From Bountiful to Ponoka

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Re: From Bountiful to Ponoka

Postby Potatoe1 » Tue Nov 22, 2011 8:53 pm

BCExpat wrote:
Potatoe1 wrote:
BCExpat wrote:
Yeah - but this re-signing was Feaster's doing. Babchuk is great at playing the point on the power play, but that's about it. Lots of tough times ahead for the Flames.


I thought Babchuk was better then Phaneuf? :D


Like I said - Babchuk is good on the point for the powerplay.



My bad BC, wasn't directing that comment directly at you.

Was just pointing out that a lot of Flames fans were claiming Babchuk to be better then Phaneuf, which is obviously ridiculous.
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Re: From Bountiful to Ponoka

Postby coco_canuck » Tue Nov 22, 2011 8:59 pm

BCExpat wrote:No doubt, changes are coming. Right now, there isn't anyone in the organization that is "untouchable", including coaching and management.


I don't know what's going on in the Flames locker room and what Sutter's relationship with his players is like, but I wouldn't fire him unless the team wants to play a completely different style of game.

The Flames problems remain the same. They have a very mediocre defense and a glut of borderline 2nd liners and 3rd liners. Other than Iginla they don't have a star forward.

I don't know what the expectations were in Calgary, but they didn't look like a playoff team going into the season.

They really have no hope if they try to play an offensive style of game, and right now it looks like it's going to be quite a while before they have the talent to do so.

Fortunately, they'll have some cap space after this season, but they need to start developing some prospects. They're not a trade or free agent signing away from being a good team. I think Feaster realizes that and that's why the Regher trade was made. But he better have not lost sight of that, because a desperate trade or another bad contract will only cause more pain for a team that needs a complete overhaul.

Also, I think the Flames strong surge in the second half of last year did the team a disservice long-term. It gave fans and the players an illusion that they could be a playoff team and it kept Feaster from selling some assets at inflated prices at the deadline and starting a the re-tooling much earlier.
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Re: From Bountiful to Ponoka

Postby tantalum » Tue Nov 22, 2011 9:57 pm

Flames fans (not our resident ExPat) honestly thought that based on the "run" they had the back half of the season last year that they were going to be a playoff team. The thing they forgot to recognize is that it was awfully similar to the ISlanders run and the various Oiler runs over the last handful of years. A team counted out with no pressure on them whatsoever. Once they got close to achieving the full comeback they choked (i.e. when the pressure was back on).

They have Iginla but he is part of the problem. He is the leader on the team and every player on the team now and in the past has seen him fail to buy into any system over the last 4 years and completely ignore the defensive side of the puck. If the Flames want to move forward they need to jettison the face of the team in order to move forward. If it remains his room the same thing will happen over and over again. They have to get him out and just try ot let some kids develop.

Now the problem is that they really have few kids that are actually ready to make the jump and that will lead to a bad team. They may have cap space in the summer but they will likely not be a sought after destination among the free agents (and the free agent crop is likely to be sparse). They need to blow it up but it is going to be painful for Flames fans. It won't turn around in a season or even two.
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Re: From Bountiful to Ponoka

Postby BCExpat » Tue Nov 22, 2011 11:32 pm

Right now, the young guys are about the only thing that looks good for the Flames. Horak, Byron, Brodie and Backlund, are all looking really good. I don't think Backlund will be the superstar that many other Flames fans are hoping for, but he will shape up to be a decent player.

Last year, I was against the Flames trading away key pieces, because I thought they had a legitimate shot at making the playoffs. I figured one more kick at it with this group, wouldn't be a bad thing. Having said that, they missed a great opportunity to trade away key pieces and get a bunch of picks and prospects. In the long run, this did hurt them, as Coco noted above. By the same token, as a Flames fan, I would have been pissed off at Feaster, if he gave up on a team that looked like it was on a roll.

This season, I don't care what they do in the second half. Time is running out for getting a decent return for Iggy, Kipper, etc. Now if Feaster is smart, he won't do anything until near the trade deadline - when he will get the best bang for the buck for some of these players. What he can't move at the trade deadline, then trade away during the offseason. I except a much different lineup next season.

The thing that scares me is that Feaster has threatened that he will not have any patience with losing. I hope that doesn't mean making a move now to shore up the present team - that would be a huge mistake.
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Re: From Bountiful to Ponoka

Postby tantalum » Wed Nov 23, 2011 7:14 am

Feaster and the FLames have to decide what they are going to do. Are they going to rebuild or are they content with being a middling team that may scrape into the playoffs? Right now it seems to be the latter while I think it needs to be the former.

The next thing they have to assess is how bad the "cancer" is in the room. Sutter's comments leave very little to the imagination. He is calling it a disease. Either those diseased players become part of the cure or they will be moved. If the cancer is bad enough you want to move those players ASAP (assuming a goo return) so they no longer have an influence on the young guys and the guys that are trying to buy into the system (regardless of coach guys like Iginla and Bourque just don't buy in for significnat stretches. Same with Tanguay). The problem is that Iginla will be hard to move until closer to the deadline due to cap hit. Last year was the year to move Kiprusoff...when the Caps needed a goaltender. Right now I'm not sure I see a great market for him but one may develop if a goaltender or two goes down or some start to struggle.

Despite all that money coming off the books, Feaster is still in a tough spot. He has guys that aren't going to generate much of a return and other guys who will be somewhat hard to move. I also think he has one guy that is not tradeable right now (Bouwmeester). Given the struggles the last few years, the front office confusion etc I also don't see Calgary as a free agent destination right now. It will, in all likelihood, be a couple of tough years.

Personally I hope the Flames are close to a playoff spot a the deadline and Feaster decides to trade future for more old present.
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Re: From Bountiful to Ponoka

Postby Blob Mckenzie » Wed Nov 23, 2011 9:47 am

Bountiful really is the gift that keeps on giving.


Check out this pearl


the short bus kids are convinced Burrows and Lapierre conspired to run Winchester through the gate on Sunday.

Thanks again D'Arcy. :lol:
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Re: From Bountiful to Ponoka

Postby Rumsfeld » Wed Nov 23, 2011 9:53 am

Blob Mckenzie wrote:Bountiful really is the gift that keeps on giving.


Check out this pearl


the short bus kids are convinced Burrows and Lapierre conspired to run Winchester through the gate on Sunday.

Thanks again D'Arcy. :lol:


LOL, how diabolical. As if our team has the level of chemistry and timing required to make that happen.
Cowards die a thousand times before their deaths; the valiant never taste of death but once.
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Re: From Bountiful to Ponoka

Postby tantalum » Wed Nov 23, 2011 10:48 am

When they aren't practicing how to dive and whine they are practicing how to run guys through open doors and how to run them into the turnbuckle. Cheap, dirty cheaters don't ya know.
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Re: From Bountiful to Ponoka

Postby dhabums » Wed Nov 23, 2011 10:50 am

tantalum wrote:When they aren't practicing how to dive and whine they are practicing how to run guys through open doors and how to run them into the turnbuckle. Cheap, dirty cheaters don't ya know.


Practicing for the Boston game perhaps?
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Re: From Bountiful to Ponoka

Postby dbr » Wed Nov 23, 2011 10:59 am

Back to the rebuild talk, hasn't Feaster said publicly on a few occasions that he won't be presiding over any rebuild - or at least any Oilers style tank job?

I don't know if that's bluster (and I'm not familiar enough with Feaster to even know whether that's his style) but if it's not then we can expect him to try a rebuild more along the lines of what the Canucks have done since the lockout; the flames would be at a significant disadvantage by comparison as their cupboard is bare and they are unlikely to be a top free agent destination, but the Canucks and other teams have been able to significantly change the makeup of their teams without bottoming out and even in some cases while letting fairly significant assets walk away in unrestricted free agency (Jovanovski, Naslund and Morrison in our case).

We've had two fairly good GMs at the helm and I don't know if Feaster is going to measure up or not, but as an organization that is accustomed to winning 40+ games every year I can see why they'd be tempted to try.
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Re: From Bountiful to Ponoka

Postby tantalum » Wed Nov 23, 2011 8:46 pm

A couple of Flames took huge dives tonight. So now of course they are all mad that they have divers on the team, but what is REALLY funny is that are all pretending it's the first time a Flame has ever dove.
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Re: From Bountiful to Ponoka

Postby BCExpat » Wed Nov 23, 2011 9:14 pm

The Flames were playing well tonight, until Glencross took an extremely stupid and selfish penalty. That gave the Wings a 2 man advantage, on which they managed to score two goals to break the tie. Anyway, at this point, it's better if they keep losing so they get a shot at a lottery pick.
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Re: From Bountiful to Ponoka

Postby tantalum » Wed Nov 23, 2011 9:22 pm

BCExpat wrote:The Flames were playing well tonight, until Glencross took an extremely stupid and selfish penalty. That gave the Wings a 2 man advantage, on which they managed to score two goals to break the tie. Anyway, at this point, it's better if they keep losing so they get a shot at a lottery pick.


I've tried mentioning it several times since the Flames acquired Glencross and Bourque that while they can give you some very strong games, ultimately they are both selfish players that are going to hurt at exactly the time you can't afford it. Tonight, after being embarrassed by Columbus and having all the media coverage (Sutter says this, Jokinen agrees, others say simple cliches), needing a win, and playing well enough to maybe get the win and Glencross has a hissy fit. If it wasn't him it would have been Bourque.

Of course up until maybe the last week or so very few Flames fans would even entertain the notion.
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Re: From Bountiful to Ponoka

Postby wienerdog » Wed Nov 30, 2011 5:15 pm

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Re: From Bountiful to Ponoka

Postby BCExpat » Wed Nov 30, 2011 9:53 pm

wienerdog wrote:Giordano out on LITR.

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=381641


Well, considering I'm hoping for a lotto pick in the draft this year, I guess it's good news. :drink: :look:

I really like what I see in TJ Brodie on the Flames blue line. He's a great skater, has great vision, and is improving in leaps and bounds. Also, Butler has become a very steady D man for the Flames - nothing flashy, but gets the job done. Realistically, they will miss Gio, but I like the way some of the young guys have stepped up. BTW - the Flames have finally won two in a row - :roll:
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