Gillis. Who is He?

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Re: Gillis. Who is He?

Postby Mondi » Thu Mar 28, 2013 8:10 am

Meds wrote:
Mondi wrote:When it comes to providing sources for an argument, I have one highly connected NHL writer. You have rhetorical claims. Are you closer to the league and have better sources than DamoSpin? Do you honestly believe that you have more insight than him, someone who spends his life on the topic?


And that means exactly Jack Shit. Sports WRITERS have about as much insight as the average avid fan of the game. The difference is that they break the story and find out about half and hour before the rest of the world.....it's their job. When I count out the number of "connected" writers who have stated something that is a "rumor" but gone on and say it's a "safe bet" and then been totally wrong......well I run out of fingers and toes in a hurry.

Insight? LMAO! Most of the talking heads get a few tips here and there, but if you follow the game closely enough, you can generally tell who is going to be a buyer and a seller, and you can look and see what names and contracts are likely to be moved. But you tell us all about your sports writer who is so highly connected..... :roll:

Mondi wrote:And I'll say is that if you interpret the bible literally...it may call into question your common sense. And let's face it, common sense is required to play sports.


Hmmm.....

Mike Gartner interpreted it literally.....but he was a terrible hockey player. The loser only scored a little over 700 goals in his career.

Dan Hamhuis interprets it literally. He has absolutely ZERO hockey sense and is a terribly stupid defenseman.

Paul Henderson.....there's another. Man what did he ever do as a hockey player?

Jarome Iginla says he interprets it literally. Total bust as an athlete.....all the tools but no sense.

Mike Fisher, Shane Doan, Joe Sakic, Markus Naslund, Val Bure......

Some sources list the Staal brothers, Cam Ward, Robyn Regehr, Curtis Joseph, Al McInnis, and Glen Wesley. All gifted athletes who just couldn't put it together on the ice.

Now that's just hockey.....and it isn't even a complete list. Shall we dive into other sports like baseball and football? I mean, after all, you did generalize by saying "...play sports".

Keep 'em coming Mondi.

:lol:


Go read Booth's twitter account and you tell me if you think this guy screams common sense.

The rest of your post is just you screaming at me and arguing using rhetorical claims. No need to respond.

As for those of you who say "Garrison is better than Salo, and if you disagree it means you don't even watch the games"...have a look at Salo. He's +10 on the Lightning. And, unless you all have Game Centre, you haven't seen one single Salo game this year.

There is an argument to be made. Particularly if you people are arguing based on Salo's performance last season.

Furthermore, my point was that Ballard prevented us from keeping Salo AND acquiring Garrison. And lastly, Garrison + Ballard is a higher cap hit than Salo + Erhoff. People love to point out Erhoff's deficiencies, of course these are very intangible deficiencies especially when you compare them with his ability to lead the PP, lead the breakout and his 50+ points. Nucks had the #1 PP with Salo and Erhoff. And the #28 PP with Garrison and Ballard. etc...etc...etc...etc...etc...etc...etc...
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Re: Gillis. Who is He?

Postby Mondi » Thu Mar 28, 2013 8:11 am

wafflecombine wrote:Lol...we could always have Jay Feaster as GM instead of MG. Then we could trade the twins for bubble gum trading cards and a 6 pack of Bud.

Man is cowtown boned after the Igilna trade.


Agreed.
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Re: Gillis. Who is He?

Postby Jovocop » Thu Mar 28, 2013 8:41 am

Mondi wrote:
As for those of you who say "Garrison is better than Salo, and if you disagree it means you don't even watch the games"...have a look at Salo. He's +10 on the Lightning. And, unless you all have Game Centre, you haven't seen one single Salo game this year.

There is an argument to be made. Particularly if you people are arguing based on Salo's performance last season.


The improvement is age and durability, not necessarily the points. Salo is 37 and has injury problems throughout his career. Not many GMs would give him a 2-yr $7.5m contract, except Yzerman. Garrison is 10 years younger than Salo and has been pretty durable. If you look at this shorten season, Garrison might not be "better" than Salo. However, if you look at it again next season or the season after, you will definitely see the difference.


Mondi wrote:Furthermore, my point was that Ballard prevented us from keeping Salo AND acquiring Garrison. And lastly, Garrison + Ballard is a higher cap hit than Salo + Erhoff. People love to point out Erhoff's deficiencies, of course these are very intangible deficiencies especially when you compare them with his ability to lead the PP, lead the breakout and his 50+ points. Nucks had the #1 PP with Salo and Erhoff. And the #28 PP with Garrison and Ballard. etc...etc...etc...etc...etc...etc...etc...


Ehrhoff is a different story. The cap hit is reason but the length of the contract is the problem. When people complain about Luongo's contract, they should look at Ehrhoff's contract first. How old will Ehrhoff be when his contract expires?
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Re: Gillis. Who is He?

Postby Meds » Thu Mar 28, 2013 10:19 pm

Mondi wrote:Go read Booth's twitter account and you tell me if you think this guy screams common sense.


Go read most twitter accounts and tell me they scream common sense. It's fucking Twitter. But good source. On par with your sports writer.

Mondi wrote:The rest of your post is just you screaming at me and arguing using rhetorical claims. No need to respond.


Where was I screaming? I was laughing at you, I used capital letters as emphasis, but nowhere did I yell.

Of course there is no need to respond. I pointed out how wrong you were. I know it. You know it. Anyone who read both sides knows it.

At least you were right about the use of rhetoric.....I asked no questions that required a response. Merely pointed out the fallaciousness of your entire post.
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Re: Gillis. Who is He?

Postby RoyalDude » Sat Mar 30, 2013 10:39 pm

So what now Gillis? What's it gonna be?
"I just want to say one word to you. Just one word. Are you listening? - Plastics." - The Graduate
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Re: Gillis. Who is He?

Postby Blob Mckenzie » Sun Mar 31, 2013 8:43 am

RoyalDude wrote:So what now Gillis? What's it gonna be?



Gillis is probably pissed off at the ranking hf boards gave his prospects. After all they are experts at that site.


:bounce: :rofl: :bounce: :drunk: :rofl: :bounce:

Duh, Hockeysfuture ranked us 29th.
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Re: Gillis. Who is He?

Postby RoyalDude » Sun Mar 31, 2013 9:32 am

Blob Mckenzie wrote:
RoyalDude wrote:So what now Gillis? What's it gonna be?



Gillis is probably pissed off at the ranking hf boards gave his prospects. After all they are experts at that site.


:bounce: :rofl: :bounce: :drunk: :rofl: :bounce:

Duh, Hockeysfuture ranked us 29th.


It's all pie in the face for Gillis cause on the day of his hiring, the arrogant a-hole made a boo boo by slagging the Nonis regime for making the cupboards bare. And now the cupboards have never been more bare in Canucks history, all under his watch. Nice one Gillis

Still waiting for Gillis to draft in one draft year quality full time NHL players like Nonis did in 2004 with Schneider, Edler, Mike Brown and Hansen.
"I just want to say one word to you. Just one word. Are you listening? - Plastics." - The Graduate
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Re: Gillis. Who is He?

Postby Diehard1 » Sun Mar 31, 2013 9:44 am

RoyalDude wrote:
Blob Mckenzie wrote:
RoyalDude wrote:So what now Gillis? What's it gonna be?



Gillis is probably pissed off at the ranking hf boards gave his prospects. After all they are experts at that site.


:bounce: :rofl: :bounce: :drunk: :rofl: :bounce:

Duh, Hockeysfuture ranked us 29th.


It's all pie in the face for Gillis cause on the day of his hiring, the arrogant a-hole made a boo boo by slagging the Nonis regime for making the cupboards bare. And now the cupboards have never been more bare in Canucks history, all under his watch. Nice one Gillis

Still waiting for Gillis to draft in one draft year quality full time NHL players like Nonis did in 2004 with Schneider, Edler, Mike Brown and Hansen.


Never been more bare? Go back and look at the rankings over the last 10 years before making statements that are simply incorrect.

I gues the last 2 seasons of winning mean nothing. I know I'd much rather have prospects than wins!
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Re: Gillis. Who is He?

Postby RoyalDude » Sun Mar 31, 2013 10:00 am

Diehard1 wrote:
Never been more bare? Go back and look at the rankings over the last 10 years before making statements that are simply incorrect.

I gues the last 2 seasons of winning mean nothing. I know I'd much rather have prospects than wins!


Hey, I ain't defending Nonis drafting, but I find it hilarious that Gillis slagged some of the efforts of previous management when Gillis, this whole time, has been riding on the coattails of the core star elite group of this team that was provided by the previous management(s) - Luongo and Schneider, Elder, Raymond, Hansen (Nonis players), The Sedins, Bieksa, Kesler, Burrows (Burke), Kesler.
"I just want to say one word to you. Just one word. Are you listening? - Plastics." - The Graduate
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Re: Gillis. Who is He?

Postby paddy » Sun Mar 31, 2013 10:48 pm

RoyalDude wrote:
Diehard1 wrote:
Never been more bare? Go back and look at the rankings over the last 10 years before making statements that are simply incorrect.

I gues the last 2 seasons of winning mean nothing. I know I'd much rather have prospects than wins!


Hey, I ain't defending Nonis drafting, but I find it hilarious that Gillis slagged some of the efforts of previous management when Gillis, this whole time, has been riding on the coattails of the core star elite group of this team that was provided by the previous management(s) - Luongo and Schneider, Elder, Raymond, Hansen (Nonis players), The Sedins, Bieksa, Kesler, Burrows (Burke), Kesler.


Dude makes dome valid points...
whether you like it or don't like it learn to live with it because its the best thing going today...
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Re: Gillis. Who is He?

Postby RoyalDude » Sun Mar 31, 2013 10:51 pm

paddy wrote:
RoyalDude wrote:
Diehard1 wrote:
Never been more bare? Go back and look at the rankings over the last 10 years before making statements that are simply incorrect.

I gues the last 2 seasons of winning mean nothing. I know I'd much rather have prospects than wins!


Hey, I ain't defending Nonis drafting, but I find it hilarious that Gillis slagged some of the efforts of previous management when Gillis, this whole time, has been riding on the coattails of the core star elite group of this team that was provided by the previous management(s) - Luongo and Schneider, Elder, Raymond, Hansen (Nonis players), The Sedins, Bieksa, Kesler, Burrows (Burke), Kesler.


Dude makes dome valid points...


It's all falling upon deaf ears Paddy, this is the Gillis Fan Club here.
"I just want to say one word to you. Just one word. Are you listening? - Plastics." - The Graduate
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Re: Gillis. Who is He?

Postby Blob Mckenzie » Mon Apr 01, 2013 5:53 am

paddy wrote:
RoyalDude wrote:
Diehard1 wrote:
Never been more bare? Go back and look at the rankings over the last 10 years before making statements that are simply incorrect.

I gues the last 2 seasons of winning mean nothing. I know I'd much rather have prospects than wins!


Hey, I ain't defending Nonis drafting, but I find it hilarious that Gillis slagged some of the efforts of previous management when Gillis, this whole time, has been riding on the coattails of the core star elite group of this team that was provided by the previous management(s) - Luongo and Schneider, Elder, Raymond, Hansen (Nonis players), The Sedins, Bieksa, Kesler, Burrows (Burke), Kesler.


Dude makes dome valid points...


He can and does make some valid points. Point is we all get it because he repeats the same crap over and over again. I am not happy with some MG's performance but what is the point of beating a dead horse multiple times in a day ? Then when the dude has a point crammed down his throat he ignores it like it never happened or conveniently dances around the subject.
Here's one : How different would this team look if Trailer Park Randy didn't step put of the box and fuck up his first round picks from 05 - 07 ? I like the names Anze Kopitar, Chris Stewart and David Perron better than Luc Bourdon, Michael Grabner and Patrick White.

Or how about the fact he constantly uses hf as a tool to back up his arguments yet fails to acknowledge hf thought the Canucks prospects in 05 which included Bieksa, Burrows, Edler, Schneider, Kesler, Raymond and Hansen was 25th in the NHL. Quite the wizards at hf.
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Re: Gillis. Who is He?

Postby Diehard1 » Mon Apr 01, 2013 7:50 am

RoyalDude wrote:
Diehard1 wrote:
Never been more bare? Go back and look at the rankings over the last 10 years before making statements that are simply incorrect.

I gues the last 2 seasons of winning mean nothing. I know I'd much rather have prospects than wins!


Hey, I ain't defending Nonis drafting, but I find it hilarious that Gillis slagged some of the efforts of previous management when Gillis, this whole time, has been riding on the coattails of the core star elite group of this team that was provided by the previous management(s) - Luongo and Schneider, Elder, Raymond, Hansen (Nonis players), The Sedins, Bieksa, Kesler, Burrows (Burke), Kesler.


Actually you did exactly that - defended Nonis' drafting - 'I'm still waiting for Gillis to have a draft like Nonis did in 2004'.

I love the argument of 'Nonis and Burke drafted everyone'. It's such a stupid argument - they threw away 5 seasons of hockey, or perhaps you forget 96 through 2002? Their reward? They were able to draft the twins and Bryan Allen, who was a major piece of the Luongo trade. Keenan got McCabe, Bertuzzi and Jarkko Ruutu for Linden so he should get just as much credit as Burke for the twins, given McCabe and a 1st (Vorobiev) turned into Henrik Sedin, but nobody gives him any love. Edler was 21 when Nonis was fired - yes Nonis drafted him but Gillis and team developed him into a top level dman. Same with Hansen, who played all of 5 NHL games under Nonis - his development is all Gillis. Kes was a 30 point 3rd line NHLer under Nonis, it was Gillis who brought in Sundin who had a huge hand in helping Kes turn into a top notch player. Burrows wasn't Burke, he was a Moose signing (Cheveldayoff) so he gets zero credit there.

I've criticized Gillis' handling of the Lu situation, and I will criticize it even more if Lu is still a Canuck in 48 hours. Same with Ballard (should have cut bait last off-season). Booth I still think needs some time, if he can ever get any damn luck and stay healthy. You do nothing but criticize without giving any credit for his good moves (Hamhuis, Garrison, Tanev, and keeping pretty much every player on the team for below market value), can't have it both ways my friend.

You really should go cheer for Florida, they are great at being ranked highly by Hockey's Future (which you love) and not coming anywhere close to being an elite team while throwing away year after year. Those are the things you cheer for.
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Re: Gillis. Who is He?

Postby Diehard1 » Mon Apr 01, 2013 7:59 am

RoyalDude wrote:
Diehard1 wrote:
Never been more bare? Go back and look at the rankings over the last 10 years before making statements that are simply incorrect.

I gues the last 2 seasons of winning mean nothing. I know I'd much rather have prospects than wins!


Hey, I ain't defending Nonis drafting, but I find it hilarious that Gillis slagged some of the efforts of previous management when Gillis, this whole time, has been riding on the coattails of the core star elite group of this team that was provided by the previous management(s) - Luongo and Schneider, Elder, Raymond, Hansen (Nonis players), The Sedins, Bieksa, Kesler, Burrows (Burke), Kesler.


Dude makes dome valid points...[/quote]

He can and does make some valid points. Point is we all get it because he repeats the same crap over and over again. I am not happy with some MG's performance but what is the point of beating a dead horse multiple times in a day ? Then when the dude has a point crammed down his throat he ignores it like it never happened or conveniently dances around the subject.
Here's one : How different would this team look if Trailer Park Randy didn't step put of the box and fuck up his first round picks from 05 - 07 ? I like the names Anze Kopitar, Chris Stewart and David Perron better than Luc Bourdon, Michael Grabner and Patrick White.

Or how about the fact he constantly uses hf as a tool to back up his arguments yet fails to acknowledge hf thought the Canucks prospects in 05 which included Bieksa, Burrows, Edler, Schneider, Kesler, Raymond and Hansen was 25th in the NHL. Quite the wizards at hf.[/quote]

Yup, development is key, not draft position. Hockey's Future and THN both rank guys by draft position when they should also rank by team track record - i.e. how has the team that picked them done in recent times developing players? Nucks would be much higher then.
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Re: Gillis. Who is He?

Postby RoyalDude » Mon Apr 01, 2013 9:41 am

Diehard1 wrote:
Actually you did exactly that - defended Nonis' drafting - 'I'm still waiting for Gillis to have a draft like Nonis did in 2004'.

I love the argument of 'Nonis and Burke drafted everyone'. It's such a stupid argument - they threw away 5 seasons of hockey, or perhaps you forget 96 through 2002? Their reward? They were able to draft the twins and Bryan Allen, who was a major piece of the Luongo trade. Keenan got McCabe, Bertuzzi and Jarkko Ruutu for Linden so he should get just as much credit as Burke for the twins, given McCabe and a 1st (Vorobiev) turned into Henrik Sedin, but nobody gives him any love. Edler was 21 when Nonis was fired - yes Nonis drafted him but Gillis and team developed him into a top level dman. Same with Hansen, who played all of 5 NHL games under Nonis - his development is all Gillis. Kes was a 30 point 3rd line NHLer under Nonis, it was Gillis who brought in Sundin who had a huge hand in helping Kes turn into a top notch player. Burrows wasn't Burke, he was a Moose signing (Cheveldayoff) so he gets zero credit there.

I've criticized Gillis' handling of the Lu situation, and I will criticize it even more if Lu is still a Canuck in 48 hours. Same with Ballard (should have cut bait last off-season). Booth I still think needs some time, if he can ever get any damn luck and stay healthy. You do nothing but criticize without giving any credit for his good moves (Hamhuis, Garrison, Tanev, and keeping pretty much every player on the team for below market value), can't have it both ways my friend.

You really should go cheer for Florida, they are great at being ranked highly by Hockey's Future (which you love) and not coming anywhere close to being an elite team while throwing away year after year. Those are the things you cheer for.


Breath Diehard, take a deep breath

So, according to you, you give no credit to the people (previous mgmt) that brought in the players to this organization who are the core elite group of the team that Gillis has been riding the coattails of since he got here, but now since this group seemingly is on the down slide, getting stale and in need of a serious new addition to, it just proves that Gillis has not added any significant pieces of his own other than signing to BC born and raised defenseman WHO WANTED TO SIGN HERE regardless of who the GM was here.

So in short, you are saying, if it were not for Gillis and Matts Sundin these core group players like the Sedins, Kesler, Edler Bieksa, Schneider, etc would never have become the players they are today. Holy shit Batman, Gillis is fucking brilliant. (I love how AV was left out of the discussion by Diehard, but I digress)

Nonis drafted Schneider late in the draft, Burke drafted Kesler late in the draft - two very important cogs to the Canucks machine at the momment, but no credit given. IT'S ALL GILLIS!

Gillis currently has the best goalie tandem in the NHL, who brought those two goalies in? And just how good would Gillis be without them, cause it seems to me that it's the goaltending right now that is the lifeblood of this organization. Without them, we are riding shotgun with Florida Panther bottom feeders, cause we certainly cannot count on our scoring which is 19th in the league and PP which is 30th. Something that Gillis chooses not to deal with. I really cannot wait to see Gillis add some 3rd or 4th line talent and 5th, 6th,7th type D-men at the trade deadline like he always does like it's really gonna help. Until Gillis manages to figure out how to put his own mark to the core elite group of this team and not ride on Burkes and Nonis, I will then give him credit.

And Diehard, I am not the only critic of Gillis drafting, even Gillis good buddie's and flag wavers on 1040 mainly Tony Eor Gallagher have been calling out Gillis and his drafting which to put lightly, has been atrocious, yet the Player Agent, shitty GM, good executive Gillis shows us his patented, undeserving arrogance, at his hiring by slagging Nonis for leaving the cupboards bare all the while every pundit across this nation rate the Canucks prospect list as worst in the NHL? Don't shoot the messenger, Diehard, get mad at Gillis and his merry men of homo's.

And please do not use the late drafting excuse for Gillis, Teams like the Bruins have managed to draft the likes of Bergeron, Marchand, Krejci and Marchand outside the 2nd round in recent drafts. The Blues always seem to find gems late in the draft and outside the first as well as a boat load of other teams. Just no excuses for Gillis making the cupboards as bare as they are now, which is the worst in Canuck history.
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