2018 Offseason

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Diehard1
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2018 Offseason

Post by Diehard1 » Sun Apr 08, 2018 8:38 am

Long post coming, you are forewarned.

So another season done, and aside from some good fun games in the last week or two, another dismal season of Canucks hockey. There are already big changes this offseason, the first season coming since 2000 that won’t include at least 1 Sedin in the lineup. There are a lot of forwards fighting for spots next year even before FA and the D looks relatively set barring a trade or two.

Forward locks (assuming no major trades):

Horvat, Boeser, Sutter, Eriksson, Gagner, Virtanen, Baertschi

Forwards that should be on the team, IMHO:

Gaudette, Goldobin, Leipsic

Young guys with a chance to make the team (I’d assume one or two will):

Pettersson, Dahlen, Lind, Gadjovich, Jasek (been great in Utica so far - yes I know he needs a contract and we have his rights another year)

So call it 11 forwards on the team. There is room for a FA or two, ideally somebody with some grit as it’s a soft group of forwards as is.


The D is set, again barring a trade or two:

Edler, Tanev, Stecher, Guddy, Del Zotto, Pouliot, Biega. Hutton is also signed but given the last half of the season he had I don’t expect him to be around.

Guys with a chance to make the team:

Sautner (Green seems to like him), Juolevi (I expect him to push for a roster spot)

Not a good group as is, so definitely room for changes.


Goal:

Markstrom was hit and miss this year, hopefully he will be more consistent next but I fully expect him back as the #1. Backup will be between Nilsson and Demko, and I would be surprised if Demko isn’t the backup by Christmas if not sooner.


If the team above is who breaks camp next year, I think we can expect another bottom 5 finish and a shot at the #1 pick for the draft here in Van. That’s not such a bad thing long term, and it’s what I expect will happen.

Now, the team above also has about $15-$20 million in cap space after factoring in raises for the RFAs, so they could do a lot of things to improve the team. Hopefully no more Eriksson contracts, though I think they’ve learned their lesson there. 1 or 2 year deals are fine, even at overpayments it’s not a problem as there will be lots of cap space for the next few years. Think guys like Bouma, Wingels, Winnik - solid vets that can take a year or two and help the kids. I’m not advocating those guys specifically, just vets who can play a role and play up and down the lineup if needed.

On D, a guy who can put up points is badly needed. Edler was great the past 20 games but we have all seen how streaky he is so I don’t expect that for a whole season. Barring winning the lottery there’s not much coming in terms of offensive D, and those guys are very hard to find in FA - Carlson isn’t signing here unless he gets a massive overpayment, and that’s not happening. Draft a Hughes, Dobson, Bouchard or Boqvist and let them develop into that offensive D.

Goal is set as I said previously.

If it was me I would try and trade a vet or two at or before the draft, pick up some extra picks for this year and/or next and keep developing the young guys. Let the chips fall where they may, perhaps we get surprised and the kids are more ready than I think they are. Don’t try and sign any long term contracts with vets unless it’s a sweetheart deal, as with Sutter, Guddy, Edler, Gagner, Eriksson, MDZ there’s enough veteran leadership and Bo is a great pick to be the next captain. If there’s a trade to exchange a forward or two for a comparable young dman then do it, otherwise it’s time to draft and develop D.

I for one excited to watch a young, hungry team play next year. Hopefully Benning and Linden agree and don’t blow their wad on players that are only here short term.

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Re: Offseason

Post by RoyalDude » Sun Apr 08, 2018 9:08 am

Well with Benning saying the team will be extremely young next season, I see a lot of new faces.

It's becoming quite clear that out of respect to the Sedins they couldn't go full rebuild with them around, surrounding them with a bunch of green, pimple faced teenagers.

You can't keep cooking Demko in the A, by Nilsson

Juolevi gets forced in on a fast track development, Hutton is out

Tanev and Edler are not getting traded unless you get a mind blowing offer for Tanev

Pettersson will be too good to keep out

Dahlen may surprise

Gaudette, really liked what I saw but like Lind those two need cooking in the A until they get their old man strength going

Goldy stays, the kid is crafty in spite of his D flaws

Virtanen has arrived

Gaunce has cemented himself as a good bottom 6 player

I'm coming around to Leipsic

Motte, Archibald, Boucher and Dowd on the bubble. Limited players

Eriksson, Baertschi, Sutter, Gagner are obviously sticking

Granlund is a mystery to me but like Hutton, doesn't seem to fit what Green wants

Nothing to be said about Bo and Brock

Really liked what I saw in Sautner

Biega is a perma fixture as well as Stecher

We all know Guds is staying. The team likes Del Zottos leadership

Pouliot deserves a stay

Interested in seeing Brisebios, Chatfield, Brassard, Jasek, McEewan at camp. One of them could surprise. WTF happened with McEneny?

Are we sticking a fork in Cassels

Insert mysterious 2018 draft prospects, may get Patrick, Hischier lucky and have an 18 year old make the team next year
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Re: Offseason

Post by Island Nucklehead » Sun Apr 08, 2018 10:10 am

They won't throw the kids to the wolves, and they'll want some competition at camp. After the marginal acquisitions over the past couple seasons (Motte, Boucher, Leipsic, Goldobbin, Dowd), there should be plenty of competition for bottom-6 spots.

I think they'll go hard after one "name brand" UFA, and leave the "other" Sedin spot open for competition at camp. I can't see any UFA looking at Vancouver as choice destination, so hopefully they don't sign a bloated contract they'll live to regret. With another 4 years of Eriksson, we can't really afford another $6M mistake. Boeser will be in that $8M per range soon enough, cap space will be essential.

I would kick the tires on a guy like Rick Nash. Less cap and term than the Neal/JVR/Kane's will command, but still a useful guy in the room and on the ice.

They need to replace Dorsett, this team desperately needs more sandpaper, especially with so many kids coming online.

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Re: 2018 Offseason

Post by Hockey Widow » Sun Apr 08, 2018 11:33 am

In net:

Markstrom returns as the number one.

Demko will get a chance to make the team out of camp. But he won’t be pushed into the lineup for the sake of if. Repeatedly they have said they want him playing, not sitting. If he shows enough he will stay but if he doesn’t then I look for a year of him being up and down between Utica and Vancouver as his final development year. Either way it will be a good story.

Nilsson may be gone. It depends on whether they can unload him or not and whether or not another inexpensive back up who projects better is available. Demko is certainly knocking on the door so whoever backs up will just be temporary. They of course have the option of promoting Demko or Bachman and waiving Nilsson. But is Bachman a better option than Nilsson?

On D:

I’d really look to move Tanev and or Gudbranson. Edler did enough for me to earn the right to start here next year.

Perhaps Edler is TDD fodder if we stink and he can be convinced to move on but otherwise if he has a decent year next year I’d consider re-signing him, two years max.

Tanev has good trade value and I think given his age and injury issues now is the time to contemplate moving him for what should be a decent return, perhaps for 2019 picks.

Gudbranson is a quandary. He is a big body that seemed to be playing well when we had to shut him down. But he hasn’t shown enough to warrant being placed into that “new” core category, placeholder yes. And he played well with Edler.

I think Hutton will be made available. I like Pouliot and think he will improve. I liked what I saw from Sautner. Biega is the little train that could. A great 7-8 guy that can fill in nicely. He has a great work ethic and shows a little guy back there can be tough as nails. Stetcher is a Green fav but maybe only because he plays right side. Green loves himself those correct handed D pairs.

So
LHD: Edler, Hutton, MDZ, Pouliot, Sautner
RHD: Tanev, Stetcher, Biega, Gudbranson.

Nine D for 7-8 spots. None can be sent to Utica with clearing waivers. If you lose Hutton and Tanev that brings you to 7 with one spot for an 8th. Who sits? Biega and who else? As others have said there are some kids we need to see to see what we have and oh ya a kid named Juolevi that you know Benning wants to get into the line up.

Maybe we lose a couple on that so list near the draft or over the summer with a couple more around camp.

Up front:

Bo, Boeser are locks. Everyone else is expendable if the right trade comes along.

Benning really is hoping Pettersson is NHL ready. He says it every time he talks about him. Dahlen will get a show me chance with Utica, same as Lind. It’s too bad Gaudette can’t go there to play out the season with them. I liked what I saw from him but he could benefit from a playoff push with the Comets.

I saw enough from Jake to finally have hope he has broken through and he will step up next year. He needs top six minutes to succeed. The flip side, with the twins gone, his past off season behaviour and his past attitude all may find him thinking he’s a lock now. He’ll have to guard against that.

I’m warming to Goldobin. He has to play in the NHL and has to be given a chance to play through the defensive gaffs. Something we never allowed Gabner to do. Back then we were contending and wanted more of a bottom six defensively reliable type. Now I think is the perfect time to hang onto a gifted offensive minded forward with potential and let him work out the defensive side.

I like Baertschi and I like Granlund. Their future seems to be linked to the emergence, or not, of players like Pettersson, Lind, Gaudette, Dahlen and that other Gad guy. Spell check isn’t helping me here, Gadjovich (sp).

I’d love to move on from Eriksson, if Benning can somehow undo that mistake it would be impressive. Sutter is foundational even if slightly over paid. Great on face offs, solid defensively. Great on the PK. Plays the right way with good leadership qualities. Gagne is expendable but may be worth keeping another year to help transition in the kids.

Dowd, Gaunce meh. If you can get picks for them, move on. Leipsic is just another placeholder, maybe buys us a year of Utica time for some kids that aren’t quit ready. Motte can start in Utica if need be. I like his energy and he may prove to be a good bottom six for us down the road, or another placeholder for a year of development of others.

I haven’t moved on from Cassells but he’s running out of time. I’d like for him to get a shot at a few games next year. But I’m not attached to him either way.

If Benning is active in FA it had better be either 1) Tavares or 2) limited in term placeholders. I’d take a run at E Kane only if we can get the right term and cap, whatever those are and if we can move on from Eriksson. Not that they are comparable players only that I want room for the kids.

2018-2019 is the perfect transition year to take a long hard look at what we have in the organization as we prepare to host the 2019 draft. Accumulate picks and lets have a draft party.

So really I’d like to see 2-3 Dmen gone. 4-5 up front gone. Limited FA action. Just let the kids play for real this time. Even ifs it’s one more year of great pain let’s see what we’ve got and develop develop develop.
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Re: 2018 Offseason

Post by ESQ » Sun Apr 08, 2018 11:51 am

Lots of stories to watch for next season (hopefully they'll take some of the sting off the many many losses!).

I think the D is very interesting to watch, Benning referred to the D as an area of strength to trade away at the deadline - probably setting up the Holm and almost-Hutton deals.

I feel like with the exception of 2018-Edler, this D performed as bad as we could have feared. Guddy was hurt, Tanev was hurt, Hutton was lost, Stecher played small and ineffective, MDZ was asked to do too much in leading the team in TOI, Pouliot had stretches of good offence but also looked like a deer in the headlights.

Barring a lotto miracle, I agree with OP that the D is likely set. But I wonder if there's some hope of improvement from within on that front.

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Re: 2018 Offseason

Post by Topper » Sun Apr 08, 2018 12:01 pm

Something to remember when looking at camp competition is sending a waiver eligible player down then is of little risk. All teams are in the same boat with their tweeners.

Lipstick, Archie, Motte, Dowd may as well be Chaput and Megna.

The PK did quite well without Loui and Granlund.

Pouliot is the one D I find intriguing. He makes the occasional blunder that many zoom in on, but watch him stick handle, watch him get into shooting positions, watch him block shots. Without a doubt, he's the best puck handling D the Canucks have had in years.

lil trojan is consistently bad and drags down whoever he is partnered with. Watching him try to get position and muscle on McHeyZues last night had me laughing. Reminded me of that first mosquito of the year.

Jake is learning, becoming much more aware of the play and looking for team mates to make a play. Not out of the woods yet and he needs to really step up next season to get himself beyond the run of the mill.

Goldy's oozes talent, consistency is an issue as is reading the play. He busts his ass to back check, his gaffs are not seeing the ice and making errant passes. That is correctable and should be overcome with experience.

Outside of Bo, Brock and Sutter, everything is up for grabs. Some, like Gagger, Bearchia, Granlund, Loui will have an inside track because of contract status and experience, but they are all in for a tryout come camp time or they are movable chips in the off season.
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Re: 2018 Offseason

Post by Cherry Picker » Sun Apr 08, 2018 12:56 pm

Only FA I want is Reaves on a limited term, 2 or 3 years max, but perhaps higher salary than market value contract.
Other teams need a psycho like him around to worry about or the kids will be abused.
There are already too many bodies that can’t avoid wavers, so no need to bring any FA in that isn’t a total asshole.
Keep the cap space open and see what cap tight teams will offer as next season draws near.
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Diehard1
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Re: 2018 Offseason

Post by Diehard1 » Sun Apr 08, 2018 4:22 pm

Seems most are in agreement, relatively speaking. Will be interesting to see what happens, my guess is at least one new, top 2-3 dman will be acquired, whether by trade or signing. I’d guess by trade and it will cost us a good young forward.

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Re: 2018 Offseason

Post by Blob Mckenzie » Sun Apr 08, 2018 5:47 pm

Diehard1 wrote:
Sun Apr 08, 2018 4:22 pm
Seems most are in agreement, relatively speaking. Will be interesting to see what happens, my guess is at least one new, top 2-3 dman will be acquired, whether by trade or signing. I’d guess by trade and it will cost us a good young forward.
I’m not sure I trust this pro scouting staff to evaluate defencemen. They have yet to bring in a top 4 d man in going on five summers. That’s horrendous
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Re: 2018 Offseason

Post by Strangelove » Sun Apr 08, 2018 6:22 pm

Blob Mckenzie wrote:
Sun Apr 08, 2018 5:47 pm
I’m not sure I trust this pro scouting staff to evaluate defencemen. They have yet to bring in a top 4 d man in going on five summers. That’s horrendous
If we wanted your input MS, we'd hold our noses and visit the cesspool.

Is "going on five summers" the new four summers? :lol:

You're saying they "can't evaluate defencemen" because "they have yet to bring in a top 4 d man"

... which of course implies they have tried and failed to bring in a top 4 d man.

Who exactly did they bring in to be a top 4 d man that didn't pan out?

MDZ and Guds are the only two I can think of... except of course for the fact they are indeed top 4 dmen.

(and bonus they are underpaid for top 4 dmen at $3M and $4M respectively = genius) :mex:
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Re: 2018 Offseason

Post by Strangelove » Sun Apr 08, 2018 6:24 pm

Baertchi - Horvat - Boeser
Dahlen - Pettersson - Eriksson
Kane - Sutter - Virtanen
Granlund - Gaudette - Gaunce
Archibald

Edler – Green
MDZ/Olli – Tanev
MDZ/Olli – Gudbranson
Pouliot/Sautner – Stecher/Biega

Markstrom
Demko


Sign Green for 2 years, Kane for 6, trade Goldobin, Gagne, Hutton for picks…
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Blob Mckenzie
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Re: 2018 Offseason

Post by Blob Mckenzie » Sun Apr 08, 2018 6:30 pm

Strangelove wrote:
Sun Apr 08, 2018 6:22 pm
Blob Mckenzie wrote:
Sun Apr 08, 2018 5:47 pm
I’m not sure I trust this pro scouting staff to evaluate defencemen. They have yet to bring in a top 4 d man in going on five summers. That’s horrendous
If we wanted your input MS, we'd hold our noses and visit the cesspool.

Is "going on five summers" the new four summers? :lol:

You're saying they "can't evaluate defencemen" because "they have yet to bring in a top 4 d man"

... which of course implies they have tried and failed to bring in a top 4 d man.

Who exactly did they bring in to be a top 4 d man that didn't pan out?

MDZ and Guds are the only two I can think of... except of course for the fact they are indeed top 4 dmen.

(and bonus they are underpaid for top 4 dmen at $3M and $4M respectively = genius) :mex:
If I’m MS you are Reseob ot Ettedaug.

Sure I guess Gudbranson and MDZ are getting top 4 minutes here. There isn’t another team in the league where they would get top 4 ice time however. If they were legit top 4 d men this team wouldn’t have the leagues worst defence considering legit top 4 guys in Tanev and Edler already were on the team.
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Re: 2018 Offseason

Post by Strangelove » Sun Apr 08, 2018 6:41 pm

Blob Mckenzie wrote:
Sun Apr 08, 2018 6:30 pm
There isn’t another team in the league where they would get top 4 ice time
:crazy:

We've already had this debate about Guds and you conceded he received top 4 minutes in Florida.

MDZ received top 4 minutes for 3 season in Philly and another 3 seasons in New York.

Are you a masochist? :lol:
Blob Mckenzie wrote:
Sun Apr 08, 2018 6:30 pm
If they were legit top 4 d men this team wouldn’t have the leagues worst defence considering legit top 4 guys in Tanev and Edler already were on the team.
Ahhh but this team doesn't have "the leagues worst defence" (no matter how many times you say it).

I've asked you twice now to rebut my post on this, but you prefer your blindfold and endless repetitions...
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Blob Mckenzie
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Re: 2018 Offseason

Post by Blob Mckenzie » Sun Apr 08, 2018 7:05 pm

Gudbranson has played too 4 minutes in two of seven seasons. Once in five years in Florida and once here.

Del Zaster is fine on the third pair and on Philly their D was a mess when he got big minutes. He went steadily downhill after starting out strong as a young guy inNY. So big deal they can get top 4 minutes on a team or two with horrendous back ends. Doesn’t make them legit top 4 guys, certainly not on a decent team.

It is the leagues worst D. End of story
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Re: 2018 Offseason

Post by Diehard1 » Sun Apr 08, 2018 7:21 pm

Strangelove wrote:
Sun Apr 08, 2018 6:22 pm
Blob Mckenzie wrote:
Sun Apr 08, 2018 5:47 pm
I’m not sure I trust this pro scouting staff to evaluate defencemen. They have yet to bring in a top 4 d man in going on five summers. That’s horrendous
If we wanted your input MS, we'd hold our noses and visit the cesspool.

Is "going on five summers" the new four summers? :lol:

You're saying they "can't evaluate defencemen" because "they have yet to bring in a top 4 d man"

... which of course implies they have tried and failed to bring in a top 4 d man.

Who exactly did they bring in to be a top 4 d man that didn't pan out?

MDZ and Guds are the only two I can think of... except of course for the fact they are indeed top 4 dmen.

(and bonus they are underpaid for top 4 dmen at $3M and $4M respectively = genius) :mex:
Apples and oranges if you ask me - one guy was acquired for nothing but cap space and has been a serviceable 3/4 year, while the other cost substantial assets plus cap space and has been a disappointment at best, and a tire fire at worst.

Give me more MDZS, fewer Guddys and I’m happy.

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