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WCE
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Post by WCE »

Bartman wrote:
WCE wrote:Why hasn't Rypien been called up yet?

http://www.moosehockey.com/2006-07/061107/recap.php#

Kid is a spark plug and fights like a buzzsaw (very similar to Bieksa in that pound for pound he is an outstanding fighter).

I'd sure as hell like to see some physical play. If we are going to be a team that has stone hands, we might as well throw a few.

Maybe something that will give the team a jolt and help them stay on the plus side of .500
Seeing as he was virtually a lock to make the team before getting injured one has to wonder why he hasn't been called back. Unless he isn't 100%. The other question is who goes the other way? Isn't everyone on a one way and have to go thru waivers?
Would you be heart broken at this point if we were to lose someone like Santala? ;)
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tantalum
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Post by tantalum »

WCE wrote: Would you be heart broken at this point if we were to lose someone like Santala? ;)
Pretty much what I said when I read that. I personally would like to see them call up Rypien and maybe Hansen (struggled of late but had a good start in the AHL). Two guys that can inject some energy into the team. It's the 20 game mark. The others have had time to prove themselves so might as well give a couple of farm players a look.
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sic puppy
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Post by sic puppy »

Interesting in this new cap era of the NHL how everyone is so dollar conscious when it comes to whether or not a player is called out.

Not long ago it was Bertuzzi. Then it was that greedy Jovonovski. Then the Carter issue. Some rumblings have even started questioning Luongo.

IMO players ARE rewarded for their past performance and the expectation that they will perform in a similar fashion in the future. That doesn't always work out, but who can adequately predict this?

We focus on the Canucks players, duh. But, look around the NHL and compare some of the salaries over the last few years leading into the cap era and now.

Is /was Morrison a first line center? Back in '02-03 and '03-04 he was the 43/44th highest paid center. '05-06 he moved up to 20th and this year he is 13th.

If you look at other players on the other 29 teams you will notice a similar pattern. Management signs these players based on need, performance, expectation and some intangibles that are of benefit from a corporate perspective. (profile and revenue)

Appears to me that more and more the fans/posters have to re-act in a negative way (similar to those media types) when the unreasonable expectations don't produce their anticipated result. Much easier to criticize than to look for the positive signs or the overall result, and after awhile this mountain of negative shit is picked up by the players.

As I and some have posted before, yes these guys are professionals and are paid gobs of money to play a game, but, they are also still people with the same feelings and foibles as the rest of us mere mortals.
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Post by Jyrki21 »

WCE wrote:Why hasn't Rypien been called up yet?
He's injured again.
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tantalum
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Post by tantalum »

smalien wrote: IMO players ARE rewarded for their past performance and the expectation that they will perform in a similar fashion in the future. That doesn't always work out, but who can adequately predict this?
The thing is many if not the majority of people predicted that the Morrison, Cooke and Cloutier contracts were bad deals. In some cases not just because it was overpayment for past performances but because they were likely to be overpayments for current performance.

This isn't some hinssight is 20/20 thing. They were bad deals then and they seem to be getting worse by the day.
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Post by sic puppy »

tantalum wrote:
smalien wrote: IMO players ARE rewarded for their past performance and the expectation that they will perform in a similar fashion in the future. That doesn't always work out, but who can adequately predict this?
The thing is many if not the majority of people predicted that the Morrison, Cooke and Cloutier contracts were bad deals. In some cases not just because it was overpayment for past performances but because they were likely to be overpayments for current performance.
While I agree that some fans voiced their opinion of the deals, the market place was dictating who should get what.

No one can predict why certain players play well together. The WCE line was arguably the best line in hockey when the big 3 received their compensation. If you look at the salaries awarded during these years, the success of the big line and the expectations going into the '05-06 year, Mo was not overpaid by any stretch.

As mentioned he was the 43 & 44th paid center in the League. Based on the WCE success AND the lofty position the team was finishing in (not to mention lack of secondary scoring) was Mo overpaid?

Should he have been the number one center during these years? That IMO was not his decision. The fact that the coaches and management saw fit to "reward" his play was just as "unfair" as Clarke offering Kesler more money.

The new NHL has certainly focused criticism on the players salary. To suggest that the players are overpaid is subject to any number of variables that for some is easy to criticize, especially in cities where hockey is life itself.
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Post by Arbour »

It is interesting that Cooke and Morrison have come under the spotlight as two players who are not earning there money based on present performance. The general criticism seems to be they lack the goal production that warrants the pay cheque. To some extent similar criticism is also directed towards Naslund.

So given the above, and I don't mean to hijack the thread since it is about Morrison, but lets go once step further. At the present pace both the Sedins will probably end up with about the same number of goals as last year, which means two thirds of our first line will score approximately 36 goals between them, and earn over 7 million dollars. Now granted they will also generate points by setting up goals, but so did Morrison when he was on the WCE line, and when he was on the first unit power play. In fact his numbers were not unlike Daniel's for which he is now payed less.

Perhaps the criticism of this team should be that management has over valued, and over estimated the team's offensive talent, period. That includes others besides Morrison. The WCE line is no longer there to take the heat, and the better teams have no problem in now shutting down the pieces that are left. Morrison is all the more conspicuous because his previous success has left fans with expectations that his offensive performance will continue in spite of the break up the WCE, and over all a much, much less offensively gifted team.
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Post by Island Nucklehead »

If BMo is a first line center, as his salary would suggest, playing on a second line would allow him to flourish and prove his worth playing aganst second tier defenders. Thus far, he has not. The Sedins, on the other hand, played against second tier defenders last year (for the most part), and this year face the best, so a repeat of last year would be acceptable IMHO.

If anything Brendan Morrison is proving that his contract is un-warranted, and therfore should be traded. Hometown boy and everything be damned, he's not performing at the level his contract demands. Morrison simply is not CREATING scoring chances, the same cannot be said for the Sedin twins and Naslund.

If we can find someone to eat BMo's salary I think we should take it...we're so close to the cap its scary. This team might not make the playoffs, and for a team so close to the cap thats unacceptable. To me, that means that the players that make beacoup $$ need to be held accountable...Cooke and Morrison have not done their jobs thus far, neither has Kesler but we can't trade him....in the off season we sign and trade his ass. It's time for this team to reward skill, not speed and hands of stone.
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Post by gobi »

What DN needs to do now is to get rid a bunch of deadweights similar to what Burke did last year. Cooke, BMo, Bulis all needs to go. Trade or waive them. I would add Kesler to that list but he's not tradeable. Try to get back a centre and bring Hansen up. In fact, Simek is doing quite well too and I wouldn't mind seeing him here. I would also ask Linden to retire immediately for the sake of the team.
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Post by Jyrki21 »

Island Nucklehead wrote:If anything Brendan Morrison is proving that his contract is un-warranted, and therfore should be traded.
Honestly, I've never understood the "he's underperforming so he should be traded" dogma. That's the hardest time to trade him – for the same reason you don't want him at that price, neither does a rival GM.
gobi wrote:What DN needs to do now is to get rid a bunch of deadweights similar to what Burke did last year. Cooke, BMo, Bulis all needs to go.
Burke got rid of cancers, which none of those guys are. Seriously, that's not how you run a team in the salary cap era – blowing up everything the second your team has a losing season. Half the rosters of every team are going to change every offseason – unless you can replace these guys, there's so little to gain.
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Post by Island Nucklehead »

Jyrki21 wrote:
Island Nucklehead wrote:If anything Brendan Morrison is proving that his contract is un-warranted, and therfore should be traded.
Honestly, I've never understood the "he's underperforming so he should be traded" dogma. That's the hardest time to trade him – for the same reason you don't want him at that price, neither does a rival GM.
Normally I would agree with you. But this is not a slump, this is what we can probably expect from this guy from here on out, he dosn't have the talent around him to leach off of, and the entire team is being forced to play a two-way style so he can no longer fall back on his two way play to support his offensive line mates. It's no longer a buy low, sell high deal with this guy, it's a get rid of him for whatever we can, buy help somewhere else.
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Post by tantalum »

smalien wrote:
tantalum wrote:[
While I agree that some fans voiced their opinion of the deals, the market place was dictating who should get what.
Except Nonis wiped out the 24% rollback for Morrison. The market was reset and he didn't take advantage of it. It was a bad deal and I remember that day because it was first reported at a $2.3 mil a year a deal that most were reasonably happy with. When it came out at $3.2 mil very few people were happy with it. He was gettign overpaid. Especially considering he signed a deal pre-rollback worth about the same and hadn't played another NHL game between them. It didn't make sense then. It doesn't make sense now.
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Post by Fred »

You know all salary awards, offered, signed or arbitration can only be judged by history and at the time he agreed to the salary he wasn't actually considered chopped liver. He was a strategic part of the NHL's best line. He's defensive responsible and is a character player. He's still injured apparently but never uses it as an excuse, maybe he should sit out a few then there would be an uproar. Putting with a bunch of checkers will not help, try putting Henrik with the same kind of player and let's see how much he would produce.

YOu know a lot of the other players have been signed on the basis of their history as well, such as Cooke and Kesler ( who I'm really starting to wonder about long term) and Bulis was judged by what he did last season. There's a long line of players who have been judged historically and failed to show up and they're not injured either
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