GDT - Canucks vs Ducks 7PM PST TSN

[Farhan Lalji]

The entire team deserves criticism for the Stanley Cup loss. On a personal level, I was actually much more critical of the twins than I was with Luongo last year throughout the playoffs.....and in the finals. I was extremely critical of the team in front.

However - as it relates to the goaltending, we are supposed to have a guy that is an elite goalie. We do.....and he proved it. However - what he did NOT prove, was that he could be consistent when it mattered most. Yes - without Luongo - the Canucks don't win Games 1, 2, and 5 (although the same can be said for Boston in those games.....The B's would have been blown out in Games 1 and 2 had it not been for Thomas).

However - one simply CANNOT ignore the fact that Luongo had one of the most solid performances of all-time in Game 5, followed by two terrible outings in Game 6 and 7. Those first 10 minutes in Game 6 was up for grabs......and that incredibly soft goal by Marchand completely changed the momentum.

It's this insane inconsistency this time of year, that has fans up in arms.

Comparing Luongo to Thomas isn't ridiculous........why? Because - given Lou's talent level, we expect him to be at or near that level on a consistent basis......or atleast when in matters most.

[Farhan Lalji]

I would also like to point out that I should NOT be the "poster boy" on here for hating Luongo, or being a Luongo critic.

That I am not.

I am neither a Luongo lover nor a Luongo hater.

As it relates to Luongo, I see myself as a guy that falls somewhere in between.

I recognize the fact the fact that Luongo is an exceptional regular season goalie, and played tremendously for the most part in the post-season last year.

However - it's the bizarre inconsistency and Spidey-like meltdowns of epic proportions (when it matters most) that has people rightfully concerned.

We saw it against Chicago in 09, 10, and 11, and we saw in the finals against Boston.

That is not to say however, that Luongo is the only guy we should blame.

The twins, and almost the entire team in front of Luongo also deserve a lot of shit for what happened in the finals.

However - this WHOLE criticism of EVERYONE might be a moot point anyways......considering how injured we were.

[Farhan Lalji]

So it's not his fault, but if only he'd outplayed Thomas things might've gone differently. To me that's implying losing a game in which we score ZERO goals is is somehow related to our goaltenders performance. Again, ZERO GOALS. It is absolutely impossible for Lou to have played well enough for us to win a game in which WE SCORE ZERO GOALS. End of argument.

Thomas played tremendously and prevented us from scoring. The Canucks didn't play their greatest, due to their injuries, but they still managed 37 shots.....a lot of which were Grade A scoring chances.

On that fateful day of June 15th, not one.....not two.....but THREE very soft goals were scored against us.....goals that an elite goalie should be able to stop.

And who knows - maybe if he had stopped those, we would have won Game 7 1-0 at some point.........just as we did in Games 1 and 5.

[Badfish]

My only point is this:

When it comes to Game 7 specifically, a game we played on home ice for all the marbles, Lou just can not be blamed for the loss. It's mathematically impossible. If he had stood on his head and made 50 saves, with zero goals scored by his teammates he does not get the win. It's just impossible, It's that simple. You can argue the first goal changed the momentum. Fine and dandy. But if the team expected to win 1-0 they were delusional. THIS IS THE CUP, you battle through adversity and you do whatever it takes to make a game of it. Our team didn't come through in that department, a fact Lou had no control over. If our team was so mentally fragile that one goal against shook them to the point that they couldn't respond, they deserved to lose, and NOT because of Lou.

Say what you will about the rest of the playoffs. Some people point to his bad games in Boston. I point to his 2 SO's in the series (a feat matched by only 3 other goalies in history if I remember correctly). My main point: When it comes to game 7, a game in which we score nothing, you just can't blame your goalie.

[Badfish]

Again, when we get on the board, then we can complain about "should have wion if not for those soft goals". But we didn't. If that were the case and we lost 3-1 or 3-2, I would probably be singing a different tune. But we didn't. We got nothing through 60 min, therefore the actions of our goalie can not be the MAIN reason for losing that game, which is the attitude of the majority of these Lou-haters (not saying you Farhan, just the sentiment I hear constantly around town).

[Per]

Teams like Montreal, Calgary, Edmonton and Toronto deserve to be booed. You don't harass your starting goalie when you're tied for first in the league. How arrogant is that??

This!

Couldn't say it better myself.

[Farhan Lalji]

Fair enough Badfish.

To be perfectly honest, I think we're actually saying very similar things. Just a few different word choices.

I completely agree with you that injuries or not, our offensive output for the finals was very unacceptable.

As much as some people have labelled Luongo as a 'choke artist', I have yet to see a single series where the twins have carried this team when playing against a team that has an elite shut down defensive pairing. Outside of the San Jose series, the twins did not play anywhere near their regular season level in the playoffs. Maybe the first few games against Chicago, but that's about it. Granted - the production of most players drops come playoff time since a team faces higher quality teams more regularly, but the twins need to find a way to pick it up.

It's not an impossible feat either.

Just ask Kesler last year when he made Weber his bitch in those final few games.

Or the Anaheim Ducks when their top players were scoring quite regularly against the Preds.

Or the Tampa Bay Lighning when they exposed Tim Thomas' vagina for the entire world to see.

[Nuckertuzzi]

8 goals for in a 7 game series. Let's start the finger pointing there. Sedins -8 in game 7...

A big reason for that is the guy at the opposite crease. He did to us the entire series what we expect our stopper to do to them a lot more than 3 games out of the 7. I agree a lot of players deserved blame, including the Sedins..glad you pointed that out, but when you have two guys who should really be equals in Luongo and Thomas and one of them completely outclasses the other to an embarrassing degree. Sorry a couple shutouts mean didley if you don't play in 4 out of 7 games...the other guy also got a couple shutouts but he played all 7 at optimum level.

I will give him credit for getting us to the Finals, in fact I would put his Game 5 performance against the Sharks among the greatest in Canucks history..but I'm sorry his overall performance in the Finals was a joke..no matter what other guys failed to do, that doesn't change the fact he was among the biggest reasons we couldn't it the job done.

[Farhan Lalji]

.but I'm sorry his overall performance in the Finals was a joke..no matter what other guys failed to do, that doesn't change the fact he was among the biggest reasons we couldn't it the job done.

I see what you're saying Nuckertuzzi, but you also have to acknowledge that Lou DID get 2 very well deserved shut outs in the finals. As Nucklehead and Badfish have pointed out, we don't win a couple of those games without Lou.

As a whole though - I would like to see Lou play with more consistency in games where it matters most. Ditto for the twins, and many other players on our team for that matter.

[Nuckertuzzi]

Teams like Montreal, Calgary, Edmonton and Toronto deserve to be booed. You don't harass your starting goalie when you're tied for first in the league. How arrogant is that??

This!

Couldn't say it better myself.

Montreal boo's players no matter how good or bad their teams are. We're talking about a franchise with 24 Stanley Cups. Roy got jeered bigtime in his last game as a Hab..this after he single-handedly won them their last two Cups.

Yankee fans are notorious for giving their players the gears and they won 27 championships.

Right or wrong it happens everywhere and it's not like it happens every single day here. It happens a couple times this year and oh man leave poor Lu alone. Get over it people...it's not that big a deal. I actually like the fact we hold our guys to a higher standard and not accept anything less.

[Nuckertuzzi]

I see what you're saying Nuckertuzzi, but you also have to acknowledge that Lou DID get 2 very well deserved shut outs in the finals.

Agreed and I pointed out his incredible Game 5 against the Sharks, but my point is it's the Finals we're talking about..it's a championship..to be champions you cannot be satisfied with a few good spurts...you have to bring it each and every second. That is what separates a champ from a chump...you have to embrace the moment and never let go. Lu stupidly and very obviously (with his Thomas comments) thought the series was over after getting up 2-0..and he proved from that point on he wasn't ready to be a champion. Nor the rest of our boys. Hopefully that was a valuable learning experience for this year.

[Farhan Lalji]

I see what you're saying Nuckertuzzi, but you also have to acknowledge that Lou DID get 2 very well deserved shut outs in the finals.

Agreed and I pointed out his incredible Game 5 against the Sharks, but my point is it's the Finals we're talking about..it's a championship..to be champions you cannot be satisfied with a few good spurts...you have to bring it each and every second. That is what separates a champ from a chump...you have to embrace the moment and never let go. Lu stupidly and very obviously (with his Thomas comments) thought the series was over after getting up 2-0..and he proved from that point on he wasn't ready to be a champion. Nor the rest of our boys. Hopefully that was a valuable learning experience for this year.

Lou made the comments after Game 5 but I still see your point.

I don't think there's anything to support the idea that Lou specifically thought that the series was over after Game 2 (perhaps the whole team thought that on some level), but I suspect that the Canucks' piss poor performance as a whole after Game 2 had far more to do with their injuries.

However - we will hopefully find out what these boys are really made of over the next few months.

[Badfish]

...but my point is it's the Finals we're talking about..it's a championship..to be champions you cannot be satisfied with a few good spurts...you have to bring it each and every second. That is what separates a champ from a chump...you have to embrace the moment and never let go.

Exactly my thoughts, although in regards to the team as opposed to Lou. Name me a single player on our roster from that series that was a standout, that single handedly won us a game or two. Yet it's Lou who gets all the hate.

Agreed it was a team series loss. I just wish the Lou haters would realize that a bit more often.

[rats19]

Injuries cost us the cup.....the rest Is wasting time till till playoffs start again.

[donlever]

..it's amazing how little pub the fact that Hammer was lost in game one gets.