Amnesty Buyout

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Re: Amnesty Buyout

Postby Tciso » Mon Jan 07, 2013 1:15 pm

ukcanuck wrote:If memory serves, Gilly traded for Ballard as he was losing Erhoff and before he knew that Hamhuis would sign here so I dont see what was wrong with that trade as far as in the moment goes.
However since the trade its hard not to argue that its been a bit of a battle but correct me if I'm wrong, since returning from injury last season he was much improved and during the first round seemed one of the better defense men we had?

enough effort to not throw him under the bus just yet no?


You'ld think so, but, remember. There's a bus going past Roger's Arena every couple of minutes :D
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Re: Amnesty Buyout

Postby UWSaint » Mon Jan 07, 2013 3:42 pm

The Canucks are in a far better position with the amnesty buyout and the not-so-substantial cap roll back (look at what players signed for 2 years ago!) than they could have been as a veteran, near cap team. The 24% roll-back w/ 2/3 buyout and stuff in the AHL would have been far worse than two free do overs and a 10% decline in the cap. Fact is, the Canucks (like everyone else) have a couple overpaid players and don't need to sweat cap management any more than they would in any other year -- and remember that every other year involves a judgment calls as existing players transition from entry level to RFA to arbitration eligible RFA to keep-them-before-they-are-UFAs and therefore become much more expensive.

I expect this CBA will have next to no impact on open market prices of free agents (contract lengths aside). Next year is last year's cap number, every team willing to spend can shed bad contracts (which might make for more resurrection projects in the UFA pool, though some teams will still need to make reach-the-floor deals). In some ways, the cap hit for UFA's might be expected to slightly increase because more teams are going to be able to compete for free agents because this CBA will reduce the importance of cash flow and front loading contracts.
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Re: Amnesty Buyout

Postby Madcombinepilot » Tue Jan 08, 2013 8:54 am

just out of curiosity,

whats the going rate for a second line forward who averages around a 1/2 point a game??

about 4.2-4.6 million a year?
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Re: Amnesty Buyout

Postby dbr » Tue Jan 08, 2013 9:15 am

Based on this year's crop I'd say $3-4m depending on what they've got left in the tank, what else they bring to the table, etc.

Mikael Samuelsson got $3m from Detroit after putting up 28 in 48 for Florida, Jiri Hudler got $4m from Calgary for putting up 50 in 81 for Detroit, David Jones got $4m from Colorado for 37 in 72.

Guys like Alex Ponikarovsky (33 in 82), Lee Stempniak (28 in 61) and old farts like Steve Sullivan and Ryan Smyth (who were both better than half a point a game I think) all go for less.
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Re: Amnesty Buyout

Postby Tciso » Tue Jan 08, 2013 10:59 am

Madcombinepilot wrote:just out of curiosity,

whats the going rate for a second line forward who averages around a 1/2 point a game??

about 4.2-4.6 million a year?


Florida is paying $4.4 to $4.5 for 54 and 60 point 1st liners in Fleishmann and Versteeg at 20 minutes a night, and 28 minutes/point. Booth is right in line with these guys.
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Re: Amnesty Buyout

Postby Madcombinepilot » Wed Jan 09, 2013 6:30 pm

So if Booths contract is in line with most everyone else in his age/production catagory, why are we all so willing to hunt him and skin him?
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Re: Amnesty Buyout

Postby Vader » Wed Jan 09, 2013 9:14 pm

Tciso wrote:
Madcombinepilot wrote:just out of curiosity,

whats the going rate for a second line forward who averages around a 1/2 point a game??

about 4.2-4.6 million a year?


Florida is paying $4.4 to $4.5 for 54 and 60 point 1st liners in Fleishmann and Versteeg at 20 minutes a night, and 28 minutes/point. Booth is right in line with these guys.



Fleishman has scored at a 60 point pace the past 3 years, Versteeg 51 (and won a cup) and Booth just 41 points and was virtually given away by FLA, while the other two were signed by FLA. They all make roughly the same dough. Maybe I am mis-interpeting your post but exactly how is Booth in line with the other two?
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Re: Amnesty Buyout

Postby Soapy » Wed Jan 09, 2013 10:28 pm

Do the Canucks have to use the Buy Out or can we hold onto it?

I think its a one time thing....well a two time thing but you knwo what I mean....you have to use it in a specific time
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Re: Amnesty Buyout

Postby Hockey Widow » Wed Jan 09, 2013 10:32 pm

Soapy wrote:Do the Canucks have to use the Buy Out or can we hold onto it?

I think it's a one time thing....well a two time thing but you knwo what I mean....you have to use it in a specific time



None of us know the exact specifics. What is rumoured is that there will be two buy outs per team to be used in 2013-2014 and/or 2014-2015. No buy outs for the balance of this season. The teams do not have to use them but if they don't, and choose to buy a player out later, then the cap hit will apply. These two come with a cap amnesty attached.

But the specifics won't be released until the CBA is fully ratified and signed off on.
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Re: Amnesty Buyout

Postby Topper » Wed Jan 09, 2013 10:38 pm

I wonder if they will be a tradeable commodity? I know better, but it would be fun watch a GM trade for one or the look on some guys face when he found out he was the other side of the deal. (We're trading you so we can get rid of your team mate. LOL)
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Re: Amnesty Buyout

Postby Soapy » Wed Jan 09, 2013 10:57 pm

Topper wrote:I wonder if they will be a tradeable commodity? I know better, but it would be fun watch a GM trade for one or the look on some guys face when he found out he was the other side of the deal. (We're trading you so we can get rid of your team mate. LOL)


You nailed it Topper. I was thinking the same thing. The Islanders need two right away..DiPetro and Yashin...some teams are not going to use them at all....
It wont happen but it would be cool to trade a pick to kill the Yashin deal
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Re: Amnesty Buyout

Postby Tciso » Thu Jan 10, 2013 12:32 pm

Vader wrote:
Tciso wrote:
Madcombinepilot wrote:just out of curiosity,

whats the going rate for a second line forward who averages around a 1/2 point a game??

about 4.2-4.6 million a year?


Florida is paying $4.4 to $4.5 for 54 and 60 point 1st liners in Fleishmann and Versteeg at 20 minutes a night, and 28 minutes/point. Booth is right in line with these guys.



Fleishman has scored at a 60 point pace the past 3 years, Versteeg 51 (and won a cup) and Booth just 41 points and was virtually given away by FLA, while the other two were signed by FLA. They all make roughly the same dough. Maybe I am mis-interpeting your post but exactly how is Booth in line with the other two?


He's had major injuries, and has been getting 2nd line ice time and team-mates in Vancouver. He's not as good as Fleishmann or Versteeg, but he's in the same ball park as they are. His minutes/point is totally in line. Yes, he's over-paid, but only by a few hundred grand.
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Re: Amnesty Buyout

Postby Vader » Thu Jan 10, 2013 2:34 pm

Tciso wrote:
He's had major injuries, and has been getting 2nd line ice time and team-mates in Vancouver. He's not as good as Fleishmann or Versteeg, but he's in the same ball park as they are. His minutes/point is totally in line. Yes, he's over-paid, but only by a few hundred grand.


FLA disagrees with your assessment.

Booth is a buyout candidate. Take away his one 60 point season, and Booth is barely a forty point guy over the past 5 years, even while getting top line minutes in FLA (while the other two you mentioned significantly out-pointed him in the same role on the same team last year).
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Re: Amnesty Buyout

Postby Meds » Thu Jan 10, 2013 3:21 pm

Madcombinepilot wrote:So if Booths contract is in line with most everyone else in his age/production catagory, why are we all so willing to hunt him and skin him?


We "all" actually only consists of RD.....he's jut overly vocal so he sounds like lots of people. That and negativity always outweighs the positive when considering opinions.
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Re: Amnesty Buyout

Postby Vader » Thu Jan 10, 2013 3:55 pm

Meds wrote:
We "all" actually only consists of RD.....he's jut overly vocal so he sounds like lots of people. That and negativity always outweighs the positive when considering opinions.


C'mon, that's not fair. RD is calling it how he sees it. It's not like he's trying to crucify Booth or nail him to the cross or anything like that
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