BRIAN BURKE'S TORONTO MAPLE LEAFS

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BRIAN BURKE'S TORONTO MAPLE LEAFS

Postby DavidPratt_ » Sat Mar 03, 2012 9:57 pm

PT BARNUM ONCE SAID, "THERE'S A SUCKER BORN EVERY MINUTE". THAT STATEMENT IS OFTEN TRUE. UNFORTUNATELY FOR TORONTO MAPLE LEAFS FANS AND OWNERSHIP, THEY WERE THE SUCKERS AND BRIAN BURKE WAS THE CON MAN WHO CONVINCED THEM HE KNEW HOW TO BUILD A STANLEY CUP WINNER.

INTO HIS FOURTH SEASON AS GM OF THE TORONTO MAPLE LEAFS, THE LEAFS ARE ON THE PATH TO MISSING THE PLAYOFFS. AGAIN.

AS KEVIN LOWE OF THE EDMONTON OILERS ONCE SAID OF BRIAN BURKE IN 2008, ""HE'S A MORON, FIRST OF ALL...HERE'S A FACT - HE LEFT DAVE NONIS NOTHING IN VANCOUVER. NOTHING. HE DESTROYED THAT TEAM....I MEAN, THAT'S HIS M.O, BUT NO ONE SAYS ANYTHING. HE GOES INTO ANAHEIM AND HE INHERITS AN INCREDIBLE TEAM. HE GETS CHRIS PRONGER.....KUDOS TO HIM. ...I'LL TELL YOU THIS, THEY HAVE NOT MUCH COMING.... AND THAT APPEARS TO BE HIS M.O"

ANYONE LOOKED AT THE DEPTH THAT BRIAN LEFT BEHIND WHEN HE LEFT ANAHEIM TO BECOME GM OF THE TORONTO MAPLE LEAFS IN NOVEMBER, 2008?

HISTORY LESSON KIDS, BUT IN 2012 WHERE ARE THE LEAFS?

OUT OF A PLAYOFF SPOT.

BRIAN'S CRONY RON WILSON JUST GOT FIRED.

TWO FIRST ROUND DRAFT PICKS TRADED FOR THE 'MOST EASILY INTIMIDATED' PLAYER AS POLLED BY NHL PLAYERS IN A RECENT SPORTS ILLUSTRATED ISSUE, PHIL KESSEL.

ONE OF THOSE FIRST ROUNDERS TURNED OUT TO BE TYLER SEGUIN. THINK BRIAN WOULD DO THAT DEAL AGAIN?

DION PHANEUF WAS CHOSEN AS THE 'MOST OVERRATED PLAYER' IN THE SAME POLL.

BOTH PHANEUF AND KESSEL ARE THE TWO 'BUILDING BLOCKS' IN BRIAN'S REBUILDING PLAN. HOW HAS THAT TURNED OUT?

RON WILSON GOT FIRED A FEW DAYS AGO. LOOKING AT THE LEAFS LINEUP AFTER THREE AND A HALF YEARS OF BRIAN BURKE, MAYBE, JUST MAYBE THE CON MAN'S M.O. WILL BE EXPOSED FOR WHAT HE IS.

UNLESS OF COURSE, THERE IS A SUCKER BORN EVERY MINUTE, AND PEOPLE IN TORONTO STILL BELIEVE THAT BRIAN'S 'PLAN' WILL BRING A STANLEY CUP DOWN YONGE STREET.


PRATT OUT.
Last edited by DavidPratt_ on Sat Mar 03, 2012 11:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: BRIAN BURKE'S TORONTO MAPLE LEAFS

Postby mathonwy » Sat Mar 03, 2012 10:08 pm

Maaan.. this is a hard post to read.

Ron Wilson wasn't BB's crony. He was hired by Cliff Fletcher. Burke just extended him when the Laughs were still in the playoff race.

Yeah, bad trade for Kessel but without Kessel, you think the Laughs would even be contending for a playoff spot? Nope.

You forgot to mention Burke's acquisition of Lupul AND Gardiner for Beauchemin. How did that trade go? Pretty damn good.

Oh yeah, and Burke's absolutely robbery of Calgary for Phaneuf and Aulie (who's turned into Carter Ashton).

Take off your shit coloured glasses fatty. All in all, Burke's done a pretty good job with the Laughs.
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Re: BRIAN BURKE'S TORONTO MAPLE LEAFS

Postby DavidPratt_ » Sat Mar 03, 2012 10:55 pm

GUESS YOU ARE ONE OF THE SUCKERS.

SURE, SOME OK TRADES. HOW MANY PLAYOFF ROUNDS HAVE THE LEAFS WON SINCE BRIAN BURKE TOOK OVER IN 2008?

ZERO, MORON.

AND IF YOU ACTUALLY THINK THAT BRIAN BURKE DIDN'T WHISPER INTO CLIFF FLETCHER'S EAR (WHILE BRIAN WAS GM IN ANAHEIM NO LESS) TO HIRE HIS OLD COLLEGE BUDDY FROM PROVIDENCE, WHILE BURKE PLANNED ON MOVING TO TORONTO MONTHS LATER, I HAVE A BRIDGE IN VANCOUVER, I CAN SELL YOU REAL CHEAP.

'NUFF SAID.

DP
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Re: BRIAN BURKE'S TORONTO MAPLE LEAFS

Postby mathonwy » Sat Mar 03, 2012 11:10 pm

Hahahah.

One of the suckers that think Burke isn't as bad as you make him out to be?

Just because you and Burke had a spat while he was GM of Nucks and he petitioned to kick you off the air doesn't make him a bad GM (provided you are the real David "Big Daddy" Pratt).

So you are using the fact that the laughs haven't made the playoffs as a rebuttal to my pointing out that aside from Kessel trade, he's done pretty good? That's just a weak argument man. Come with something a bit stronger next time.

There's absolutely no doubting the fact that Kessel and Lupul are the main reasons why the Laughs are contending for a spot. So, as both Kessel and Lupul are products of Burke's trade decisions, one must conclude that Burke has been an ok GM.

Aside from maybe firing Wilson earlier, I'm not sure sure what you expected Burke to do.
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Re: BRIAN BURKE'S TORONTO MAPLE LEAFS

Postby DavidPratt_ » Sat Mar 03, 2012 11:25 pm

AFTER NEARLY FOUR SEASONS AS GM OF THE LEAFS, DON'T YOU THINK A 'GENIUS' LIKE BRIAN BURKE WOULD HAVE THAT TEAM IN THE PLAYOFFS?

DID THE LEAF PLAYERS TUNE RON WILSON OUT? SURE THEY DID.

HOW MUCH REAL COMPETITIVE TALENT DO THE LEAFS HAVE? ENOUGH TO MAKE THE PLAYOFFS? ENOUGH TO WIN A CUP?

WHY HAVEN'T THE LEAFS DONE ENOUGH TO BRING IN A QUALITY GOALIE IF BOTH REIMER AND GUSTAVSSON HAVEN'T CUT IT?

REMINDS ME OF BURKE WHEN HE WAS GM OF THE CANUCKS.

NASLUND, BERTUZZI, JOVANOVSKI, MORRISON.....AND THEN THERE WAS DAN CLOUTIER.

WHAT DID BURKE DO TO REALLY BRING IN A TOP-FLIGHT GOALIE IN A NON-CAP ERA WHEN CLOUTIER CHOKED EVERY PLAYOFF SERIES?

BRIAN GOT LUCKY IN ANAHEIM. NEARLY THE ENTIRE CORE OF THAT TEAM THAT WON THE CUP IN 2007 WAS ASSEMBLED BY BRIAN MURRAY AND HIS STAFF. BRIAN ADDED A FEW KEY PLAYERS LIKE PRONGER AND NIEDERMAYER SO GOOD ON HIM FOR ADDING THE FINAL PIECES. LET'S NOT FORGET HE ALREADY HAD JS GIGUERE, SO HIS INEPTITUDE IN BRINGING IN QUALITY GOALIES INTO TEAMS HE HAS MANAGED WAS ALREADY SOLVED BEFORE HE SHOWED UP.

AS KEVIN LOWE SAID ABOUT BURKE: "MAC T SAID IT BEST - HE'S LIKE THE WIZARD OF OZ, YOU PULL THE CURTAINS AWAY AND THERE'S NOT MUCH SUBSTANCE."

WHAT'S EVEN MORE TELLING ABOUT BRIAN BURKE IS HIS PHILOSOPHY ON HIRING COACHES THAT FIT IN WITH HIS BELIEFS.

AS BRIAN SAID TODAY DURING A PRESS CONFERENCE WITH RANDY CARLYLE AT HIS SIDE "I DON'T LIKE COACHES WHO ARE WARM AND FUZZY, THE GAME SHOULDN'T BE FUN...THE COACHES CAN'T COME DOWN AND SAY YOU HAD A GREAT SHIFT. MOST OF THE FEEDBACK YOU GET FROM A COACH IN THE CONTEST IS NEGATIVE, AND I DON'T WANT IT ANOTHER WAY."

GEE, BRIAN - SOUNDS LIKE YOUR COACHING PHILOSOPHY FITS IN WITH THE YOUNG GENERATION OF PLAYERS WHO EXPECT TO BE COACHED DIFFERENTLY THAN 20 YEARS AGO. THIS IS THE GUY WHO FIRED MIKE BABCOCK AND DOESN'T UNDERSTAND THAT COACHES LIKE DAN BYLSMA ARE PART OF THE NEW GENERATION OF COACHES WHO UNDERSTAND HOW TO COACH IN 2012 AND BEYOND AND GET RESULTS.

WHY WOULD A FREE AGENT WANT TO COME TO TORONTO WITH THIS PHILOSOPHY?

SORRY, NEVER GOT ALONG WITH BRIAN, BUT THE FACTS ARE THE FACTS.

DP
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Re: BRIAN BURKE'S TORONTO MAPLE LEAFS

Postby CorranHorn » Sun Mar 04, 2012 1:20 am

Pretty hard to win an argument when you can't just cut he guy off huh Dave?
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Re: BRIAN BURKE'S TORONTO MAPLE LEAFS

Postby porp » Sun Mar 04, 2012 10:07 am

How old is your computing equipment? Modern computers have both upper- and lower- case alphanumerics and modern network transmission protocols can even tell the two apart now!
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Re: BRIAN BURKE'S TORONTO MAPLE LEAFS

Postby dbr » Sun Mar 04, 2012 10:12 am

Hey mathonwy, are the Leafs "the real deal" yet? :twisted:
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Re: BRIAN BURKE'S TORONTO MAPLE LEAFS

Postby Groovypippin » Sun Mar 04, 2012 10:19 am

I can't really disagree with anything that Mr. Pratt has raised here. Burke is a swing for the fences type of GM and all home run hitters strike out a lot as well. So his record is very hit and miss. At the end of the day writing a "Leafs aren't very good" story is about as challenging as writing a "cancer isn't a lot of fun" story. Why bother, right?
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Re: BRIAN BURKE'S TORONTO MAPLE LEAFS

Postby mathonwy » Sun Mar 04, 2012 10:47 am

dbr wrote:Hey mathonwy, are the Leafs "the real deal" yet? :twisted:

:D

I think they're close. They're definitely closer than the Coil that's for sure.

All of the TV talking heads also seem to think so as well. I don't watch enough Laughs to be able to tell you any more than that but I think they got all of the components.

They have a good complement of forwards and defense and if they were able to snag Ginger from us at the trade deadline, I think Burke could have completed that team (or at least have gotten a lot closer). Schenn and Monster for Ginger? Yeah, I would do that. Or Gardiner, Aulie and Monster for Ginger and Sulzer. I'd do that as well.

My dislike of that team is more about the center-of-the-universe mentality created by the media than about the actual team itself. Having the Laughs in the playoffs is good for hockey in general IMO.
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Re: BRIAN BURKE'S TORONTO MAPLE LEAFS

Postby dhabums » Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:11 am

mathonwy wrote:Schenn and Monster for Ginger? Yeah, I would do that. Or Gardiner, Aulie and Monster for Ginger and Sulzer.


You are fired.
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Re: BRIAN BURKE'S TORONTO MAPLE LEAFS

Postby mathonwy » Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:31 am

dhabums wrote:
mathonwy wrote:Schenn and Monster for Ginger? Yeah, I would do that. Or Gardiner, Aulie and Monster for Ginger and Sulzer.


You are fired.

Fuck....
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Re: BRIAN BURKE'S TORONTO MAPLE LEAFS

Postby DavidPratt_ » Sun Mar 04, 2012 12:06 pm

Groovypippin wrote:I can't really disagree with anything that Mr. Pratt has raised here. Burke is a swing for the fences type of GM and all home run hitters strike out a lot as well. So his record is very hit and miss. At the end of the day writing a "Leafs aren't very good" story is about as challenging as writing a "cancer isn't a lot of fun" story. Why bother, right?


THIS ISN'T AS MUCH A 'LEAFS AREN'T VERY GOOD' STORY AS A 'BRIAN BURKE IS A SHAM' STORY. WHEN HE WON THAT STANLEY CUP IN ANAHEIM, EVERYONE HAILED HIM AS A GENIUS. YES, HE DID THE RIGHT THINGS TO GET THE DUCKS OVER THE HUMP TO WIN THE CUP, BUT HE INHERITED SOME TALENT AS WELL. BRIAN DID SOME GOOD THINGS IN VANCOUVER TOO. HE DID DRAFT THE SEDINS AND KESLER. HE ALSO INHERITED SOME GOOD PLAYERS - NAMELY TODD BERTUZZI AND MARKUS NASLUND. WHAT HE DIDN'T DO IN VANCOUVER WAS EVER GET THE CANUCKS INTO THE FINAL FOUR BECAUSE HIS EGO AND STUBBORNESS GOT IN THE WAY. BRIAN ALSO FAILS TO REALIZE THAT PLAYERS HAVE CHANGED AND COACHING THEM HAS AS WELL.

READ WHAT I QUOTED BRIAN BURKE ABOVE REGARDING THE KIND OF COACHES HE LIKES. THERE'S A REASON A TEAM WITH GUYS LIKE PERRY AND GETZLAF TUNED OUT RANDY CARLYLE. KIND OF LIKE WHY MANY OF THE LEAFS TUNED OUT RON WILSON. THE LEAFS WON'T MAKE THE PLAYOFFS THIS SEASON, AND THEY'LL HAVE A HARD TIME ATTRACTING FREE AGENTS OR RETAINING PLAYERS WHO WANT TO STAY. WHY WOULD ANYONE WANT TO STAY WITH THAT TEAM WITH THAT KIND OF MANAGEMENT AND COACHING PHILOSOPHY.

GM'S AND COACHES LIKE KENNY HOLLAND AND MIKE BABCOCK, RAY SHERO AND DAN BYLSMA, AND YES, MIKE GILLIS AND ALAIN VIGNEAULT KNOW WHEN TO PUT THE HEAT ON THE PLAYER AND WHEN TO GIVE A PAT ON THE BACK. BURKE AND CARLYLE IS DOOMED TO FAIL.

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Re: BRIAN BURKE'S TORONTO MAPLE LEAFS

Postby mathonwy » Sun Mar 04, 2012 1:01 pm

You still haven't shown me why Brian Burke is a sham.

He's an attention whore, he's an ego maniac and he's offends the shit out of the media but these things don't make him a sham.

Your post just seems like the continuation of a hate crusade you got for Burke instead of an objective analysis.

Anaheim - You're discrediting Burke for winning the Stanley Cup because he inherited a good team and you imply that anyone could have won it with Anaheim's roster at that point of time but Burke was in the right place right time and "lucked" into some good trades. Come on man. If it was that easy, everyone would be winning a SC.

Vancouver - You're discrediting Burke for not going out and getting a goaltender. I can't really comment on this one as I can't remember what options were available to us at that point of time. Cloutier was bad in the playoffs but he did win 30+ games for us in three consecutive season. Do we blame "we choked" on Brian Burke as well?

Toronto - You're discrediting Burke for not being in touch with how the modern player should be coached. Up until 7 or 8 games ago, Toronto was in a playoff position and had been in there for the majority of the season. Then the goaltenders forgot how to goaltend and it was a downward spiral after that.

You're quoting Kevin Lowe to support your argument because we all know Lowe is the most objective and unbiased fan of Burke... :crazy: Are you going to quote Don Cherry next time?

Coaching philosophy.. Yes. Bylsma is part of the new generation of coaches that seems to be enjoying quite a lot of success. There's Bylsma and there's Arniel and Payne. Arniel and Payne are both part of the younger generation of coaches that couldn't get it done and were subsequently fired and replaced with arguably older generation guys. Hitch is old school and Richards is just a temp.

Re: Firing Mike Babcock. This isn't the first time you've said this.

http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1 ... 34,1125831

There's quite a big difference between firing and not extending. Geezes man.

Sooooo.... Brian Burke is a sham. Blah blah blah. You're like the Wizard of Oz. One pulls away the curtains and there's not much substance.
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Re: BRIAN BURKE'S TORONTO MAPLE LEAFS

Postby ESQ » Sun Mar 04, 2012 2:14 pm

mathonwy wrote:You still haven't shown me why Brian Burke is a sham.


I think he's a sham because he has not improved his team at all in 4 years. If you look at teams with a similarly-pathetic record since the lockout, only Burke's Leafs have been near the salary cap ceiling, the others (Atlanta, Florida, Columbus) have stayed near the floor.

Then he makes the Kessel trade, not for the future, but to win now. Instead of getting them to the playoffs, the Kessel Leafs tank and give a lottery pick to Boston - meaning Burke can't even lose properly.

He's tried to develop a "Burke Hockey" identity of truculence and size, but has failed to get any results from this model. He's confused his so-called identity with the gift-wrapped championship team he inherited in Anaheim, where size and truculence came from some of the best players in the game - Pronger, Perry, and Getzlaf. He's also failed to learn that Anaheim's success was due to drafting and developing.

He complained that the Leafs prospects cupboard was bare, and he's done nothing to improve the situation.
mathonwy wrote:Up until 7 or 8 games ago, Toronto was in a playoff position and had been in there for the majority of the season.

This is Burke's main failing - he chooses to evaluate his team based on their play during a hot streak. Really, everybody else can see that even though the Leafs always play well in the mean-nothing games at the end of the season have only finished at the bottom of the East once, they're not close to a playoff team. I've said from the beginning of the season, if the Leafs are in the playoff picture because Phil Kessel is on a 2 ppg pace, its not going to last and he can't cover up the team's weaknesses over an entire season. I don't think its accurate to say they were "in a playoff position" for the majority of the season until 7 or 8 games ago, they've been hanging around 10-7th place for months.
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