So, who would you like in a return for Luongo

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BladesofSteel
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Re: So, who would you like in a return for Luongo

Post by BladesofSteel » Sat Feb 23, 2013 5:37 pm

I'm sure the fact the league is watered down with quality goaltending, some of which are extremely cap friendly, has had some impact on Gillis' ability to garner serious offers.

Depending on how things go over the next month or so, it's entirely possible the likes of Ryan Miller, Jonas Hiller, Miikka Kiprusoff, Jonathan Bernier, and Brian Elliott could be made available. Thus, grinding the interest for Roberto to a screeching halt.

The longer this goes on, the more obvious it seems to me that the best opportunity to deal Luongo will come next off season.

I, for one, don't believe its necessary to deal Luongo at this time, and that there will be other deals to be made to improve the club sans #1.

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Re: So, who would you like in a return for Luongo

Post by RoyalDude » Sat Feb 23, 2013 5:38 pm

rats19 wrote:So what would the head of player personel follow the canucks around for 3 road games?
I don't have no fly on the wall like HW. Ask her. Maybe the Hawks see us as their biggest threat come the playoffs and are getting the head start on scouting the team for that reason alone and not for potential trades??? Apparently scouts scouting games of other teams is a common occurrence. Wasn't Gillis just called out for rumors of scouting the Capitals?
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Re: So, who would you like in a return for Luongo

Post by rats19 » Sat Feb 23, 2013 5:43 pm

Hmmm maybe, ii try to watch other tournament teams before I play them...and I pay to play...lofl.
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Re: So, who would you like in a return for Luongo

Post by RoyalDude » Sat Feb 23, 2013 5:50 pm

BladesofSteel wrote:
The longer this goes on, the more obvious it seems to me that the best opportunity to deal Luongo will come next off season.
Trading Luongo in the off-season will not be the best opportunity to trade him. Any day is a good trade for Luongo, I don't think the offers will get any better for him in the off-season, if anything they will get worse. Gillis will be pushed to get a deal done this summer whether he likes the deal or not. That cushy little thing that Gillis has been sitting on called time will have ran it's course if he still owns the rights to Lou this summer. Other GM's ain't gonna shower Gillis with flowery offers, if anything the opposite. IMO, his value will be at it's highest prior to the deadline. It is also my opinion that this team is better off keeping him for this season than letting him go for scrubs. I'd rather let him go for scrubs in the off season that during this.
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Re: So, who would you like in a return for Luongo

Post by Hockey Widow » Sat Feb 23, 2013 6:11 pm

No question that the longer this drags on the less likely we will like the return but it isn't about that right now. Its about icing the best team possible to make a deep run.

Last season a lot of people complained about the timing of the Hodgson trade. It wasn't so much the return but whether that return could helps us in the playoffs last year. That return did not help in any way for our playoff run. Not saying keeping Hodgson for the run would have helped us get past LA just saying that making a trade because you fear the return later will be less is a bad idea unless you are a seller and dealing with FA.

The big difference right now between a Hodgson deal and a Luongo deal is that Luongo is helping us right now and in all likelihood will continue to do so.

If we trade Luongo now we know we need a goalie back or we had better hope someone still unsigned can come in and do a decent back up job. So it is not just a matter of getting a return that helps us now it is a little thing like having a back up goalie until Lack returns and gets back into form and shows he is ready for the NHL which may be another full season yet given his injury.

But if we deal Luongo now we need to address it now. I'm all for it if the right piece(s) come back, including another goalie. Barring that why trade him for the sake of a trade. If he isn't going to get us much why hurry at this point. Whether his value increases or decreases over the summer who knows. It still boils down to another team wanting his contract and being willing to give up a few pieces, or not. :D

So Luongo for Scivens and Kadri? That'd work. Get a young back up and a fast speedy forward and get that 5.3 cap hit off the bench right? Throw in a D'man and we are set.
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Re: So, who would you like in a return for Luongo

Post by BigTuna » Sat Feb 23, 2013 6:39 pm

[quote="BladesofSteel"][b]I'm sure the fact the league is watered down with quality goaltending, some of which are extremely cap friendly, has had some impact on Gillis' ability to garner serious offers.[/b]

Depending on how things go over the next month or so, it's entirely possible the likes of Ryan Miller, Jonas Hiller, Miikka Kiprusoff, Jonathan Bernier, and Brian Elliott [i]could[/i] be made available. Thus, grinding the interest for Roberto to a screeching halt.

The longer this goes on, the more obvious it seems to me that the best opportunity to deal Luongo will come next off season.

I, for one, don't believe its necessary to deal Luongo at this time, and that there will be other deals to be made to improve the club sans #1.[/quote]

In the end, that is the issue. Star goalies don't tend to bring back much in trades. There's just too many good goalies, and so few teams looking for goalies to make much of a market for Luongo. Chicago and Toronto were seen as teams needing a goalie. Not anymore.

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Re: So, who would you like in a return for Luongo

Post by BigTuna » Sat Feb 23, 2013 6:42 pm

[quote="Potatoe1"][quote="RoyalDude"]I know that Potatoe is a big fan of the Kadri types but I don't see a good fit with Canuck hockey and the chemistry of this group. [/quote]

I'm not a big fan of Kadri or "Kadri types", but I have always maintained that we need a quality young player coming back in return for Luongo.

I would have been fine with kadri because he is a quality young player with a great pedigree, who looked close to becoming an NHL contributor.

The kid was a high first rounder, he tore it up in Jr. posted great stats in the AHL, and looked pretty good during his brief NHL stints.

I[b]'m not sure why anyone would have been unhappy with that as a return, perhaps Canuck fans are just so anti-Leaf we create this alternate reality where all of their players and prospects suck[/b].[/quote]

That's pretty much what happens.

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Re: So, who would you like in a return for Luongo

Post by Blob Mckenzie » Sat Feb 23, 2013 6:59 pm

Goalies DON'T usually tend to return a huge haul.... that sadid goalies like Luongo who is a solid top 8 - 10 keeper on his worst day almost never get dealt.

I don't want to see one of our two elite goalies rocking a hat in the playoffs while this team once again gets exposed for not having a guy who can score greasy goals in the playoffs. One of them needs to be dealt this April unless the return is dogshit. The salary gone itself will outweigh waiting until the draft. This is posturing by Eye Bags. He and anyone with half a walnut knows the cap is coming down for a year and there will be less..... not more suitors for RL this season, unless he has something worked out with Holmgren/Snyder.

The window isn't closing but hang onto Lu instead of Ginger and it will close. Wake the fuck up Pauser.

And Big Tuna I love to have fans from other teams come here but please learn how to use the fucking quote feature .
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Re: So, who would you like in a return for Luongo

Post by RoyalDude » Sat Feb 23, 2013 7:29 pm

Blob Mckenzie wrote:Goalies DON'T usually tend to return a huge haul.... that sadid goalies like Luongo who is a solid top 8 - 10 keeper on his worst day almost never get dealt.

I don't want to see one of our two elite goalies rocking a hat in the playoffs while this team once again gets exposed for not having a guy who can score greasy goals in the playoffs. One of them needs to be dealt this April unless the return is dogshit. The salary gone itself will outweigh waiting until the draft. This is posturing by Eye Bags. He and anyone with half a walnut knows the cap is coming down for a year and there will be less..... not more suitors for RL this season, unless he has something worked out with Holmgren/Snyder.

The window isn't closing but hang onto Lu instead of Ginger and it will close. Wake the fuck up Pauser.

And Big Tuna I love to have fans from other teams come here but please learn how to use the fucking quote feature .
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Re: So, who would you like in a return for Luongo

Post by Diehard1 » Sat Feb 23, 2013 7:38 pm

BladesofSteel wrote:I'm sure the fact the league is watered down with quality goaltending, some of which are extremely cap friendly, has had some impact on Gillis' ability to garner serious offers.

Depending on how things go over the next month or so, it's entirely possible the likes of Ryan Miller, Jonas Hiller, Miikka Kiprusoff, Jonathan Bernier, and Brian Elliott could be made available. Thus, grinding the interest for Roberto to a screeching halt.

The longer this goes on, the more obvious it seems to me that the best opportunity to deal Luongo will come next off season.

I, for one, don't believe its necessary to deal Luongo at this time, and that there will be other deals to be made to improve the club sans #1.
I get the point you are trying to make, but Elliott has been demoted to the minors and worse than any goalie in the league save maybe Dipietro this year, Jonas Hiller has lost his job and has a SV% of .880 this year, Kipper is injured and has been even worse than Hiller, Ryan Miller has a no trade clause and Bernier has around 50 games of pretty average goaltending in the league so far so who knows if he's an upgrade on anything. The Kings aren't trading him until Quick gets out of his funk for sure.

There will be some goalies available but they all have a lot of wars on them. Lu's only wart is his contract, which is a big one I know, but he's far and away the best of the group that is available or will be available.

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Re: So, who would you like in a return for Luongo

Post by Uncle dans leg » Sat Feb 23, 2013 7:45 pm

Diehard1 wrote:Lu's only wart is his contract.
and his inexplicable affliction....(Chelsea Dagger Syndrome)
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Re: So, who would you like in a return for Luongo

Post by Meds » Sat Feb 23, 2013 9:31 pm

BladesofSteel wrote:Depending on how things go over the next month or so, it's entirely possible the likes of Ryan Miller, Jonas Hiller, Miikka Kiprusoff, Jonathan Bernier, and Brian Elliott could be made available. Thus, grinding the interest for Roberto to a screeching halt.
A few holes in this line of thinking.....

Kiprusoff is 3 years older than Luongo and carries a heavier cap hit.

Miller is just one year younger and carries a heavier cap hit. He has also been less than consistent of late.

Hiller has been up and down health-wise, and he's just $800K cheaper than Lou on the cap.

Bernier is completely unproven as a starting goaltender.

Elliot is coming off of an incredible season in St. Louis last year. One in which he had the best numbers in the NHL, but only played 38 games. He has followed it up with some TERRIBLE play. His numbers absolutely suck this year and if he becomes available it's because he is losing his job to rookie Jake Allen.

Of the names you mentioned only Kiprusoff and Miller have Luongo's pedigree right now. Kiprusoff is 36 and doesn't help a team beyond a season or two, maybe three, but he may come at a bargain. Miller may but he's going to cost as much or more, and chances are good he will be looking for at least a 5 year deal, if not 6 or 7, after next season. At that point you are probably looking at the same kind of money that will be left on Lou's contract, if not more.

The way Lou is playing right now he could be the most sought after goaltender out there.

There is a reason that goaltenders don't often command a "huge haul" in return and why they don't often end up being traded. Once they have proven they can play at that high level and are not just flash in the pan headliners they tend to end up staying with their teams. It is very rare that a team finds itself in the enviable position that the Canucks are in right now with an elite and proven goaltender liek Luongo, a very good young goaltender in Schneider who is ready to take the reigns, and another potential starter waiting in the AHL who will be ready for regular NHL duty next year.

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Re: So, who would you like in a return for Luongo

Post by Uncle dans leg » Sun Feb 24, 2013 12:02 am

Rumsfeld wrote: Luongo is never going to be worth more than he is right now. He is never going to play better than he is right now and he's only going to be a year older in the summer. If and when he shits the bed again in any playoff games he appears in, his value will decrease accordingly. There is a reason Gillis hasn't received a "home run" offer for Lou... he has a reputation for melting down in the postseason, and he's earned that reputation.

Luongo wants out. Schneider is a younger and technically superior goaltender who hasn't shown a penchant for bed-shitting.
Exactly. I've seen this movie 3 times already

Here's a nightmare scenario I'm in no hurry to see happen:
-We trade Schneider for player(s) X
-We make it to the conference finals
-We face the shit hawks and proceed to watch Luongo have his 4th Chicago meltdown in 5 years.
-We've already moved CS and now know WITHOUT A DOUBT...AGAIN that Luongo just can't win it when it matters the most
-We have 9 more years to piss and moan about trading the wrong man
-RD continues his irrational anti-Gillis tirade but now it is justified and we all have to acknowledge this over and over and over again for the next 9 years

I dunno...I'll vote for the Ginger kid thanks
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Re: So, who would you like in a return for Luongo

Post by Meds » Sun Feb 24, 2013 5:37 am

Uncle dans leg wrote:Exactly. I've seen this movie 3 times already

Here's a nightmare scenario I'm in no hurry to see happen:
-We trade Schneider for player(s) X
-We make it to the conference finals
-We face the shit hawks and proceed to watch Luongo have his 4th Chicago meltdown in 5 years.
-We've already moved CS and now know WITHOUT A DOUBT...AGAIN that Luongo just can't win it when it matters the most
-We have 9 more years to piss and moan about trading the wrong man
-RD continues his irrational anti-Gillis tirade but now it is justified and we all have to acknowledge this over and over and over again for the next 9 years

I dunno...I'll vote for the Ginger kid thanks
You're probably right Dan. There's a good chance that alot of Lou's play right now is the result of him being relaxed and not having all the pressure on his shoulders. I think if Gillis were to deal Schneider, then Lou goes back to be "the guy" and all the expectations are right back on top of him. He's the personality type to take that burden right back and carry it again. Suddenly the meltdowns return. I bet that Lou would stand on his head against Chicago in the playoffs this year if both him and Schneider are still here. As much as Schneider has learned and benefits from Lou, the same is true going the other way.

Come playoffs I'll bet AV still goes to his "coin" and we see alot of both of these guys.....unless one guy totally shits the bed. A deep playoff run, or better still a Stanley Cup win where both guys shared the load, would be icing on the cake and Luongo's value would skyrocket.

There is also the little matter of his Vezina worthy play so far this year. If he keeps this up the only guy that challenges him is Anderson.....assuming Anderson continues his hot play too. (Maybe Rinne).

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Re: So, who would you like in a return for Luongo

Post by BladesofSteel » Sun Feb 24, 2013 9:15 am

All I'm suggesting is, the market for acquiring a goaltender could open up significantly by the deadline, thus providing more options for, likely, a only a handful of teams looking to upgrade. Realistically, not all of these teams have the go-ahead from ownership to take on Luongo's contract, even if he's their #1 choice in net.

There are just so many quality options out there right now, and not very many teams in need of an upgrade. Supply=high and Demand=low.

I don't disagree that Luongo isn't the best option among the list I suggested, Miller being the only possible exception. Everyone wants to drive a Ferarri, but most would have to settle for Corvette, or take their chances on a Camero, depending on what their wife says. :D

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