidders).

$lacker wrote:YOU don't seem to get that it has nothing to do with his contract "MID-SEASON" vs. "OFF-SEASON", it's the LENGTH of term not the cap hit.


Well one of us doesn't "get it" and that someone is certainly NOT yours truly.

ONE MORE TIME SON: It's much easier to move a LONG contract in the "OFF-SEASON". :stupid:

$lacker wrote:If his contract were 5 years there WOULD be a bidding war, but no one wants to have him on the books until he's 41. It's a TERRIBLE contract to trade.


I'm SO glad you said that.

See, after 5 years a team can buy him out @ $583,333 times 8 years.

(true the cap-hit penalty would be about $4mil per for the first few years, but that doesn't bother a team like FLORIDA)

You mean to tell me that relatively minor detail is gonna make the difference of "bidding war" vs "TERRIBLE contract"?

Think $lacker, THINK!

$lacker wrote:I still don't see what team takes him on in a true hockey trade... it's either going to be a buyout situation or GIllis will have to take back a contract/eat some of RL's salary.


Well of course YOU don't see it. 8-)
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Re: The Goalie Market

Postby $lacker » Sat Jun 29, 2013 9:01 am

Hmmm.. Maybe I'm not so crazy after all eh Strangelove?

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The pre-draft buzz continues in NYC with the #Canucks reportedly testing the Schneider trade market if they can't move Luongo. #pndraft

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It's getting interesting. 2 sources say Corey Schneider is in play. 1st and a prospect part of asking price. Suspect Oilers in on talks.
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Re: The Goalie Market

Postby Strangelove » Sat Jun 29, 2013 1:58 pm

$lacker wrote:Hmmm.. Maybe I'm not so crazy after all eh Strangelove?

Ben Kuzma
The pre-draft buzz continues in NYC with the #Canucks reportedly testing the Schneider trade market if they can't move Luongo. #pndraft

Darren Dreger
It's getting interesting. 2 sources say Corey Schneider is in play. 1st and a prospect part of asking price. Suspect Oilers in on talks.


Hmmm.. maybe not.

But if it turns out to be hogwash would you agree to a little shock therapy? :mex:

BTW Gillis denied the rumour, said many teams are calling about Schneids though.

I'm on record as preferring to trade Schneids, but Luongo has made it clear he wants out.

I have also suggested AV might have been a big part of why Lou wanted out.

I hope I was right.

Gillis would still hafta smooth things over with Gina though, not sure it can be done.

WAY too soon to be putting any stock in this rumour....
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