Gills and Vigneault

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Re: Gills and Vigneault

Postby Meds » Mon May 06, 2013 12:32 am

RoyalDude wrote:We must not forget that there is a serious waning interest in this city regarding the fans and that falls squarely onto the shoulders of the GM of this team. I'm sure Aquaman ain't too happy about it. Gillis job is far from safe if this team gets knocked again in the first round. AV getting fired is nowhere near the magic bullet you all is hoping for. No new coach coming in here is gonna make a difference, it will just be a revolving door of coaches like we see in Edmonton. The problem? It's the GM.


You're right about some of that.

A new coach is not the magic bullet "we all hope for". But it's the the cross-hairs that aim the bullet.

Vigneault being axed is a first step.

Changing up some of the personnel on the roster is the next step.

If that fails, then a new GM is the final step.

I don't think Gillis will follow in the footsteps of Kevin Lowe and the Coilers. He will replace the coach, make a couple of changes to the roster, and, if the team performs the same, he will make big changes to the roster. If he doesn't do this, then you and I can meet up for a cold one and I'll buy and tip my glass to you and say you were right about him.

Regardless of the Gillis argument, Vigneault still needs to go. We have seen enough of the dog and pony show that is AV and Bowness.
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Re: Gills and Vigneault

Postby Meds » Mon May 06, 2013 12:36 am

Blob Mckenzie wrote:Hey Knucklehead you're preaching to a guy who follows the same guy to work every day. I aint happy with MG's efforts thelast 2 years but anyone who says he is the worst GM in the teams history likely gets his food cut up for him.

As an asside AV is a joke. Best thing that come out of a sweep is seeing that fat prick unemployed.


Blob, I think I'd enjoy tossing back cold ones in front of hockey with you whilst mutually swearing at the team and throwing darts at a picture of AV's head.
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Re: Gills and Vigneault

Postby Meds » Mon May 06, 2013 12:50 am

SKYO wrote:Every single player should be made available, no untouchables!


Ya know, I might spout off and rage a bit here and there, but I never say stupid irrational shit like this.

Henrik, Daniel, Kesler, Hamhuis, Bieksa, and Garrison, all have NTC's or NMC's. So you can't just make them available.

Kesler, Burrows, Garrison, Tanev, Hanen, and Schneider, should all be considered untouchable. They bring 100% every night, and when their on they bring 110%. Schneider may have turned in a stinker tonight, but he's staying because Luongo wants to go. Those guys right there are the emotional nucleus of the team. They bring the passion and the fire that is needed to compete at this level. Luongo and Bieksa are the same that way, but Juice is too prone to brain farts to be considered untouchable, and as I said, Lou wants out.

The rest of the team lacks the consistent fire in their belly, and some of them (the Sisters, Edler, Raymond) seem to be encased in turnout gear and rarely catch the passion.
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Re: Gills and Vigneault

Postby Jovorock » Mon May 06, 2013 5:40 am

I think both will and should go if we lose this series. Two years in a row going out in the first round is unbelievable
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Re: Gills and Vigneault

Postby Island Nucklehead » Mon May 06, 2013 6:23 am

Jovorock wrote:I think both will and should go if we lose this series. Two years in a row going out in the first round is unbelievable


AV for sure.

Gillis is on a choke-chain. This goaltending shitshow is a complete cluster-fuck. Two of his bigger acquisitions from the past couple seasons have been disasters, and his lack of foresight into our Centre position this year made us a team without an identity.

Another year of "just wait til we get into the playoffs". Nope. This team needs a structural change. If Gillis isn't the guy to make wholesale changes, then he should go too.
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Re: Gills and Vigneault

Postby Boston Canucker » Mon May 06, 2013 6:35 am

I look forward to seeing AV on the TSN panel next year. I'm sure he'll do well on the quiz.
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Re: Gills and Vigneault

Postby Eddy Punch Clock » Mon May 06, 2013 6:36 am

Boston Canucker wrote:I look forward to seeing AV on the TSN panel next year. I'm sure he'll do well on the quiz.


He won't go unemployed that long.
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Re: Gills and Vigneault

Postby Diehard1 » Mon May 06, 2013 6:50 am

AV will be gone if they lose this round, that's for sure. I can't say the same for Gillis, he's got at least one more coach before he's going anywhere.

On the team itself - I have no idea what's happened to them. Every year I hear it's injuries, this year it's Bieksa, Tanev and Schneider who are hurting. Quite simply, at some point the injury excuse has to stop.

And where the hell have Higgins, Hansen, Roy, etc gone? The best forwards have been Kesler, Burrows and then maybe Kassian. The twins have been awful outside of one nice pass by Henrik, but that seems to be par for the course this time of year.

The one good thing is there will be major changes if/when this team goes out - there's no way they can stand pat this time. This team has been together way too damn long.
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Re: Gills and Vigneault

Postby Boston Canucker » Mon May 06, 2013 6:52 am

Eddy Punch Clock wrote:
Boston Canucker wrote:I look forward to seeing AV on the TSN panel next year. I'm sure he'll do well on the quiz.


He won't go unemployed that long.


Likely so, no doubt, but the TSN desk seems to be the coach re-deployment transition zone...
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Re: Gills and Vigneault

Postby RoyalDude » Mon May 06, 2013 7:31 am

We should sign old man Ruff to a uber expensive contract, he seems to be doing a real bang up job over at the IIHF Worlds after getting axed in Buffalo. I wonder how Kassian would thrive under Ruff, seemingly, Ruff parked his ass down in Rochester when Zack was there. :rofl:
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Re: Gills and Vigneault

Postby paddy » Mon May 06, 2013 7:40 am

Hockey Widow wrote:How many times have we come away from a playoff series and someone somewhere said AV was out coached? Too many. Ottawa, forced to try rookies all year, changed things up after game one and gave some of their kids a chance to play. What did AV do? He put is Sestito.

Since the Boston series our PP has been on a steady decline. What does AV do? The same thing.

The young kid Corrado looks like a keeper but not quite ready. What does AV do? Sits Ballard and lets the kid draw in.

He goes back to the well over and over but never comes up with anything new. Just keeps talking about the system and playing the system and on and on. But what happens when the system fails or needs tweaking? Nothing.

He is a good regular season coach but lets face it last year we won the PT because NYR failed to win it. This year we won the Division because Minny tanked at the right time for us. Well, next season we won't have the weak Division as a cushion. We have shown we can't beat LA, SJS, Chicago and Anaheim on a regular basis.

As to MG. Well, he has assembled a good defence on paper but for the life of me when they are on the ice they look AHLish. Up front he has too many of the same type of players. Next season is the time to see what a few of the farm boys have. Enough of saying we can't get the youngsters in because we are pushing for a title of some sort. It has to be next season that we see 3-4 young players crack the line up. Give Kassian a bigger role. We don't need to push for a title next year. Our goal should be to make the playoffs with as good as seeding as possible all the while letting the next generation earn their strips.

I never thought we were a contender at the start of the year but it is these embarrassing ass kickings and give up that irk me. I'm done. I don't care if they come back and win a game or 2 or 3 or 4. They will not make it out of the West even if they pull a miracle on Georgia Street and come back in this series, which they won't do. They are done. All that is left is the excuses.

We need a major overhaul and I'd advocate the following: (Like no surprises here)

Trade Luongo for the best offer
Trade Edler for a good return
Trade/buy our Ballard
Trade/buy out Booth
Let Lappy walk
Let Raymond walk
Let Roy walk


Package up as many of those guys as you can and get something back, even if it is just cap space. Next season get some of the kids in the line up with a coach that can work with them. Get ready for the end of the Sedins and get ready now. When their contract is up they have said they want one more deal. Well, we had better be in a position to be able to offer it to them at around 4 each per year as second line players. I am so done with this team and if it comes back next year almost intact then count me as one who will no longer watch.

I woke up the other day and realized I don't have a lot of winters left. Perhaps 5, 10 maybe 15 if I'm lucky. I just don't want to spend them watching this same incarnation of the Canucks. If MG doesn't handle this the right way we will be the Flyers or the Preds or heaven forbid the Flames. With the current group he has 1, maybe 2 seasons before the bottom falls out. Bette the address it this off season.

At least the streets of downtown are nice and quiet. :mrgreen:


There are only 2 players on this roster that will bring you back anything in a return IMO You are not getting anything for Booth or a Ballard the forward I move is Burrows and the blueliner I move is Edler... Before you kill me HW here me out...

The Gm has done all he can in FA and at the deadline giving up prospects and picks but the returns are rentals or guys like Max & Higgins...

Burrows is the forward because the twins and Kesler are not going anywhere you are not getting anything for Hansen...Higgins Kassian are not going anywhere... Burrows brings you the most in a return

Edler is the Blueliner cause his upside to the outside world is a puck moving blueliner who can play elite minutes throw the odd check and be a 45-50 pt guy... I think he is a lil too casual and has been for awhile to ever think he fulfills that potential I think the outside world looks at him a lil different ... Edler is the most you get in a return I am on the phone to Mac T They need a d man I luv Gagner...

Garrisson Juice Hamhuis Tanev Frankie are 5 you live with sign a 6 who is cheap move on...

HW the coach should of been blown out of here Last yr after he threw Danny under the bus in his exit presser after the LA series... Holding off on the full post mordem until they are done...
whether you like it or don't like it learn to live with it because its the best thing going today...
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Re: Gills and Vigneault

Postby RoyalDude » Mon May 06, 2013 7:49 am

Good points, Paddy. Burrows is pushing 32 years of age, he is still very marketable and could fetch us a real good young player to start the next phase of your Vancouver Canucks while we transition over the next couple seasons as the Sedins fade into the sunset. Kesler is younger and a centre. We really need a quality, young, top 6 forward to play with him to help kick start the next wave and Burrows might be the guy for that. Edler is a tough one for to move, cause he is young. I know he is struggling a bit, but I'd consider Bieksa only cause of his age, like Burrows.

You could get some very decent young returns for Burrows and Bieksa

Ballard and Booth are automatic buyouts if you can't move them.

Higgins and Raymond have to go

I'd still consider moving Schneider for the mere reason that we would get a very good return for him. Luongo can give us a few more years of solid goaltending if he can be coaxed into wanting to stay here.

I'd try to use either one of Burrows, Bieksa and maybe Schneider and our first and maybe a prospect to sneak up into the top 5 of the draft.
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Re: Gills and Vigneault

Postby paddy » Mon May 06, 2013 8:29 am

RoyalDude wrote:Good points, Paddy. Burrows is pushing 32 years of age, he is still very marketable and could fetch us a real good young player to start the next phase of your Vancouver Canucks while we transition over the next couple seasons as the Sedins fade into the sunset. Kesler is younger and a centre. We really need a quality, young, top 6 forward to play with him to help kick start the next wave and Burrows might be the guy for that. Edler is a tough one for to move, cause he is young. I know he is struggling a bit, but I'd consider Bieksa only cause of his age, like Burrows.

You could get some very decent young returns for Burrows and Bieksa

Ballard and Booth are automatic buyouts if you can't move them.

Higgins and Raymond have to go

I'd still consider moving Schneider for the mere reason that we would get a very good return for him. Luongo can give us a few more years of solid goaltending if he can be coaxed into wanting to stay here.

I'd try to use either one of Burrows, Bieksa and maybe Schneider and our first and maybe a prospect to sneak up into the top 5 of the draft.


Edler is gets you more than Juice cause his upside is greater Juice stays cause this blueline is marshmellow soft as it is Higgins just signed for 4 more yrs he aint going anywhere...
whether you like it or don't like it learn to live with it because its the best thing going today...
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Re: Gills and Vigneault

Postby vic » Mon May 06, 2013 8:36 am

Game 1:
Aside from Sedins & Burrows, AV shuffles the entire forward group and has players playing with brand new guys in game 1 of the Stanley Cup Playoffs. Luongo the only player that shows up for that game and Niemi shuts out the Canucks as they can't generate any offense because they don't know how to play with their new line-mates.

Game 2:
AV puts his lines back to "normal" and the team plays possibly the best game they have since the CHI game. With a minute to go and the team being shorthanded, he throws out the Sedins in a short-handed situation when the two of them have never killed a penalty in the regular season. That combined with playing Edler almost 30 minutes after it was apparent he was going to have a bad game 10 minutes into the first. Edler can't get it deep, Henrik tosses the puck up the middle, Burrows loses it, Daniel lays down, Edler doesn't cover Marleau, puck in the net.

Game 3:
After being the best player in the first two games of the series, Luongo is pulled in favor of a cold goalie just coming off injury. Puts in Corrado and kills a year off his ELC.

Let's see how AV fucks up game 4.
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Re: Gills and Vigneault

Postby Island Nucklehead » Mon May 06, 2013 8:41 am

Bieksa has a full NTC, so who knows where he'd waive to. He's also our only real "gritty" guy back there. We need more piss and vinegar on the back end, not less.

I too would shop Burrows. This team needs higher quality scorers that can thrive without the Sedins. Hansen has proven himself capable of taking on Burrows' defensive assignments. In the longer-term, I think if Kassian improves his conditioning he could be a good fit on the first line. Thomas Vanek's name has been bandied about in trade rumours lately. He makes a lot of money but he produces (43 goal, 110 point pace this year). He's still on the good side of 30 and has one year left on his deal @ a $7.14 cap hit.

Evgeni Nabokov and Tim Thomas are going to be a UFA for the Islanders this offseason. Anyone think they'd want to bring in Luongo to backstop their move to a new barn next year? They're also probably going to lose Mark Streit. I'd look at moving Edler and Luongo and see what kind of package we get back. They have some very solid guys in their system (Niederreiter, Strome, de Haan, Neslon) and they might be inclined to make some 'go for it now' type moves.

One thing is clear, this team needs more scoring up front. The defense-can-score-goals-too style isn't working when guys are getting in the lanes and blocking shots from the outside. We need that 1-2 punch up front that teams like LA, Pittsburgh, Chicago, San Jose etc. Ryan Kesler with the Sedins on the PP doesn't count. We also need to get bigger and better in our own zone. Offensive d-men are fine, but this team lacks a mean asshole to clear our crease and inflict some damage.
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