The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Welcome to the main forum of our site. Anything and everything to do with the Vancouver Canucks is dicussed and debated here.

Moderator: Referees

User avatar
Tiger
CC Hall of Fan Member
Posts: 1742
Joined: Sat Nov 14, 2009 6:09 pm
Contact:

The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Post by Tiger »

Just in case there is a hockey season.. and if the lineup is the one we have now I don't think the Canucks got a snowballs chance in hell of winning a Stanley.. They are not as strong as the teams that got knocked out of the playoffs by Chicago and then next year lost the finals to the Bruins.. I flew back from Thailand for the playoffs hoping for a win last year but after the Allstar break their play was mediocre and they did not deserve a win.. So now the twins are a year older.. Kesler recovering from injury.. Booth instead of Samuelsson.. Raymond playing like a wimp.. Defence ? no Salo ,, no Ohlund.. looking for salvation by a fringe NHL/AHL Kassian ( yeah he might be good )... and the Dude is right.. not much depth or prospects.

Please tell me why I am a Canuck fan? is it curable?
" If you cant beat them in the alley - you can't beat them on the ice
Benjo
CC 1st Team All-Star
Posts: 844
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2011 9:39 pm

Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Post by Benjo »

The big question is if this extended break is just the thing they needed. Last season they were clearly still gassed from the long finals run which has included nagging injuries for many of our players. Currently we only have 2 players playing overseas which I believe shows how much the boys needed a good break.

I do believe they will suck terribly the first month back thanks to the accumulation of rust and relaxing for months. After that it should be back to business as usual, maybe not a Presidents trophy due to the shortened season and terrible first month but they should still be a division winning team, possibly competing with Minnesota for the division crown.
User avatar
Lancer
CC Legend
Posts: 3123
Joined: Fri Oct 08, 2004 10:41 am
Location: Kingston, Ontario

Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Post by Lancer »

Benjo wrote:The big question is if this extended break is just the thing they needed. Last season they were clearly still gassed from the long finals run which has included nagging injuries for many of our players. Currently we only have 2 players playing overseas which I believe shows how much the boys needed a good break.

I do believe they will suck terribly the first month back thanks to the accumulation of rust and relaxing for months. After that it should be back to business as usual, maybe not a Presidents trophy due to the shortened season and terrible first month but they should still be a division winning team, possibly competing with Minnesota for the division crown.
I think the extended break will benefit them and I agree that they were gassed on a number of levels from the playoffs the year before. A healthy Kesler, IMHO, is a game-changer for the team. I also believe that the roster we see now will not resemble what ends up come playoffs - over and above what may happen with an inevitable Luongo trade. Even so, given the current core, they should have enough to contend.

I agree that they will be sloppy out of the gate, but as long as they're in the top 8 - which I think they will now matter how badly they start - they have as good a chance as - say - LA had when they fought to get in as the 8th seed. It's all about being hot at the right time, and even if they're kinda warm as opposed to hot come playoffs, the Canucks can do it this season.

Sorry Tiger, can't share your pessimism here.
Love the Sport. Love the Team.

Hate the League.
User avatar
Blob Mckenzie
MVP
MVP
Posts: 31126
Joined: Wed Aug 11, 2004 12:34 pm
Location: Oakalla

Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Post by Blob Mckenzie »

Tiger wrote: Defence ? no Salo ,, no Ohlund.. looking for salvation by a fringe NHL/AHL Kassian ( yeah he might be good )... and the Dude is right.. not much depth or prospects.
Salo and Ohlund are fucking done like dinner. Ohlund has been for three seasons now.

Why is it that you want to hitch the wagon to a 21 year old kid still learning the game ? How about let him develop into a good player first ?

The dude isn't right . I agree there isn't a lot of high end talent coming up the pipe but we were fed the same line of shit back in 2005-06 as well by hockeysfuture and to me Bieksa, Edler, Kesler, Hansen, Raymond, Schneider, Burrows etc have turned out pretty fucking well. The assheads who write for hockeysfure are not FUCKING scouts and they are as qualified to comment on hockey prospects as I am to be a fucking astronaut.

I believe that hf ranked Canucks prospects around 25th back then when they were easily mid pack. I have tried to engage the dude on this subject but he turtles like Matt Cooke and I understand why . He puts a lot of stock into what hf says for rerasons only known to himself.
“I don’t care what you and some other poster were talking about”
Benjo
CC 1st Team All-Star
Posts: 844
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2011 9:39 pm

Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Post by Benjo »

Blob Mckenzie wrote: I believe that hf ranked Canucks prospects around 25th back then when they were easily mid pack. I have tried to engage the dude on this subject but he turtles like Matt Cooke and I understand why . He puts a lot of stock into what hf says for rerasons only known to himself.
Canucks pick too low to have any sure fire prospects and MG has been choosing a great deal of project/college players that will hopefully fill the cupboard back up when they are done developing, to hell with HF projections. Professional scouts have a hard enough time finding diamonds in the rough I bid good luck to HF boards to accurately assess the quality of prospects they've likely never seen personally.
User avatar
Strangelove
Moderator & MVP
Moderator & MVP
Posts: 42928
Joined: Sat Dec 18, 2004 12:13 pm
Location: Lake Vostok

Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Post by Strangelove »

Blob Mckenzie wrote: The assheads who write for hockeysfure are not FUCKING scouts and they are as qualified to comment on hockey prospects as I am to be a fucking astronaut.
A few months ago the guy who wrote the recent-at-the-time Canuck prospects ratings showed up in the HF Canucks forum to face the music. He apologized to all the posters laughing at his ratings and admitted he had very few resources to go by. SERIOUSLY, there are scores of posters both here and at HF who could do a better job. The guy pretty much admitted that. The posts are still there somewhere of course, but I can't be bothered to look them up....
Blob Mckenzie wrote: Dude puts a lot of stock into what hf says for reasons only known to himself.
Easy, HF seems to lend some credence to his We're Doomed future Canuck worldview.

Dude wants us all to get off the bandwagon and join him in his paranoid bed-wetting party.

Thanks anyway Dude, but I'd rather enjoy the ride.

Your present Vancouver Canucks are contenders and that could continue forever as far as anyone knows...
____
Try to focus on someday.
Fred
CC Legend
Posts: 3435
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2004 7:00 pm

Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Post by Fred »

Success rate of first-round draft picks


•Of the 494 career players drafted in the 1990s, 160 were selected in the first round.
•Of those 160 career players, over half have played more than 500 NHL games.
•Among the older players (those drafted from 1990 to 1994), six first-round picks have made it to 1,000 games. Another couple of dozen are still active and within reach of 1,000.
•Based on the 1990s sample, a first-round draft pick has a 63 percent chance of being a career player.
Results can vary widely from year to year:

•The 1993 NHL Draft produced 22 career players from 26 first-round picks.
•In 1999, less than half of the first-round selections went on to become career players (12 out of 28).

Beyond the first round.

This is where the NHL dream begins to fade in a hurry:

•From 1990 to 1999, about one-quarter of the players selected in the second round turned into NHL career players.
Those drafted in the third round and beyond are really up against it.

•From over 2,000 players selected in the third round and beyond during 1990s, just 261 made it as NHL career players. That's about 12 percent.
http://proicehockey.about.com/od/prospe ... uccess.htm

I don't have an axe to grind with the amateur scouts, it's a low success rate after the first round and they have found some non drafted amateur young players who have turned out good. Tanev/Lack are the equivalent of a first round selection. The problem I have is with the pro scouting staff. They should have a better success rate, they're dealing with older players already often in the NHL already and yet keep recommending chumps.

The comparison of Detroit is not a good comparison, they've selected as many poor choices and have been lucky with some of their late rounds which gives the impression they were smart...they weren't IMO...they were just lights out lucky
cheers
User avatar
Chef Boi RD
MVP
MVP
Posts: 28935
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2004 6:36 pm
Location: Vancouver

Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Post by Chef Boi RD »

Benjo wrote:lf.
Canucks pick too low to have any sure fire prospects [/quote]

Hands down the lamest excuse as to why Gillis is the worst drafter in Canucks history.

Canucks draft picks drafted outside the 1st round

Alexander Edler
Mike Peca
Adrian Aucoin
Matt Cooke
Peter Schaefer
Gino Odjick
Artem Chuberov
Janik Hansen
Kevin Bieksa
Gary Valk
Scott Walker
Jason Cullimore
Mason Raymond
Pavel Bure
Stan Smyl
Curt Fraser
Brent Sopel
Petri Skriko

I'm sure there is shitloads more that I am missing

If Boston can draft Krejci, Lucic, Bergeron and Marchand outside the 1st round over a short time span, ain't no fucking reason why Gillis cannot at least find one good player.

But hey, this is the Mike Gillis fan club here, the guy can do no wrong.
“Tyler Myers is my guy... I was taking to Scotty Bowman last night and he was bringing up his name, and saying he’s a big guy and big guy need big minutes to play, he is playing great for ya… and I agree with him… He’s been exceptional” - Bruce Boudreau
User avatar
Chef Boi RD
MVP
MVP
Posts: 28935
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2004 6:36 pm
Location: Vancouver

Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Post by Chef Boi RD »

Tiger wrote:looking for salvation by a fringe NHL/AHL Kassian ( yeah he might be good )... and the Dude is right.. not much depth or prospects.
Zack Kassian - 163rd on the AHL scoring leader board.

BTW, Jordan Eberle the 2nd leading goal scorer, was drafted after we drafted Hodgson.

Another BTW, I can confidently say that at least 6 of the remaining 8 players drafted after Jordan Schroeder in the first round are better prospects.
“Tyler Myers is my guy... I was taking to Scotty Bowman last night and he was bringing up his name, and saying he’s a big guy and big guy need big minutes to play, he is playing great for ya… and I agree with him… He’s been exceptional” - Bruce Boudreau
User avatar
Blob Mckenzie
MVP
MVP
Posts: 31126
Joined: Wed Aug 11, 2004 12:34 pm
Location: Oakalla

Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Post by Blob Mckenzie »

Blob Mckenzie wrote:
I believe that hf ranked Canucks prospects around 25th back then when they were easily mid pack. I have tried to engage the dude on this subject but he turtles like Matt Cooke and I understand why . He puts a lot of stock into what hf says for reasons only known to himself.
:P
Sigh...........Matt Cooke AKA the TURTLE ONCE AGAIN chooses to cowardly run away from YOURS TRULY.......oh it's true


UMMMM EXCUSE ME BIKERDUDE but your attention to this matter is appreciated by the PEOPLES POSTER.

ME THINKS you been spending too much time in the lair of a ceratin MALE to FEMALE bicycle rider. Tell me DUDE did you get the handlebar ride or did (S)HE ?????
“I don’t care what you and some other poster were talking about”
User avatar
Island Nucklehead
MVP
MVP
Posts: 8392
Joined: Wed Sep 07, 2005 2:27 pm
Location: Ottawa

Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Post by Island Nucklehead »

RoyalDude wrote: If Boston can draft Krejci, Lucic, Bergeron and Marchand outside the 1st round over a short time span, ain't no fucking reason why Gillis cannot at least find one good player.
Which one of these guys should Gillis have drafted?
User avatar
Chef Boi RD
MVP
MVP
Posts: 28935
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2004 6:36 pm
Location: Vancouver

Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Post by Chef Boi RD »

Island Nucklehead wrote:
RoyalDude wrote: If Boston can draft Krejci, Lucic, Bergeron and Marchand outside the 1st round over a short time span, ain't no fucking reason why Gillis cannot at least find one good player.
Which one of these guys should Gillis have drafted?
I'm just shootin' down the propaganda like Tony Montana over this nonsensical belief system around here that the reason Gillis has not done well at the draft table is due to his unfavorable drafting positioning since taking over when in fact the facts show that many a good players can STILL be found late in the first round OR rounds after like what your Boston Bruins proved in a few short years by drafting Bergeron and Lucic in the 2nd round and Krecji and Marchand in the 3rd round. No more excuses for Gillis, his drafting is atrocious. The record shows so let him take the blows. He deserves massive untoward criticism around these parts.
“Tyler Myers is my guy... I was taking to Scotty Bowman last night and he was bringing up his name, and saying he’s a big guy and big guy need big minutes to play, he is playing great for ya… and I agree with him… He’s been exceptional” - Bruce Boudreau
User avatar
Chef Boi RD
MVP
MVP
Posts: 28935
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2004 6:36 pm
Location: Vancouver

Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Post by Chef Boi RD »

Blob Mckenzie wrote:
Blob Mckenzie wrote:
I believe that hf ranked Canucks prospects around 25th back then when they were easily mid pack. I have tried to engage the dude on this subject but he turtles like Matt Cooke and I understand why . He puts a lot of stock into what hf says for reasons only known to himself.
:P
Sigh...........Matt Cooke AKA the TURTLE ONCE AGAIN chooses to cowardly run away from YOURS TRULY.......oh it's true


UMMMM EXCUSE ME BIKERDUDE but your attention to this matter is appreciated by the PEOPLES POSTER.

ME THINKS you been spending too much time in the lair of a ceratin MALE to FEMALE bicycle rider. Tell me DUDE did you get the handlebar ride or did (S)HE ?????
All I know B Mac Attack, is that Zack Gassedian is sinking like the Titanic down the AHL scoring leaders list. the future ain't looking so bright in Nuckville, who is going to be replacing the Sedin skill set in a few short years? Who in this system has those kinds of potentials??? Nobody my Tri-cites friend, NOBODY!
“Tyler Myers is my guy... I was taking to Scotty Bowman last night and he was bringing up his name, and saying he’s a big guy and big guy need big minutes to play, he is playing great for ya… and I agree with him… He’s been exceptional” - Bruce Boudreau
User avatar
Island Nucklehead
MVP
MVP
Posts: 8392
Joined: Wed Sep 07, 2005 2:27 pm
Location: Ottawa

Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Post by Island Nucklehead »

RoyalDude wrote:The record shows so let him take the blows. He deserves massive untoward criticism around these parts.
I think the record shows that Gillis wins Presidents Trophy's. That he inherited a playoff team, and made it better.

His drafting record will speak for itself 3-4 years after the draft year in question. Hodgson was playing on the Canucks last year. There is no season right now... far too soon to be bed-shitting, Dude.
User avatar
Chef Boi RD
MVP
MVP
Posts: 28935
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2004 6:36 pm
Location: Vancouver

Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Post by Chef Boi RD »

Island Nucklehead wrote: I think the record shows that Gillis wins Presidents Trophy's.
My god man, are you hitting the booze trail all the way to the top of ol' Westwood Plateau with Blobby Mac there?
“Tyler Myers is my guy... I was taking to Scotty Bowman last night and he was bringing up his name, and saying he’s a big guy and big guy need big minutes to play, he is playing great for ya… and I agree with him… He’s been exceptional” - Bruce Boudreau
Post Reply