What is Higgins Worth?

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Re: What is Higgins Worth?

Postby dbr » Wed Sep 26, 2012 1:09 pm

I prefer Lapierre on the 4th but if he takes another step (or rather if he can consistently play like he has in the past) I'd be fine with him centering the third line and being paid an appropriate amount for the job. I don't think it's too likely that it happens but he does have the potential.

As for Higgins I'm indifferent as to whether he plays on the second or third line - really it depends mostly on who else is on those lines and how they are deployed. I think he'd be a good option to do the spade work for Ryan Kesler and another winger (those two did pretty well with David Booth for much of the season) and he's got the work ethic and all-around ability to line up with some less experienced players and help make sure they are able to at least tread water when things go awry. He's also of course good enough to take on a more defensive assignment and still have the ability to score opportunistic goals.

Really the only assignment I don't like for Higgins is in the top six when he's not the least skilled player on his line - and the only chance that happens is if the Canucks suffer a string of injuries.. or if they overpay players like Higgins, Raymond, Malhotra and Lapierre and their depth suffers as a result.
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Re: What is Higgins Worth?

Postby FAN » Thu Sep 27, 2012 12:44 pm

dbr wrote:Really the only assignment I don't like for Higgins is in the top six when he's not the least skilled player on his line - and the only chance that happens is if the Canucks suffer a string of injuries.. or if they overpay players like Higgins, Raymond, Malhotra and Lapierre and their depth suffers as a result.

I have to disagree with this. To me, Higgins is a very skilled player whose production hasn't reflected his skill level the past few years. There's a reason he was a mid first-round pick and had three consecutive 20+ goal seasons to start his career. In terms of overall skill, I think Higgins is better than Booth and even Raymond.
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Re: What is Higgins Worth?

Postby dbr » Thu Sep 27, 2012 2:55 pm

FAN wrote:
dbr wrote:Really the only assignment I don't like for Higgins is in the top six when he's not the least skilled player on his line - and the only chance that happens is if the Canucks suffer a string of injuries.. or if they overpay players like Higgins, Raymond, Malhotra and Lapierre and their depth suffers as a result.

I have to disagree with this. To me, Higgins is a very skilled player whose production hasn't reflected his skill level the past few years. There's a reason he was a mid first-round pick and had three consecutive 20+ goal seasons to start his career. In terms of overall skill, I think Higgins is better than Booth and even Raymond.


Well in the interest of finding common ground I suppose I could more accurately phrase that thought as "the only assignment I don't like for Higgins is in the top six when he's not expected to be the least prolific scorer on his line" - whatever his skill level is he's a few years away from his last 20+ goal season and given his usage I think cracking that number would be a nice bonus for the team (but not something anyone should be expecting).

It is a number I expect from pretty much anyone else in the top six (except Henrik), and starting a season where Chris Higgins is your fourth-best goalscorer (as opposed to fifth or even sixth, where he is now) would be a major disappointment.
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Re: What is Higgins Worth?

Postby Tciso » Thu Sep 27, 2012 6:44 pm

Man, I think that this group is under-rating Higgins' value. He was in the top 150 for scoring last season, and is pretty much at that mark every season, barring injuries. The league is paying pretty damned good money for 40+ point guys, especially if they are doing it mainly at even strength. His career numbers are on par with Burrows, and he hasn't played 5 seasons with the twins. I just see him asking for $3.5mil, and I can almost guarantee that he'll get it (or a pro-rated version if salaries plummet in the next cba), if not $4 mil.
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Re: What is Higgins Worth?

Postby Blob Mckenzie » Thu Sep 27, 2012 6:55 pm

Tciso wrote:Man, I think that this group is under-rating Higgins' value. He was in the top 150 for scoring last season, and is pretty much at that mark every season, barring injuries. The league is paying pretty damned good money for 40+ point guys, especially if they are doing it mainly at even strength. His career numbers are on par with Burrows, and he hasn't played 5 seasons with the twins. I just see him asking for $3.5mil, and I can almost guarantee that he'll get it (or a pro-rated version if salaries plummet in the next cba), if not $4 mil.


You make some decent points but look at the salaries moving forward.

Sedin 6.1
Sedin 6.1
Burrows 4.5
Kesler 5
Booth 4.25
Garrison 4.6
Hamhuis 4.6
Bieksa 4.6
Schneider 4
Edler ?? 5.75
Ballard 4.2

These guys alone will make around 55 million and you need 12 other players. Who knows who comes back in a Luongo deal. I can't see the cap ceiling at 70 million. I'm thinking 62 - 66 at best and i don't think a rollback is in the cards either.
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Re: What is Higgins Worth?

Postby Tciso » Thu Sep 27, 2012 7:11 pm

Blob Mckenzie wrote:
Tciso wrote:Man, I think that this group is under-rating Higgins' value. He was in the top 150 for scoring last season, and is pretty much at that mark every season, barring injuries. The league is paying pretty damned good money for 40+ point guys, especially if they are doing it mainly at even strength. His career numbers are on par with Burrows, and he hasn't played 5 seasons with the twins. I just see him asking for $3.5mil, and I can almost guarantee that he'll get it (or a pro-rated version if salaries plummet in the next cba), if not $4 mil.


You make some decent points but look at the salaries moving forward.

Sedin 6.1
Sedin 6.1
Burrows 4.5
Kesler 5
Booth 4.25
Garrison 4.6
Hamhuis 4.6
Bieksa 4.6
Schneider 4
Edler ?? 5.75
Ballard 4.2

These guys alone will make around 55 million and you need 12 other players. Who knows who comes back in a Luongo deal. I can't see the cap ceiling at 70 million. I'm thinking 62 - 66 at best and i don't think a rollback is in the cards either.


Yeah, it makes the Ballard n Booth contracts stand out, unless they can both step up this season, or they get traded.
They are OK for 2012/13, but could be a problem for the last 2 years for both. Still, Higgins is worth as much as Booth, and more than Ballard. Booth should be making $3.5, and Ballard is playing like $2mil in our system.
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Re: What is Higgins Worth?

Postby RoyalDude » Thu Sep 27, 2012 7:41 pm

But Chef Boi RD is a very, very bad man for not liking Booths and Ballards contracts. But seriously people, we need to stay focused on Mason Raymonds measly 2 million dollars.
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Re: What is Higgins Worth?

Postby Tciso » Thu Sep 27, 2012 8:44 pm

RoyalDude wrote:But Chef Boi RD is a very, very bad man for not liking Booths and Ballards contracts. But seriously people, we need to stay focused on Mason Raymonds measly 2 million dollars.


WTF does Mayray's contract that expires at the end of this season have to do with Higgins extension? Unless you wanna give MayRay a 2 or 3 year extension ????? $2 million buys a lot of koolaid
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Re: What is Higgins Worth?

Postby Blob Mckenzie » Thu Sep 27, 2012 9:12 pm

Tciso wrote:
RoyalDude wrote:But Chef Boi RD is a very, very bad man for not liking Booths and Ballards contracts. But seriously people, we need to stay focused on Mason Raymonds measly 2 million dollars.


WTF does Mayray's contract that expires at the end of this season have to do with Higgins extension? Unless you wanna give MayRay a 2 or 3 year extension ????? $2 million buys a lot of koolaid


What's the over/under on how many threads the dude has torched blabbering about Mason Raymond or David Booth ?

I'm sure there will be an anti Gillis rant in this thread within the hour.
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Re: What is Higgins Worth?

Postby RoyalDude » Thu Sep 27, 2012 9:32 pm

Tciso wrote:
RoyalDude wrote:But Chef Boi RD is a very, very bad man for not liking Booths and Ballards contracts. But seriously people, we need to stay focused on Mason Raymonds measly 2 million dollars.


WTF does Mayray's contract that expires at the end of this season have to do with Higgins extension? Unless you wanna give MayRay a 2 or 3 year extension ????? $2 million buys a lot of koolaid


We just like to pick on the less expensive players here instead of the overpaid bums, I guess that is Boi RD's point, Crisco. Capiche?
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Re: What is Higgins Worth?

Postby RoyalDude » Thu Sep 27, 2012 9:33 pm

Blob Mckenzie wrote:
Tciso wrote:
RoyalDude wrote:But Chef Boi RD is a very, very bad man for not liking Booths and Ballards contracts. But seriously people, we need to stay focused on Mason Raymonds measly 2 million dollars.


WTF does Mayray's contract that expires at the end of this season have to do with Higgins extension? Unless you wanna give MayRay a 2 or 3 year extension ????? $2 million buys a lot of koolaid


What's the over/under on how many threads the dude has torched blabbering about Mason Raymond or David Booth ?

I'm sure there will be an anti Gillis rant in this thread within the hour.


Blobby Beer Bellies, why do you love Gillis so much?
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Re: What is Higgins Worth?

Postby Madcombinepilot » Fri Sep 28, 2012 4:09 pm

Typical RD Misdirection and innuendo about his own intelligence.

So, Dudette,

instead of hijacking a thread to amuse yourself, why dont you answer the question?

Whats Higgins worth?
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Re: What is Higgins Worth?

Postby rockalt » Fri Sep 28, 2012 4:18 pm

Been ages since I posted regularly but I just had to chime in on Higgins as he surprisingly doesn't get much love among Canucks fans.

It's good to see that there are some fellow fans on these boards who fans of his game, but I was surprised by my recent trip to Vancouver to see how many people complain about him. Frankly I consider him one of the most valuable players on the team when you consider bang for buck. The guy put up 18 goals and 43 points in 71 games essentially playing 3rd line minutes all season long with occasional stints up on the AMEX line. I thought he was very effective in his callups to the second line but clearly AV prefers him on the third line. In any case, he never looked out of place on either line and given a regular second line spot, I think he's a lock to score between 20 to 25 goals. That may not be elite but it's not half-bad either. Further, his excellent forechecking has served each line he has played on well. He's defensively quite sound as well. I basically view him as everything MayRay and Booth should be. I have more confidence in Booth's goal scoring ability but overall I think Higgins is the best of the 3. My only surprise with his play, is how ineffective he was in the playoffs this year. I'm willing to give him a pass however considering how unimpressive the bulk of the team was as well as the fact that he played quite well in the playoffs the year before ('til he broke his foot).

Also I agree with the supporters of Lapierre. He's an excellent 4th liner. For me, he's the 4th line centre the team had coveted for so many years. The only problem is this team no longer has a 3rd line centre. Is Lapierre a good fit for the 3rd line? I think he could fit in that role but I'm not convinced he's offensively gifted enough to handle full line duties. Personally I love the agitator role he plays. For years we complained that this team needed a little more piss and vinegar. This guy may not be a heavyweight but he's not exactly a little puke either. You've got to admire how he's handled himself as a Canuck. Yes he's still a shit disturber but he also plays a disciplined game and even dedicated last offseason learning how to fight.

In conclusion, these two are my preferred bottom 6 players. If I were to make changes to the bottom 6, these are the two players I'd ensure stay.
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Re: What is Higgins Worth?

Postby RoyalDude » Fri Sep 28, 2012 8:02 pm

Higgins is the best thing since slice bread, Rats. I don't how it is humanly possible to numbers to that.
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Re: What is Higgins Worth?

Postby Fred » Sat Sep 29, 2012 7:33 am

Rockalt I have to say Lapierre and Higgins are a coaches dream come true, consistent. Game after game they play the same consistent quality. The coaches knows what to expect every shift
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