GDT: R1G1 - Canucks host Kings - 7:30

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Re: GDT: R1G1 - Canucks host Kings - 7:30

Postby okcanuck » Thu Apr 12, 2012 9:43 am

Blob Mckenzie wrote:I'm not too sympathetic for Kyle Clifford's situation if he has a concussion. He could have killed Tanev last year when he burried him from behind with a dirtier play than Bitz's hit last night.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dv6ExX2-1uE


Clifford didn't receive a suspension either .

Dumb play by Bitz.

PP Kings 2-8,Canucks 0-5 that tells you the whole story.
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Re: GDT: R1G1 - Canucks host Kings - 7:30

Postby Puck » Thu Apr 12, 2012 10:08 am

Yes, inconsistency is certainly the cry from the masses, yet again. In today's NHL, you can cross-check Sidney Crosby in the head penalty-free, but you get two minutes for spraying snow. I don't get it. The talking heads also think that driving Zetterburg's head into the glass after the whistle is OK, because he wasn't seriously hurt. Meanwhile, there's some sort of workshop going on in TO to investigate head shots. No, I really don't get it.

Go 'Nucks. No-one expected this series to be easy. Get to work.
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Re: GDT: R1G1 - Canucks host Kings - 7:30

Postby Farhan Lalji » Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:10 am

Puck wrote:Yes, inconsistency is certainly the cry from the masses, yet again. In today's NHL, you can cross-check Sidney Crosby in the head penalty-free, but you get two minutes for spraying snow. I don't get it. The talking heads also think that driving Zetterburg's head into the glass after the whistle is OK, because he wasn't seriously hurt. Meanwhile, there's some sort of workshop going on in TO to investigate head shots. No, I really don't get it.

Go 'Nucks. No-one expected this series to be easy. Get to work.


What disturbed me the most way how passionless the Canucks appeared last night.

Perhaps they've been thinking/dreaming about playoff redemption for so long, that it had an adverse effect and they felt mentally drained? (i.e. mental overload). That's probably not the case but I wouldn't be surprised if it WAS. Sometimes - if a team fears losing/underperforming too much, you can subconsciously attract that as well. Who knows....

All I know, is that we have to be better tomorrow otherwise the Kings are going to make quick work of us.
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Re: GDT: R1G1 - Canucks host Kings - 7:30

Postby KeyserSoze » Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:11 am

Puck wrote:Yes, inconsistency is certainly the cry from the masses, yet again. In today's NHL, you can cross-check Sidney Crosby in the head penalty-free, but you get two minutes for spraying snow. I don't get it. The talking heads also think that driving Zetterburg's head into the glass after the whistle is OK, because he wasn't seriously hurt. Meanwhile, there's some sort of workshop going on in TO to investigate head shots. No, I really don't get it.

You are not alone.

We will see what Bitz gets. He has a hearing, so there will likely be a suspnsion, and rightfully so.

But a $2500 fine for Weber smashing Zetterberg's head into the turnbuckle...er..glass, is beyond. A clear attempt to injure an opponents head, and one that did not remotely resemble a "hockey play".

Sure, Bitz is a plug and Weber is a superstar. Keep in mind that Clifford is also a plug, and Zetterberg is also a superstar.
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Re: GDT: R1G1 - Canucks host Kings - 7:30

Postby herb » Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:22 am

KeyserSoze wrote:Sure, Bitz is a plug and Weber is a superstar. Keep in mind that Clifford is also a plug, and Zetterberg is also a superstar.


Also keep in mind that Clifford was injured and Zetterberg was not. Like it or not, Shanahan has made it clear that he bases his suspensions on the severity of the injury to the player the offending play occurred on.
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Re: GDT: R1G1 - Canucks host Kings - 7:30

Postby Benjo » Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:29 am

The boys should have taken the hint that there would be no clowning around by the officials when the Kesler penalty happened, instead they chose to play Bruin hockey for the next 2 periods and it got them nowhere. Last season many Canuck fans and posters on this board were up in arms that the NHL changed the rules for the playoffs and were calling nothing, now in this thread I'm reading the refs should have just let the players sort it out. We can't have it both ways at our convenience.

Raymond is a train wreck and has been nothing more than a passenger on this Presidents trophy winning team. It can't all be blamed on him but he is occupying a spot on the #1 line, him not contributing on that line is in itself a negative for the team.

Luongo was great not much more can be said about him

Edler made a few goofball plays that he wish he could iron out of his game

I would love to add Lappy back to the top line and Higgins back to the second line. The winger on the third line just has to be tenacious and cover his check, we should have someone like that available.

It's just 1 game LA is very beatable if the boys stick to THEIR game. Getting into a big hitting slug fest is just what LA wants, the boys should be using their skill and while they are on half decent ice.

The PP was much better in the third with quick crisp passes and good shots with bodies in front, more of that please.

Kesler stop diving...just...enough already jesus. That somersault in the neutral zone was ridiculous.
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Re: GDT: R1G1 - Canucks host Kings - 7:30

Postby wafflecombine » Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:38 am

okcanuck wrote: PP Kings 2-8,Canucks 0-5 that tells you the whole story.


Lets compare apples to apples rather than be simplistic.
1st Period
02:06 LAK Jarret Stoll : Charging - 2 min
09:51 LAK Dustin Penner : Tripping - 2 min
12:32 VAN Ryan Kesler : Unsportsmanlike conduct - 2 min
13:21 VAN Chris Higgins : Delaying Game-Puck over glass - 2 min
14:23 VAN Alexander Edler : Delaying Game-Puck over glass - 2 min
17:41 VAN Sami Salo : Hooking - 2 min
2nd Period
03:24 VAN Zack Kassian : Charging - 2 min
03:48 LAK Jarret Stoll : Holding - 2 min
06:50 VAN Maxim Lapierre : Charging - 2 min
12:12 VAN Byron Bitz served by Zack Kassian : Boarding (maj) - 5 min
12:12 VAN Byron Bitz : Game misconduct - 0 min
3rd Period
02:58 LAK Alec Martinez : Hooking - 2 min
13:55 LAK Jordan Nolan : Slashing - 2 min


17 minutes of pp assessed against the Canucks. Kassian & Stoll in 2nds were damn near offsetting and really meant only about 20 seconds of pp going each way. So, not accounting for the time it took LA to score, the PP time was approximately 15:20 against the Nucks and 8:20 against the Kings. More important was the grouping and duration. 4 consecutive penalities in 1st creating two distinct 5 on 3's of significant duration. Second period momentum stolen in Kassian and Lappy calls followed by 5 min on Bitz (which I think he earned).

The PPs in the third are almost a wash after continous PK duty.

Also (stolen from CDC) from a fan there outlining refs with a (in the posters mind) statistical predisposition to call card against the Canucks. I make no claims as to its veracity and only throw it up here as a point for debate
As posted by (RunningWild 3535 posts ) - Before the game even starts, I bet I can accurately predict which team will have the PP advantage based on who is officiating.

I've gone through every reg season game to see how each official has called games. It's disgusting how some officials have 'very clearly' called against Nucks in every game.

O'Rourke (tonights official) doesn't like the Canucks. Short of the Bos game in Jan, O'Rourke calls against the Canucks almost every game he officiates. Tonight is no different. There are 8 other officials who hate the Canucks: O'Hallaran, Peel, Walsh, Watson, Sutherland, Kozari, Joanette, Leggo. Keep your eye out for these tools. "
Source - http://forum.canucks.com/topic/327389-t ... ge__st__60


All this notwithstanding, you can't win a game from inside the penalty box. We need to be better in game 2. And for the record, Weber fined 2500 fo slamming detroit heads into the rail. Bitz faces a disciplinairy hearing. :) NO idea who reffs on Friday :)
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Re: GDT: R1G1 - Canucks host Kings - 7:30

Postby coco_canuck » Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:40 am

Some thoughts...

While the Canucks were looking to take the body, the Kings were focused on forechecking and playing a north-south game.

Taking 8 penalties doesn't help, but that's what happens when you're a step behind a team you're faster than.

Don't worry about making a physical impact, the hits will be there, just simplify and get working on the forecheck.

The defensive breakouts have been poor due to the Kings aggressive forecheck, drop a forward down a little lower, and don't be afraid to chip it out. Too many turnovers when the D was pressured last night, and they have too much ability and quickness back there to rush into low-percentage plays.

Just remember, it's game 1.
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Re: GDT: R1G1 - Canucks host Kings - 7:30

Postby SKYO » Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:49 am

wafflecombine wrote:I've gone through every reg season game to see how each official has called games. It's disgusting how some officials have 'very clearly' called against Nucks in every game.

O'Rourke (tonights official) doesn't like the Canucks. Short of the Bos game in Jan, O'Rourke calls against the Canucks almost every game he officiates. Tonight is no different. There are 8 other officials who hate the Canucks: O'Hallaran, Peel, Walsh, Watson, Sutherland, Kozari, Joanette, Leggo. Keep your eye out for these tools. "[/i] Source - http://forum.canucks.com/topic/327389-t ... ge__st__60

Yeah at the start of the playoffs the ref's call it tight, and for the ref's who don't like us it's even worse, iirc we had the most penalties last playoffs as well.

AV should try Ebbett next game and have a more scoring 4th line instead of a bruising bitz-lap-kass line, which I thought would be a smash line but the ref's are calling everything, so might as well save that for the latter rounds...if we make it that far.
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Re: GDT: R1G1 - Canucks host Kings - 7:30

Postby KeyserSoze » Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:59 am

herb wrote:
KeyserSoze wrote:Sure, Bitz is a plug and Weber is a superstar. Keep in mind that Clifford is also a plug, and Zetterberg is also a superstar.


Also keep in mind that Clifford was injured and Zetterberg was not. Like it or not, Shanahan has made it clear that he bases his suspensions on the severity of the injury to the player the offending play occurred on.

Another thing to keep in mind is that Weber already received a $2500 fine in October when he hit Hansen from behind.

I am not saying that the Weber and Bitz plays dererve equal discipline.

What I am saying that there is no question in my mind, based on everything that the league has done and said this season, that Weber slamming Zetterberg's head into the glass WWF style deserved at least a 1 game suspension.

...

On a Canucks related note, it sounds like Daniel did not skate today (optional practice).
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Re: GDT: R1G1 - Canucks host Kings - 7:30

Postby Larry Goodenough » Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:08 pm

I dislike Tony Gallagher. But what he said this morning summed it up. The NHL "headquarters" are the problem, not the reffing. "Reffing by memo" is how Gallagher described it. It's clear they sent out an email to all the refs before last night. Something to the effect that playoff hockey is more intense, so they needed to set the tone early by not letting players get too out of control. Mike Babcock mentioned the same thing when the 2 least penalized teams in the league get 34 minutes in penalties.

In effect, the league changed the rules... again. Colon Campbell and Mike Murphy do this endlessly and leave their refs all twisted in knots trying to figure out what to do. How to show Colon they got the memo and want to ref the next round. The refs ruined last nights game. It was not fun to watch. It sounds like they did the same thing in the Det/Nash game. The linesman in the Phi/Pit games was beyond awful. Bottom line, the officals are the talk today in all 3 games, not the players or the game.

Add this to the Decision no to suspend Weber for a deliberate headshot.

Headquarters has no integrity. They do not value their fans and would rather exert their powers and convince us of their superior insider hockey knowledge then present the customer with a consistent product.

They don't value us. Instead, they hold all of us in contempt.
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Re: GDT: R1G1 - Canucks host Kings - 7:30

Postby mathonwy » Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:10 pm

wafflecombine wrote:
Also (stolen from CDC) from a fan there outlining refs with a (in the posters mind) statistical predisposition to call card against the Canucks. I make no claims as to its veracity and only throw it up here as a point for debate
As posted by (RunningWild 3535 posts ) - Before the game even starts, I bet I can accurately predict which team will have the PP advantage based on who is officiating.

I've gone through every reg season game to see how each official has called games. It's disgusting how some officials have 'very clearly' called against Nucks in every game.

O'Rourke (tonights official) doesn't like the Canucks. Short of the Bos game in Jan, O'Rourke calls against the Canucks almost every game he officiates. Tonight is no different. There are 8 other officials who hate the Canucks: O'Hallaran, Peel, Walsh, Watson, Sutherland, Kozari, Joanette, Leggo. Keep your eye out for these tools. "
Source - http://forum.canucks.com/topic/327389-t ... ge__st__60


Trying to verify this would be a very interesting and worthwhile endeavour for the Canucks to look into. Is there statistical proof that shows certain officials are predisposed to calling penalties on the Canucks.

You'd have to do a shit load of pattern analysis of all of the refs calling penalties in the last say.. 5 years. Find out what a normal penalty calling pattern is and then compare the individual refs pattern against the normal one.

I'm sure you could do it but wow, would that ever take a lot of work.
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Re: GDT: R1G1 - Canucks host Kings - 7:30

Postby wafflecombine » Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:17 pm

Yeah trying to prove the original poster's supposition would be a very hard endeavour. I personally don't have the time or desire to do that detailed of a statistical review. Even so, I would caution anyone trying that correlation doesn't necessarily imply causation.

meh...

It is interesting food for thought and while I generally shy away from overt conspiracy theories, I still find myself wondering "who is reffing game 2 and are they on that list"???
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Re: GDT: R1G1 - Canucks host Kings - 7:30

Postby Larry Goodenough » Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:42 pm

Here's the penalties from the Det/Nash game

1st Period
01:59 NSH Brandon Yip : Roughing - 2 min
03:32 DET Johan Franzen : Roughing - 2 min
08:50 NSH Gabriel Bourque : Boarding - 2 min
12:10 DET Cory Emmerton : Interference - 2 min
16:20 DET Jonathan Ericsson : Tripping - 2 min
17:06 DET Justin Abdelkader : Hi-sticking - 2 min
2nd Period
01:10 NSH Roman Josi : Cross checking - 2 min
04:23 DET Henrik Zetterberg : Tripping - 2 min
09:28 DET Kyle Quincey : Holding - 2 min
13:50 NSH Martin Erat : Roughing - 2 min
19:54 NSH Patric Hornqvist : Hi-sticking - 2 min
3rd Period
05:06 NSH Roman Josi : Hooking - 2 min
05:06 DET Jiri Hudler : Diving - 2 min
14:52 NSH Jack Hillen : Interference - 2 min
16:08 NSH Ryan Suter : Slashing - 2 min
19:37 NSH Martin Erat : Holding - 2 min
20:00 NSH Shea Weber : Roughing - 2 min
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Re: GDT: R1G1 - Canucks host Kings - 7:30

Postby Cornuck » Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:51 pm

wafflecombine wrote:Yeah trying to prove the original poster's supposition would be a very hard endeavour. I personally don't have the time or desire to do that detailed of a statistical review. Even so, I would caution anyone trying that correlation doesn't necessarily imply causation.


You'd also have to look at who was winning and by how much when the penalty was called. In the league of parity, you need to give the underdog all the help you can get. This could explain why the Canucks get a lot of penalties called on them - they're usually winning.
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