Canucks News and Notes

Welcome to the main forum of our site. Anything and everything to do with the Vancouver Canucks is dicussed and debated here.

Moderator: Referees

User avatar
RoyalDude
CC Legend
Posts: 11355
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2004 6:36 pm
Location: Vancouver

Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by RoyalDude » Fri Jul 10, 2015 7:22 am

Fuck its a rebuild people, it ain't fucking pretty. Doesn't matter what GM was hired to clean up the Gillis shit show the mess remains the same and tough decisions are to be made. At least we now have a GM who aint scared to make unpopular decisions unlike baggage eyes who was too chicken shit to pull the trigger. Benning has a vision and he plans on seeing it through, it aint going to happen overnight

Can't believe the moaning, everybody knew this day was coming, the break it down and start a new. The two guys that have been hoisting this team on its back since the WCE are 35. It's over. Everyone is screaming for it - the rebuild, yet when it actually happens people are hurt by it.

I have great confidence in a GM who knows what he wants - Benning. Not a wishy washy fence sitter who shat the bed when the team he inherited and rode on needed for him to make hard moves and decisions. Since 2011 Gillis was a scared puppy with out a clue on what to do

All hail Benning - the true bird dog scout

We should all be jacked about the coming Horvat, Virtanen, McCann, Boeser, Cassels years. Really good pieces to build around which is exactly what Benning is doing. Patience my friends
"I just want to say one word to you. Just one word. Are you listening? - Plastics." - The Graduate

dbr
CC Legend
Posts: 3048
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2011 5:37 pm

Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by dbr » Fri Jul 10, 2015 7:48 am

I'll say this, the way the Gillis regime ended and what we were hearing in the last year or so, I had a bad feeling that ownership had their big fucking noses in hockey operations and couldn't stomach a down period in terms of the on ice product, even if was necessary to get back to contention.

(A cynical read on their replacement - pretty boy spectacles-and-fitness magnate :roll: Trevor Linden - did not help at all.)

(Nor did the return on their first big move, and only major trade chip in Ryan Kesler.)

If the messaging that we're seeing in the last few weeks is true and accurately represents the vision for this franchise - that we're going to see them strip this thing down to the frame if that's what it takes - that's heartening, at least.

There's still a lot that's unsettling going on - like Linden talking up Weisbrod as the guy behind Gaudreau (drafted before Weisbrod was hired) and Monahan (drafted exactly where he was expected, and by most accounts after Weisbrod was marginalized in the Flames organization) - but at least they are fundamentally doing the right thing.

bckev
CC Veteran
Posts: 190
Joined: Mon Jul 29, 2013 9:53 am

Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by bckev » Fri Jul 10, 2015 7:50 am

I like that Benning and Linden are willing to take the heat and stick to their guns. It is important to do what you think is going to work and be committed to it. Time will tell if they were right or wrong. The one thing I know for sure is they know more about what they are doing and how to do it than I do, so I will defer to their decision making.

User avatar
Topper
CC Legend
Posts: 9588
Joined: Wed Sep 15, 2004 8:11 pm
Location: Earth, most days.

Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by Topper » Fri Jul 10, 2015 7:54 am

Traded a career backup for a high third and a seventh. Well done Jim. Well done.
Over the Internet, you can pretend to be anyone or anything.

I'm amazed that so many people choose to be complete twats.

User avatar
ukcanuck
CC Legend
Posts: 3402
Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 3:04 am

Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by ukcanuck » Fri Jul 10, 2015 9:32 am

Topper wrote:Traded a career backup for a high third and a seventh. Well done Jim. Well done.
^^^
We seem to be on the same page here

User avatar
Meds
CC Legend
Posts: 5837
Joined: Mon Jul 11, 2011 8:50 pm

Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by Meds » Fri Jul 10, 2015 9:52 am

Topper wrote:Traded a career backup for a high third and a seventh. Well done Jim. Well done.
Yeah, the Lack trade hasn't bothered me at all. It made sense, even more so when we hear that GM's around the league viewed Eddie as just a very capable backup goaltender and not a true starter.

User avatar
Hockey Widow
CC Legend
Posts: 12774
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2011 8:52 pm

Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by Hockey Widow » Fri Jul 10, 2015 11:05 am

While I think it is far too early to know whether the moves Benning is making will substantially pan out to bring us back to contender status down the road, I like the decisiveness of his moves. Imagine if MG moved that quickly in dealing with our goaltending situation, either trading Luongo or Schneider right away. True, we may not have Bo right now, but we would have more that Markstrom, a 15% hold back and future staggering cap recapture penalties. Imagine if he had moved Kesler at the TDD for the best return when more than one team was in the bidding. Imagine if he had only handed out a few NTC to players who you truly wanted to build around. Imagine if all his draft years were like his last.

I liked MG and supported him until his last season. For whatever reasons he could not get it done. Benning came in last year and made major changes right away.

Garrison was moved quickly. Keep in mind Benning had an up close and personal view of him while he was with Florida.he was not a fan of his game at that cap. Gone.

Was not convinced Lack/Markstrom combo would leave us competitive every night. Miller signed.

Tried to keep Kesler, even contemplated letting him sit until he softened his stance on his team list but in the end decided it was in the best interests of the team to get that extra first last year and to move on. Kesler traded.

Wanted a top six, couldn't land Iggy as he wasn't willing to bite on four years so he went to plan B and the Vrbata signing was seen by most as one of the top FA signings last year.

Saw a glaring hole in the organization of players in the 20-25 year range who were ready for NHL playing time and went about, methodically, acquiring those players. Yes he gave up a couple of seconds and a promising prospect in Forsling but he plugged some holes.some of those players may end up being serviceable place holders, some may actually work out long term.

Targets the type of character players he believes the organization needs and goes out and gets them, Dorsett and Prust.

Decides Bieksa's time here is done and moves quickly to move him out, while accommodating a great team guy.

Decides, rightly or wrongly, Lack is a career back up, a good one, but that Markstrom has more upside. An assessment by the way that is historicall between these two. At every level Markstrom has always been rated ahead of Lack. Benning makes a business decision that trading a soon to be UFA for a soon to be FA is the smarter move.

By all accounts he had been trying to trade Kassian pretty much from last Christmas until he finally succeeded in July. We may never know the whole story but Benning made his assent then acted as soon as he could. He wanted to free up a RW spot and he did. He wanted to add another character guy and he did.

My point in all this long winded recap is that right or wrong, Benning has a plan and is following it. He has traded, in 12 months, three players with NTC. One who demanded it but two who most felt would never waive. he has talked with agents for Hamhuis, Vrbata, Higgins and Burrows. You know he has broached the subject of NTC. I would venture that not one of those players, will at this point, refuse to waive should they be asked. Of course they will use their NTC to control where they go, as they should and in my opinion the real benefit and intent of holding a NTC. But I trust should Benning decide it is time to move any of those four he will make it happen. He has hinted as much regarding Vrbata and Hamhuis. He will move them out NOT because he is worried about the return but to clear space for younger guys he feels are ready for the NHL and to free cap for 2016. In that respect I think Hamhuis is the easiest one to keep for a couple of more years as our defensive prospect pool is very thin.

But we could over the course of the next year or year and a half move out Vrbata, Higgins and Burrows as we see how our prospects develop. We have the potential depth to replace this three within that time frame.

I think most will agree his drafting has been excellent.

I think most will agree he has done a solid job of building Utica and creating a winning culture there.he has coaches who give a shit and actually spend time with the prospects and watch their development, unlike the Torts culture.

Some of his signings are cause for major debate. Dorsett a tad too much and one year too long, but no NTC. Sbisa 500,000-600,000 above his qualifying offer and perhaps a year too long but he bought two years of FA, no NTC for a team dearth of defensive prospects ready to take the next step. He brought in Bartkowski, one year. Brought back Weber one year. Signed Corrado and Clendening one year. Resigned Vey one year. Resigned Kenins on a two way. A pattern here. A whole whack of show me contracts for players who may end up being place holders or who may earn longer deals. And there is Miller. The one that seems to cause the most emotion second to Sbisa of course. But let's face it. He wanted a goalie he perceives to be a proven number one to stabilize the team and mentor Markstrom and then perhaps Demko. And if people are honest they will say that prior to his knee injury Miller delivered. Sure he had a few blow out games and that sucked but overall, he delivered. He gave us a chance to win most nights, in front of a horrible defence for the most part.

I like that Benning is owning it. I like that he was pissed with our playoff showing and made changes. I may have liked that he did some things a little different, like getting a pick for Matthias at the TDD, but overall I like that he has a plan and is willing to take the heat for sticking with it. It would be far to easy to give into the pressure and change mid stream but he seems to be sticking with it. Had he been successful in trading for Lucic I would have been very confused because to me that does not fit the long term plan. And I know if LA does not resign him then we will be big suitors next July. I think part of Benning's plan now is to free the cap to be in a position to target him and if available Seabrook. But that's a year away.

Ok I'm done.
The only HW the Canucks need

User avatar
the toucan kid
CC Legend
Posts: 3923
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2004 10:50 am

Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by the toucan kid » Fri Jul 10, 2015 11:23 am

Well said Hockey Widow. And any executive that gives a darn about what his moronic fanbase thinks is not a good one. 98% of sports fans are slobbering, reactionary loons with whom I'm ashamed to share species designation.

The truth is that most of what Benning has done so far is really insignificant in the big picture. We're just shedding layers before building back up. That's when we measure the mettle of the man.

User avatar
ukcanuck
CC Legend
Posts: 3402
Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 3:04 am

Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by ukcanuck » Fri Jul 10, 2015 11:25 am

Hockey Widow wrote:While I think it is far too early to know whether the moves Benning is making will substantially pan out to bring us back to contender status down the road, I like the decisiveness of his moves. Imagine if MG moved that quickly in dealing with our goaltending situation, either trading Luongo or Schneider right away. True, we may not have Bo right now, but we would have more that Markstrom, a 15% hold back and future staggering cap recapture penalties. Imagine if he had moved Kesler at the TDD for the best return when more than one team was in the bidding. Imagine if he had only handed out a few NTC to players who you truly wanted to build around. Imagine if all his draft years were like his last.

I liked MG and supported him until his last season. For whatever reasons he could not get it done. Benning came in last year and made major changes right away.

Garrison was moved quickly. Keep in mind Benning had an up close and personal view of him while he was with Florida.he was not a fan of his game at that cap. Gone.

Was not convinced Lack/Markstrom combo would leave us competitive every night. Miller signed.

Tried to keep Kesler, even contemplated letting him sit until he softened his stance on his team list but in the end decided it was in the best interests of the team to get that extra first last year and to move on. Kesler traded.

Wanted a top six, couldn't land Iggy as he wasn't willing to bite on four years so he went to plan B and the Vrbata signing was seen by most as one of the top FA signings last year.

Saw a glaring hole in the organization of players in the 20-25 year range who were ready for NHL playing time and went about, methodically, acquiring those players. Yes he gave up a couple of seconds and a promising prospect in Forsling but he plugged some holes.some of those players may end up being serviceable place holders, some may actually work out long term.

Targets the type of character players he believes the organization needs and goes out and gets them, Dorsett and Prust.

Decides Bieksa's time here is done and moves quickly to move him out, while accommodating a great team guy.

Decides, rightly or wrongly, Lack is a career back up, a good one, but that Markstrom has more upside. An assessment by the way that is historicall between these two. At every level Markstrom has always been rated ahead of Lack. Benning makes a business decision that trading a soon to be UFA for a soon to be FA is the smarter move.

By all accounts he had been trying to trade Kassian pretty much from last Christmas until he finally succeeded in July. We may never know the whole story but Benning made his assent then acted as soon as he could. He wanted to free up a RW spot and he did. He wanted to add another character guy and he did.

My point in all this long winded recap is that right or wrong, Benning has a plan and is following it. He has traded, in 12 months, three players with NTC. One who demanded it but two who most felt would never waive. he has talked with agents for Hamhuis, Vrbata, Higgins and Burrows. You know he has broached the subject of NTC. I would venture that not one of those players, will at this point, refuse to waive should they be asked. Of course they will use their NTC to control where they go, as they should and in my opinion the real benefit and intent of holding a NTC. But I trust should Benning decide it is time to move any of those four he will make it happen. He has hinted as much regarding Vrbata and Hamhuis. He will move them out NOT because he is worried about the return but to clear space for younger guys he feels are ready for the NHL and to free cap for 2016. In that respect I think Hamhuis is the easiest one to keep for a couple of more years as our defensive prospect pool is very thin.

But we could over the course of the next year or year and a half move out Vrbata, Higgins and Burrows as we see how our prospects develop. We have the potential depth to replace this three within that time frame.

I think most will agree his drafting has been excellent.

I think most will agree he has done a solid job of building Utica and creating a winning culture there.he has coaches who give a shit and actually spend time with the prospects and watch their development, unlike the Torts culture.

Some of his signings are cause for major debate. Dorsett a tad too much and one year too long, but no NTC. Sbisa 500,000-600,000 above his qualifying offer and perhaps a year too long but he bought two years of FA, no NTC for a team dearth of defensive prospects ready to take the next step. He brought in Bartkowski, one year. Brought back Weber one year. Signed Corrado and Clendening one year. Resigned Vey one year. Resigned Kenins on a two way. A pattern here. A whole whack of show me contracts for players who may end up being place holders or who may earn longer deals. And there is Miller. The one that seems to cause the most emotion second to Sbisa of course. But let's face it. He wanted a goalie he perceives to be a proven number one to stabilize the team and mentor Markstrom and then perhaps Demko. And if people are honest they will say that prior to his knee injury Miller delivered. Sure he had a few blow out games and that sucked but overall, he delivered. He gave us a chance to win most nights, in front of a horrible defence for the most part.

I like that Benning is owning it. I like that he was pissed with our playoff showing and made changes. I may have liked that he did some things a little different, like getting a pick for Matthias at the TDD, but overall I like that he has a plan and is willing to take the heat for sticking with it. It would be far to easy to give into the pressure and change mid stream but he seems to be sticking with it. Had he been successful in trading for Lucic I would have been very confused because to me that does not fit the long term plan. And I know if LA does not resign him then we will be big suitors next July. I think part of Benning's plan now is to free the cap to be in a position to target him and if available Seabrook. But that's a year away.

Ok I'm done.
So works for me

bckev
CC Veteran
Posts: 190
Joined: Mon Jul 29, 2013 9:53 am

Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by bckev » Fri Jul 10, 2015 11:25 am

Well put HW. I really like Lack, and have since I first saw him in Penticton, but I agree I do not think he is a starter. I think Benning made the right move, even though I would love to have moved Millers 6 million dollar cap hit. I believe it is important to build in a winning tradition. I know everyone thinks Edmonton is going to be great guns this year but it is a big shift from being a loser to a winner. I don't think LA will bounce back as much as everyone thinks. There is so much that goes into creating a team. I think Benning and Linden understand that. I think the team this year will be better than we think. If we aren't I am okay with that too, because I think it will be only for a year. We were the 8th best team in the regular season last year. We play in the toughest division. People forget this so quickly, it is not fluke that we did that well. We will probably drop off a bit, nothing is going to surprise me. I won't be surprised if we get a lottery pick, and I won't be surprised if we make a long playoff run. The only thing that would surprise me is if Benning changes his tactics and blows it up all at once. I see him being a seller at trade deadline, even if we are in the running. I think we will see a lot more young guys getting looks during the year, to get a taste of playing in the bigs, as part of their development. It is going to be a fun season for a lot of different reasons. I don't want to wish my life away but I am having a hard time waiting.

Groovypippin
CC Veteran
Posts: 115
Joined: Fri Sep 16, 2011 3:26 pm

Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by Groovypippin » Fri Jul 10, 2015 11:32 am

Hockey Widow wrote:
Ok I'm done.
Great summation. I have no problem with anyone who argues against the Benning plan, but anyone who argues there is no plan is uninformed and not paying attention.

I have faith and confidence in Benning. I see what kind of team he is trying to build. I like that he understands the NHL - and particularly the West - requires a mix of skill and sandpaper. I like that he is trying build a real "team" of high quality, high character individuals. It's going to be tough going for a couple of seasons from a wins/losses perspective, but I like the groundwork being laid.

User avatar
Meds
CC Legend
Posts: 5837
Joined: Mon Jul 11, 2011 8:50 pm

Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by Meds » Fri Jul 10, 2015 11:53 am

Groovypippin wrote:
Hockey Widow wrote:
Ok I'm done.
Great summation. I have no problem with anyone who argues against the Benning plan, but anyone who argues there is no plan is uninformed and not paying attention.
The only one that was odd was the Kassian trade.....up until you hear his rationale after the fact. Then you see a bit of the why, and where the move fits in his plan, and it's not terrible. I think Bergevin would have made that trade straight up but he probably had an inkling that Benning had a hard-on for Prust and so he squeezed and a 5th popped out of Jimbo's pocket.

User avatar
RoyalDude
CC Legend
Posts: 11355
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2004 6:36 pm
Location: Vancouver

Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by RoyalDude » Fri Jul 10, 2015 12:19 pm

All I know is looking forward to seeing some of the promising prospects push for spots next year with Prust and Dorsett saying don't fuck with the kids. Think the Nucks will have a decent year but the work ethic will make it fun to watch along with the new kids but I am quietly hoping for a Tank it for Matthews, Puliarvi or Chychrun

They compare Matthews to Messier/Marleau, Puliarvi to Selanne/Nash and they say Chychrun is better than Ekblad




,
"I just want to say one word to you. Just one word. Are you listening? - Plastics." - The Graduate

User avatar
dangler
CC 1st Team All-Star
Posts: 958
Joined: Wed Aug 11, 2004 5:31 pm
Location: Commercial Drive Coffee shop

Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by dangler » Fri Jul 10, 2015 12:51 pm

Hockey Widow wrote: Had he been successful in trading for Lucic I would have been very confused because to me that does not fit the long term plan. And I know if LA does not resign him then we will be big suitors next July. I think part of Benning's plan now is to free the cap to be in a position to target him and if available Seabrook. But that's a year away.

Ok I'm done.
Agreed,Benning has done a great job for the most part. We'll have to see in a couple of years how his draft picks pan out,but he get's problems dealt with in a timely manner and i really liked the way he didn't sugarcoat the playoff loss.
Wasn't a big fan of the Miller signing but shortly into the season it became apparent it was a necessity.
Really hope he forgets about Lucic,don't want to see him wearing a Canuck jersey.
Retool Rebuild

User avatar
Hockey Widow
CC Legend
Posts: 12774
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2011 8:52 pm

Re: Canucks News and Notes

Post by Hockey Widow » Fri Jul 10, 2015 1:05 pm

So Linden last night said that they offered Chris Higgins to everyone and no one was willing to take him because of his contract. First, why would Linden say this? Poor Higgins having to come back knowing no one wants you. Second, I think he becomes more moveable with another year burnt off his contract or at the latest TDD 2017 when he is on an expiring contract. But the return will be putrid.

Glad to learn though that they are done sniffing the glue and are looking to move him out. We just have to wait. I guess if it gets bad enough we can waive him.
The only HW the Canucks need

Locked