Canucks get Zack Kassian

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Re: Canucks get Zack Kassian

Post by rats19 »

What's the point....
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Re: Canucks get Zack Kassian

Post by wafflecombine »

I was leaning polio vaccine and the fact our banks didn't actively try to destroy our economy.

BTW... I'm still waiting for those WMD's you promised us in Iraq. I know you boys kept reciepts....
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Re: Canucks get Zack Kassian

Post by tantalum »

jkibler wrote: and it has NOTHING to do with the quality of the team??? you wanted Kassian for toughness, how many fights has he turned down now?? They questioned his heart in Rochester, and he is showing you all why
They didn't get Kassian for fighting. You get a goon for fighting. You get a 13th overall pick at a PPG in the AHL as rookie for skill and his style of play. Perhaps this was the issue in buffalo and Rochester...they wanted to develop a clearly skilled power forward player as a grinding goon. There is no way Kassian should be fighting a Bissonette unless Bissonette has run a player.

Cody wasn't scoring when he left...on the this same quality of team. Cody is also getting more quality icetime right now on the Sabres. And not scoring.

The only "they" I have heard questioning his heart are fans doing the typical run down the old guy and build up the new guy.

Both are young players. It isn't heart that leads to inconsistencies it's being young. You don't think Hodgson was somehow a completely consistent player in vancouver do you? He wasn't. Both teams got what they want in the deal. Early on only one of the players has truly contributed to the team. That may certainly change but Kassian's 3 strong games are more than acceptable at this point.
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Re: Canucks get Zack Kassian

Post by clem »

Kassian has shown us less energy the last couple games. The novelty and adrenalin are wearing off.

In the 3rd period of the Winnipeg game, Kassian assumed Hodgson's old defensive position - on the bench.

Kassian could benefit from a more consistent / simpler role as he settles in.
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Hockey Widow
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Re: Canucks get Zack Kassian

Post by Hockey Widow »

clem wrote:Kassian has shown us less energy the last couple games. The novelty and adrenalin are wearing off.

In the 3rd period of the Winnipeg game, Kassian assumed Hodgson's old defensive position - on the bench.

Kassian could benefit from a more consistent / simpler role as he settles in.

Agree 100%. His conditioning isn't up to where he can keep up with this line up. It amazes me the number of players we have picked up from other teams are simply not up to the level of conditioning on the Canucks. That speaks volumes about other teams.

The best thing for Kassian is to do what he can to improve his conditioning for the playoffs and to keep learning the system. The best spot for him right now, and one I would be happy to see him play the rest of the season is on the 4th line. He can use his energy and not have as much pressure to gets points. But it is noticeable that in third periods he seems gassed and gets a little lazy and often out of position.

Most felt he would not be a significant short term contributor to the line up. So keeping it simple while he works on the defensive part of his game and conditioning will be key to managing him going forward.

AS to fighting, there hasn't been a reason for him to fight since he has been on the team. I'm sure he has been told that. Just as the Canucks reigned in Lappy I am sure they have spoken to Kassian about playing whistle to whistle and picking his spots. If it was a goon we wanted we certainly would not have traded Cody for one.

From an offensive point of view I doubt you will find anyone who seriously thinks that over the course of their respective careers Kassian will out produce Hodgson.
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Re: Canucks get Zack Kassian

Post by mathonwy »

Kassian could benefit from a week long boot camp at any number of the UFC training facilities.

If the guy can implement a training program like David Booth, the sky is absolutely the limit. With his large frame and high hockey acumen, he would be a fucking beast to handle along the boards. We've already seen how difficult it is for the opposition to handle David Booth at 6'0, 212lb. 6'4, 225lb of 2% body fat Zackian would be a sight to see.

Of course, that doesn't exactly help us now which is why I'm still confused why this deal had to be done at the trade deadline versus the summer.
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Re: Canucks get Zack Kassian

Post by rats19 »

Codys value was at a high point with no guarantee of it getting higher before summer
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Re: Canucks get Zack Kassian

Post by mathonwy »

rats19 wrote:Codys value was at a high point with no guarantee of it getting higher before summer
It wasn't a matter of whether coho's value was going to get higher, it is about the here and now and what is more useful to the Canucks for our long playoff run.

Last year, we were a half crippled team who took the champs to game 7.

Last year's issues were:

Our lack of on-the-road goaltending
Our lack of a PP.
Our lack of defensive depth (due to the mismanagement of Keith Ballard).
Mason Raymond on the 2nd line not scoring.

This year:

We got Ginger to address the goaltending.
Our PP's gone pretty stinky recently but its been pretty good for the majority of the season.
Our defensive depth was pretty good until Ballard got concussed. We brought in Gragnani who had a pretty good last game on a pairing with Tanev but who really knows over the long term.
We got David Booth and our Amex line is solid

So... why trade Coho? Obviously GMMG must see Kassian playing a bigger role on our team for the playoffs than if we had Coho but I don't.

We trade depth down the middle for the possibility of size on the wing. I just don't like it.
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Re: Canucks get Zack Kassian

Post by Jovocop »

rats19 wrote:Codys value was at a high point with no guarantee of it getting higher before summer
Plus the Kassian's value was at a low point with no guarantee of it not going back up before summer.
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Re: Canucks get Zack Kassian

Post by Jovocop »

mathonwy wrote:
rats19 wrote:Codys value was at a high point with no guarantee of it getting higher before summer
It wasn't a matter of whether coho's value was going to get higher, it is about the here and now and what is more useful to the Canucks for our long playoff run.

Last year, we were a half crippled team who took the champs to game 7.

Last year's issues were:

Our lack of on-the-road goaltending
Our lack of a PP.
Our lack of defensive depth (due to the mismanagement of Keith Ballard).
Mason Raymond on the 2nd line not scoring.

This year:

We got Ginger to address the goaltending.
Our PP's gone pretty stinky recently but its been pretty good for the majority of the season.
Our defensive depth was pretty good until Ballard got concussed. We brought in Gragnani who had a pretty good last game on a pairing with Tanev but who really knows over the long term.
We got David Booth and our Amex line is solid

So... why trade Coho? Obviously GMMG must see Kassian playing a bigger role on our team for the playoffs than if we had Coho but I don't.

We trade depth down the middle for the possibility of size on the wing. I just don't like it.
I am not sure that MG did trade depth down the middle. Pahlsson seems to be a very nice addition, at least from I have seen so far. He might not outscore Hodgson but Pahlsson had the "shutdown" capability that Hodgson does not have right now. As for clutch goals, Pahlsson just scored one last night. With the Hodgson's trade, I think that the Canucks added the needed size and grit to the bottom six. With the addition of Pahlsson, the bottom six is tougher to play against. Personally, I don't believe Sulzer had much value at the time. I believe that Gragnani was also part of the Hodgson's deal as well.
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Re: Canucks get Zack Kassian

Post by herb »

mathonwy wrote:We trade depth down the middle for the possibility of size on the wing. I just don't like it.
Vigneault doesn't trust rookies and I doubt Hodgson would have played much here in the post season. Manny and Lapierre likely would have been playing elevated minutes when the games that count start.

This BS about Hodgson being some sort of "insurance" in case Hank or Kes go down is just that; BS. If Hank or Kes go down we are screwed anyway. No 33 point rookie is going to lead us to the promised land.
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Re: Canucks get Zack Kassian

Post by Hockey Widow »

I think the expectation is that Kassian can help us now but that the long term projection is that he will help us immensely in the future so it wasn't a wasted trade for this year's run. It is a project which does not negate the fact that he can have a vital role on the team right now and hopefully as he develops that role will increase. In Hodgson he had hit the wall with respect to where he was going as a Canuck in the short term. What we saw was what we were going to get.

The trade cannot be looked at in isolation when assessing whether we are better now or before the trades. It is the overall additions that make us better. Palhsson is what we had in Manny before the injury. If that injury does not happen and Manny continued along his way I suspect Hodgson would not have been given the opportunity he had this year anyway. AV wasn't suddenly going to insert him and give up that traditional 3rd line he covets. Hodgson git his chance due to the injury and ran with it.

I liked the kid and had high hopes for him but the deadline day deals make perfect sense to me. Whether that helps us win the cup time will tell but I doubt very much that standing still and keeping Hodgson would be any better, at least not with the coaching philosophy we have.

If Kassian can play catch up and get himself to a point where he is not gassed in the third period I think he will add a dimension to the team we have had a little glimpse of. If he can't then we will see a number of players on the 4th line again.
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Re: Canucks get Zack Kassian

Post by CorranHorn »

That's just it HW.

I had a hard time accepting this trade too, but I started to look at this trade in a different way.

At the beginnin of the year people were exclaiming for that 4th line player who can hit, fight(if he needs to) but also play the game. In my mind, for this cup run, that's the role Kassian is going to have/fill, and if St. Louis game was any indication of how he going to play in that role then he is going to be fine.

The problem a lot of people are having is seeing past this years run, and what kind of role Kassian can EVOLVE into. It's either we got a poor mans bertuzzi right now OR we got a 4th liner.

The reality is we got both. A player that fills a need we have now, as well as a player that will fill a need that this team will have in the future. All for a player who would fill no need this team has now nor in the future
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Re: Canucks get Zack Kassian

Post by Meds »

Hockey Widow wrote: If Kassian can play catch up and get himself to a point where he is not gassed in the third period I think he will add a dimension to the team we have had a little glimpse of. If he can't then we will see a number of players on the 4th line again.
Do you think he can get there in time for the post-season? I don't.
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Re: Canucks get Zack Kassian

Post by Fred »

Listening to MG he stated Kassian turned up in good shape. The reason IMO Kassian didn't play is he screwed up with his assignment along the boards whicvh lead to Wellwoods goal. He just got benched
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