Luongo will Waive NTC If Asked To

Welcome to the main forum of our site. Anything and everything to do with the Vancouver Canucks is dicussed and debated here.

Moderator: Referees

Re: Luongo will Waive NTC If Asked To

Postby Meds » Sun Nov 04, 2012 3:12 pm

RoyalDude wrote:
Meds wrote:With the Oilers track record for defensemen of late, he could be a total bust, and considering their goaltending situation Schultz had better be a helluvalot better defensively than most guys playing in their first NHL season.

Tell us RD, do you really think that Gillis should have matched that contract offer?


Well, I don't like to get too worked up over AHL stats but if you wonder over to the AHL website and scan the stats, you will notice that Justin Schultz is leading the AHL in scoring with 6 goals and 9 assists for 15 points in 9 games. Not bad for a rookie D-man. Next guy on the list has 12 points. Much to popular belief around here, the Oilers actually have some very good prospects on defense, Oscar Klefbom is a highly touted prospect.


I'm not saying that they don't have prospects in their cupboard, just that they haven't really demonstrated a great track record when it comes to grooming blueline prospects into solid NHL defensemen who make a significant contribution on a regular basis. That may have something to do with the fact that they haven't had any decent NHL defensemen on their regular roster who can help bring those guys along. In the last few years it has been Pronger and Souray who have been their most touted blueliners, and Pronger wanted out and Souray had a shit attitude. I think we've all seen our share of Canuck disappointments when it comes to our prospect cupboard.
User avatar
Meds
CC Legend
 
Posts: 3462
Joined: Mon Jul 11, 2011 8:50 pm

Re: Luongo will Waive NTC If Asked To

Postby Jovocop » Mon Nov 05, 2012 12:22 pm

Aaronp18 wrote:
Strangelove wrote:
Hockey Widow wrote:Money was never the issue with Shultz.


DUH! RD, Meds: WAKE UP... you braindead mammyrammers!!


Yup, if it was about a chance to win he'd be in Vancouver.

He knows, and Edmonton all but guaranteed this, he has a far better chance landings a full time NHL gig with the Oilers. Of course paying him his NHL salary.

In Vancouver there no way he has a chance like that and there's a high probability (if the league actually started when it was supposed to) he starts in Chicago, making his AHL salary.


Bingo. Schultz most likely will be playing Chicago making his AHL salary instead of Vancouver. Money is much more important for a kid than winning...
User avatar
Jovocop
CC Hall of Fan Member
 
Posts: 1769
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2011 10:18 pm

Re: Luongo will Waive NTC If Asked To

Postby Strangelove » Mon Nov 05, 2012 1:01 pm

^^^ Yeah that's what HW was pointing out. :hmmm:

However the mammyrammers in question did not know/remember that the Canucks offered the exact ELC as the Oil!

How do two hardcore longtimers miss that at this point?

Like how many times have we gone over this...

*knocks RD and Meds's heads together like Mo*

Enough partying boys, a new CBA is just around the corner, time to get in shape!
____
The Ring Leader
User avatar
Strangelove
CC Legend
 
Posts: 7548
Joined: Sat Dec 18, 2004 1:13 pm

Re: Luongo will Waive NTC If Asked To

Postby Meds » Mon Nov 05, 2012 1:55 pm

Strangelove wrote:^^^ Yeah that's what HW was pointing out. :hmmm:

However the mammyrammers in question did not know/remember that the Canucks offered the exact ELC as the Oil!

How do two hardcore longtimers miss that at this point?

Like how many times have we gone over this...

*knocks RD and Meds's heads together like Mo*

Enough partying boys, a new CBA is just around the corner, time to get in shape!


I had assumed that he went to Edmonton partly for the money, but more because of a phone call from Gretzky and Coffey. Most young kids are going to be swayed when the phone rings and it's one of the best defensemen of all time and the greatest player of all time on the other end saying, "Hey, you should really consider this team as you're make your decision." That was what I thought swayed him the most. I only looked at the money he was given yesterday when I commented. I didn't think that Gillis would have offered that much.....
User avatar
Meds
CC Legend
 
Posts: 3462
Joined: Mon Jul 11, 2011 8:50 pm

Re: Luongo will Waive NTC If Asked To

Postby Strangelove » Mon Nov 05, 2012 2:58 pm

Meds wrote:I didn't think that Gillis would have offered that much.....


Every team offered him that much there Curley. :wink:
____
The Ring Leader
User avatar
Strangelove
CC Legend
 
Posts: 7548
Joined: Sat Dec 18, 2004 1:13 pm

Re: Luongo will Waive NTC If Asked To

Postby RoyalDude » Mon Nov 05, 2012 8:00 pm

Aaronp18 wrote:Yup, if it was about a chance to win he'd be in Vancouver.



Yes, Schultz with his age and all is completely focused only on the short term, the near future, since he only has a few years left in his long storied NHL career, his days as a pro are coming to and end. Sorry my friend, he sees something brewing in Edmonton. No offense, but the heart of your beloved Vancouver Canucks, ahem 'the Sedins' ahem are coming close to the end of the line. Schultz, Im assuming is a smart man, it ain't too hard to see what the future lies here, for both clubs. To sit there and to completely disregard just how good this group of RNH, Hall, Eberle, Yakupov, Schultz, Klefbom will be like in a few years when they start to really hit their stride is complete fucking ignorance.
"I just want to say one word to you. Just one word. Are you listening? - Plastics." - The Graduate
User avatar
RoyalDude
CC Legend
 
Posts: 4600
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2004 6:36 pm
Location: Vancouver

Re: Luongo will Waive NTC If Asked To

Postby rats19 » Mon Nov 05, 2012 8:19 pm

I don't think any one doubts the talent coil country has on board. I think only..how good are they going to be and how much are they going to cost..no team can afford half a dozen superstars..2 maybe 3 and still have a decent supporting roster in todays nhl.....what with parody and all.
You are who you hang with.....
User avatar
rats19
Moderator & MVP
Moderator & MVP
 
Posts: 4814
Joined: Wed Jun 22, 2011 7:21 am
Location: over there.....

Re: Luongo will Waive NTC If Asked To

Postby Aaronp18 » Mon Nov 05, 2012 9:24 pm

RoyalDude wrote:
Aaronp18 wrote:Yup, if it was about a chance to win he'd be in Vancouver.



Yes, Schultz with his age and all is completely focused only on the short term, the near future, since he only has a few years left in his long storied NHL career, his days as a pro are coming to and end. Sorry my friend, he sees something brewing in Edmonton. No offense, but the heart of your beloved Vancouver Canucks, ahem 'the Sedins' ahem are coming close to the end of the line. Schultz, Im assuming is a smart man, it ain't too hard to see what the future lies here, for both clubs. To sit there and to completely disregard just how good this group of RNH, Hall, Eberle, Yakupov, Schultz, Klefbom will be like in a few years when they start to really hit their stride is complete fucking ignorance.


If Shultz is so smart he should also realize that some players can go their whole career without winning a Cup, even with great players on the team and when you have the chance to play for a serious contender you should jump at it. What a team needs to be successful is a good mix of talented veterans, role players, and good young talent on entry level deals.

Edmonton is missing some pieces, even the Barons (with all the young talent they have) still have an issue keeping the puck out of their net. Not unfamiliar territory for those who have played with the big club. It's going to take more than just Shultz and experience to put the Oilers over the top.

I'm not saying there isn't a talented group there but they may run into a problem when all these first overallers contracts are up. I guess we'll have to wait and see what the new CBA has in store. Who knows how many of these players the Oilers will be able to afford in a few years when they will likely be ready to contend.

Anyways, perhaps if Shultz really thought about it he could have realized that with his services the Canucks may be that much closer to another Cup run, in particularly within the next 3 years (when his rookie deal is set to expire). Then his contract will be up and the Canucks may be headed in another direction, and he could move on if he doesn't like the way things are going.

But that would be if he didn't want to be all but guaranteed a NHL salary.

:wink:
User avatar
Aaronp18
CC Hall of Fan Member
 
Posts: 1783
Joined: Thu Jul 07, 2011 10:36 pm

Re: Luongo will Waive NTC If Asked To

Postby Tiger » Mon Nov 05, 2012 10:04 pm

Blob Wrote ..
Jake Milford traded Rick Vaive and Billy D for Tiger Williams. Yeah he was a real wizard.

OK it was actually Tiger and Jerry Butler.. but probably Jakes worst trade .. Vaive turned into To's first 50 goal scorer.. Tiger's best year was 35 .. However Vaive was not good defensively .. Tiger was that as well as a great entertainer .. Only Canuck to win top goalscorer and top penalty minutes in the same season :)
The same Jake Milford had a few other trades to build a team that was completely shot when he got to Vancouver..

Gradin for a 2 round draft choice :)
Lars Lindgren signed as FA..
Kevin McArthy plus Drew Callendar .. for Vervegart.
"King " Richard Brodeur and a 5th rounder for Canucks 5th rounder..
Ivan Bolderive and Darcy Rota for Don Lever and Brad Smith
Brought in Delorme ( The Chief ) and Colin Campbell ( a nasty dman for sure )
Dealt Ashton for the rights to Ivan Hlinka and Juri Bubla..
Sorry Blob.. Jake maybe made a bad trade Vaive for Tiger .. but he did a great job building a tough team that fought its way to the Stanley Cup finals..
Jakes teams made the playoffs 5 years in a row... Toronto .. nope just twice in 5 years
" If you cant beat them in the alley - you can't beat them on the ice
User avatar
Tiger
CC Hall of Fan Member
 
Posts: 1062
Joined: Sat Nov 14, 2009 7:09 pm

Re: Luongo will Waive NTC If Asked To

Postby Tiger » Tue Nov 06, 2012 12:19 am

hmmm ok to try and be "on topic".. here was Jake Milfords goaltender trade..

The Carrot top ..
March 1982: To Vancouver: Jim Nill, Tony Currie, Rick Heinz and a 4th round pick (Shawn Kilroy)
To St. Louis: Glen Hanlon

Lets see if Gillis does as well with Luongo..
" If you cant beat them in the alley - you can't beat them on the ice
User avatar
Tiger
CC Hall of Fan Member
 
Posts: 1062
Joined: Sat Nov 14, 2009 7:09 pm

Re: Luongo will Waive NTC If Asked To

Postby Tiger » Tue Nov 06, 2012 12:37 am

Aaronp said :

Anyways, perhaps if Shultz really thought about it he could have realized that with his services the Canucks may be that much closer to another Cup run, in particularly within the next 3 years (when his rookie deal is set to expire). Then his contract will be up and the Canucks may be headed in another direction, and he could move on if he doesn't like the way things are going.

Perhaps Shutlz thought that the Canucks are in decline NOW.. and Oil on the way up? Unless MG comes up with a great return for Roberto.. this is the truth..
" If you cant beat them in the alley - you can't beat them on the ice
User avatar
Tiger
CC Hall of Fan Member
 
Posts: 1062
Joined: Sat Nov 14, 2009 7:09 pm

Re: Luongo will Waive NTC If Asked To

Postby RoyalDude » Tue Nov 06, 2012 8:27 am

Tiger wrote:Aaronp said :

Perhaps Shutlz thought that the Canucks are in decline NOW.. and Oil on the way up? Unless MG comes up with a great return for Roberto.. this is the truth..


this

I think there might be a bit of a denial factor here regarding the future of the Canucks and Oilers. Most Hedge Fund Managers would be calling the Oilers a good investment right now and the exact opposite for the Canucks. No offense, but this team only goes when the Sedins go, once they are gone, we have nothing in the way of high end talent replacing those two. They will be 33 next year. When they hit 36, the young whipper snapper Oilers are still in their early 20's hitting their stride. It's simple mathematics.

Also, I disagree that the Canucks are odds on favorite to win the cup or Strong contenders. That window of opportunity left when the Bruins won the Stanley Cup.
"I just want to say one word to you. Just one word. Are you listening? - Plastics." - The Graduate
User avatar
RoyalDude
CC Legend
 
Posts: 4600
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2004 6:36 pm
Location: Vancouver

Re: Luongo will Waive NTC If Asked To

Postby Aaronp18 » Tue Nov 06, 2012 10:02 am

RoyalDude wrote:Also, I disagree that the Canucks are odds on favorite to win the cup or Strong contenders. That window of opportunity left when the Bruins won the Stanley Cup.


Who said they were odds on favorites to win the Cup? I would still consider them contenders, and with a (hopefully) shortened season coming up it may work in their favour. Going into the playoffs would you have considered the Kings odds on favorites.

Nobodies denying the talent in Edmonton, but it's what Oilers management can do with that talent that is the big question. I would say they should be hitting their stride in the 2014-15 season and as of right now they have a whopping 4 players signed for that season (6 if you include Klefbom and Musil). That's a lot of work and a lot of roster spots to fill.

Remember when Gagner and Cogliano were going to bring the Oilers back from the brink? Oilers management surrounded these guys with nothing but more high first round picks.

Again though your missing my point, if Shultz really wanted to win he could have signed here for 2-3 years which is still within the Canucks "window of opportunity". Then he could have moved on if the team was headed for a rebuild.

He wanted his NHL salary as soon as possible and signing with the Oilers is easily the best way to get that. I don't blame him for that, it's his choice, just don't tell me he went with his best chance to win a championship because that isn't the case.

If he was really looking for his best shot at a Cup he probably should have signed with the Rangers. :P
User avatar
Aaronp18
CC Hall of Fan Member
 
Posts: 1783
Joined: Thu Jul 07, 2011 10:36 pm

Re: Luongo will Waive NTC If Asked To

Postby Blob Mckenzie » Tue Nov 06, 2012 11:12 am

Tiger wrote:Blob Wrote ..
Jake Milford traded Rick Vaive and Billy D for Tiger Williams. Yeah he was a real wizard.

OK it was actually Tiger and Jerry Butler.. but probably Jakes worst trade .. Vaive turned into To's first 50 goal scorer.. Tiger's best year was 35 .. However Vaive was not good defensively .. Tiger was that as well as a great entertainer .. Only Canuck to win top goalscorer and top penalty minutes in the same season :)
The same Jake Milford had a few other trades to build a team that was completely shot when he got to Vancouver..

Gradin for a 2 round draft choice :)
Lars Lindgren signed as FA..
Kevin McArthy plus Drew Callendar .. for Vervegart.
"King " Richard Brodeur and a 5th rounder for Canucks 5th rounder..
Ivan Bolderive and Darcy Rota for Don Lever and Brad Smith
Brought in Delorme ( The Chief ) and Colin Campbell ( a nasty dman for sure )
Dealt Ashton for the rights to Ivan Hlinka and Juri Bubla..
Sorry Blob.. Jake maybe made a bad trade Vaive for Tiger .. but he did a great job building a tough team that fought its way to the Stanley Cup finals..
Jakes teams made the playoffs 5 years in a row... Toronto .. nope just twice in 5 years


Tiger had one 35 goal season. Vaive AVERAGED 40 + goals for the next ten seasons. Derlago averaged 35 for the next 6 years after. That trade is 2nd only to the Neely/Wesley trade as the worst one this team has ever made.

Dealing Ashton for Bubla was ok short term , but horrific long term into the mid eighties when the bottom of the team fell out. Brent Ashton was a very good player for 15 years after leaving here. Hlinka played two years and Bubla played for 4. Drafting Jere Gillis 4th overall ahead of Doug Wilson and Mike Bossy was cool.

Milford's teams never had more than 77 points in any year. They benefitted from being ina very weak conference and in 82 when all of the good teams got upset in the first and 2nd rounds. He was an ok GM at best who drafted very well in 78 and made some good depth trades. He was no Bill Torrey, Glen Sather or Sam Pollock.
Tell me how my ass tastes.
User avatar
Blob Mckenzie
CC Legend
 
Posts: 3138
Joined: Wed Aug 11, 2004 12:34 pm
Location: Oakalla

Re: Luongo will Waive NTC If Asked To

Postby damonberryman » Tue Nov 06, 2012 7:14 pm

The Hockey News has Van as favoured to win the cup. Getting a bunch of young stars together can work well as in a previous version of the Oil with Gretz, etc. However, I am not sure the demands for depth and second third and fourth lines is going to fit in the Cap whatever that may turn into. Klefbom coulb be a stud but he is a swede and only some swedes who are good can play NHL. Also Van does have talent coming up. The Sedins will have to be replaced but the club has the brains and money to make it work. I do not see us getting a lottrey pick anytime soon unless we trade for it.

I do not think there is another set of fans in the NHL who are so fucking pessimistic about a great club that is well run. The fuck is wrong with some of you? We modeled on the Wings for a reason. We have been in the hunt for a while and I trust the Club to deliver a Cup soon.

Someone said we will never win it due to the Boston series. You are taking the media too seriously man. The glass is only full when they are on a big run. For most Canuck fans it is easy to retreat into negativity. Lou is a perfect example. Be fans and stop parroting the fear. I know some are not like this but it seems the shitty Van media is winning the perception war with some of you. It did with me for a while.
damonberryman
CC 2nd Team All-Star
 
Posts: 452
Joined: Thu Aug 18, 2011 9:07 am

PreviousNext

Return to Canucks Corner Chat

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: CorranHorn, Google [Bot], Hockey Widow, Yahoo [Bot] and 3 guests