2013 Stanley Cup Finals Boston vs. Chicago

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Re: 2013 Stanley Cup Finals Boston vs. Chicago

Postby Hockey Widow » Mon Jun 17, 2013 8:18 pm

Ok. I feel like shit. I have never felt as horrible as I do right now. Why oh why can't we be Boston. I think I'll go start a riot now.
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Re: 2013 Stanley Cup Finals Boston vs. Chicago

Postby Rumsfeld » Mon Jun 17, 2013 8:19 pm

Topper wrote:What happened to Hossa? Did a team mate pat him on the back?


He actually got hurt taking a wrist shot in warm-ups... so pretty close. :lol:
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Re: 2013 Stanley Cup Finals Boston vs. Chicago

Postby Rumsfeld » Mon Jun 17, 2013 8:20 pm

Hockey Widow wrote:Ok. I feel like shit. I have never felt as horrible as I do right now. Why oh why can't we be Boston. I think I'll go start a riot now.


That's the spirit!
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Re: 2013 Stanley Cup Finals Boston vs. Chicago

Postby Meds » Tue Jun 18, 2013 2:51 am

Everyone going on about the bigger, younger, faster, Bruins, seems to overlook the fact that the Bruins aren't just winning because of size, strength, and grit. They are winning because they are all on the same page and none of them take a night off. They are winning because they support the puck almost perfectly in all 3 zones. They back check better than any other team. They protect their net better than any other team. They crash the net better than any other team. They move the puck as well as any other team, and they hit like trucks.

So their success at hitting, crashing the net, and protecting their own net is due to their size and toughness.

But what about the way some of their players are shooting and capitalizing on chances? Some of that is puck luck, some of it is confidence, most of it is getting good looks that they have created with a team game where all 5 skaters on the ice are contributing.

Boston is for real. They don't have the superstar forwards, but they definitely know how to win with what they have.

I have really enjoyed watching some good teams get absolutely destroyed by Boston. It's a little ironic that they are back in the finals again and the only team likely to take them to 7 games like the Canucks did was Toronto. :roll:
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Re: 2013 Stanley Cup Finals Boston vs. Chicago

Postby tantalum » Tue Jun 18, 2013 6:16 am

I've never really hated the Bruins even after they beat the canucks in the Final. Sure I didn't like what they were getting away with and I can't stand Julien anymore than I can Quennville but the fact remains the players don't call the game. The Bruins do what they do because they can. Kudos to them as they have found an effective way to win important games. They are rough. They are tough. They are fast. They are responsible at both ends of the ice. They have good goaltending. They are a good team. But the biggest difference is really the depth they have. The core guys take series off just like all other core players on teams, but they have the depth that seems to step up and win series.

Paille has 4 goals this playoff. Campbell 3. Boychuk for goodness sakes has 5 goals! Krug 4.

Paille and Campbell in 34 playoff games this year have 7 goals....a 17 goal pace.

Raymond, Higgins, Hansen...in the last 96 playoff games have 11 goals....a 9 goal pace. Twice as many goals from 2 depth players up front compared to 3 of the canucks. That is a huge difference. It's even bigger when you consider that one or two of the canucks are typically on the second line.

The ONLY reason the Hawks are in the final this year is because of the depth scoring. The core has by and large has not been great.
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Re: 2013 Stanley Cup Finals Boston vs. Chicago

Postby coco_canuck » Tue Jun 18, 2013 9:32 am

tantalum wrote:The ONLY reason the Hawks are in the final this year is because of the depth scoring. The core has by and large has not been great.


Not sure I agree.

Toews hasn't scored much, but he's been a two-way beast for the Hawks, man-handling his match-ups.

Hossa had been their best forward and Sharp has been fantastic.

Their D has been excellent, led by Keith.

I thought the Hawks outplayed the Bruins in the first two games and Boston was fortunate to leave Chicago with a split.

The Hawks have played some very solid team hockey this playoffs, out-performing the opposition in the majority of their playoff games. I even thought the Hawks outplayed the Red Wings for the most part but Detroit won a couple on the back of excellent Jimmy Howard performances.

Personally, I don't have a vested interest in this series, I thought the a healthy Hawks team with speed and skill would be too much for Boston. We'll see what happens, but I expect Chicago to win game 4 and probably still win this series.
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Re: 2013 Stanley Cup Finals Boston vs. Chicago

Postby tantalum » Tue Jun 18, 2013 9:42 am

Toews hasn't scored much, but he's been a two-way beast for the Hawks, man-handling his match-ups.
Sorry he is expected score and isn't. I also don't think man-handling is what he has done. He hasn't been all that good IMO.

Hossa had been their best forward


Agreed.

and Sharp has been fantastic.


...in the first round and first two games of the Detroit series. Since then 5 points in 13 games. 1 in the last 6. Hossa has been a touch more consistent but not much. The bulk of that lines scoring was done the first 7 games of the playoffs.

Their D has been excellent, led by Keith.


I don't disagree.

I thought the Hawks outplayed the Bruins in the first two games and Boston was fortunate to leave Chicago with a split.


Chicago was better the first game and the first half of the second game. Since then the Bruins have overwhelmed them. The Bruins are full marks for the series lead.

The Hawks have played some very solid team hockey this playoffs, out-performing the opposition in the majority of their playoff games. I even thought the Hawks outplayed the Red Wings for the most part but Detroit won a couple on the back of excellent Jimmy Howard performances.

Personally, I don't have a vested interest in this series, I thought the a healthy Hawks team with speed and skill would be too much for Boston. We'll see what happens, but I expect Chicago to win game 4 and probably still win this series.
[/quote]

Not saying the Hawks have been horrible or anything, clearly they haven't, but if it wasn't for the 20 goals from the bottom 6 forwards on the team they aren't going anywhere in the post-season because the core with maybe the exception of Keith simply have not been at all consistent. Depth is getting them through this post-season more so than great performances from their stars. Much of the same can be said for Boston but the Lucic lines has produced all along the way, just not as much as it did in the first round.
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Re: 2013 Stanley Cup Finals Boston vs. Chicago

Postby coco_canuck » Tue Jun 18, 2013 10:05 am

tantalum wrote:Sorry he is expected score and isn't. I also don't think man-handling is what he has done. He hasn't been all that good IMO.


He's been cold offensively, but he's been excellent from everything I've seen. Despite only putting up 9 points, his team has outscored the opposition 12-7 with him on the ice 5on5.

That's pretty damn impressive when you've been playing against number 1 pairs all post-season without having much puck luck.I think luck is a major factor with point scoring when you're only shooting 1.6% on 63 shots, 4th most on the team.

tantalum wrote:Chicago was better the first game and the first half of the second game. Since then the Bruins have overwhelmed them. The Bruins are full marks for the series lead.


I wouldn't say full marks, the Bruins probably lose game 2 if that phantom no-goal call isn't made. The tying goal in game 2 came against the run of play after the 2-0 goal was called off.

tantalum wrote:Depth is getting them through this post-season more so than great performances from their stars. Much of the same can be said for Boston but the Lucic lines has produced all along the way, just not as much as it did in the first round.


I think the Hawks top forwards have been excellent two-way performers and you're right, they've got a lot of production from their depth but no one should apologize for having effective depth players.
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Re: 2013 Stanley Cup Finals Boston vs. Chicago

Postby tantalum » Tue Jun 18, 2013 10:39 am

I think the Hawks top forwards have been excellent two-way performers and you're right, they've got a lot of production from their depth but no one should apologize for having effective depth players.


Nor should they apologize. But when you look at the Hawks and Bruins and compare them to, say, the canucks and Sharks what you see is that by and large the top guys don't as whole through the post-season outproduce the other top guys by a huge margin. But when you start digging into the bottom 6 the differences seem large to me. Higgins, hansen and Raymond have 11 goals in their last 96 combined playoff games. Paille and Campbell this year have 7 in 34 combined games. Those two players have scored at twice the rate of three canuck players and those three canucks players get PP time. It's huge this time of year. And if you look at what the bottom 6 for Chicago has done this year it is staggeringly superior to anything the canucks have received as secondary scoring since, well, ever.

I guess it's why I don't see the issue being Daniel, Henrik, Burrows and Kesler (well some Kesler for his atrocious post-seaosn penalty killing) but rather that depth who is able to step up and take the load off the top 4 guys for a series or two. Last year for the Kings it was Penner, Lewis and King chipping in with big goals and Matt Greene of all people had 5. There are other issues to be sure and not saying those top 4 guys need to step up more at times but until the bottom 6 actually becomes some sort of post-season threat another trip to the final is unlikely.

To me, in the end, it boils down to being able to get to the net when speed can be nullified by playoff officiating. Take away Raymonds speed with a quick hold or hook and he's done. Same with Hansen at this point. It's why as a GM I would seriously look to overpay for a Bickell type. He may not be as "talented" as a Raymond or be able to play in all situations but come playoff time he is a whole lot more effective because he can get to the net no matter what style of game is played or how the officials call it.

It's time to stop worrying about how fast a player is and rather how fast a player can actually get to the net to create a scoring chance. I know people hate Booth (for some good reasons) but if I had to guess, it's why he may still be a canuck next season. hands of stone perhaps but he gets the puck to the net every shift and that creates issues. Especially if his linemates can do the same.
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Re: 2013 Stanley Cup Finals Boston vs. Chicago

Postby Rumsfeld » Tue Jun 18, 2013 2:20 pm

SKYO wrote:Brute size combined with skills is winning it, EastVan thug Lucic pounding everyone, looks like he injured Toews with a crushing hit.

Hope Kassian can be a Lucic clone.

Just sign Penner for more added size upfront!


Haha, OK Skyo. Why don't you sit the next few plays out.
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Re: 2013 Stanley Cup Finals Boston vs. Chicago

Postby coco_canuck » Tue Jun 18, 2013 3:44 pm

tantalum wrote:It's time to stop worrying about how fast a player is and rather how fast a player can actually get to the net to create a scoring chance. I know people hate Booth (for some good reasons) but if I had to guess, it's why he may still be a canuck next season. hands of stone perhaps but he gets the puck to the net every shift and that creates issues. Especially if his linemates can do the same.


Excellent post.

I don't think our top players are necessarily the issue, other than Kesler staying healthy and Edler turning his game around.

We really do lack the type of players who can excel in the playoffs. The hope is Kassian will become that type of player, but we really need another top 9 forward with some pop who can thrive in playoff games and we have to upgrade the 4th line.

It's not that I am against trading any of our top players, but doing so isn't necessarily the answer because chances are we will be parting with the best player in the deal unless we're blown away by something.

In other words, the chances of a major shake-up happening, that will actually benefit this team, are fairly slim.
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Re: 2013 Stanley Cup Finals Boston vs. Chicago

Postby Rumsfeld » Tue Jun 18, 2013 4:17 pm

coco_canuck wrote:In other words, the chances of a major shake-up happening, that will actually benefit this team, are fairly slim.


That's why this offseason should be fun.

Gillis has a lot to prove and I think he's going to make some big moves.

At this point I'd rather make a big move that backfires than do nothing and go back into the playoffs with basically the same team next year. There's no point in standing pat with this group, they've proven they can't get it done the last two seasons.

That doesn't mean just moves for the sake of moves, but if Gillis is as savvy as he seems to think he is, this team can be a contender next season. Not a favourite by any stretch, but a contender that competes hard and can play playoff hockey.

And that's really all we can ask for at this point, yeah?
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Re: 2013 Stanley Cup Finals Boston vs. Chicago

Postby RoyalDude » Tue Jun 18, 2013 4:31 pm

SKYO wrote:
Just sign Penner for more added size upfront!


LMAO...Skyo, hands down you have the worst Arm Chair GM trade proposals on the planet. I tend to compare Kassian to Penner from time to time, and Skyo, they are not for good reasons. But then again, since the two of them suffer from serious disappear-itis syndrome they could just take turns showing up so by then we would actually at least be getting one of our big bodies showing up when one may not, in which, that is a guarantee with these two.
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Re: 2013 Stanley Cup Finals Boston vs. Chicago

Postby RoyalDude » Tue Jun 18, 2013 4:36 pm

Rumsfeld wrote:
coco_canuck wrote:In other words, the chances of a major shake-up happening, that will actually benefit this team, are fairly slim.


That's why this offseason should be fun.

Gillis has a lot to prove and I think he's going to make some big moves.

At this point I'd rather make a big move that backfires than do nothing and go back into the playoffs with basically the same team next year. There's no point in standing pat with this group, they've proven they can't get it done the last two seasons.

That doesn't mean just moves for the sake of moves, but if Gillis is as savvy as he seems to think he is, this team can be a contender next season. Not a favourite by any stretch, but a contender that competes hard and can play playoff hockey.

And that's really all we can ask for at this point, yeah?


I don't see any big moves at all and in fact pretty much believe every word Gillis and Gillman have been saying this off-season. I do see Corrado, Jensen, Lain and Schroeder making the line-up to help get under the cap and prove that Gillis no longers wants to cook the kids in the minors.

How the line-up will look next season

Dank, Hank, Burrows
Jensen, Kesler, Kassian
Higgins, Schroeder, Hansen
Sestito, Lain, Weiss

Booth IR

Bieksa Edler
Tanev Hamhius
Corrado Garrison

Schneider
Lack
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Re: 2013 Stanley Cup Finals Boston vs. Chicago

Postby Rumsfeld » Tue Jun 18, 2013 4:43 pm

Really Dude, you don't think Gillis is going to add a single forward that isn't from our AHL squad?

Jensen on the second line? Schroeder the anklebiter centering line #3?

I know you want the guy dead but come on.

BTW I'm surprised you guys haven't taken Gillis' comments about playing the youngsters with a grain of salt. Every GM says that every year, it very rarely happens.

I would be absolutely fucking flabbergasted if Jensen, Schoeder and Lain all start with the team. Hell, I'd be pretty surprised if two of them make it. Jensen is so not ready and Schoeder just isn't that good.
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