Oils owner in seattle....?

[Meds]

I don't like the CFL. I have always thought it was an inferior product . The ocean sized endzone, the fact you can win a game by missing a field goal, the officiating, and the fact 75 % of the teams make the playoffs pretty much make it a bush league imho.

Preferring the CFL is like saying the ECHL is a better product than the NHL.

That's the kind of comment I'm talking about, it really seems to me like it's meant to insult more than anything else.
logically it can't be like the east coast league, just by the numbers alone. there are a lot less places to play pro ball than pro hockey in the world and just as many pro football players as pro hockey players to fill them.
To be honest it's like Canadian fans of American ball are trying to make up for the fact that most of us up here prefer the Canadian brand.
"NFL is real football and the CFL is a joke" is Like its the sports version of little man syndrome.
Enjoy your game but don't ridicule the rest of the country.

Most people up here that I talk to about football like the CFL out of a sense of national loyalty.....can't figure it out myself, most of the players are American anyhow.

The NFL is more exciting. The rules in the CFL are Mickey Mouse. I think the NHL should follow suit. From now on a missed shot on a penalty shot or shootout should count for .15 of a goal so long as the puck hits above the boards or clears the glass completely. Shit. I think I would like it if the NFL adopted a wider field like the CFL, that would make for some crazy passing yardage games when dealing with the calibre of QB's down there.

The CFL IS a joke by comparisson. The rules for scoring a point by missing the target are retarded, the fact that you have an individual player award for "best Canadian born player" is completely hilarious. It's like, here you go, you weren't the best player in the league, not by a long shot, but you were the best out of (maybe) 30% of the guys out there. Now don't even get me started about how cool it is when 75% of the league makes the playoffs and a team with a losing record all year has a shot at the Grey Cup. Wow! We were the best of 8 teams!!!! We RULE!!!! Gimme a break. The CFL is fun to watch, but it doesn't hold a candle to the NFL. The best thing that could happen to the CFL would be for the NFL to move into Canada in 2 or 3 major markets and the CFL then become a legitimate farm system for the NFL. The CFL could then move back into the US with a few rule alterations and would likely be even more successful.

[ukcanuck]

But Hey I'm human and make mistakes, the difference is I can admit when I'm wrong and I try to be upfront with my opinion right or wrong. 

But  thanks For the slight anyway, I'm sure you feel Better about it now

What does YOU admitting to being wrong have to do with me?

What do I have to admit?

Admit? nothing but what do I have to be sorry about for trying to genuine? 

Well by your logic if you meant it as a sole remark not meant to insult, the ECHL is more than a couple of steps down, it's way down the list. 
The hockey writers.com for example doesn't  even rank it in their top ten leagues...
By default the CFL is the second best league unless you count arena ball , which in sure you will jump on but whatever...

Maybe you meant your comparison as a matter of fact but it sure doesn't cone across as that - sorry 

Stop assuming things that aren't there, and who gives a shit about the CFL being the 2nd best league, when in terms of quality, IMO, it's more than just a step down?

I don't care if you take it as an insult, it was given with a bit of ribbing, but drawing these grand conclusions and breathless arguments is just slightly ridiculous.

 
Okay so it was meant as a ribbing, well that's helpful. If you'll remember I pointed out your comment as an example about what I meant in a prior context and now that I think about it, its precisely because of the argument we had about Rome and Patrick, 

I wanted to know if there was more to the comments than just back handed crap.
 Believe it or not as Clam said you are generally the logical one around here, so if you make the comparison between the CfL and the ECHL I wanted to be clear whether you are serious before I call your comparison bullshit or enter into a debate about it.
In a way it's showing you some respect for what I took away from our last exchange, so fuck you  

I didn't create the fact that CFL ranks close to the NHL in popularity and far outstrips baseball and NFL football in this country.
 
It's  just fact that the Grey Cup breaks TV ratings records almost annually 
I didn't  create the dichotomy it exists whether you like it or not.

Oh my god, you're having real trouble grasping what I'm saying.

I said you're creating a false dichotomy by assuming my comment is necessarily pitted against the CFL and Canada as a whole, and you went on to stupidly assume that it's due to some sort insecure complex.

That's drawing a conclusion without the facts, which in other words is complete and utter bullshit, and it shows why Tater told you to stop talking out of your ass.

Actually  just like pot you are drawing conclusions based on mistaken inference...
I did not accuse you of any of the above, I merely described what your comments sounded like.. If you want to jump to I'm accusing you of insecurity I can't help that. 

that's kind of my point. The CfL is a legitimate sport unto itself and doesn't deserve to be compared the NFL. The Americans have their version, Canada has it's own. They are related but comparing them is like comparing countries ....
Wait you don't like it when I do that...

Again, with your laughably empty assumptions...

Just because a league is based in the US or Canada doesn't mean preferring one over another has anything whatsoever to do with the country itself.

ah I see why you are indignant now... You think I'm accusing you of that! 
I am not accusing you of that, I was pointing out that your comment sounded just like that.
And since you admit it was in jest it's not crazy to mistake it for something LIKE that.

These are private, corporate entities that offer football in two widely different ways, and the preference for one over the other has sweet fuck all to do with the country the league is in.

 
Quite right about preference but the fact is that some if the differences that get knocked about the CFL are culturally related, "The Rouge" for example . 
Or the closer similarities to rugby due to a closer relationship with English culture than the revolutionary version down south...
(as he cringes waiting for the spewing derision)

the key word in my sentence was LIKE as in "it seems this way but I'm not sure"
(the whole country meaning the vast majority of Canadians who prefer the Home Grown version, seriously you didn't get that?) 

Oh, I got it just fine, but for you to assume my criticism has anything to do with the country itself is fucking stupid, the same way you assumed I was anti Canadian for saying Jim Rome and Dan Patrick are far more talented than any Canadian broadcasters that operate in this here great nation.

Sure, assuming your dislike for the CFL is a out of some kind of Canadiana versus Americana is stupid out of context. But I asked you if you were intending to sound like you did, because it sounded like that kind of reasoning. Which is not entirely unreasonable or are you saying there is no such thing as an  inferiority complex in this country. 

Finally if you meant your comparison to be factual and not insulting- why the unfriendly response?

Wow, seriously?

First of all, get thicker skin and stop asking people to be nicer to you.

Secondly, when you make stupid assumptions, expect to get them thrown back in your face.

Maybe you should take that finger and turn it around, 
You throw out a comment like that and your upset that someone takes issue with it? 

[coco_canuck]

I did not accuse you of any of the above, I merely described what your comments sounded like.. If you want to jump to I'm accusing you of insecurity I can't help that. 

Oh come on.

You throw out these passive aggressive assumptions, then you retreat behind semantics and "what I meant was.."

I keep having to repeat this, but this shit on the boards doesn't bother me in the least, all I do is say it like it is, the same way I'd say it to you in a bar.

Quite right about preference but the fact is that some if the differences that get knocked about the CFL are culturally related, "The Rouge" for example.

So what?

Just because someone says the CFL is a circus doesn't mean it's even close to being culturally motivated.

Why can't someone just make fun of the CFL because of itself?

I never made fun of the fans who enjoy the product, I make fun of the game itself, and that has nothing to do with Canada.

Quickly assuming a Canadian is against his own country because of his feelings about a mutant form of football is a pretty stupid thing to do.

When you say stupid things, expect to get a response in kind.

Sure, assuming your dislike for the CFL is a out of some kind of Canadiana versus Americana is stupid out of context. But I asked you if you were intending to sound like you did, because it sounded like that kind of reasoning. Which is not entirely unreasonable or are you saying there is no such thing as an  inferiority complex in this country. 

Do you know how silly this is?

Two Canadians are chatting about two separate types of football, one league happens to be in the US, the other in Canada.

First guy says: "I watched that league in Canada, I find the product to be far inferior to the league I watch based out of the US, so much so that the best comparison I can make between the two is the disparity between the NHL and ECHL"

Second guy says: "It sounds like your preference for the American League is rooted in a Canadian, cultural inferiority complex."

The second guy's answer is pretty stupid.

Amirite?

[okcanuck]

I don't like the CFL. I have always thought it was an inferior product . The ocean sized endzone, the fact you can win a game by missing a field goal, the officiating, and the fact 75 % of the teams make the playoffs pretty much make it a bush league imho.

Preferring the CFL is like saying the ECHL is a better product than the NHL.

So ..... you prefer watching 90% of the NFL kickoffs going through the end-zone for a touch-back rather than watching a run back. Thats pussy football.

[Topper]

Inferior athletes playing an inferior game.

The 2004 CFL MVP could not get a job as a third string QB holding a clip board on the sidelines for one of the worst teams in the NFL.

CFL rosters are boosted every September when NFL cuts are made.

Defence lines up a yard off the ball, 20 yard end zones (except at I never win stadium), offensive motion at the snap, 3 billion ways to score a single point, wider field, all gimmicks to compensate the offence for three downs.

CFL employs a racist quota on foreign players.

You complain about kick off returns OK. Eight NFL teams have 50 yard or longer returns through three weeks of football this year, half of those for 70+ yards. The longest was 105 yard for a touch down.

Thirteen teams have a return average above 24 yards, note 20 yards would be the average for all kicks sailing through the end zone. Three teams are below that 20 yard average.

[Blob Mckenzie]

Not much I can add here. Topper pretty much nailed it.

The Canadian quota is a joke. If they aren't good enough to play then they shouldn't be in the league solely because of where they were born.

It's pretty hard to take a league seriously that for years had two teams with the same name, not to mention one man owns 25 % of the league's teams.

[ukcanuck]

Not much I can add here. Topper pretty much nailed it.

The Canadian quota is a joke. If they aren't good enough to play then they shouldn't be in the league solely because of where they were born.

It's pretty hard to take a league seriously that for years had two teams with the same name, not to mention one man owns 25 % of the league's teams.

Nailed it? too bad the job required a screw

Inferior athletes playing an inferior game.

How about differently skilled for a different style of game
the size of the field and the 20 second play clock require smaller, faster players that are generally not transferable.
however the money in the NFL guarantees that the best play in that league, I agree
Doug Flutie who should be considered in the know has been quoted as saying that an exceptional CFLer is about an average NFLer

but completely disagree about inferior game unless your talking about the money that provides better play by play, analysts, stadiums etc etc.

The 2004 CFL MVP could not get a job as a third string QB holding a clip board on the sidelines for one of the worst teams in the NFL.

Casey Printers was a flash in the pan bum with a head the size of Texas, he cant get a job period. it may reflect badly on the CFL that he got the award, but it doesn't say what you are inferring that the best CFLer cant make third string clip board duty on the worst team.
Including CFL and NFL hall of famers, Warren Moon and coach Bud Grant. There are many cases of CFLers going to the NFL and having success, such as Pro Bowlers Joe Horn, Brendon Ayanbadejo, Joe Theismann, Cameron Wake, Doug Flutie, and Brandon Browner. Pro Football Hall of Fame coach Marv Levy and Jeff Garcia are also good examples. [wiki]

On the other hand, there have also been cases of NFL stars coming to the CFL and failing to excel, such as Vince Ferragamo, Onterrio Smith and Ricky Williams.[wiki]

CFL rosters are boosted every September when NFL cuts are made.

True but CFL teams have different needs than do NFL teams, so often enough there are players available who can play the CFL game but not the NFL version. However, bringing in NFL cuts in september is a sure sign that you are not going to win much in October and November...NFL cuts rarely make a difference.

Defence lines up a yard off the ball, 20 yard end zones (except at I never win stadium), offensive motion at the snap, 3 billion ways to score a single point, wider field, all gimmicks to compensate the offence for three downs.

you call them gimmicks, you can also call them variations on the bastardization of rugby football. the original game which both leagues derive their rules and conventions from. The CFL size field is actually closer to the original, the American field was adapted to fit Yale's smaller available space.

I agree with the contention that 4 downs gives the offense more options but the smaller field especially inside the red zone where both teams are confined in such a small space (and the postage size end zone) suggests that a greater number of drives end in field goals.

CFL employs a racist quota on foreign players.

Racist? you mean Warren Moon wasn't allowed to play?
The Import rule is not designed to keep inferior players on the field but rather to compensate for the college system down south that produces better PREPARED players at the same age.

Canadian football as a game needs a supply of talent that is not adapted from another game. In this country there is a path from the back yards and school fields of Canada to the CFL that kids can dream of reaching. Its the same dream that Crosby talks about when holding the Stanley Cup. The ratio keeps that dream open.

It doesn't mean that Canadians can't compete at the CFL level it just means that they need the extra year or two to develop.

and its not racist anymore than a miner from arkansas can come and take a job without a work visa

You complain about kick off returns OK. Eight NFL teams have 50 yard or longer returns through three weeks of football this year, half of those for 70+ yards. The longest was 105 yard for a touch down.Thirteen teams have a return average above 24 yards, note 20 yards would be the average for all kicks sailing through the end zone. Three teams are below that 20 yard average.

aberrations happen, but how many times have I turned off an NFL game halfway through the third quarter because a two touchdown lead is insurmountable. how many games have you watch possession change twice in a half?
With a 40 second play clock, 4 time outs, TV timeouts, video challenges and 4 downs, a decent offensive co ordinator and quarterback can manage a clock in stopping the revolutions of the earth

It's pretty hard to take a league seriously that for years had two teams with the same name, not to mention one man owns 25 % of the league's teams.

There are plenty of quirks about things with the adjective Canadian attached to them that might seem anachronistic. but GODDAMN if i'm gonna change the way I spell colour and honour or neighbour just because Bill Gates decided American English would be the default language and it makes more sense...

[Blob Mckenzie]

I won't quote that mongoloid spill above.

Wake the fuck up uk. You bring up drug addicts and never will be's as your guys who can't crack the Comical Football League. Pull your head out of your anus and come up for some air brother. Ferragamo had ONE good season in the NFL.... Williams considered this a pot smoking hobby and Onterrio Smith was a full blown fucking addict. KINDA SHREDS any point you wanted to make.

And no Braley shouldn't own two teams. In real leagues they call that a conflict of interest. Two teams called the Roughriders makes the whole country appear a little limited.

Big fucking deal guys like Moon, Theisman, and Wake used this minor league as a stepping stone. People do that on their way to bigger and better things. The Industrial League is what it is.... a semi pro league for people who can't crack the show.

[RoyalDude]

Shit, UK is a hardcore Lions fan, did not know that, nothing wrong with that I guess. Me, never was a CFL guys. I'm actually liking the Whitecaps myself, that was actually a good game I watched on the tellee last night against Seattle. I'm liking the MSL.

[okcanuck]

Along with the pussy football kick-offs in the NFL another thing I hate about the NFL is the time-clock. Shit a team in front by a measly 3 pnts can basically kill off the last minute and a half of each half by running 3 plays up the middle. Wow exciting stuff that. Whereas the CFL has stop[ time in the last 3 minutes of each half enabling the team thats behind at least a fighting chance to come back.

[Blob Mckenzie]

Along with the pussy football kick-offs in the NFL another thing I hate about the NFL is the time-clock. Shit a team in front by a measly 3 pnts can basically kill off the last minute and a half of each half by running 3 plays up the middle. Wow exciting stuff that. Whereas the CFL has stop[ time in the last 3 minutes of each half enabling the team thats behind at least a fighting chance to come back.

you're a pretty good snake oil salesman










for the CFL .

[Meds]

So both sides agree that the athletes in the NFL are faster and stronger.....but the CFL isn't inferior?


I suppose the only way to settle this would be to see if a CFL team could actually defeat an NFL team under a hybrid format that combined elements of both games. Never gonna happen though.

Personally I would love to see what the NFL would look like on a bigger field, say a CFL field minus the doubled up 50 yard lines and with an NFL end zone. Toss all the other CFL crap out though.

[ukcanuck]

wow looky here

Anyone who might think the Greedy NHLPA is holding the sticky end of the shit while the owners have shitty end.

A reason to like the CFL and its players..

http://canadiandimension.com/articles/1825

[ukcanuck]

I won't quote that mongoloid spill above.

lol

Wake the fuck up uk. You bring up drug addicts and never will be's as your guys who can't crack the Comical Football League. Pull your head out of your anus and come up for some air brother. Ferragamo had ONE good season in the NFL.... Williams considered this a pot smoking hobby and Onterrio Smith was a full blown fucking addict. KINDA SHREDS any point you wanted to make.

Shreds my point?? What did you think my point was, the CFL is as good as the NFL because the above three players couldn't cut it in the Canadian league?
Try again...

And no Braley shouldn't own two teams. In real leagues they call that a conflict of interest. Two teams called the Roughriders makes the whole country appear a little limited.

This country is built on conflicts of interest...Any western Anglophone who ever tried to get a federal job knows that without being told.
So Braley has to take the losses for two teams to keep the thing going and the whole thing and everyone involved in it is a joke? I'll take that over an Art Modell, or a Bob Irsay

Big fucking deal guys like Moon, Theisman, and Wake used this minor league as a stepping stone. People do that on their way to bigger and better things. The Industrial League is what it is.... a semi pro league for people who can't crack the show.

No one ever said that the CFL is anything more than a small mom and pop league with never do well's, up and comers, and old stars on the way down, as far as talent goes.

What has been said is that the CFL is a worthwhile entity, its got warts and oddities, but it has a lot to like, not the least of which is a valid argument that its a better vision of the game of football, as most things are when comparing things Canadian to American.
And yes it a vision and not a mutation Coco if your reading this. Football developed simultaneously in both countries, The United States does not own a monopoly on Gridiron Football.

but whatever you don't agree, thats fine you don't have too, but I find it interesting that the same dismissive, I just stepped in dog shit, tone is missing whenever the "other" hockey leagues around the world are discussed.

With the possible exception of the ECHL as a metaphor for third or fourth rate that Coco used, or the comments made about the KHL and aircraft. At the end of the day every other league not called the NHL still play hockey. How bad can they be?

I'm sorry on a board full of free thinking individuals, I just don't get "the NFL is great, football is awesome....The CFL is the mongoloid version getchyur hockey helmets on girls, the short bus is pulling up front...

[Strangelove]

Hmmm perhaps we should have a CFL forum and force everyone to post in it!

I like the wider field in the CFL. I like it a LOT. For that reason I prolly watch as many CFL as NFL games (not many). I was a huge Lions fan as a kid, now it's meh. Obviously NFLers are the better footballers, even if they are mostly a pack of... ummm... gangsters.... hopped up on cocaine.