Should Gillis Trade Alexander Edler?

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Re: Should Gillis Trade Alexander Edler?

Postby herb » Mon Jun 03, 2013 8:44 am

dbr wrote:1. Click on username
2. Click on "add foe"
3. Everybody wins


Thanks Dave.

I don't always post, but I read CC almost every day. Royaldude's schtick has gotten beyond tiresome. His posts don't form logical, cogent thoughts anymore.
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Re: Should Gillis Trade Alexander Edler?

Postby herb » Mon Jun 03, 2013 8:54 am

Lancer wrote:You're taking this tack that everybody who wants Edler traded does so because they think he's a crap defenceman. No doubt there are a couple who fit that bill, but the consensus I see is that Edler should be traded because he's the best asset Gillis can trade in terms of value coming back as well as the one significant trade that won't leave a gaping hole in the line-up outside of goal. Does he have flaws? Definitely. Will the organization miss him as much as dealing other parts of the core Gillis could trade? Not really, but that doesn't mean he's a shitty defenceman.

The Canucks are staring at a lot of payroll, a decreasing cap, and a team in dire need of significant change on the roster beyond just rotating role-players. Add in the NTCs most of the valuable roster players have and the fact that Edler's doesn't kick in until July and it's a no-brainer.


I was just about to write nearly the exact same thing.

Thank you for pointing out the obvious for those who choose to ignore it. The bottom line with Edler for me is:
- What you see is what you get. I don't think we will see any dramatic improvement in his play moving forward. He is primarily an elite offensive defenseman, with average defensive play and below average physicality.
- He has a NTC that doesn't kick in until July 1, which makes dealing him now easier than dealing him later. Hamhuis, Bieksa and Garrison already have NTCs of their own.
- He becomes big money cap hit next season.
- The return in an Edler trade should be enough to significantly improve this group up front and provide a much needed "reset" or "refresh".
- Edler cannot play the right side. We already have Hamhuis and Garrison who can play left side top 4 roles, so the loss of Edler would not put a gaping hole in the lineup. It doesn't make sense having one of Garrison, Hamhuis or Edler playing bottom pairing minutes given the decreasing cap and other holes in the lineup. Gillis would still have to resolve other issues, like finding a right side defenseman and filling out the bottom pairing, though.
- The recurring back issue is a concern. Even Alex has stated as much.
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Re: Should Gillis Trade Alexander Edler?

Postby vic » Mon Jun 03, 2013 10:27 am

Hockey Widow wrote:Out of sincere respect for your opinion I would like to know what you personally think MG should do, how he should do it and how he should improve a team you have blasted all season....


Waste of keystrokes, HW. He's been asked the same question by at least a dozen other posters and it causes him to go into hiding.
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Re: Should Gillis Trade Alexander Edler?

Postby ukcanuck » Tue Jun 04, 2013 8:37 am

This is the kind of shit that scares me about trading good players for a chemistry change...
How often does it work? The last one was Philly if I recall and where were they this spring?

http://www.theprovince.com/touch/story.html?id=8472802
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Re: Should Gillis Trade Alexander Edler?

Postby dbr » Tue Jun 04, 2013 9:25 am

Well, Ottawa got Dany Heatley, stayed at the top of the league and made a trip to the finals themselves out of that Hossa deal - Hossa has since hit UFA age, signed in a couple of places and his time in Ottawa is pretty much ancient history right now.

As for Chara, that was a pure cap crunch situation.. the Senators had to choose between Chara and Redden as I recall, chose hilariously wrong (admittedly the "Chara was pissed at the way Hossa was treated" narrative is new to me although it doesn't explain why he followed a member of Sens management straight to Boston) and ended up letting Redden walk for nothing within a couple of years anyways.

I'd say that moving Edler looks a lot more like moving Hossa (in that you are returning players who will either replace the outgoing guy or address some other issue on the roster) than it does like allowing one of the league's most dominant defensemen to walk for nothing.

Besides, if we can't part with Edler because of the "what if" factor then we're pretty well left hoping that we can move Roberto Luongo, David Booth and Keith Ballard for the type of return that will give this team a shot in the arm next year.. I don't see that happening.
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Re: Should Gillis Trade Alexander Edler?

Postby Uncle dans leg » Tue Jun 04, 2013 9:28 am

vic wrote:
Hockey Widow wrote:Out of sincere respect for your opinion I would like to know what you personally think MG should do, how he should do it and how he should improve a team you have blasted all season....


Waste of keystrokes, HW. He's been asked the same question by at least a dozen other posters and it causes him to go into hiding.

I asked Artie a handful of times what the hell was up with the CAP LOCKs all the time and got the same response.

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Re: Should Gillis Trade Alexander Edler?

Postby Topper » Tue Jun 04, 2013 9:42 am

The Dude's posts are never to be missed.
Over the Internet, you can pretend to be anyone or anything.

I'm amazed that so many people choose to be complete twats.
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Re: Should Gillis Trade Alexander Edler?

Postby SKYO » Tue Jun 04, 2013 11:29 am

ukcanuck wrote:This is the kind of shit that scares me about trading good players for a chemistry change...
How often does it work? The last one was Philly if I recall and where were they this spring?
http://www.theprovince.com/touch/story.html?id=8472802


Except we are not trading Edler just for a chemistry change in the team, we are idealizing the thought of trading AE out of necessity and logical choice, as it's been said already, his NTC hasn't kicked in yet, too many left side dmen, he has the most value, not being an uber dominant clear cut #1 dman, Tanev/Corrado stepping up and other assets to trade to shore up veteran presence to help ease the loss of AE. imo enough offense from our defense in Hamhuis, JG and Juice. Plus whatever other dman we get this offseason, preferably an offensive right side dman to play on the 2nd pairing OR just a big vet defensive specialist for the bottom pairing to play with Corrado.

Canucks have never had a rock solid 2nd line behind the Sedins, ever.
Edler gives us that chance, whether by getting a young sniper/scoring winger in return for RK to play with.
or by trading up to get a top 5 draft pick in a deep draft to solidify our long term success.
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Re: Should Gillis Trade Alexander Edler?

Postby Uncle dans leg » Tue Jun 04, 2013 12:14 pm

Shea frickin Weber... There's gotta be a way to pry him out of Nashville.

He's exactly what we need and I'm sure I read on here somewhere he wants to come home.

How about Kesler, Edler and our 1st for Weber, Filip Forsberg and their 1st?

Cue to culture change and rebuild.
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Re: Should Gillis Trade Alexander Edler?

Postby Rumsfeld » Tue Jun 04, 2013 12:21 pm

Uncle dans leg wrote:Shea frickin Weber... There's gotta be a way to pry him out of Nashville.

He's exactly what we need and I'm sure I read on here somewhere he wants to come home.

How about Kesler, Edler and our 1st for Weber, Filip Forsberg and their 1st?

Cue to culture change and rebuild.


So they're going to give us the best d-man in the league for a guy who's probably now considered top-20, a better pick than we're giving them, AND a blue-chip prospect because we throw in Kesler?

More like Kesler, Edler and our 1st for Weber and MAYBE one of their crappier forwards. And no, I wouldn't do it because I think Kesler is going to beast out next season and we're already short one good center on this team.
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Re: Should Gillis Trade Alexander Edler?

Postby Reefer2 » Tue Jun 04, 2013 3:13 pm

ukcanuck wrote:This is the kind of shit that scares me about trading good players for a chemistry change...
How often does it work? The last one was Philly if I recall and where were they this spring?

http://www.theprovince.com/touch/story.html?id=8472802


Didn't LA just win a cup?
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Re: Should Gillis Trade Alexander Edler?

Postby ukcanuck » Tue Jun 04, 2013 3:30 pm

Reefer2 wrote:
ukcanuck wrote:This is the kind of shit that scares me about trading good players for a chemistry change...
How often does it work? The last one was Philly if I recall and where were they this spring?

http://www.theprovince.com/touch/story.html?id=8472802


Didn't LA just win a cup?

I was under the impression that LA was just the beneficiary of philly's desire to change it up.
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Re: Should Gillis Trade Alexander Edler?

Postby Uncle dans leg » Tue Jun 04, 2013 7:32 pm

Rumsfeld wrote:So they're going to give us the best d-man in the league for a guy who's probably now considered top-20, a better pick than we're giving them, AND a blue-chip prospect because we throw in Kesler?


Hence why it's a good deal ;)

I don't think it's that bad of a package going back honestly. Maybe screw swapping picks then if you want to lean it back their way a bit but still I see Kesler as having very good trade value. Maybe even enough to weasel Weber out of there.

They didn't exactly light the world on fire with their line up either so there could be a trade there...since we're tossing out redonkulous proposals...
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Re: Should Gillis Trade Alexander Edler?

Postby Rumsfeld » Tue Jun 04, 2013 7:39 pm

Uncle dans leg wrote:
Rumsfeld wrote:So they're going to give us the best d-man in the league for a guy who's probably now considered top-20, a better pick than we're giving them, AND a blue-chip prospect because we throw in Kesler?


Hence why it's a good deal ;)

I don't think it's that bad of a package going back honestly. Maybe screw swapping picks then if you want to lean it back their way a bit but still I see Kesler as having very good trade value. Maybe even enough to weasel Weber out of there.

They didn't exactly light the world on fire with their line up either so there could be a trade there...since we're tossing out redonkulous proposals...


Well, look at ot this way. Edler plus our lousy 1st round pick is not even CLOSE to being enough to land Weber. Especially given Edler's season.

I'm sure Kesler has excellent trade value so if you added him in you might get Weber plus a throw-in... but then we just have an even bigger hole to plug.

Honestly, I know he's a dick but out of all our forwards Kesler is the guy I'd say we HAVE to hang on to, at least for a season. We haven't seen him play healthy and with a training camp in a long time, and he'll be motivated to prove some shit to folks this year. Plus his contract is pretty affordable.
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Re: Should Gillis Trade Alexander Edler?

Postby Uncle dans leg » Tue Jun 04, 2013 7:46 pm

Rumsfeld wrote:Well, look at ot this way. Edler plus our lousy 1st round pick is not even CLOSE to being enough to land Weber. Especially given Edler's season.

I'm sure Kesler has excellent trade value so if you added him in you might get Weber plus a throw-in... but then we just have an even bigger hole to plug.

Honestly, I know he's a dick but out of all our forwards Kesler is the guy I'd say we HAVE to hang on to, at least for a season. We haven't seen him play healthy and with a training camp in a long time, and he'll be motivated to prove some shit to folks this year. Plus his contract is pretty affordable.

Agreed that Kesler is our most dynamic forward but...if you have a shot at SW, you do what it takes.

Filip Forsberg is a young, dynamic winger/centre who would be a downgrade admittedly but with Keslers' recent health concerns I feel this is the best time to move him. The way Kes plays will have him in suit and tie more often the older he gets. Add in the dickhead factor and I just feel this is the time to maximize return on him and put our resources into a different asset, one more respected and dynamic at his position.
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