GDT: Canucks @ Beantown - 10am - Snet / NHLN-US

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Re: GDT: Canucks @ Beantown - 10am - Snet / NHLN-US

Post by Listercat » Sun Jan 08, 2012 6:31 pm

Dude you're back fishing again eh?

Sorry but you are wrong about the situation with the 4 v 4 and Manny. There are 2 forwards and 2 D men and the forwards job is to cover the pointmen. The opposing forwards are supposed to be picked up by our D men. Hammer and Bieksa failed on their assignments on this one. Hammer was off to the side and KB was out too high.

On a 5 v 5 the centreman is supposed to stay with the other centreman allowing the D men to pick up the wingers.

While Manny has not been as effective this year thus far as we had hoped don't continually crucify the guy for stuff that is not his fault.
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Re: GDT: Canucks @ Beantown - 10am - Snet / NHLN-US

Post by wienerdog » Sun Jan 08, 2012 6:36 pm

RoyalDude wrote:
wienerdog wrote:
5) Malhotra. The man may not be full value on his $2.5M contract post-injury, but he is still a huge part of this team's defense. His play has been steadily improving, and I remember AV or MG saying conditioning was an issue due to the fact he couldn't work out due to pressure in the eyeball. He's making strides.

For anyone who expects more than just un-flashy defensive play from MM, you're not going to get it. He's terrible offensively (remember the bitching about our third line this time last season?) and he's clumsy with the puck. Me, I don't care. I care what he does without the puck and when the opposition has it. He's our key faceoff guy and is the heart of our PK.

A
Just curious wienerdog, what your thoughts were on Boston's 3rd goal and why it happened, cause nobody seems to want to talk about this, or I think what it is, is that when Malhotra fucks up royally, people turn a blind eye like the parents of a psychotic out of control child, do. Kind of like brushing it quietly under the carpet hoping nobody notices.

Let me remind, draw you up the scenario the best that I can from memory, Daniel Sedin was in the box, it was 4 on 4 hockey. A face-off is set in our end of the ice, here comes the great face-off man, Malhotra. Important Face-Off No. 1 - Manny loses to Krejci, puck ends up going into the mesh after, setting it up for 'Important Face-Off No. 2 in our zone. Manny loses again, but here is the kicker, instead of doing what all centreman are suppose to do after the face-off in their zone, and that is stay with opposing face-off/center-man cause he is suppose to be your check, what does the Genius of Manny do, he for some reasons goes after the point man whom ends up with the puck that Krejci won on his 2nd face-off, leaving Krejci unchecked and alone in a great scoring position in front of our net, cause Manuel there is chasing the point man with another one of our players. Complete brilliance, but ssssssshhhhh, we don't need to bring this up any.
[facepalm] Lol, at it again, huh? Sssssssssshhhhhh, indeed. Read what I wrote.

Nobody's arguing MM isn't living up to his $$. He's overpaid for what he brings to the table today, but he nearly lost a freaking eye, so I think that's understandable. GMMG can't see the future.

Malhotra also makes mistake - like the one you pointed out. Big deal, all players do. He's not super-human and without flaws.

But the bottom line is (like it or not) he's a key part of a top-of-the-League defense and he's steadily improving (albeit slowly). That's the glass-half-full view (you know, the one you never have ;) ) Besides, who exactly do you suggest replacing him with? Mancari? Oreo? Please.

Most importantly, RD / BD, he has a freaking NTC, so stop your incessant trumpeting that he's here already. MG won't ask him to waive. End of story, get over it.

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Re: GDT: Canucks @ Beantown - 10am - Snet / NHLN-US

Post by BladesofSteel » Sun Jan 08, 2012 6:50 pm

mathonwy wrote:We won the battle but lost the war.

Imagine if this was game 1 of the SCF. We lose both Salo AND Ebbett? Big deal, we won one game and proceeded to lose a top 4 defenseman and a 4th line plug (that was actually playing quite well).

The playoffs are a war of attrition and I don't think we don't have the genetics to compete.

Sure the Nucks could have beat the B's in a 7 game series if everyone was healthy. The reality is, the Nucks will NEVER be 100% healthy in the SC final based on the physical make up of the team. How close to 100% healthy we'll be is based on luck and based on how physically durable our players are. History shows, our team wears down.
True, True.

But one thing Boston had last year was a relatively healthy lineup (Savard excluded) throughout the entire playoffs. They were the luckier of the two teams in the finals in that respect, yet with the way that team plays there is no way they can maintain that same luck in another deep playoff drive. Particularly if they opt to play at a similarly high level as yesterday, on a consistent basis b/w now and April. It all catches up at some point. Boston is certainly not immune to injuries.

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Re: GDT: Canucks @ Beantown - 10am - Snet / NHLN-US

Post by RoyalDude » Sun Jan 08, 2012 6:51 pm

wienerdog wrote:
RoyalDude wrote:
wienerdog wrote:
5) Malhotra. The man may not be full value on his $2.5M contract post-injury, but he is still a huge part of this team's defense. His play has been steadily improving, and I remember AV or MG saying conditioning was an issue due to the fact he couldn't work out due to pressure in the eyeball. He's making strides.

For anyone who expects more than just un-flashy defensive play from MM, you're not going to get it. He's terrible offensively (remember the bitching about our third line this time last season?) and he's clumsy with the puck. Me, I don't care. I care what he does without the puck and when the opposition has it. He's our key faceoff guy and is the heart of our PK.

A
Just curious wienerdog, what your thoughts were on Boston's 3rd goal and why it happened, cause nobody seems to want to talk about this, or I think what it is, is that when Malhotra fucks up royally, people turn a blind eye like the parents of a psychotic out of control child, do. Kind of like brushing it quietly under the carpet hoping nobody notices.

Let me remind, draw you up the scenario the best that I can from memory, Daniel Sedin was in the box, it was 4 on 4 hockey. A face-off is set in our end of the ice, here comes the great face-off man, Malhotra. Important Face-Off No. 1 - Manny loses to Krejci, puck ends up going into the mesh after, setting it up for 'Important Face-Off No. 2 in our zone. Manny loses again, but here is the kicker, instead of doing what all centreman are suppose to do after the face-off in their zone, and that is stay with opposing face-off/center-man cause he is suppose to be your check, what does the Genius of Manny do, he for some reasons goes after the point man whom ends up with the puck that Krejci won on his 2nd face-off, leaving Krejci unchecked and alone in a great scoring position in front of our net, cause Manuel there is chasing the point man with another one of our players. Complete brilliance, but ssssssshhhhh, we don't need to bring this up any.
[facepalm] Lol, at it again, huh? Sssssssssshhhhhh, indeed. Read what I wrote.

Nobody's arguing MM isn't living up to his $$. He's overpaid for what he brings to the table today, but he nearly lost a freaking eye, so I think that's understandable. GMMG can't see the future.

Malhotra also makes mistake - like the one you pointed out. Big deal, all players do. He's not super-human and without flaws.

But the bottom line is (like it or not) he's a key part of a top-of-the-League defense and he's steadily improving (albeit slowly). That's the glass-half-full view (you know, the one you never have ;) ) Besides, who exactly do you suggest replacing him with? Mancari? Oreo? Please.

Most importantly, RD / BD, he has a freaking NTC, so stop your incessant trumpeting that he's here already. MG won't ask him to waive. End of story, get over it.
I just want everyone to stop using the only excuse why Manny is soooooo valuable because of his face-offs when after losing two key face-offs in a row at a key point in the game, not mention his brain fart in letting his check go, the same guy who ended up putting the Bruins back to within 1 goal. That goal gave Boston life. Manny is overrated. I don't get the love for the guy. Of course, I know full well about the NTC with Manny, all I am saying is 'scratch the fucking bum'.
Last edited by RoyalDude on Sun Jan 08, 2012 6:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: GDT: Canucks @ Beantown - 10am - Snet / NHLN-US

Post by RoyalDude » Sun Jan 08, 2012 6:55 pm

wienerdog wrote:he's a key part of a top-of-the-League defense and he's steadily improving (albeit slowly). That's the glass-half-full view (you know, the one you never have ;) ) Besides, who exactly do you suggest replacing him with? Mancari? Oreo? Please.
The Canucks current line-up has the luxury of a lot of players who play both ends of the rink really well, one of them being Raymond. Malhotra is redundant thanks to CoHo and Lapierre. He's lost on the 4th line. Practically the entire forward group can penalty kill with the best of them. He wouldn't be missed if he was scratched. Get rid of the bum, time for him to ride the pine, make room for Bitz or Duco when Booth gets back. Done Deal.
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Re: GDT: Canucks @ Beantown - 10am - Snet / NHLN-US

Post by RoyalDude » Sun Jan 08, 2012 6:59 pm

Listercat wrote:Dude you're back fishing again eh?

Sorry but you are wrong about the situation with the 4 v 4 and Manny. There are 2 forwards and 2 D men and the forwards job is to cover the pointmen. The opposing forwards are supposed to be picked up by our D men. Hammer and Bieksa failed on their assignments on this one. Hammer was off to the side and KB was out too high.

On a 5 v 5 the centreman is supposed to stay with the other centreman allowing the D men to pick up the wingers.

While Manny has not been as effective this year thus far as we had hoped don't continually crucify the guy for stuff that is not his fault.
Can't say I 100% agree with you here, to put all this blame on Hammer. The bottom line is, Malhotra lost two face-offs in a row at a key point in the game, he choked and was directly responsible for the goal cause that is why he is here, face-offs,
Last edited by RoyalDude on Sun Jan 08, 2012 7:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: GDT: Canucks @ Beantown - 10am - Snet / NHLN-US

Post by Southern_Canuck » Sun Jan 08, 2012 7:00 pm

RoyalDude wrote:Just curious wienerdog, what your thoughts were on Boston's 3rd goal and why it happened, cause nobody seems to want to talk about this, or I think what it is, is that when Malhotra fucks up royally, people turn a blind eye like the parents of a psychotic out of control child, do. Kind of like brushing it quietly under the carpet hoping nobody notices.
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Re: GDT: Canucks @ Beantown - 10am - Snet / NHLN-US

Post by tantalum » Sun Jan 08, 2012 8:03 pm

Fred wrote:Nice photo of Lucic leaving the ice

http://media.zenfs.com/en/blogs/sptusnh ... 96653.jpeg
That's why the call on the ice was the correct one. He's at the bench if not on it and then leaves to join an altercation. It's in the rule 70.1 that he can not do so even if he was a legal guy on the ice from a line change. But the NHL set the precedent by not suspending Downie for something similar.

I can't help but think people's thoughts on it would be far different if the altercation was 100 feet away and Lucic went charging into the pile. Because it's 10 feet he's not at fault? Come on.

Regardless the refs made the call for that reason and for a game management reason. Nothing wrong with that but yet again the NHL embarasses the officials with a public decisions and statement. Just stupid.

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Re: GDT: Canucks @ Beantown - 10am - Snet / NHLN-US

Post by BladesofSteel » Sun Jan 08, 2012 8:34 pm

I agree Tant.

All in all, I applaud the job the refs did yesterday as it must have been one of the more difficult games they'll face all (regular) season.

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Re: GDT: Canucks @ Beantown - 10am - Snet / NHLN-US

Post by Reefer2 » Sun Jan 08, 2012 8:44 pm

tantalum wrote:
Fred wrote:Nice photo of Lucic leaving the ice

http://media.zenfs.com/en/blogs/sptusnh ... 96653.jpeg
That's why the call on the ice was the correct one. He's at the bench if not on it and then leaves to join an altercation. It's in the rule 70.1 that he can not do so even if he was a legal guy on the ice from a line change. But the NHL set the precedent by not suspending Downie for something similar.

I can't help but think people's thoughts on it would be far different if the altercation was 100 feet away and Lucic went charging into the pile. Because it's 10 feet he's not at fault? Come on.

Regardless the refs made the call for that reason and for a game management reason. Nothing wrong with that but yet again the NHL embarasses the officials with a public decisions and statement. Just stupid.
Not to defend him but he only had 1 foot in the bench and one on the ice, does that consititute a line change? And Cherry, the reason Sedin got off the ice was because it was a line change and he would of been in trouble if he even touched a guy.

Just once I would love to see MG go on CBC and call Cherry and stooge #1 out, Cherry is such a fuck tard, the only time I watch him is if Canucks play the early game, he goes on about the 11 PP Canucks get but not the 8 Boston gets. He talks about the tap Burrows gives but not the punched Boston gives. He talks about the non fight but not the constant after whistle punched to the Sedin's by Boston tough guys.

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Re: GDT: Canucks @ Beantown - 10am - Snet / NHLN-US

Post by tantalum » Sun Jan 08, 2012 8:56 pm

Reefer2 wrote: Not to defend him but he only had 1 foot in the bench and one on the ice, does that consititute a line change? And Cherry, the reason Sedin got off the ice was because it was a line change and he would of been in trouble if he even touched a guy.
I admit it's a grey area but I think it would have been a lot less grey if Lucic charged 100 feet to get involved. I don't get why the lack of distance excuses it. And as I said it was still the correct call by the officials from a game management scenario and what it looked like to them. It's like that Edler goal against the WIngs, there is no way to actually know if the push was what caused Hansen to go down or not the only thing the refs sees at full speed is the contact and Hansen falling. IT's a good call given what he saw (it would also have been a good call to wave off the goal and call incidental contact...could have either way). There was no need for the league to come out and say the wrong call was made because they have no idea from a replay what caused the fall.

Every canucks on the ice even with it being 6 guys was on the ice legally as they were in the midst of a line change. Henrik was likely smart to be overly cautious but I don't there would have been an issue. IT is the reason they Downie off the hook.

I understand a 10 game suspension would be harsh to Lucic and I can't help but think the NHL had to rescind the game misconduct or suspend him for 10.

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Re: GDT: Canucks @ Beantown - 10am - Snet / NHLN-US

Post by Hockey Widow » Sun Jan 08, 2012 9:09 pm

70.1 Leaving the Bench - No player or goalkeeper may leave the players’ or penalty bench at any time during an altercation or for the purpose of starting an altercation. Substitutions made prior to the altercation shall be permitted provided the players so substituting do not enter the altercation.

So if I'm reading this correctly, the substituting player is not deemed to have left the bench to join an altercation but if he does so he is still in contravention which means Lucic should have been penalized as he was as substituting player. Therefore, whoever replaced Hank was also in contravention of the rule and thus should have been penalized correct?

Now what I don't know is what the penalty is. Is it a game misconduct or what? I think Lucic clearly made a legal substitution, i.e., he did not leave the bench to join an altercation, but the rules says he cannot join an altercation as a substituting player. So I can see no automatic 10 game suspension which I am fine with in this case but I am a little confused.
Last edited by Hockey Widow on Sun Jan 08, 2012 9:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: GDT: Canucks @ Beantown - 10am - Snet / NHLN-US

Post by Listercat » Sun Jan 08, 2012 9:10 pm

:P Dude, now you are changing your tune!

First it was Manny didn't stay with his check. Now its he lost the draw! Make up your mind FFS.

If KB or Hammer pick up Krecji he doesn't get a whiff of that puck. BTW look at a lot of the faceoffs in that game. The B's bend the face off interference rule to the breaking point. Seems to be a systemic thing.

If you want to give a player horns how about Alex Edler. Gave the puck away on the Peverley goal. Gave the puck away on a cute drop pass that resulted in a penalty shot. Cory saved his ass big time on that. Gave the puck away and took a penalty when he had lots of time to put it off the boards and out. This is a guy with huge potential but for the past month his head has been in the stratosphere. His +- is lower than KB3 and Hammer and they play against the other teams top players. When KB3 had a +- arounf -10 everyone was screaming about "casual Kev". Is there a different rating system for AE? Alex' defensive play has been brutal, he's not hitting and he is making some really bad decisions with the puck.
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Re: GDT: Canucks @ Beantown - 10am - Snet / NHLN-US

Post by hist » Sun Jan 08, 2012 9:13 pm

Reefer2 wrote:
Just once I would love to see MG go on CBC and call Cherry and stooge #1 out, Cherry is such a fuck tard, the only time I watch him is if Canucks play the early game, he goes on about the 11 PP Canucks get but not the 8 Boston gets. He talks about the tap Burrows gives but not the punched Boston gives. He talks about the non fight but not the constant after whistle punched to the Sedin's by Boston tough guys.
Not only that, but the "11 Power Plays" is misleading. If you score on a 5-minute major, you're considered to be starting another power play after that. They scored twice on that penalty, so they were 2-3 on it. They didn't get 11 separate power plays. They really only got 9.

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Re: GDT: Canucks @ Beantown - 10am - Snet / NHLN-US

Post by porp » Sun Jan 08, 2012 10:02 pm

I really don't understand the *hate* on MM - has everyone forgotten his dominance in the FO before his injury? Sure, he's not playing nearly as well right now, but he's still probably a leader in the dressing room and definitely a player we'll want in the playoffs especially once he gets back into form/learn to compensate for his disability.

Totally sympathize with all of the angst about the Canucks being cheapshotted all the time. Maybe it's a compliment - the feeling around the league is that the 'nucks can't be beat without cheapshotting and generally playing dirty. When was the last time another team tilted the 'nucks acting like white knights at an Arthurian tournament? And won?

Personally, I suspect that Mike Gillis' ego is SOOOO fucking enormous that he wants to be inducted into the HHOF as a builder - a GM who changed the 'modern' NHL (back) into a game of skill and sportsmanship. By building the Canucks this way and making his coach stick to hockey integrity, if MG wins a cup, or a couple/few cups, other teams will try to follow the template, and hopefully the rest of the league swings along into the pure-skill template.

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