Take a chance on Marleau??

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newostar
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Take a chance on Marleau??

Post by newostar » Tue Feb 12, 2008 8:35 pm

Marleau is apparently on the block for a solid d-man that can play decent minutes.

If our D get healthy enough, maybe we can look at trading a D man, grinder (cookie?) and a pick for Marleau.

I know he's had a terrible season, but sometimes a change of scenery does well and I think he will only cost less.

Buy low, sell high.......

Any thoughts?

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the toucan kid
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Post by the toucan kid » Tue Feb 12, 2008 10:12 pm

I think highly of him and would love to bring him in, but would it cost Bieksa or Edler, or would they settle for Ohlund if he waived his NTC? Anyway it isn't happening, but a nice idea.

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Post by mattola » Tue Feb 12, 2008 10:18 pm

the toucan kid wrote:I think highly of him and would love to bring him in, but would it cost Bieksa or Edler, or would they settle for Ohlund if he waived his NTC? Anyway it isn't happening, but a nice idea.
if it cost only Bieksa. I would take that chance in a heartbeat.

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Post by Badfish » Wed Feb 13, 2008 12:23 am

mattola wrote:
the toucan kid wrote:I think highly of him and would love to bring him in, but would it cost Bieksa or Edler, or would they settle for Ohlund if he waived his NTC? Anyway it isn't happening, but a nice idea.
if it cost only Bieksa. I would take that chance in a heartbeat.
Blasphemy! Our newly signed young, tough dman for a C who's on the decline? Sure we need scoring but I don't think PM's the answer. Also, I still don't see us trading Bieksa after we just signed him to a new contract. This is a guy we want to hold on to methinks ;)

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Post by Jovorock » Wed Feb 13, 2008 6:15 am

Marleau is very talented but if we want goal scoring we have to trade one of our defense men. It's the only asset we have either than Schneider.
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Post by Bartman » Wed Feb 13, 2008 9:06 am

I'm a big Bieksa fan but you've got to give to get. With many teams being set in goalie prospects who else besides one of our young D can we move?

Now PM is probably not THE answer but moving Bieksa or Edler or even Kessler might be what Nonis has to do.
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Post by Fred » Wed Feb 13, 2008 1:48 pm

Canucks fans who generally like their players to show effort on every shift, would be disapointed with Marleau he lacks any emotion despite his high skill level. That's why SJ want him out of town. he cost $6.3 mil, same as Naslund. We get rid of one non performer and replace him with a clone ? I can't believe it
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Post by jchockey » Wed Feb 13, 2008 4:18 pm

You're talking about acquiring a player who before Joe Thornton's arrival has never come close to averaging a point per game in his NHL career. Tack on the fact that so far this year he's been about as good as Taylor Pyatt offensively and the fact that he has a fat contract with a NTC that kicks in, he's not too attractive of an option.

You're talking about acquiring another 1b/2 centre for double the price of B-Mo.

No thanks.

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Post by magnum44 » Thu Feb 14, 2008 4:37 am

I'd take a chance on him if he could be had for a reasonble price. More of an offseason move though imo. SJ doesn't need cap room so I doubt they dump him cheaply, only if its a good hockey trade.
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Post by sic puppy » Thu Feb 14, 2008 12:42 pm

magnum44 wrote:I'd take a chance on him if he could be had for a reasonble price. .
It's not the price the Nux would have to give up in trade that would bother me. It's his salary for the next 2 years.

Marleau certainly has upside if he can rejuvenate his career. However over the last 3 seasons (including this one) he has 76 goals. Naslund over that same period has 76 goals. And we all know the discussion around Naslund not scoring enough to validate his salary in this market.

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Re: Take a chance on Marleau??

Post by Farhan Lalji » Fri Feb 15, 2008 3:33 pm

newostar wrote: Buy low, sell high.......

Any thoughts?
EXACTLY!

In my opinion, Marleau would be a very good risk to gamble on. A few reasons:

1) Marleau is only 28 years old. I completely disagree with the statement that "Marleau is in decline." In my opinion, there's a vast difference between "being in decline" and "having a bad year." Who knows what Marleau's relationship with Ron Wilson is....which leads me to my next point:

2) Curtis Joseph: Remember how Cujo struggled terribly in St. Louis under Keenan? Remember how he completely revived his career in Edmonton? Sometimes - a change of scenery is necessary.

3) Like you said - buy low, sell high. And hell - Marleau is only 28! With Marleau-Sedin-Kesler as our centers, the Canucks will have some very respectable depth down the middle.

4) Playoff performer: Is it just me, or does Marleau seem to outperform Joe Thornton come playoff time? I'm not really sure why Ron Wilson bitched Marleau out last season in the playoffs.

5) Leadership/Power Play help: Marleau has had experience being a captain. Marleau can also help us on the Power Play.

Getting a guy like Jokinen or Lecavlier would be tremendous obviously, but it would cost us a shit load. Marleau, given his potential (relative to the year he's having), can be had for fairly cheap.

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Re: Take a chance on Marleau??

Post by jchockey » Sat Feb 16, 2008 11:18 am

Farhan Lalji wrote:
newostar wrote: Buy low, sell high.......

Any thoughts?
EXACTLY!

In my opinion, Marleau would be a very good risk to gamble on. A few reasons:

1) Marleau is only 28 years old. I completely disagree with the statement that "Marleau is in decline." In my opinion, there's a vast difference between "being in decline" and "having a bad year." Who knows what Marleau's relationship with Ron Wilson is....which leads me to my next point:

2) Curtis Joseph: Remember how Cujo struggled terribly in St. Louis under Keenan? Remember how he completely revived his career in Edmonton? Sometimes - a change of scenery is necessary.

3) Like you said - buy low, sell high. And hell - Marleau is only 28! With Marleau-Sedin-Kesler as our centers, the Canucks will have some very respectable depth down the middle.

4) Playoff performer: Is it just me, or does Marleau seem to outperform Joe Thornton come playoff time? I'm not really sure why Ron Wilson bitched Marleau out last season in the playoffs.

5) Leadership/Power Play help: Marleau has had experience being a captain. Marleau can also help us on the Power Play.

Getting a guy like Jokinen or Lecavlier would be tremendous obviously, but it would cost us a shit load. Marleau, given his potential (relative to the year he's having), can be had for fairly cheap.
1. It's not so much Marleau is in decline, but he has failed to play at an elite level for some time prior to the arrival of Joe Thornton. If you're asking for a team to bank roughly $6m for Marleau to bounce back from a supposed "bad year," that's a bit pricey, don't you think?

2. I agree, but unfortunately that change in scenery will cost at the very LEAST 1 first round, 1 top 10 prospect, a NTC, and a $6m price tag. As we all very well know in the CBA NHL a NTC is just as good as the kiss of death.

3. Buy low? Are you crazy? If a low price consists of what Wilson describes as a good package of prospects and picks you're crazy. The fact is, Marleau will not be the second coming of Lecavalier, and a $6m price tag should fetch you an equal, if not better, centre on the free agent market.

4. I don't think Marleau's playoff performance has anything with us not acquiring him. Wilson has lashed out on Marleau's performance because he can't kick his play into that extra gear in the playoffs guys like Brind'Amour and Linden can. It's not so much what they can't accomplish on the scoresheet, but the fact that sometimes the work ethic just isn't there. Marleau's play has been uninspiring to say the least this year. If anything, Marleau's playoff woes should fit perfectly with ours (I don't care what you say, we shouldn't have beaten Dallas last year).

5. I don't believe there are any special teams problems right now. We're not doing as well as we did last year but I don't think acquiring a special teams specialist is at the top of the agenda. I cannot see Marleau having a significant impact leadership-wise on this team either. I would more readily put the C on B-Mo's chest than Marleau.

Farhan Lalji

Re: Take a chance on Marleau??

Post by Farhan Lalji » Sun Feb 17, 2008 12:29 pm

jchockey wrote: 1. It's not so much Marleau is in decline, but he has failed to play at an elite level for some time prior to the arrival of Joe Thornton. If you're asking for a team to bank roughly $6m for Marleau to bounce back from a supposed "bad year," that's a bit pricey, don't you think?
I'll have to agree. Since he was younger and better than Morrison however, I figured he'd be a pretty nice upgrade at center. With Sedin, Marleau, and Kesler down the middle, the Canucks would be one of the deepest teams at center. If Marleau was our 1st or 2nd line center, then he'd also be good enough (presumably) to bring out the best in a guy like Naslund (and if not Naslund, then someone else in the future with similar talent).

2. I agree, but unfortunately that change in scenery will cost at the very LEAST 1 first round, 1 top 10 prospect, a NTC, and a $6m price tag. As we all very well know in the CBA NHL a NTC is just as good as the kiss of death.
Yes - upon further thought, you are correct.
3. Buy low? Are you crazy? If a low price consists of what Wilson describes as a good package of prospects and picks you're crazy. The fact is, Marleau will not be the second coming of Lecavalier, and a $6m price tag should fetch you an equal, if not better, centre on the free agent market.
My mistake - I COMPLETELY forget about Marleau's price tag! My bad! When I said, "buy low sell high", I was thinking about the idea of getting a guy that was in a slump, but had the potential to be a far better player (based on past performance).
4. (I don't care what you say, we shouldn't have beaten Dallas last year).
I wholeheartedly agree with that. Speaking of which - I was a little disturbed at the lack of presence that the Sedin twins had.
5. I don't believe there are any special teams problems right now. We're not doing as well as we did last year but I don't think acquiring a special teams specialist is at the top of the agenda. I cannot see Marleau having a significant impact leadership-wise on this team either. I would more readily put the C on B-Mo's chest than Marleau.
I might have to disagree a little on this. IMO - a good strategy for Nonis, might be to upgrade his special teams....to the point of which BOTH are great strengths.

-The Canucks have the goaltending
-The Canucks have the defense (when healthy).
-The Canucks offense is pitiful.

You mentioned the Dallas series from last year. Let me ask you these hypothetical questions:

1) If the Canucks were healthy last post-season, how do you think they might've faired? (yes - all teams deal with injuries, but I'm just asking).

2) If the Canucks had a strong POWER-PLAY last season, how do you think we would have done? (think - against the Stars...AND..the Ducks).

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Re: Take a chance on Marleau??

Post by sic puppy » Sun Feb 17, 2008 3:12 pm

Farhan Lalji wrote:
-The Canucks have the goaltending
-The Canucks have the defense (when healthy).
-The Canucks offense is pitiful.
Too simplistic. IMO if you add a qualifier to the defense (when healthy), you must also add that to the offense. Your comment is the offense is pitiful.

Based on goals scored ? If so, look at Anaheim and San Jose totals.

Certainly the Nux need secondary scoring. Last year that was provided by the Defence. 31 goals scored at the 60 game mark to 18 this year at 59 games by the top 4 offensive D.

So. IMO the Nux have the defense AND the offense when the D is healthy.

Provided of course the D performs at or near last year's output. Having said that, the Nux do need some offensive help as I'm sure everyone including Mr Nonis is aware.

Being able to acquire it and maintain a post season team is the challenge.

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Post by Island Nucklehead » Sun Feb 17, 2008 10:20 pm

That's the cap. You can't be great in all areas, only balanced. Right now, we're one decent forward and a healthy D core away from being a VERY good team in this league. Our window is small, but I think that if we lose one of those 3.5M contracts on D, and give it to the offensive side of the puck, we'd be in great shape going with Edler/Bourdon on the back end while they're cheap. These guys have stepped up recently and proved they can maintain at least decent minutes at this level. Risk to their development? Maybe...but risks have to be taken to realize any real gains.

Ohlund/BXA
Mitchel/Edler
Bourdon/Miller(or Miller replacement)

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