Offseason Wheelings and Dealings

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Offseason Wheelings and Dealings

Postby dbr » Wed May 02, 2012 7:58 am

I figured this probably doesn't belong in the OOTS thread but as the majority of the league is now done for the year there might as well be somewhere to track the changes being made around the league.

The Canadiens are scooping up another Chicago Blackhawks executive, assistant GM Marc Bergevin to fill their vacant GM position. He passes the French test, we know that much at least.

Staying with Montreal, the Canadiens are reportedly planning to buy Scott Gomez out of his boat anchor contract.
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Re: Offseason Wheelings and Dealings

Postby spooner » Wed May 02, 2012 8:23 am

As Bob McKenzie pointed out on Twitter today, the Gomez buyout news doesn't make a lot of sense. They would save a bit of cash but they would still have a fairly large "dead" cap hit for the next 4 seasons ($3.5M, $4.5M, $1.7M, $1.7M).

Burying Gomez in the AHL, a la Wade Redden, might make a lot of sense if the owner is on board with that type of move.
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Re: Offseason Wheelings and Dealings

Postby Eddy Punch Clock » Wed May 02, 2012 8:46 am

spooner wrote:As Bob McKenzie pointed out on Twitter today, the Gomez buyout news doesn't make a lot of sense. They would save a bit of cash but they would still have a fairly large "dead" cap hit for the next 4 seasons ($3.5M, $4.5M, $1.7M, $1.7M).

Burying Gomez in the AHL, a la Wade Redden, might make a lot of sense if the owner is on board with that type of move.


I wouldn't go the buy out route necessarily either but for arguments sake only the first two years of that dead cap hit are pretty bad; and with a new GM in place I'd expect a full rebuild/youth movement. So I don't see Montreal being a team that spends to the cap the next couple of seasons anyways.

I could be way of though. Is Montreal a market that will have the patience to accept failure for a few seasons in order to ice a truly competitive team? I think Leaf fans were completely exasperated by the time Burkie arrived and would have accepted a longer rebuild process but BB screwed that one up in my mind. Who knows what the Canadiens will do.
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Re: Offseason Wheelings and Dealings

Postby donlever » Wed May 02, 2012 8:47 am

..yeah, speaking of wheelings and dealings and the Habs I strolled over to some sites to look at Gomez and the Habs in general after dbr posted this.

Just who the fuck has been running this sad, sorry lot (rhetorical) for the past few years?


Gomez 33 7.3 million cap hit through 2014

Cole 34 4.5 million cap hit through 2015

Kaberle 34 4.25 million cap hit though 2014

Gionta 33 5 million cap hit through 2014

Bourque 31 3.3 million cap hit through 2016

Plekanec 30 5 million cap hit through 2016

Damn near half your cap for that sorry lot?

I can see one or two of (some) of them mixed in to a decent group of players, fine, but this bumbling, maladroit troupe as a whole for that much cash?

Wow.

Good luck Marc Bergevin.
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Re: Offseason Wheelings and Dealings

Postby Eddy Punch Clock » Wed May 02, 2012 8:54 am

donlever wrote:..yeah, speaking of wheelings and dealings and the Habs I strolled over to some sites to look at Gomez and the Habs in general after dbr posted this.

Kaberle 34 4.25 million cap hit though 2014

Good luck Marc Bergevin.


The Montreal board nearly imploded when this deal went down.

A desperate move by a desperate GM who knew he was on his last legs.

Sort of like purposely giving your soon to be ex herpes before she kicks you to the curb.
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Re: Offseason Wheelings and Dealings

Postby dbr » Wed May 02, 2012 9:34 am

The buyout makes no sense if you're planning to compete for the Stanley Cup next year, or the year after.

However as donnie pointed out this team is committed to a lot of thoroughly mediocre players for a lot longer than that - I suspect that a buyout would be the first step in cleaning house in Montreal.. something Bergevin has to do if he's going to remake the organization to reflect his own ideas about what it takes to be successful in the NHL.

Buying Gomez out sends a couple of important messages - to the players around the league it says that the Canadiens aren't necessarily going to embarrass a veteran player with a regrettable contract by making them ride the busses in the AHL the way other organizations have, but at the same time to the media and the paying customer it says the Canadiens are not going to leave an underperforming player on the roster indefinitely and that they are committed to bringing in the right kind of players to have future success - cutting the perhaps the league's most notorious underperformer/scapegoat loose is a great way to send that message.

(It also saves Bergevin's new boss about $3m.)

Obviously on its own a buyout does nothing but if it is the opening salvo of a years-long commitment to building the Montreal Canadiens the right way then I think it's worth the cost.

It's almost certainly going to take longer than it will for the big chunk of dead cap space to go away, and after that a $1.67 hit is pretty manageable.
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Re: Offseason Wheelings and Dealings

Postby spooner » Wed May 02, 2012 11:22 am

Very good points dave.
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Re: Offseason Wheelings and Dealings

Postby Fred » Wed May 02, 2012 11:42 am

Don if there was ever a word made specfically for Brian Burke.............maladroit............. has to be it :D
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Re: Offseason Wheelings and Dealings

Postby Strangelove » Wed May 02, 2012 12:03 pm

dbr wrote:Buying Gomez out sends a couple of important messages - to the players around the league it says that the Canadiens aren't necessarily going to embarrass a veteran player with a regrettable contract by making them ride the busses in the AHL


Dave, Gomez is perhaps the league's most notorious underperformer/scapegoat.

Everyone would understand completely if Les Canadiens flushed his ass to the AHL.

dbr wrote:but at the same time to the media and the paying customer it says the Canadiens are not going to leave an underperforming player on the roster indefinitely and that they are committed to bringing in the right kind of players to have future success - cutting the perhaps
the league's most notorious underperformer/scapegoat
loose is a great way to send that message.


They show they are committed to bringing in the right kind of players if they get that $7.35mil cap-hit off the books and then use the resulting cap-space Dave. They show they are committed to winning by spending to the cap PLUS paying that extra $7.35mil.

dbr wrote:(It also saves Bergevin's new boss about $3m.)


Dave, the Canadiens are one of the richest teams in the NHL.

They owe it to their fans at this point to get rid of the entire $7.35mil cap-hit.

Then do what they can about some of those other horrible contracts....
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Re: Offseason Wheelings and Dealings

Postby Topper » Wed May 02, 2012 12:24 pm

Is it un Canadian to say Molson is hurting for bucks?
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Re: Offseason Wheelings and Dealings

Postby dbr » Wed May 02, 2012 3:10 pm

Strangelove wrote:
dbr wrote:Buying Gomez out sends a couple of important messages - to the players around the league it says that the Canadiens aren't necessarily going to embarrass a veteran player with a regrettable contract by making them ride the busses in the AHL


Dave, Gomez is perhaps the league's most notorious underperformer/scapegoat.

Everyone would understand completely if Les Canadiens flushed his ass to the AHL.


You're probably right, but Gomez has only supplanted Wade Redden as the biggest waste of money in the league since the Rangers sent him packing and you still saw the puff pieces etc. about whether it's right that a guy who can play in the NHL is stuck in Hartford.

I'm sure if this is in the minds of the Habs brass it's not so they will still be able to acquire players on grossly inflated contracts, but a lot of teams have had success revamping their image as more player-friendly.

As a team that fired an assistant coach for no reason, traded a player during a game (and then told him he could purchase his own jersey from them for $1300 - allegedly) etc, the Canadiens could certainly stand to be more personnel-friendly if they wish to attract the best people.

Strangelove wrote:
dbr wrote:but at the same time to the media and the paying customer it says the Canadiens are not going to leave an underperforming player on the roster indefinitely and that they are committed to bringing in the right kind of players to have future success - cutting the perhaps
the league's most notorious underperformer/scapegoat
loose is a great way to send that message.


They show they are committed to bringing in the right kind of players if they get that $7.35mil cap-hit off the books and then use the resulting cap-space Dave. They show they are committed to winning by spending to the cap PLUS paying that extra $7.35mil.


Well, sure. I know I'd want the owner of my team to eat $10m to improve the on-ice product, it certainly reflects a commitment to winning (now). But what if that team is going into a rebuilding phase and building from the ground up is the priority over having an extra $7.3m to spend next season?

It would still be better to see your team's owner eat the $10m I would think, but for whatever reason ( :P ) I am guessing Geoff Molson doesn't agree. At any rate the stakes are lower, they could replace Gomez with

Strangelove wrote:
dbr wrote:(It also saves Bergevin's new boss about $3m.)


Dave, the Canadiens are one of the richest teams in the NHL.

They owe it to their fans at this point to get rid of the entire $7.35mil cap-hit.

Then do what they can about some of those other horrible contracts....


I don't think you see fans getting "fair treatment" from many NHL teams - especially not losing teams - if you think that fans have a right to expect this and that, anyway. Hell just look at the Maple Leafs, how many times in their eight seasons and counting playoff drought have they raised ticket prices?
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Re: Offseason Wheelings and Dealings

Postby Strangelove » Wed May 02, 2012 7:10 pm

dbr wrote:
Strangelove wrote:Dave, Gomez is perhaps the league's most notorious underperformer/scapegoat.

Everyone would understand completely if Les Canadiens flushed his ass to the AHL.


You're probably right, but Gomez has only supplanted Wade Redden as the biggest waste of money in the league since the Rangers sent him packing and you still saw the puff pieces etc. about whether it's right that a guy who can play in the NHL is stuck in Hartford.


Listen to me closely David: It is absolutely right to send the NHL's most notorious underperformer to the AHL.

dbr wrote:I'm sure if this is in the minds of the Habs brass it's not so they will still be able to acquire players on grossly inflated contracts, but a lot of teams have had success revamping their image as more player-friendly.


Dave, there's "player friendly" and then there's "ridiculous".

They gave Gomez a chance to redeem himself by trading for him.

They have since given him 3 full seasons to get his shit together.

Guess wot Dave: Shit ain't happenin. :)

dbr wrote:As a team that fired an assistant coach for no reason, traded a player during a game (and then told him he could purchase his own jersey from them for $1300 - allegedly) etc, the Canadiens could certainly stand to be more personnel-friendly if they wish to attract the best people.


Yeah that's why they brought in Bergevin.

As I say, and as I believe you agreed, no one would blame new GM Bergevin for sending Gomez down.

In fact most hockey pundits and fans would be screaming RIGHT ON!! :mex:

dbr wrote:I don't think you see fans getting "fair treatment" from many NHL teams - especially not losing teams - if you think that fans have a right to expect this and that, anyway. Hell just look at the Maple Leafs, how many times in their eight seasons and counting playoff drought have they raised ticket prices?


Dave, you are saying they are interested in appearing "player friendly" but not interested in appearing "fan friendly".

Why would they care about what the players think of them?

And if they don't care at all about the fans, why don't they become a cap-floor team?

Hell, even those evil leaves you speak of paid Jeff Finger $7mil to play for the Marlies the past two seasons.

Not to mention the fact they are still paying Darcy Tucker ($6mil total to NOT ever play for them again!) :lol:

See Dave, at the very least they have to "appear" fan-friendly.

All part of the business.

Speaking of business, one round of playoffs would earn them about as much as Scott Gomez makes in a season.
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Re: Offseason Wheelings and Dealings

Postby Island Nucklehead » Wed May 02, 2012 9:45 pm

I bet Parise would play for $7.5M.
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Re: Offseason Wheelings and Dealings

Postby dhabums » Wed May 02, 2012 10:44 pm

Island Nucklehead wrote:I bet Parise would play for $7.5M.


Or 6.5 in a cheaper city with far less taxes than Canada.
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Re: Offseason Wheelings and Dealings

Postby dbr » Thu May 03, 2012 8:06 am

Strangelove wrote:Dave, you are saying they are interested in appearing "player friendly" but not interested in appearing "fan friendly".


Well it's not that simple. I'm saying "fan friendliness" isn't going to be the be-all, it would be crazy to suggest they are not interested at all in appealing to their paying customers.

Why would they care about what the players think of them?


Ask the Oilers, they don't seem too worried about sending a big fuck you to the players clearly on the outs with the organization. You think another Sheldon Souray signs there any time soon?

And if they don't care at all about the fans, why don't they become a cap-floor team?


I didn't say that, and clearly they care about winning: they just fired their awful GM.

Hell, even those evil leaves you speak of paid Jeff Finger $7mil to play for the Marlies the past two seasons.

Not to mention the fact they are still paying Darcy Tucker ($6mil total to NOT ever play for them again!) :lol:

See Dave, at the very least they have to "appear" fan-friendly.


So wait is the Darcy Tucker buyout supposed to be fan-friendly (where the Gomez buy out is not)? The similarity here is that both organization have scads of awful contracts to deal with, and in buying out Gomez the Canadiens would be holding their nose and ridding themselves of the worst. Maybe Tomas Kaberle ends up in Hamilton before his deal is up (at least he'd be close to Toronto :P ), who knows.
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