Elephant in the Room - Trade the Sedins

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5thhorseman
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Re: Elephant in the Room - Trade the Sedins

Post by 5thhorseman » Fri Feb 09, 2018 1:12 pm

Maybe all this decide in the off-season nonsense is because the Sedins know their time is up, but they're having a hard time letting go.

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Re: Elephant in the Room - Trade the Sedins

Post by SKYO » Fri Feb 09, 2018 1:26 pm

Well even Stamkos waiting till last second to sign with TBL coupla years ago, and the same will hold true with Tavares, all-stars don't have to think about next season's contract until after the season is done, it's their right and choice yo!
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Re: Elephant in the Room - Trade the Sedins

Post by black ace » Sat Feb 17, 2018 5:07 pm

They've said they will retire as Canucks so why start a controversy with the 2 best players your team has ever had ?
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Re: Elephant in the Room - Trade the Sedins

Post by Meds » Sun Feb 18, 2018 12:15 am

SKYO wrote:
Fri Feb 09, 2018 1:26 pm
Well even Stamkos waiting till last second to sign with TBL coupla years ago, and the same will hold true with Tavares, all-stars don't have to think about next season's contract until after the season is done, it's their right and choice yo!
There's a huge difference between 26 year old Steven Stamkos and 37 year olds Henrik and Daniel.

It's.....

HOLY SHIT do we even have our franchise centerman next year or are we going to be looking at trying to replace our best player!??

vs

So, like are you guys retiring or not? We just wanna know when we need to find a two-thirds of a new second or third line?

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Re: Elephant in the Room - Trade the Sedins

Post by SKYO » Sun Feb 18, 2018 2:20 pm

facts, but like it or not the Sedins were the Canucks franchise for many years so they get auto-respek.

I figure they'll decide during the two-week open discussion prior to UFA season, so management can plan their july 1st battle plan.
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Re: Elephant in the Room - Trade the Sedins

Post by DonCherry4PM » Sun Feb 18, 2018 9:56 pm

SKYO wrote:
Sun Feb 18, 2018 2:20 pm
facts, but like it or not the Sedins were the Canucks franchise for many years so they get auto-respek.

I figure they'll decide during the two-week open discussion prior to UFA season, so management can plan their july 1st battle plan.
I tend to agree with you that they have earned their right, but I would hope they would take into consideration how their delay in a decision puts JB in a bit of a bind. Finding replacements for 2/3 of a 2nd or 3rd line isn't exactly something that can (or should) be accomplished at the drop of a hat. And if Vanek is traded or doesn't re-sign, that's an entire line.

Forwards with contracts going into next season*:
Baer(RFA)-Bo-Brock
Eriksson-Sutter/Gagner-Goldobin
Jake(RFA)-Sutter/Gagner-Granlund(RFA)
Guance

*Assuming RFA's are all re-signed.

Forwards on expiring contracts going into next season:
Sedins
Vanek
Dowd
Archibald

If two of Dalhen, Pettersson, Gaudette, Gadjovich and/or Lind are able to make the team, that helps but that's a pretty big if to take into next season. Obviously Dowd and Archibald aren't a big deal, but replacing three of the top point getters on the team is going to take some doing.
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Re: Elephant in the Room - Trade the Sedins

Post by Island Nucklehead » Mon Feb 19, 2018 3:52 am

DonCherry4PM wrote:
Sun Feb 18, 2018 9:56 pm

If two of Dalhen, Pettersson, Gaudette, Gadjovich and/or Lind are able to make the team, that helps but that's a pretty big if to take into next season. Obviously Dowd and Archibald aren't a big deal, but replacing three of the top point getters on the team is going to take some doing.
Yeah this is exactly why we should want the Sedins back next year. Some of those guys may make the team, but it’s almost as likely that none of them do. Benning would be forced to replace the Sedins on July 1, and chances are we’d have one-two more contracts we’d grow to hate.

Everyone wants to see the team move on from the Sedin years, but it should happen organically and if they do decide to hang ‘em up this season that might leave too big a gap to fill next season. I’m not sure I like the idea of Sutter, Eriksson and Del Zotto being the go-to mentors starting next fall. Another year under the Sedins would go a long way for Horvat and Boeser, IMO.

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Re: Elephant in the Room - Trade the Sedins

Post by Per » Tue Feb 20, 2018 12:50 am

Island Nucklehead wrote:
Mon Feb 19, 2018 3:52 am
Everyone wants to see the team move on from the Sedin years, but it should happen organically and if they do decide to hang ‘em up this season that might leave too big a gap to fill next season. I’m not sure I like the idea of Sutter, Eriksson and Del Zotto being the go-to mentors starting next fall. Another year under the Sedins would go a long way for Horvat and Boeser, IMO.
Agreed.
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Re: Elephant in the Room - Trade the Sedins

Post by Hockey Widow » Tue Feb 20, 2018 2:50 am

This board can be so schizophrenic sometimes. First, we complain because we have all these aging vets and are not bringing in enough youth. Now we are upset that the twins may not come back and we are f&&cked because we aren’t ready to replace their production yet!! Sheesh. : :mrgreen:

Anyway, don’t think for one moment that the possiblity of trading the twins hasn’t been discussed or broached. Through the media last year and early this seasons Hank was saying all the right things about doing whatever helps the franchise, yada, yada, yada. Daniel was a little more terse in that he was insistent he wanted to retire a Canuck. Then they did that players piece about why retiring a Canuck was important to them.

Benning said all the right things too about them earning the right to determine their own future. But I know for a fact that informal chats took place without anyone coming out directly and asking. More like a feeling out. In the end, push come to shove, if the twins were asked to waive they would CONSIDER it. But they are Swedes and as we have seen in the past with Swedes there is this team loyalty thing.

Benning isn’t shopping them but you can bet if there was serious interest he would CONSIDER asking them to CONSIDER a trade. I say CONSIDER because, like Sundin, it would be a difficult talk to have and an equal chance they’d say no which would leak out and then they get vilified by half the fan base. They don’t deserve that and neither did Sundin.

Now as to them waiting to decide if they come back, what’s the problem with that? One, they need to decide if they have it in them. Two, they need to see what changes occurr. If we were to, say for argument sake, lure Karlsson bet your bottom dollar they’d come back. But if we trade Vanek, Tanev, Edler, Ericksson, I think they retire. Now since none of those two scenarios will happen, they just don’t know yet. It doesn’t hamstring us at all. Benning still needs to do his due diligence as to what players are available July 1 anyway. You think if Tavares calls July first and says I want to play in Vancouver for 9 million per x 7 years Benning will say well geese John I have to wait and see what the twins will do? duh, no. He’ll say sign here please and tell the twins here’s what we can offer you, if you want to come back. But since that scenario isn’t happening.....keep in mind that there is also that week long feeling out process after the draft and before July 1st too. So plenty of time to call the twins and say hey, we have interest from “x” and “y” so we need to know what’s on your mind.

My point is Benning has plenty of time and cap to bring them back if they want to come back. Anything he does from now until free agency he has to do as if they weren’t coming back. If there are deals or signings that make sense you pull the trigger. Much to do about nothing really. But if we try to force them out or embarrass/shame them publicly then they won’t come back, much like Sundin would never return to Toronto. So in that regard you need to respect their process. Wings did that with Lidstrom. Sense didn’t do that with Alfredsson. Think Karlsson didn’t notice?

I’m not the least bit concerned about the process. I’d love it if we could trade them for something but I won’t be upset if we don’t. I’d love them to come back next year, at the right price, but won’t be upset if they don’t. My bet, they re-sign for one more year around 4M - 5M each and we get the goodbye tour.
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Re: Elephant in the Room - Trade the Sedins

Post by RoyalDude » Tue Feb 20, 2018 8:04 am

People, we are not trading the Twins. With possibly 2-3 maybe even 4 rookies making the team next season ya need the Twins around for one more year to mentor in a lesser role on the ice. After next season the kids will be fine without them, Bro and Brock will be good leaders in the room. Demko and Petterson have their heads screwed on right. The team will be fine after next season
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Re: Elephant in the Room - Trade the Sedins

Post by Todd Bersnoozi » Tue Feb 20, 2018 7:49 pm

Island Nucklehead wrote:
Mon Feb 19, 2018 3:52 am
I’m not sure I like the idea of Sutter, Eriksson and Del Zotto being the go-to mentors starting next fall. Another year under the Sedins would go a long way for Horvat and Boeser, IMO.
On the flip side, we might be a point now where the twins are holding the kids back. The future leaders (BoHo + Brockstar) may be hesitant to speak up and take charge as long as the twins are in the dressing room. If the Twins make a mistake that cost them the game, I can't see anyone criticizing them or holding them accountable. I thought even when we had Juice, he wouldn't dare say anything.

Trev was like into his 3rd year when he became Captain Canuck. BoHo will be entering his 5th season and honestly, I think he's ready to be the new leader of this team. Just look back to when he got injured and was out of the lineup, the team completely fell apart and the shit hit the fan. I't's no coincidence that the team is starting to play well again with him back in the lineup. Honestly, if we lost one of the twins for an extended period, I think we can whether the storm, lose BoHo and it's game over.

I'll agree that I don't think Eriksson brings much in the leadership/mentorship department, but I'd disagree with Sutter and MDZ. I think the later are great in the dressing room and with young players. You forgot to mention Eagle, Tanev and Guddy. I think Guddy is the most outspoken of the trio and with him be extended for 3 years, he'll become a part of the leadership team. Eagle and Tanev are more soft spoken, but they are our top 2 guys in the backend. There has been some chatter that we have to keep Tanev, cuz he'll be the perfect mentor for Juolevi.

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Re: Elephant in the Room - Trade the Sedins

Post by Meds » Tue Feb 20, 2018 8:03 pm

Todd Bersnoozi wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2018 7:49 pm
Island Nucklehead wrote:
Mon Feb 19, 2018 3:52 am
I’m not sure I like the idea of Sutter, Eriksson and Del Zotto being the go-to mentors starting next fall. Another year under the Sedins would go a long way for Horvat and Boeser, IMO.
On the flip side, we might be a point now where the twins are holding the kids back. The future leaders (BoHo + Brockstar) may be hesitant to speak up and take charge as long as the twins are in the dressing room. If the Twins make a mistake that cost them the game, I can't see anyone criticizing them or holding them accountable. I thought even when we had Juice, he wouldn't dare say anything.

Trev was like into his 3rd year when he became Captain Canuck. BoHo will be entering his 5th season and honestly, I think he's ready to be the new leader of this team. Just look back to when he got injured and was out of the lineup, the team completely fell apart and the shit hit the fan. I't's no coincidence that the team is starting to play well again with him back in the lineup. Honestly, if we lost one of the twins for an extended period, I think we can whether the storm, lose BoHo and it's game over.

I'll agree that I don't think Eriksson brings much in the leadership/mentorship department, but I'd disagree with Sutter and MDZ. I think the later are great in the dressing room and with young players. You forgot to mention Eagle, Tanev and Guddy. I think Guddy is the most outspoken of the trio and with him be extended for 3 years, he'll become a part of the leadership team. Eagle and Tanev are more soft spoken, but they are our top 2 guys in the backend. There has been some chatter that we have to keep Tanev, cuz he'll be the perfect mentor for Juolevi.
Bo became the unofficial leader of this team during his rookie year when he was the only player to consistently play with maximum effort and excitement during the first round against the Flames. His game had some warts, but nobody looked like they wanted it more than him, and everyone took notice. The only reason this team isn't publicly recognized as Bo's team yet is because internally the Sedins get the respect (not undeserved).

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Re: Elephant in the Room - Trade the Sedins

Post by Todd Bersnoozi » Tue Feb 20, 2018 8:55 pm

Meds wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2018 8:03 pm
Bo became the unofficial leader of this team during his rookie year when he was the only player to consistently play with maximum effort and excitement during the first round against the Flames. His game had some warts, but nobody looked like they wanted it more than him, and everyone took notice. The only reason this team isn't publicly recognized as Bo's team yet is because internally the Sedins get the respect (not undeserved).
Maybe, he had a good rookie year and was good in that series. I remember the sophomore jinx did hit him a bit, losing Bones and Sutter got injured, so Bo was thrust into minutes/matchups he couldn't really handle. Last season (his 3rd year), he was prob our best player and became the "unofficial leader". I really don't know why he doesn't wear the A on some nites.

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Re: Elephant in the Room - Trade the Sedins

Post by $lacker » Tue Feb 20, 2018 9:55 pm

Suggestion was never that they retire or not come back to the Canucks, but a mutual parting for the next 2 months to get the team assets and make them stronger going into next year and giving the Sedins an opportunity to play meaningful hockey again.

There is this thing that they “need” to play for one franchise. Ya it’s nice, and it’s one of those things that gets talked about but who really cares? They will always be known as Canucks, their numbers would be retired etc etc.

There is no intention to show disrespect, just a mutual understanding that it’s what’s best for the franchise. What’s best for the franchise is what is also best for the Sedins. They come back next year, *not* as captain and Co captain, but two very important parts to the team going forward.

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Re: Elephant in the Room - Trade the Sedins

Post by Meds » Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:46 pm

Todd Bersnoozi wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2018 8:55 pm
Meds wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2018 8:03 pm
Bo became the unofficial leader of this team during his rookie year when he was the only player to consistently play with maximum effort and excitement during the first round against the Flames. His game had some warts, but nobody looked like they wanted it more than him, and everyone took notice. The only reason this team isn't publicly recognized as Bo's team yet is because internally the Sedins get the respect (not undeserved).
Maybe, he had a good rookie year and was good in that series. I remember the sophomore jinx did hit him a bit, losing Bones and Sutter got injured, so Bo was thrust into minutes/matchups he couldn't really handle. Last season (his 3rd year), he was prob our best player and became the "unofficial leader". I really don't know why he doesn't wear the A on some nites.
I think he was wearing the "A" a bit at the beginning of this year and the end of last year.

His sophomore jinx was only point production. His intensity never waned. It's the intensity and fire that makes him a leader.

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