Roster Questions

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If an overhaul of this team is needed, which of the following players who should MG shop around...

Hank and Danny
12
7%
Edler
44
25%
Booth
45
26%
Higgins
8
5%
Bieksa
15
9%
Ballard
45
26%
Hamhuis
2
1%
None of the above
2
1%
 
Total votes: 173

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Meds
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Re: Roster Questions

Post by Meds »

Rumsfeld wrote:Burrows, Bieksa and Schroeder for a high-end top-six winger with some jam.

Get a physical third-line center and a stay-at-home punishing D-man via free agency and/or Luongo trade.

Trade Ballard for a pick if possible, if not buy him out.

Start the season with Kassian and Booth in the top six and see how things go. Look to get another top-six winger at the deadline.

Use free-agency to land at least one BAMF who can skate and check for the fourth line. Weise/Lain/Sestito would be a disaster.
I don't know who is out there for wingers that might be on the move, but.....

Get Clowe if he can be got?

Maybe Briere if he'll come cheap?

That would get us an assHOLE and a shooter who can actually hit the net. Like I said, I'm not sure what's out there for trade.

Trade Edler and something to Pittsburgh for Letang (if Shero can't sign him) then sign Komisarek to be his partner. Komisarek is expected to be bought out, will probably come for $2M or so....
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Re: Roster Questions

Post by 2Fingers »

Mëds Mëds Mëds, when are you going to learn. MG will not trade anyone with a NTC so expect to see the same starting lineup from last year. The way MG is going I would not be surprised if Luongo is still in a Canuck uniform come September/October along side Ballard/Booth. Hell our 3rd and 4th line will be nothing but $500k scrubs just so we can fit under the cap.

At least by then we may have a new coach announced.
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Re: Roster Questions

Post by Meds »

Reefer2 wrote:Mëds Mëds Mëds, when are you going to learn. MG will not trade anyone with a NTC so expect to see the same starting lineup from last year. The way MG is going I would not be surprised if Luongo is still in a Canuck uniform come September/October along side Ballard/Booth. Hell our 3rd and 4th line will be nothing but $500k scrubs just so we can fit under the cap.

At least by then we may have a new coach announced.
Wrong.

Gillis will not ASK any player to waive their NTC/NMC.

He will trade them if they have none or if they want to go.....see Luongo for the latter.

Edler does NOT have a NTC right now. I kicks in on July 1st. Until then he is a very tradable piece. Same goes for Burrows.
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Re: Roster Questions

Post by Jovocop »

Mëds wrote:
Wrong.

Gillis will not ASK any player to waive their NTC/NMC.

He will trade them if they have none or if they want to go.....see Luongo for the latter.

Edler does NOT have a NTC right now. I kicks in on July 1st. Until then he is a very tradable piece. Same goes for Burrows.
Technically, both Edler and Burrows could be traded before their NTC kick in. However, I don't believe MG would be such a douchebag to trade them while promised to provide them the job security here in Vancouver. Good or bad, I don't know but I would definitely hate to work for a boss who does not honour his words...
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Re: Roster Questions

Post by SKYO »

Jovocop wrote:Technically, both Edler and Burrows could be traded before their NTC kick in. However, I don't believe MG would be such a douchebag to trade them while promised to provide them the job security here in Vancouver. Good or bad, I don't know but I would definitely hate to work for a boss who does not honour his words...
However it sounds like players know that this team in general has under performed the last two playoffs, and they know the winds of change are coming, so I don't think Bur or Edler would be absolutely SHOCKED if they got dealt to help with the teams various needs.

Having said that I think they are both safe, unless MG manages to get a deal to swoop in and get that 5th overall pick http://bit.ly/1c7Uj6u this year, then AB or AE will likely be a part in that package to get us that pick to help secure the Canucks long term success.
Can the Canucks just win a Cup within the next 5 years.
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Re: Roster Questions

Post by 2Fingers »

Jovocop wrote:
Mëds wrote:
Wrong.

Gillis will not ASK any player to waive their NTC/NMC.

He will trade them if they have none or if they want to go.....see Luongo for the latter.

Edler does NOT have a NTC right now. I kicks in on July 1st. Until then he is a very tradable piece. Same goes for Burrows.
Technically, both Edler and Burrows could be traded before their NTC kick in. However, I don't believe MG would be such a douchebag to trade them while promised to provide them the job security here in Vancouver. Good or bad, I don't know but I would definitely hate to work for a boss who does not honour his words...
In sports I would hate to have a GM who cares more about the feelings of players than doing what is right for the team.
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Re: Roster Questions

Post by ESQ »

Reefer2 wrote:
In sports I would hate to have a GM who cares more about the feelings of players than doing what is right for the team.
I think the philosophy is respecting NTCs long-term what is right for the team. GMs/organizations that treat players poorly have difficulty attracting free agents (hello Edmonton). Vancouver is already a tough market to attract FAs - terrible travel, high taxes, insane media/fan base - that Gillis believes he needs to do whatever he can to make the market attractive. As a result Gillis has been able to attract key free agents, something Burke and Nonis could not do in Van and seem unable to do in T oronto thus far.
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Re: Roster Questions

Post by SKYO »

ESQ wrote:
Reefer2 wrote:In sports I would hate to have a GM who cares more about the feelings of players than doing what is right for the team.
I think the philosophy is respecting NTCs long-term what is right for the team. GMs/organizations that treat players poorly have difficulty attracting free agents (hello Edmonton).

Vancouver is already a tough market to attract FAs - terrible travel, high taxes, insane media/fan base - that Gillis believes he needs to do whatever he can to make the market attractive.

As a result Gillis has been able to attract key free agents, something Burke and Nonis could not do in Van and seem unable to do in Toronto thus far.
Yeah, like MG treats our players like crap, this core has been together a long time now, I highly doubt trading Burr or Edler will change how UFA's view this team and how MG handles his players and their contracts, the entire league knows he is very respectful and accommodating to all the players here.

The reason this team can attract ufa's is that this team is a contender, and that's in large part because of the Sedin's carrying this team to the playoffs every year, something pauser fails to realize, he'd rather sack the team to go through a painful re-build, in which who the fuck knows if we could ever can become a contender like this again as the draft is typically a crap shoot, we should be extremely fortunate that we have the Sedins and Kesler to build around and contend for the next 5 years or so, as long we can re-sign the twins and have RK17 still under contract.
Can the Canucks just win a Cup within the next 5 years.
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Re: Roster Questions

Post by Meds »

Jovocop wrote:
Mëds wrote:
Wrong.

Gillis will not ASK any player to waive their NTC/NMC.

He will trade them if they have none or if they want to go.....see Luongo for the latter.

Edler does NOT have a NTC right now. I kicks in on July 1st. Until then he is a very tradable piece. Same goes for Burrows.
Technically, both Edler and Burrows could be traded before their NTC kick in. However, I don't believe MG would be such a douchebag to trade them while promised to provide them the job security here in Vancouver. Good or bad, I don't know but I would definitely hate to work for a boss who does not honour his words...
I also don't think MG expected the team to get swept in the first round this year. Edler's mistakes at the point and in his own end were major contributing factors to our first round exits for two years in a row.

I don't think, actually I know first hand, that employees who have all sorts of protection and mail it in are often not overly appreciated by the ones that put in the effort. I'm certain that if Edler was traded there would be s few guys in that dressing room who were happy to see him go.
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Re: Roster Questions

Post by Meds »

ESQ wrote:
Reefer2 wrote:
In sports I would hate to have a GM who cares more about the feelings of players than doing what is right for the team.
I think the philosophy is respecting NTCs long-term what is right for the team. GMs/organizations that treat players poorly have difficulty attracting free agents (hello Edmonton). Vancouver is already a tough market to attract FAs - terrible travel, high taxes, insane media/fan base - that Gillis believes he needs to do whatever he can to make the market attractive. As a result Gillis has been able to attract key free agents, something Burke and Nonis could not do in Van and seem unable to do in T oronto thus far.
I think having an all star goaltender, two of the top forwards in the league, being a contender, and having such passionate fans, is a big reason why FA's have come to Vancouver. It also helps that the city is consistently ranked in the top 10 or 15 cities in the world.
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Re: Roster Questions

Post by Aaronp18 »

One of the biggest reasons players sign or re-sign in Vancouver is because of the commitment from ownership and management to do whatever it takes to remain a contender. Sometimes this means making some tough decisions and making changes many may not like initially to better the team.

I don't think that any future signings will hinge on whether or not Gillis moved Burrows or Edler before their NTC kicked in if they are moves to improved the team. The Canucks provide everything a player needs or might need to succeed and this is a promise the team has made to all its players. If the team fails to meet expectations changes need to be made.

The teams needs differ from season to season. Right now scoring depth is a major issue, along with what seems to be an overly comfortable core of players that may not be motivated enough to stay.

The coaching change will help with the staleness we've been witnessing the past couple years but it may not change everything. A shot across the bow of the roster is what is also necessary IMO.

It's a privilege to play in Vancouver and its expected that you bring everything you can when playing for the Canucks. If that isn't happening then you may not be playing here much longer.

Accountability.
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Re: Roster Questions

Post by ukcanuck »

Aaronp18 wrote:One of the biggest reasons players sign or re-sign in Vancouver is because of the commitment from ownership and management to do whatever it takes to remain a contender. Sometimes this means making some tough decisions and making changes many may not like initially to better the team.

I don't think that any future signings will hinge on whether or not Gillis moved Burrows or Edler before their NTC kicked in if they are moves to improved the team. The Canucks provide everything a player needs or might need to succeed and this is a promise the team has made to all its players. If the team fails to meet expectations changes need to be made.

The teams needs differ from season to season. Right now scoring depth is a major issue, along with what seems to be an overly comfortable core of players that may not be motivated enough to stay.

The coaching change will help with the staleness we've been witnessing the past couple years but it may not change everything. A shot across the bow of the roster is what is also necessary IMO.

It's a privilege to play in Vancouver and its expected that you bring everything you can when playing for the Canucks. If that isn't happening then you may not be playing here much longer.

Accountability.
I'm with ya philosophically Aaron, accountability is número UNO, however, are you suggesting they trade Edler because he deserves to not be here based on effort and commitment to win on his part

Or

Are we really talking about trading him because he is the biggest talent we have without a NTC at the moment?
Because if that's true it's not the same "we are all Canucks" message really...
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Re: Roster Questions

Post by Aaronp18 »

ukcanuck wrote:
Aaronp18 wrote:One of the biggest reasons players sign or re-sign in Vancouver is because of the commitment from ownership and management to do whatever it takes to remain a contender. Sometimes this means making some tough decisions and making changes many may not like initially to better the team.

I don't think that any future signings will hinge on whether or not Gillis moved Burrows or Edler before their NTC kicked in if they are moves to improved the team. The Canucks provide everything a player needs or might need to succeed and this is a promise the team has made to all its players. If the team fails to meet expectations changes need to be made.

The teams needs differ from season to season. Right now scoring depth is a major issue, along with what seems to be an overly comfortable core of players that may not be motivated enough to stay.

The coaching change will help with the staleness we've been witnessing the past couple years but it may not change everything. A shot across the bow of the roster is what is also necessary IMO.

It's a privilege to play in Vancouver and its expected that you bring everything you can when playing for the Canucks. If that isn't happening then you may not be playing here much longer.

Accountability.
I'm with ya philosophically Aaron, accountability is número UNO, however, are you suggesting they trade Edler because he deserves to not be here based on effort and commitment to win on his part

Or

Are we really talking about trading him because he is the biggest talent we have without a NTC at the moment?
Because if that's true it's not the same "we are all Canucks" message really...
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Re: Roster Questions

Post by ESQ »

Aaronp18 wrote:One of the biggest reasons players sign or re-sign in Vancouver is because of the commitment from ownership and management to do whatever it takes to remain a contender. Sometimes this means making some tough decisions and making changes many may not like initially to better the team.

I don't think that any future signings will hinge on whether or not Gillis moved Burrows or Edler before their NTC kicked in if they are moves to improved the team. The Canucks provide everything a player needs or might need to succeed and this is a promise the team has made to all its players. If the team fails to meet expectations changes need to be made.
Granted this isn't the year, but the time will come when the Canucks (probably under Gillis) will need to make a big splash in free agency. When that day comes I doubt the Canucks will be seen as a perennial contender, and other intangibles could make or break a FA deal. After listening to Sturm's and Samuelsson's comments after being traded 6 games in, I think the way management honours contracts for sure factors in to the decision-making of potential free agents. Right now Sammy is out there shitting all over Gillis to any player who asks his opinion, it doesn't take a ton of those disgruntled ex-players to sway a lot of peoples' opinions.

Of course my speculations as to what Gillis' motivation is for his blanket honouring of NTCs are irrelevant, it is Gillis' policy and he will deviate from it if the circumstances warrant. I'm just saying that future blowback on reneging NTCs (or trading someone a week before it comes into effect) will likely factor into his decision. As an ex-agent he is very well-positioned to know how such actions influence players' decisions.
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Re: Roster Questions

Post by Rumsfeld »

I'm telling you Esq, you worry too much.

Just kick back, spark up a fattie, and watch the bold moves fall where they may.

If your team is struggling and trading a player before his NTC kicks in makes you better, you do it. Players seldom worry about their moral obligations to a contract when they demand a trade halfway through said contract.

These guys signed a contract that allowed them to be moved before a certain date. This is professional sports, not the Oprah Winfrey show. Who gives a shit how they feel about it if no stipulations of the contract were breached?

Players sign with certain teams for a few reasons. Money, money, money, contending for Stanley, and playing in a city they like. I seriously doubt that a GM has ever vetoed future deals by moving a player early in the season or before his NTC kicks in. He is simply trying to improve his team and he is doing it within the structured confines of a mutually-agreed upon contract.

Samuelsson was a floating useless bitch who deserved to be dumped at the first opportunity. It's not uncommon for traded players to rail against the GM who traded them and it's not going to affect other players' willingness to sign with a team. Gillis was an agent and I'm sure he knows these guys are in it for themselves.

Gillis didn't give up on Sammy, Sammy gave up on us.

As for Sturm, that was a situation where Gillis realized his mistake and moved quickly to fremedy it.... something this board has put him on the rack for NOT doing with Ballard the last three seasons. Sturm was completely shot and looked like he couldn't make the top-6 of an AHL squad. Winning teams don't keep guys like that around because they don't want to hurt any feelings.

What the fuck are we worrying about again? :lol:
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