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Re: The Bubbles and Dud review every GM move thread

Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 12:19 pm
by ESQ
I seem to recall seeing Blob praising Sweeney for his (apparently) shorter turn-around on the Bruins' rebuild.

Interesting that as bad as Backes has been for the Bruins, his contract isn't holding back the club even though he's not cracking 40 points.

I reckon that'll be the same for the Canucks with Loui once we have a younger core (i.e. the Sedins are gone) and are getting good goaltending.

Again its not defending the signing, but putting it in perspective that its not the end of the world. And the Gaborik/Phaneuf trade shows there could be some value to a low-dollar/high-cap hit Loui in a couple years.

Re: The Bubbles and Dud review every GM move thread

Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 12:25 pm
by Blob Mckenzie
I think that was Island Nucklehead.

I don’t have any problem with the job Sweeney has done and choose to judge managers on their results like a mature person would. Unlike some people on this board that behave like they are 12 and pitch tantrums if people critique Jim Benning, I don’t bash the other 30 NHL GMs for no reason.

Re: The Bubbles and Dud review every GM move thread

Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 12:34 pm
by RoyalDude
Milan isn't even in his 30's. Not a good age to start playing like a geriatric, not with that contract. "What to do with Milan Lucic?" 20 goal drought

Re: The Bubbles and Dud review every GM move thread

Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 3:43 pm
by Meds
RoyalDude wrote:
Fri Feb 16, 2018 11:25 am
Meds wrote:
Thu Feb 15, 2018 8:36 pm
RoyalDude wrote:
Thu Feb 15, 2018 5:54 pm
Update on the big UFA signings of 2016

Okposo - 9 goals 25 assists 34 points
Lucic - 9 goals 21 assists 30 points
Backes - 10 goals 15 assists 25 points
Nielsen - 13 goals 11 assists 24 points
Ladd - 9 goals 12 assists 21 points
Eriksson - 8 goals 12 assists 20 points
Brouwer - 3 goals 12 assists
Okposo's wasn't as bad due to his age. He was 27.

Brouwer's was only $4.5M x 4.

The rest are indeed awful.
Brouwers not bad? Kidding right? 3 goals? Not sure if you've been following but okposo isn't playing very well and his contract is the worst of that bunch. Age doesn't matter.
He will have 2 years left after this season. The rest of those guys are boat anchors for another 3-5 years. I haven't been watching the Flames this year. I see his basic stats line, but I am assuming he still kills penalties responsibly and plays a hard game.

Re: The Bubbles and Dud review every GM move thread

Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 3:48 pm
by Meds
Blob Mckenzie wrote:
Fri Feb 16, 2018 11:57 am
Lucic and Okposo are on pace for 50 points. They are three years younger than Jesse James Eriksson.

Erikssons contract is the shittiest of that group.
At this point yes. In a year or so Lucic and Nielsen will be the worst as Looch is already too slow to be effective anywhere but in front of the net (if he can get there in time) and Nielsen is a pussy. Eriksson still has the speed to be an effective bottom six player.....albeit a grossly overpaid one.

Re: The Bubbles and Dud review every GM move thread

Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 3:52 pm
by Meds
ESQ wrote:
Fri Feb 16, 2018 12:19 pm
I seem to recall seeing Blob praising Sweeney for his (apparently) shorter turn-around on the Bruins' rebuild.

Interesting that as bad as Backes has been for the Bruins, his contract isn't holding back the club even though he's not cracking 40 points.

I reckon that'll be the same for the Canucks with Loui once we have a younger core (i.e. the Sedins are gone) and are getting good goaltending.

Again its not defending the signing, but putting it in perspective that its not the end of the world. And the Gaborik/Phaneuf trade shows there could be some value to a low-dollar/high-cap hit Loui in a couple years.
What was the value there? Gaborik's real dollar value dives off a bit towards the end, but Phaneuf's doesn't......and Ottawa had to retain 25% of Phaneuf's cap hit. The trade was mostly a salary wash in those cases.

Re: The Bubbles and Dud review every GM move thread

Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 6:06 pm
by Strangelove
Meds wrote:
Fri Feb 16, 2018 3:52 pm
ESQ wrote:
Fri Feb 16, 2018 12:19 pm
Again its not defending the signing, but putting it in perspective that its not the end of the world. And the Gaborik/Phaneuf trade shows there could be some value to a low-dollar/high-cap hit Loui in a couple years.
What was the value there? Gaborik's real dollar value dives off a bit towards the end, but Phaneuf's doesn't......and Ottawa had to retain 25% of Phaneuf's cap hit. The trade was mostly a salary wash in those cases.
Here's one way to look at the real dollars savings for Ottawa in that trade assuming they buyout Gabby:

BEFORE: Sens were looking at $24M for 3.5 years of declining Phaneuf + 1.5 years of Thompson.

AFTER: Sens are looking at $15M total on the rest of Phaneuf's retention + bought-out Gaborik.

($2.5M for Gabby for rest of season + $7.2M total over 6 years for a buyout this summer = $9.7M)

(25% retention of Phaneuf's real dollars owed over rest of contract - 3.5 years = $5.3M)

($9.7M + $5.3M = $15M)

(difference between $15M and $24M = $9M savings)

(well they have to pay Shore $400K for the rest of the season)

Moving forward, a re-signed Shore easily replaces the heavily overpaid Thompson at half the salary.

Phaneuf will be replaced internally by a younger cheaper dee.

Phaneuf's contract is what people call "buyout-proof"... but buying out Gabs makes some sense.

Now if the oft-injured Gabby becomes perma-LTIR between now and the off-season

... and if his contract is insured

... Sens will save an extra $7.2M (buyout cost) - $9.7M (buyout + rest of salary this year) in real dollars.

So the total real-dollars savings could end up being as high $16.2M to $18.7M ($9M + $7.2M/$9.7M).

(minus the salaries for the much cheaper Phaneuf/Thompson replacements)

Re: The Bubbles and Dud review every GM move thread

Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 6:29 pm
by Strangelove
Blob Mckenzie wrote:
Fri Feb 16, 2018 11:57 am
Lucic and Okposo are on pace for 50 points. They are three years younger than Jesse James Eriksson.
Lucic is on a 44 point pace over 82 games.

Eriksson is on a 35 point pace over 82 games.

Eriksson is an elite penalty killer who plays a 200 foot game.

Lucic not.

Re: The Bubbles and Dud review every GM move thread

Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 7:25 pm
by Island Nucklehead
Strangelove wrote:
Fri Feb 16, 2018 6:29 pm
Blob Mckenzie wrote:
Fri Feb 16, 2018 11:57 am
Lucic and Okposo are on pace for 50 points. They are three years younger than Jesse James Eriksson.
Lucic is on a 44 point pace over 82 games.

Eriksson is on a 35 point pace over 82 games.

Eriksson is an elite penalty killer who plays a 200 foot game.

Lucic not.
Neither is living up to their deal. Both have been massive disappointments.

Re: The Bubbles and Dud review every GM move thread

Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 7:32 pm
by Island Nucklehead
ESQ wrote:
Fri Feb 16, 2018 12:19 pm
I seem to recall seeing Blob praising Sweeney for his (apparently) shorter turn-around on the Bruins' rebuild.

Interesting that as bad as Backes has been for the Bruins, his contract isn't holding back the club even though he's not cracking 40 points.

I reckon that'll be the same for the Canucks with Loui once we have a younger core (i.e. the Sedins are gone) and are getting good goaltending.

Again its not defending the signing, but putting it in perspective that its not the end of the world. And the Gaborik/Phaneuf trade shows there could be some value to a low-dollar/high-cap hit Loui in a couple years.
Backes has played 38 games. He's playing at a 50+ point pace.

Re: The Bubbles and Dud review every GM move thread

Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 7:38 pm
by ESQ
Island Nucklehead wrote:
Fri Feb 16, 2018 7:32 pm

Backes has played 38 games. He's playing at a 50+ point pace.
Ya, I wasn't really worried about all the points Backes might have scored in games he wasn't playing in.

Re: The Bubbles and Dud review every GM move thread

Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 7:41 pm
by Blob Mckenzie
Strangelove wrote:
Fri Feb 16, 2018 6:29 pm
Blob Mckenzie wrote:
Fri Feb 16, 2018 11:57 am
Lucic and Okposo are on pace for 50 points. They are three years younger than Jesse James Eriksson.
Lucic is on a 44 point pace over 82 games.

Eriksson is on a 35 point pace over 82 games.

Eriksson is an elite penalty killer who plays a 200 foot game.

Lucic not.
Lucic recently slipped below that level. Erikssons totals are lifted by EN goals. Lucic plays a heavy game and is an intimidating presence. Eriksson plays as though he was 140 pounds and is often terrified of contact.

Re: The Bubbles and Dud review every GM move thread

Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 7:45 pm
by Island Nucklehead
ESQ wrote:
Fri Feb 16, 2018 7:38 pm
Island Nucklehead wrote:
Fri Feb 16, 2018 7:32 pm

Backes has played 38 games. He's playing at a 50+ point pace.
Ya, I wasn't really worried about all the points Backes might have scored in games he wasn't playing in.
So points/game doesn't factor in at all. Anything to help the narrative, eh?

Re: The Bubbles and Dud review every GM move thread

Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 7:47 pm
by Island Nucklehead
Blob Mckenzie wrote:
Fri Feb 16, 2018 7:41 pm
Lucic recently slipped below that level. Erikssons totals are lifted by EN goals. Lucic plays a heavy game and is an intimidating presence. Eriksson plays as though he was 140 pounds and is often terrified of contact.
The funny thing is we could really use what Lucic brings, and the Oilers could probably use what Eriksson brings. Trade?

Re: The Bubbles and Dud review every GM move thread

Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 7:55 pm
by Meds
Island Nucklehead wrote:
Fri Feb 16, 2018 7:47 pm
Blob Mckenzie wrote:
Fri Feb 16, 2018 7:41 pm
Lucic recently slipped below that level. Erikssons totals are lifted by EN goals. Lucic plays a heavy game and is an intimidating presence. Eriksson plays as though he was 140 pounds and is often terrified of contact.
The funny thing is we could really use what Lucic brings, and the Oilers could probably use what Eriksson brings. Trade?
I’d do it if Edmonton would retain $1.5M per year of Lucic’s salary.