The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

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The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Postby Tiger » Sun Nov 18, 2012 11:41 pm

Just in case there is a hockey season.. and if the lineup is the one we have now I don't think the Canucks got a snowballs chance in hell of winning a Stanley.. They are not as strong as the teams that got knocked out of the playoffs by Chicago and then next year lost the finals to the Bruins.. I flew back from Thailand for the playoffs hoping for a win last year but after the Allstar break their play was mediocre and they did not deserve a win.. So now the twins are a year older.. Kesler recovering from injury.. Booth instead of Samuelsson.. Raymond playing like a wimp.. Defence ? no Salo ,, no Ohlund.. looking for salvation by a fringe NHL/AHL Kassian ( yeah he might be good )... and the Dude is right.. not much depth or prospects.

Please tell me why I am a Canuck fan? is it curable?
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Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Postby Benjo » Mon Nov 19, 2012 9:44 am

The big question is if this extended break is just the thing they needed. Last season they were clearly still gassed from the long finals run which has included nagging injuries for many of our players. Currently we only have 2 players playing overseas which I believe shows how much the boys needed a good break.

I do believe they will suck terribly the first month back thanks to the accumulation of rust and relaxing for months. After that it should be back to business as usual, maybe not a Presidents trophy due to the shortened season and terrible first month but they should still be a division winning team, possibly competing with Minnesota for the division crown.
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Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Postby Lancer » Mon Nov 19, 2012 11:25 am

Benjo wrote:The big question is if this extended break is just the thing they needed. Last season they were clearly still gassed from the long finals run which has included nagging injuries for many of our players. Currently we only have 2 players playing overseas which I believe shows how much the boys needed a good break.

I do believe they will suck terribly the first month back thanks to the accumulation of rust and relaxing for months. After that it should be back to business as usual, maybe not a Presidents trophy due to the shortened season and terrible first month but they should still be a division winning team, possibly competing with Minnesota for the division crown.


I think the extended break will benefit them and I agree that they were gassed on a number of levels from the playoffs the year before. A healthy Kesler, IMHO, is a game-changer for the team. I also believe that the roster we see now will not resemble what ends up come playoffs - over and above what may happen with an inevitable Luongo trade. Even so, given the current core, they should have enough to contend.

I agree that they will be sloppy out of the gate, but as long as they're in the top 8 - which I think they will now matter how badly they start - they have as good a chance as - say - LA had when they fought to get in as the 8th seed. It's all about being hot at the right time, and even if they're kinda warm as opposed to hot come playoffs, the Canucks can do it this season.

Sorry Tiger, can't share your pessimism here.
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Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Postby Blob Mckenzie » Mon Nov 19, 2012 11:55 am

Tiger wrote: Defence ? no Salo ,, no Ohlund.. looking for salvation by a fringe NHL/AHL Kassian ( yeah he might be good )... and the Dude is right.. not much depth or prospects.


Salo and Ohlund are fucking done like dinner. Ohlund has been for three seasons now.

Why is it that you want to hitch the wagon to a 21 year old kid still learning the game ? How about let him develop into a good player first ?

The dude isn't right . I agree there isn't a lot of high end talent coming up the pipe but we were fed the same line of shit back in 2005-06 as well by hockeysfuture and to me Bieksa, Edler, Kesler, Hansen, Raymond, Schneider, Burrows etc have turned out pretty fucking well. The assheads who write for hockeysfure are not FUCKING scouts and they are as qualified to comment on hockey prospects as I am to be a fucking astronaut.

I believe that hf ranked Canucks prospects around 25th back then when they were easily mid pack. I have tried to engage the dude on this subject but he turtles like Matt Cooke and I understand why . He puts a lot of stock into what hf says for rerasons only known to himself.
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Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Postby Benjo » Mon Nov 19, 2012 2:20 pm

Blob Mckenzie wrote:I believe that hf ranked Canucks prospects around 25th back then when they were easily mid pack. I have tried to engage the dude on this subject but he turtles like Matt Cooke and I understand why . He puts a lot of stock into what hf says for rerasons only known to himself.


Canucks pick too low to have any sure fire prospects and MG has been choosing a great deal of project/college players that will hopefully fill the cupboard back up when they are done developing, to hell with HF projections. Professional scouts have a hard enough time finding diamonds in the rough I bid good luck to HF boards to accurately assess the quality of prospects they've likely never seen personally.
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Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Postby Strangelove » Mon Nov 19, 2012 2:54 pm

Blob Mckenzie wrote:The assheads who write for hockeysfure are not FUCKING scouts and they are as qualified to comment on hockey prospects as I am to be a fucking astronaut.


A few months ago the guy who wrote the recent-at-the-time Canuck prospects ratings showed up in the HF Canucks forum to face the music. He apologized to all the posters laughing at his ratings and admitted he had very few resources to go by. SERIOUSLY, there are scores of posters both here and at HF who could do a better job. The guy pretty much admitted that. The posts are still there somewhere of course, but I can't be bothered to look them up....

Blob Mckenzie wrote:Dude puts a lot of stock into what hf says for reasons only known to himself.


Easy, HF seems to lend some credence to his We're Doomed future Canuck worldview.

Dude wants us all to get off the bandwagon and join him in his paranoid bed-wetting party.

Thanks anyway Dude, but I'd rather enjoy the ride.

Your present Vancouver Canucks are contenders and that could continue forever as far as anyone knows...

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Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Postby Fred » Mon Nov 19, 2012 6:45 pm

Success rate of first-round draft picks


•Of the 494 career players drafted in the 1990s, 160 were selected in the first round.
•Of those 160 career players, over half have played more than 500 NHL games.
•Among the older players (those drafted from 1990 to 1994), six first-round picks have made it to 1,000 games. Another couple of dozen are still active and within reach of 1,000.
•Based on the 1990s sample, a first-round draft pick has a 63 percent chance of being a career player.
Results can vary widely from year to year:

•The 1993 NHL Draft produced 22 career players from 26 first-round picks.
•In 1999, less than half of the first-round selections went on to become career players (12 out of 28).

Beyond the first round.

This is where the NHL dream begins to fade in a hurry:

•From 1990 to 1999, about one-quarter of the players selected in the second round turned into NHL career players.
Those drafted in the third round and beyond are really up against it.

•From over 2,000 players selected in the third round and beyond during 1990s, just 261 made it as NHL career players. That's about 12 percent.


http://proicehockey.about.com/od/prospe ... uccess.htm

I don't have an axe to grind with the amateur scouts, it's a low success rate after the first round and they have found some non drafted amateur young players who have turned out good. Tanev/Lack are the equivalent of a first round selection. The problem I have is with the pro scouting staff. They should have a better success rate, they're dealing with older players already often in the NHL already and yet keep recommending chumps.

The comparison of Detroit is not a good comparison, they've selected as many poor choices and have been lucky with some of their late rounds which gives the impression they were smart...they weren't IMO...they were just lights out lucky
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Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Postby RoyalDude » Mon Nov 19, 2012 7:02 pm

Benjo wrote:lf.


Canucks pick too low to have any sure fire prospects [/quote]

Hands down the lamest excuse as to why Gillis is the worst drafter in Canucks history.

Canucks draft picks drafted outside the 1st round

Alexander Edler
Mike Peca
Adrian Aucoin
Matt Cooke
Peter Schaefer
Gino Odjick
Artem Chuberov
Janik Hansen
Kevin Bieksa
Gary Valk
Scott Walker
Jason Cullimore
Mason Raymond
Pavel Bure
Stan Smyl
Curt Fraser
Brent Sopel
Petri Skriko

I'm sure there is shitloads more that I am missing

If Boston can draft Krejci, Lucic, Bergeron and Marchand outside the 1st round over a short time span, ain't no fucking reason why Gillis cannot at least find one good player.

But hey, this is the Mike Gillis fan club here, the guy can do no wrong.
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Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Postby RoyalDude » Mon Nov 19, 2012 7:06 pm

Tiger wrote:looking for salvation by a fringe NHL/AHL Kassian ( yeah he might be good )... and the Dude is right.. not much depth or prospects.



Zack Kassian - 163rd on the AHL scoring leader board.

BTW, Jordan Eberle the 2nd leading goal scorer, was drafted after we drafted Hodgson.

Another BTW, I can confidently say that at least 6 of the remaining 8 players drafted after Jordan Schroeder in the first round are better prospects.
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Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Postby Blob Mckenzie » Mon Nov 19, 2012 8:12 pm

Blob Mckenzie wrote:
I believe that hf ranked Canucks prospects around 25th back then when they were easily mid pack. I have tried to engage the dude on this subject but he turtles like Matt Cooke and I understand why . He puts a lot of stock into what hf says for reasons only known to himself.


:P
Sigh...........Matt Cooke AKA the TURTLE ONCE AGAIN chooses to cowardly run away from YOURS TRULY.......oh it's true


UMMMM EXCUSE ME BIKERDUDE but your attention to this matter is appreciated by the PEOPLES POSTER.

ME THINKS you been spending too much time in the lair of a ceratin MALE to FEMALE bicycle rider. Tell me DUDE did you get the handlebar ride or did (S)HE ?????
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Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Postby Island Nucklehead » Mon Nov 19, 2012 8:19 pm

RoyalDude wrote:If Boston can draft Krejci, Lucic, Bergeron and Marchand outside the 1st round over a short time span, ain't no fucking reason why Gillis cannot at least find one good player.


Which one of these guys should Gillis have drafted?
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Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Postby RoyalDude » Mon Nov 19, 2012 8:41 pm

Island Nucklehead wrote:
RoyalDude wrote:If Boston can draft Krejci, Lucic, Bergeron and Marchand outside the 1st round over a short time span, ain't no fucking reason why Gillis cannot at least find one good player.


Which one of these guys should Gillis have drafted?


I'm just shootin' down the propaganda like Tony Montana over this nonsensical belief system around here that the reason Gillis has not done well at the draft table is due to his unfavorable drafting positioning since taking over when in fact the facts show that many a good players can STILL be found late in the first round OR rounds after like what your Boston Bruins proved in a few short years by drafting Bergeron and Lucic in the 2nd round and Krecji and Marchand in the 3rd round. No more excuses for Gillis, his drafting is atrocious. The record shows so let him take the blows. He deserves massive untoward criticism around these parts.
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Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Postby RoyalDude » Mon Nov 19, 2012 8:45 pm

Blob Mckenzie wrote:
Blob Mckenzie wrote:
I believe that hf ranked Canucks prospects around 25th back then when they were easily mid pack. I have tried to engage the dude on this subject but he turtles like Matt Cooke and I understand why . He puts a lot of stock into what hf says for reasons only known to himself.


:P
Sigh...........Matt Cooke AKA the TURTLE ONCE AGAIN chooses to cowardly run away from YOURS TRULY.......oh it's true


UMMMM EXCUSE ME BIKERDUDE but your attention to this matter is appreciated by the PEOPLES POSTER.

ME THINKS you been spending too much time in the lair of a ceratin MALE to FEMALE bicycle rider. Tell me DUDE did you get the handlebar ride or did (S)HE ?????


All I know B Mac Attack, is that Zack Gassedian is sinking like the Titanic down the AHL scoring leaders list. the future ain't looking so bright in Nuckville, who is going to be replacing the Sedin skill set in a few short years? Who in this system has those kinds of potentials??? Nobody my Tri-cites friend, NOBODY!
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Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Postby Island Nucklehead » Mon Nov 19, 2012 8:56 pm

RoyalDude wrote:The record shows so let him take the blows. He deserves massive untoward criticism around these parts.


I think the record shows that Gillis wins Presidents Trophy's. That he inherited a playoff team, and made it better.

His drafting record will speak for itself 3-4 years after the draft year in question. Hodgson was playing on the Canucks last year. There is no season right now... far too soon to be bed-shitting, Dude.
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Re: The 2012/13 Canucks ..contender or pretender?

Postby RoyalDude » Mon Nov 19, 2012 9:01 pm

Island Nucklehead wrote:I think the record shows that Gillis wins Presidents Trophy's.


My god man, are you hitting the booze trail all the way to the top of ol' Westwood Plateau with Blobby Mac there?
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