US Erection 12 *AND* 16

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RoyalDude
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Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Post by RoyalDude » Fri Aug 17, 2018 4:18 pm

I’m an NDP/Green?

News to me

Hey I love the Electoral College! Nothing like lonely old Hoss there down on his cotton farm out in the middle of nowhere in the Mississippis having more weight at the polls than the entire black population of an urban metropolitan city
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Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Post by Topper » Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:01 pm

RoyalDude wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 4:18 pm
I’m an NDP/Green?
Did I say that?
Over the Internet, you can pretend to be anyone or anything.

I'm amazed that so many people choose to be complete twats.

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Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Post by RoyalDude » Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:46 pm

Topper wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:01 pm
RoyalDude wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 4:18 pm
I’m an NDP/Green?
Did I say that?
I don’t know what yer saying Hoss, I was waxing on about the beginnings of the electoral college vote then you slapped me with local yocal shite
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Per
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Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Post by Per » Sat Aug 18, 2018 2:17 am

Topper wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:18 pm
... the Electoral College is Proportional Representation ...
Uhm... no it's not. It differs from state to state. None, as I understand it, are truly proportional, some follow the congressional districts within the state but most are winner take all.
And their weight is not proportional to the population of each state either.
Southern states are given more weight than northerm states.

If the Electoral College had true proportional representation, it would mimic the popular vote, and Hillary Clinton would be president of the USA.

The way it is now, in theory, a candidate who won all the smallest states with a minimal majority, could reach the 270 elector votes necessary to become president with just 22% of the popular vote. (In reality this won't happen, because some tiny states are reliably republican and others are reliably democratic leaning).

The United States is the only country that elects a politically powerful president via an electoral college and the only one in which a candidate can become president without having obtained the highest number of votes in the sole or final round of popular voting.

Four million US citizens live in a "territory" (eg Guam, Samoa, Puerto Rico) rather than a state and have no say in the presidential election, as only states get to send representatives to the electoral college.
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Per
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Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Post by Per » Sat Aug 18, 2018 8:47 am

Well, the second unite the right march was a bit of a no-show, but Arnie's video re Charlottesville is still worth watching again:

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Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Post by Topper » Sat Aug 18, 2018 9:17 am

Per wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 2:17 am
Topper wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:18 pm
... the Electoral College is Proportional Representation ...
yadda yadda yadda
Current allocation is based on the 2010 census.

Have you seen the nonsense proposals we are being asked to vote on?
Over the Internet, you can pretend to be anyone or anything.

I'm amazed that so many people choose to be complete twats.

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Per
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Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Post by Per » Sat Aug 18, 2018 3:20 pm

Topper wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 9:17 am
Per wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 2:17 am
Topper wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:18 pm
... the Electoral College is Proportional Representation ...
yadda yadda yadda
Current allocation is based on the 2010 census.

Have you seen the nonsense proposals we are being asked to vote on?
No, I have not. But proportional reoresentation typically means that eg 15% of the votes gives you 15% of the seats.
That is not how the electoral college works. And if you mean that the number of electors reflects the size of the population in each state, that's not true either. No state gets less than three. Thus a vote in Wyoming has four times the value of a vote in California. And even if the numbers mortored the population sizes, it would still not be proportional as most state use a winner takes all system.

Eleven states have however pledged to give all its electors to the candidate that wins the nationwide popular vote. This will only go into effect though if enough states agree to this that they get past the 270 electors threshold. At present they only have like two thirds of that. But this means the US coould eventually switch to a system where the candidate that gets more votes always wins.

Once they've accomplished that no-brainer, maybe they can start looking into adopting the metric system and leave the medieval system they use for weights and measures today to the history books. :drink:
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Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Post by micky107 » Sat Aug 18, 2018 11:14 pm

The metric system. For simpletons that can only count to ten.
It's restrictive.

Just another sad time in Canadian 70s history thanks to "just not and never will be ready's" father, or so we're told, father.
Ski bunny mania.
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Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Post by RoyalDude » Sun Aug 19, 2018 7:34 am

Per wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 3:20 pm

But this means the US coould eventually switch to a system where the candidate that gets more votes always wins.

Once they've accomplished that no-brainer,
That makes way too much sense for old Hoss out in the sticks of Wyomin’

“Can’t be lettin’ them uneducated black folk havin’ the ah....hilbility to swing the polls in the wrong direction, ya hear”
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Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Post by Topper » Sun Aug 19, 2018 8:57 am

RoyalDude wrote:
Sun Aug 19, 2018 7:34 am
Per wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 3:20 pm

But this means the US coould eventually switch to a system where the candidate that gets more votes always wins.

Once they've accomplished that no-brainer,
That makes way too much sense for old Hoss out in the sticks of Wyomin’

“Can’t be lettin’ them uneducated black folk havin’ the ah....hilbility to swing the polls in the wrong direction, ya hear”
I completely disagree. That would mean the political system would be dominated by dense urban populations.
Over the Internet, you can pretend to be anyone or anything.

I'm amazed that so many people choose to be complete twats.

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Per
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Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Post by Per » Sun Aug 19, 2018 12:55 pm

Topper wrote:
Sun Aug 19, 2018 8:57 am
RoyalDude wrote:
Sun Aug 19, 2018 7:34 am
Per wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 3:20 pm

But this means the US coould eventually switch to a system where the candidate that gets more votes always wins.

Once they've accomplished that no-brainer,
That makes way too much sense for old Hoss out in the sticks of Wyomin’

“Can’t be lettin’ them uneducated black folk havin’ the ah....hilbility to swing the polls in the wrong direction, ya hear”
I completely disagree. That would mean the political system would be dominated by dense urban populations.
Do you have a problem with the concept that every vote should carry the same weight?

The beauty of proportional voting is that it also renders gerrymandering pointless.
No matter how you draw the lines on the map, it is still the total that counts.

And it's not like every one living in the city is dense... :drink:
Last edited by Per on Sun Aug 19, 2018 12:59 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Per
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Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Post by Per » Sun Aug 19, 2018 12:57 pm

Also had to share this:

Image
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Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Post by micky107 » Sun Aug 19, 2018 2:55 pm

No-way, Per.
Has to be the riding system in the US and Canada.
Solely popular vote may work for small, less diversified countries but not here.
Just because a region may not have a vast population doesn't mean it shouldn't have an equal say.

In fact, here in Canada, I would like to move further away from popular vote.
That means moving towards equalizing the ridings around the country.

Explain why that would be wrong.

please
"evolution"

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Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Post by Reefer2 » Sun Aug 19, 2018 5:22 pm

Per wrote:
Sun Aug 19, 2018 12:55 pm
Topper wrote:
Sun Aug 19, 2018 8:57 am
RoyalDude wrote:
Sun Aug 19, 2018 7:34 am
Per wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 3:20 pm

But this means the US coould eventually switch to a system where the candidate that gets more votes always wins.

Once they've accomplished that no-brainer,
That makes way too much sense for old Hoss out in the sticks of Wyomin’

“Can’t be lettin’ them uneducated black folk havin’ the ah....hilbility to swing the polls in the wrong direction, ya hear”
I completely disagree. That would mean the political system would be dominated by dense urban populations.
Do you have a problem with the concept that every vote should carry the same weight?

The beauty of proportional voting is that it also renders gerrymandering pointless.
No matter how you draw the lines on the map, it is still the total that counts.

And it's not like every one living in the city is dense... :drink:
no way to proportional voting, we have in BC a minority government and the Greens hold too much power. Say no to special interest groups with fringe ideas.

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Re: US Erection 12 *AND* 16

Post by RoyalDude » Sun Aug 19, 2018 7:43 pm

Say ‘no’ to Reefer
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