Listercat wrote:Pot if you are correct in your assessment of why Everyone is down on Raymond that rationale is pretty flimsy. Kesler had 4 goals at even strength in 25 games, Chris Higgins had 3 and Raymond had 2. I agree that secondary scoring was a problem in the playoffs, but that stick could also be used to beat our D corps. Then of course we have to look at the injuries guys were playing with that certainly made them less effective.
dhabums wrote:tantalum wrote:Provided God wants that for him of course.
It depends on how hard we pray.
Hockey Widow wrote:The bubble will burst for Rome soon enough but for now it is nice to see. Good on him.
Listercat wrote:Jovocop wrote:I think you need to "review" some game tape from last year. Raymond many times turned defenders inside out to create time and space to set up Kesler or make a diagonal cross ice pass to the D man on the back side. With regard to him not shooting, I seem to recall there were more complaints about him taking too many shots from a bad angle than there were about him not shooting.
Listercat wrote:Pot I don't argue that Kesler was probably our best player and he got 4 goals in 25 games at even strength. That was my point.
Higgins was injured and Kes was injured but Raymond was supposed to make up for them? Higgins contract has absolutely nothing to do with this discussion.
He was playing on the line with Raymond and Kesler. Kesler had one very strong series and that was against the Preds.
I'm not saying Raymond had a great playoffs offensively by any means, but he seems to be the sacrificial lamb. He was a -2 for the playoffs which isn't good at all,but as I said earlier, while the Sedins, Erhoff and Edler may have produced more points they were also far worse on the Defensive side of the puck. By that logic you would have to say that Raymond's all around game was not that bad.
Listercat wrote:Christ you are obtuse Pot !!
You said Kesler was the best forward. He scored 4 goals at even strength in 25 games. That equates to 13 goals over a regular season. I certainly don't call that highly productive, do you? Raymond scored 2 goals at even strength and Higgins got 3. Did they not play as a line in the playoffs? If you don't compare to your linemates who do you compare to? I brought up Higgins because they played on the same line. Why shouldn't they have expected Higgins to score, he had done it previously?
In short none of the players on that line scored the way they could or should have. Kesler did most of his scoring in the Preds series. That line, including Raymond played shutdown hockey in the Hawks series against the Toews line and did little scoring. In the Sharks series they were up against the Thornton line. The Preds don't have much for offensive weapons so their defensive responsibility was easier. Consequently the offense improved. In the Finals they faced the top line again most of the time and while they didn't score they were not scored upon as much as the other lines either.With Malhotra out that line's role changed.
Believe what you will but look at the whole picture
Listercat wrote:What I was attempting to show was that Raymond's point totals were on balance no worse than his teammates .