Election Memorial Jr.

The primary goal of this site is to provide mature, meaningful discussion about the Vancouver Canucks. However, we all need a break some time so this forum is basically for anything off-topic, off the wall, or to just get something off your chest! This forum is named after poster Creeper, who passed away in July of 2011 and was a long time member of the Canucks message board community.

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Re: Election Memorial Jr.

Postby Topper » Wed Apr 24, 2013 2:58 pm

Exploration companies assume a huge risk trying to find a deposit. Odds are probably better at the Craps tables. As we saw with all the previous NDP administrations in BC, land tenure of mineral claims becomes doubtful. Without that, investors will not risk the venture capital involved in exploration. By it very nature, exploration occurs primarily in rural areas and is major employer in rural BC. It is the largest employer of Wagon Burners in BC.

Permitting and building a mine like Mt Milligan is a $1B + investment and that does not include exploration costs to find and define the project. The Crown does not assume any of those risks.

How do you determine the in situ value of a deposit with metal prices fluctuating constantly? The easiest way to add tonnage to a deposit is not by doing additional exploration, but rather by increasing metal prices. I can think of only one BC metals mine that has strong metal price security and all the others are borderline profitable operations.

A small community in the Cariboo that I ran a program in did an economic study to indicate where most of the legal $'s in the community were coming from. They looked at logging, mining, exploration, hunting/fishing guides, tourism...... Mineral exploration and mining trumped all others. Logging and forestry had the most employees, mining and exploration had the least. However the money spent in the local community was far greater than any other industries. At the time of the study, I had the only exploration program there. I rented a cabin at a local resort, the four man drill crew rented another place. I had two direct employees and we used a local logging contractor for road building, drill site preparation and reclamation. Myself, my employees and contractors bought our groceries, hardware and fuel in the local shops. Dined at the local cafe and pub.

It comes down to dollars spent locally. Yes big ticket items like assay cost and the drill contractors are moneys going elsewhere, but the money spent locally is what matters most. the gas station, cafe, pub, grocery store all ended up hiring additional staff. Spend two minutes and ask the local shop keepers and their employees what they think.

Last year there was +$7 million exploration program on that project and approximately 20 locals were employed along with an out of town staff of 25 housed at a variety of accommodations in the community.
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Re: Election Memorial Jr.

Postby Uncle dans leg » Wed Apr 24, 2013 3:13 pm

With the monthly fees collected in BC for medical coverage, why the fuck do they need to allocate more funding? It costs my family of 3 $135 a month. Maybe they should manage what they get now rather than throwing more cake at a broken system. Anyone tried to see a physician of late? You cant find one if your life depends on it unless you like visiting random clinics.

In Alberta, we had no monthly premiums and a far more efficient system for average people. Sure the province is wealthier but I'm curious how these 2 systems compare financially and in efficiency.

Returning to a government intent on blowing wads on these money pits is concerning to say the least. Throw in their apparent agenda to stifle economic growth and it looks like a lot more BC folks will be working in Alberia like I do already.
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Re: Election Memorial Jr.

Postby Uncle dans leg » Wed Apr 24, 2013 3:21 pm

Topper wrote:He is also against world class sea ports being used as world class sea ports.

This one is unbelievable. If he gets voted in, will he scrap the Northern Gateway project? Is this his agenda?

Edit-"New Democrats oppose this project because it is neither in the best interests of Canadians, nor does it meet the criteria of what constitutes sustainable development."
-Jean Crowder NDP MP

Well...wow. Goodbye revenue road
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Re: Election Memorial Jr.

Postby Reefer2 » Wed Apr 24, 2013 4:51 pm

Uncle dans leg wrote:With the monthly fees collected in BC for medical coverage, why the fuck do they need to allocate more funding? It costs my family of 3 $135 a month. Maybe they should manage what they get now rather than throwing more cake at a broken system. Anyone tried to see a physician of late? You cant find one if your life depends on it unless you like visiting random clinics.



Not sure of what goes on in Alberta but any medical system that is basically free will always get abused and nothing will ever change that. My wife spent 2 nights in the hospital last month as she had gal bladder stones. 50% of the people in emergency were elderly. Again not sure of how many seniors there are in Alberta compared to BC (and not looking it up either) but the elderly has been the biggest problem we are about to face and we never have a government who looks past tomorrow to deal with this.

Another problem is the poor use of emergency, I have read that 30% or higher of visits to the hospital do not need emergency treatment. How about a $50 charges for that, or how about a $50 charge for every useless visit to your doctor because you got a cold.

Classroom sizes have always been big, it is nothing more than a ploy by the teachers to get more money. The biggest change is the amount of ESL in the class. Again how about an annual fee charged to immigrants who don't speak English when they come to Canada. Canada is a country built on immigration and the more the merrier but it is time for Canada to have an identity and if you want to come here this is what you need to have.
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Re: Election Memorial Jr.

Postby Topper » Wed Apr 24, 2013 5:05 pm

Reefer2 wrote:Another problem is the poor use of emergency, I have read that 30% or higher of visits to the hospital do not need emergency treatment. How about a $50 charges for that, or how about a $50 charge for every useless visit to your doctor because you got a cold.

Classroom sizes have always been big, it is nothing more than a ploy by the teachers to get more money. The biggest change is the amount of ESL in the class. Again how about an annual fee charged to immigrants who don't speak English when they come to Canada. Canada is a country built on immigration and the more the merrier but it is time for Canada to have an identity and if you want to come here this is what you need to have.

Reef, I agree on a user fee, even a token amount. I can get a doctor friend of mine all fired up on this one. Just ask him about lonely hypochondriacs just looking for someone to talk to so they call their doctors.

I also agree on class sizes. Elementary schools through the 60's and into the 70's routinely had 30-36 six students. We also had short buses and separate special ed classes so the regular student population faced less disruption and could concentrate on learning.
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Re: Election Memorial Jr.

Postby Uncle dans leg » Wed Apr 24, 2013 5:17 pm

Reefer2 wrote:
Uncle dans leg wrote:With the monthly fees collected in BC for medical coverage, why the fuck do they need to allocate more funding? It costs my family of 3 $135 a month. Maybe they should manage what they get now rather than throwing more cake at a broken system. Anyone tried to see a physician of late? You cant find one if your life depends on it unless you like visiting random clinics.



Not sure of what goes on in Alberta but any medical system that is basically free will always get abused and nothing will ever change that. My wife spent 2 nights in the hospital last month as she had gal bladder stones. 50% of the people in emergency were elderly. Again not sure of how many seniors there are in Alberta compared to BC (and not looking it up either) but the elderly has been the biggest problem we are about to face and we never have a government who looks past tomorrow to deal with this.

Another problem is the poor use of emergency, I have read that 30% or higher of visits to the hospital do not need emergency treatment. How about a $50 charges for that, or how about a $50 charge for every useless visit to your doctor because you got a cold.

Classroom sizes have always been big, it is nothing more than a ploy by the teachers to get more money. The biggest change is the amount of ESL in the class. Again how about an annual fee charged to immigrants who don't speak English when they come to Canada. Canada is a country built on immigration and the more the merrier but it is time for Canada to have an identity and if you want to come here this is what you need to have.

You were right about % of seniors. BC more or less follows the national average on the graph(fig.2) whereas Alberta is dramatically lower. Interesting...
http://www.finance.alberta.ca/aboutalberta/census/2011/2011-census-age-and-sex.pdf
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Re: Election Memorial Jr.

Postby Listercat » Wed Apr 24, 2013 6:57 pm

Uncle dans leg wrote:
Topper wrote:He is also against world class sea ports being used as world class sea ports.

This one is unbelievable. If he gets voted in, will he scrap the Northern Gateway project? Is this his agenda?

Edit-"New Democrats oppose this project because it is neither in the best interests of Canadians, nor does it meet the criteria of what constitutes sustainable development."
-Jean Crowder NDP MP

Well...wow. Goodbye revenue road


Jean Crowder the lesbian Mp from Duncan would not know "sustainable development" if it bit her in the ass. Since when is the sale of a highly desired product not in our "best interest"? Topper do you know of any mines that would meet the "criteria of sustainable development"? For a resource based economy she would damn us to poverty. Jean Crowder worked as a civil servant for many years before being elected as an NDP MP.
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Re: Election Memorial Jr.

Postby Topper » Wed Apr 24, 2013 8:51 pm

Lister, an excellent example of sustainable development was the Island Copper mine outside of Port Hardy. When the mine opened, it had a projected mine life of twenty years. It operated for ~24 years. The town of Port Hardy expanded city limits to include the mine site so that they expanded their industrial tax base. Then the city went about long term planning for capital projects.

When the mine closed, the city had a new swimming pool, new winter sports complex, new sewage treatment facility (unheard of for a town the size of Port Hardy, let alone a town on Vancouver Island) and $5 million in the bank. The had a small debt, however the carrying charges on that were so low it made better sense to hang onto the entire $5 million than pay off the debt.

I believe a similar scenario is in the works at Kamloops with New Afton and the proposed Ajax operation.

The town of Grand Forks owns slag piles on the outskirts of town left over from an early 1900's smelter for the original Phoenix underground workings. The slag is currently used by Roxul in their rock wool insulation plant in the city and is also a supplies a business making sand for sand blasting. The city collect a royalty on the slag extracted and has a tidy little slush fund for local government white elephants.

To me those are both sustainable developments. Logan Lake has to be another, as does Fernie.
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Re: Election Memorial Jr.

Postby Topper » Wed Apr 24, 2013 9:41 pm

As for environmentalism and mining, Dr. Patrick Moore, a founder of Greenpeace, though Greenpeace has purged that from their revisionist history records (http://www.beattystreetpublishing.com/who-are-the-founders-of-greenpeace-2/), did his doctoral thesis on the mine site.

His explanation is very good and I recommended you read all 11 pages.http://www.greenspirit.com/key_issues/the_log.cfm?booknum=4&page=1. It is also very interesting to look for the remains of the Island Copper mine on google earth.
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Re: Election Memorial Jr.

Postby Meds » Thu Apr 25, 2013 1:11 am

Reefer2 wrote:
Uncle dans leg wrote:With the monthly fees collected in BC for medical coverage, why the fuck do they need to allocate more funding? It costs my family of 3 $135 a month. Maybe they should manage what they get now rather than throwing more cake at a broken system. Anyone tried to see a physician of late? You cant find one if your life depends on it unless you like visiting random clinics.



Not sure of what goes on in Alberta but any medical system that is basically free will always get abused and nothing will ever change that. My wife spent 2 nights in the hospital last month as she had gal bladder stones. 50% of the people in emergency were elderly. Again not sure of how many seniors there are in Alberta compared to BC (and not looking it up either) but the elderly has been the biggest problem we are about to face and we never have a government who looks past tomorrow to deal with this.

Another problem is the poor use of emergency, I have read that 30% or higher of visits to the hospital do not need emergency treatment. How about a $50 charges for that, or how about a $50 charge for every useless visit to your doctor because you got a cold.

Classroom sizes have always been big, it is nothing more than a ploy by the teachers to get more money. The biggest change is the amount of ESL in the class. Again how about an annual fee charged to immigrants who don't speak English when they come to Canada. Canada is a country built on immigration and the more the merrier but it is time for Canada to have an identity and if you want to come here this is what you need to have.


Try working in the medical system, then you'll really see where the money is going.

My wife is a RN who works emerg ICU, I'm a paramedic. The ethical laws and regulations that govern the medical system in North America contribute massive costs to an already beleaguered system. A very simple example is as follows.....

It starts with a 911 call for an "unresponsive person". EMS, and often Fire and Police, are dispatched. The Ambulance goes out lights and sirens. We arrive and it is a semi-responsive person.....but wait.....he's totally responsive, just completely intoxicated and pissed drunk. Because of new regulations and ethics that stem from a society that wants to take the onus off of the individual and place responsibility squarely in the lap of the "system", this individual is going to get one of two things, either a ride in a buffalo taxi to the tank, or a ride in a bus with us to the emergency to see a doctor. Now, for him to go with the RCMP, I have to deem him mentally competent. I know he's gooned. He's told me how much he's had to drink. Everything appears normal, he is just drunk. Let's say he's a regular for us. Well he's not sure what day it is, he's not too sure what time it is, he knows what town he's in, but barely. He can't obey an instruction without falling all over himself. Well policy dictates that I cannot leave him in the hands of the RCMP. Intoxication could actually be an altered mental status resulting from a stroke or some other life threatening condition. I have to take him in to the hospital. Once at the Emergency Department this fellow has to wait and see a physician before he can be released back to the RCMP to sober up in the drunk tank. That might mean calling the doctor in because apparently a nurse is just as qualified as me to release him as just being intoxicated. This guy is now taking up a bed, wasting resources, and most likely aggravating the nursing staff and other patience through various ways.....most likely noise and smell. So the cost of the ambulance, the cost of the nurses, the cost of the doctor, the use.....sorry, abuse, of resources. All because this guy couldn't stay sober. So once the doctor looks at him, this usually entails a quick history, glancing over the vitals, and taking a whiff of his clothes and body odor (generally done from 15 feet away), then this guy goes back to the RCMP cells.

Here's the kicker, yes, it gets better.....if this guy starts puking all over the drunk tank, the RCMP call us paramedics over to do a wellness check on the patient. Or at least they used to. We can't anymore. Now we have to transport him back to the Emergency Department to get re-assessed by a physician all over again. After all, the violent puking, retching, and heaving, could be stomach cancer or an abdominal bleed. So the cost just doubled.....all because someone can't stay sober.

And FYI, when someone comes in with us (Ambulance), they generally get priority over people who are waiting in the sitting area. Yeah. It's that bad.

Even better, Dix and the NDP want to increase the money going into the welfare system. Great. Give these alcoholics more money to go spend on booze, then they can tax the healthcare system even further by ending up admitted for extended periods because they wrecked their liver or put themselves into renal failure.

One drunk retard can cost society, 2 paramedics, at least 1 RCMP officer, possibly 2 firemen (minimum), a nurse, a doctor, and possibly a lab tech depending on how drunk he is and who the doctor is. This doesn't even scratch the costs of transportation, medication, and all the other miscellaneous stuff that gets thrown in at some point.

But yeah, let's give them more money.

Sorry, bit of a rant, but this happens on a REGULAR BASIS.

Vote NDP! :mex:
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Re: Election Memorial Jr.

Postby Topper » Thu Apr 25, 2013 6:18 am

Meds, - Ban alcohol in their communities and put a photo copier in every home.
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Re: Election Memorial Jr.

Postby Topper » Thu Apr 25, 2013 6:58 am

More studies by Dix

$100 million to study the BC Rail sale. The company accused of bribing government officials did not win the bidding process. Government officials have their legal fees covered for actions performed in government service, if their guilty plea to illegal activities changes that coverage, yes they should be liable for their own legal fees. However, you can not get blood from a stone. Study done.

$4 million to study the Encana Pipeline. There is already a Federal review process, how much redundancy does the process need. Interestingly, the same folks supporting the BC review and are critical of the Federal process are the ones deriding the BC review of the Prosperity Mine project while championing the Federal review.

Additional Studies - Community Living programs, liquor laws, private power projects

Push the Feds to end the foreign worker program (hi spud, hello farmers).

Shut down the Jumbo ski resort development.

The NDP is creating a lot of jobs for circle jerk consultants to write reports, but nothing constructive.
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Re: Election Memorial Jr.

Postby Rumsfeld » Thu Apr 25, 2013 5:17 pm

Christ Meds, learn to make a point in 100 pages or less.

And next time just PM Skyo and tell him to pick up his cousin, it'll save us taxpayers a bundle.

Vote Aryan Brotherhood.

Or you'll be gazing out your front windows at lawn swastikas for the next four years.
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Re: Election Memorial Jr.

Postby ukcanuck » Thu Apr 25, 2013 9:55 pm

So its drunks wasting paramedics, nurses, and doctors time that is driving the health bill through the roof?
And here I thought it was all the sick people with nerve to need medical attention that was the problem...

Maybe we should just send these annoying sickos down to the east side for fix instead... Then we could toss them in jail and solve two problems at the same time. No one gives a fuck about a convict's health and we can employ more guards and build more prisons. Drive down the unemployment lines...

Hey we can get rid of that bull shit EI too... Oh wait that's federal Isnt it? Probably have to vote for Harper again so he can make that gravy train disappear...
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Re: Election Memorial Jr.

Postby Meds » Thu Apr 25, 2013 10:23 pm

ukcanuck wrote:So its drunks wasting paramedics, nurses, and doctors time that is driving the health bill through the roof?
And here I thought it was all the sick people with nerve to need medical attention that was the problem...

Maybe we should just send these annoying sickos down to the east side for fix instead... Then we could toss them in jail and solve two problems at the same time. No one gives a fuck about a convict's health and we can employ more guards and build more prisons. Drive down the unemployment lines...

Hey we can get rid of that bull shit EI too... Oh wait that's federal Isnt it? Probably have to vote for Harper again so he can make that gravy train disappear...


I think everyone (well most everyone) would be fairly shocked if they saw the number of ER visits that are completely unnecessary. Everyone knows those visits exist, but I would venture a guess that as many as 25% of ER visits, and 50% of paramedic involved calls are a waste of time and resources.
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