Competitive and/or Contending

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Strangelove
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Re: Competitive and/or Contending

Post by Strangelove » Mon Jul 31, 2017 3:22 pm

Mondi wrote: Some posters around here should go and get some sun, and avoid thinking about the Canucks for a few days. Could do us all some good, right?!
Agreed, I just got back from a few days of dat dere (thanks for noticing Reef) and look at me! :D
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Strangelove
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Re: Competitive and/or Contending

Post by Strangelove » Mon Jul 31, 2017 3:33 pm

Reefer2 [color=#FF0000]to RoyalDude[/color] wrote: Anyways I'm done with ya brother, you are nothing but a Polly.
Thank God because that was the 5th time in 1 week that you cluttered this forum with that insult.

As someone (who just called someone else a complete and utter fool) said 48 minutes ago in this thread

... it ain't right to "be little other posters"! :lol:

Ever feel you're a semi-illiterate uncouth hypocritical kettle in a world full of pots Mr Reefer? :D
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Topper
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Re: Competitive and/or Contending

Post by Topper » Mon Jul 31, 2017 3:42 pm

Reef, good grief?
Over the Internet, you can pretend to be anyone or anything.

I'm amazed that so many people choose to be complete twats.

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Cornuck
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Re: Competitive and/or Contending

Post by Cornuck » Mon Jul 31, 2017 4:24 pm

Mondi wrote:FWIW, I don't think Canucks will make the playoffs this year or next. But, I can see the argument about how they might. I also don't think GMJB is a genius, nor do I feel he has been above the league average GM over these past three years. However, he's amassed a nice group of up-and-coming players, and seems to have the team pointed in the right direction. If he stays the course (i.e. no more Loui Eriksson-type shit), a corner will be turned. And, if they draft Rhamus Dhalin, I believe that will improve their chances in 18-19. At this point, I think they might be looking at a playoff spot in 19-20.
The corner will be turned if the prospects turn into NHL players. Until that time, we're really all in the dark and just hoping someone turns the light on.
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Mondi
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Re: Competitive and/or Contending

Post by Mondi » Mon Jul 31, 2017 5:13 pm

Oh I agree, but I mean there is certainly some precedent for this team, and others, to start turning the corner when a critical mass of prospects is obtained. Some will hit. Others will miss. But ultimately, yes, we are in the dark. We can make predictions tough, can't we? :mex:

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Strangelove
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Re: Competitive and/or Contending

Post by Strangelove » Mon Jul 31, 2017 5:31 pm

Mondi wrote:I think they might be looking at a playoff spot in 19-20.
Mondi wrote:We can make predictions tough, can't we? :mex:
Well you can but you may have to deal with Ronning's Ghost, 5thhorseman, and Reefer2

.... demanding that you quantify your "playoff spot in 19-20" prediction. :twisted:

They may want to know exactly how many points the team gets in 19-20.

They may want to know exactly how many playoff games they win.

They may hound you for months on end.

They may accuse you of making your prediction only because you want to brag about being right one day.

(aka "one-upmanship")

But yes, you... can. :wink:
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Strangelove
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Re: Competitive and/or Contending

Post by Strangelove » Mon Jul 31, 2017 5:35 pm

Cornuck wrote: The corner will be turned if the prospects turn into NHL players. Until that time, we're really all in the dark and just hoping someone turns on the light.
When that happens, the Corner will be turned on. :D
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Re: Competitive and/or Contending

Post by Ronning's Ghost » Mon Jul 31, 2017 5:57 pm

Strangelove wrote:I can't help but suspect you're being purposely obtuse...
The question of projecting has been raised, but no, I will just admit that my hockey knowledge pales before yours and I need extra guidance.
Strangelove wrote:As for "what round of the playoffs"... that is not relevant.
Playoff performance is not relevant ? Well, that certainly gets full points for a bold assertion.
Strangelove wrote:But I already "quantified" plenty. :eh:

(time-frame, how good the team will be, how big of a role young players will play)
1) Time frame: 2018-2019 -- check
2) How good the team will be:
a) good enough to make the playoffs -- well, that establishes a minimum
b) "look good" -- not so quantifiable
3) how big a role young players will play -- sorry, I seem to have missed that one. Would the Master of the Archives care to provide a link ?
Strangelove wrote:You dogs are not going to get a more quantified prediction than this on a fucking Canucks message board.
Well, you have to give to get, I suppose. Here's mine:

The Canucks will win fewer than 3 playoff games in 2019, and will score fewer than 8 playoff goals.

Now, my predictions are of lesser weight than the Great Strangelove's, of course, because
1) I am not a Canuckscorner Legend
and
2) As previously admitted, my hockey knowledge pales before his
but

They are undeniably measurable.
Strangelove wrote:They may accuse you of making your prediction only because you want to brag about being right one day.
Now please be fair. I acknowledged that your motives were pure (and, more importantly, relevant); that is, you mean to address the question of how we will assess the success of Jim Benning's rebuild. As do I.
Strangelove wrote:In that case Cliffy, would you kindly stop nipping at my heels like some deranged chihuahua? :D
If my questions annoy you, you needn't respond, but if you are going to go to the bother of responding, why not answer the questions ? Specifically, the follow-up to that statement:
Ronning's Ghost wrote:....if the Canucks win zero games in the 2019 Stanley Cup Playoffs (whether because they are swept, or fail to qualify), will you, Doc, admit that Benning's rebuild effort has been less than worthy of the appellation "genius" ?

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Re: Competitive and/or Contending

Post by Strangelove » Mon Jul 31, 2017 6:56 pm

Ronning's Ghost wrote:
Strangelove wrote:But I already "quantified" plenty. :eh:

(time-frame, how good the team will be, how big of a role young players will play)

I can't help but suspect you're being purposely obtuse...
The question of projecting has been raised, but no, I will just admit that my hockey knowledge pales before yours and I need extra guidance.
Hmmm... purposely obtuse, passively aggressive, and a patently insincere praiser!

This is quite a case!!! :)
Ronning's Ghost wrote:
Strangelove wrote:As for "what round of the playoffs"... that is not relevant.

What is relevant is where I said:

"My Canucks will look good enough (in said playoffs) to give us all plenty of hope for the future".

("We will all be talking about how far they will go the next playoffs and how long the window will be open")

You dogs are not going to get a more quantified prediction than this on a fucking Canucks message board.
Playoff performance is not relevant ? Well, that certainly gets full points for a bold assertion.
Well I most certainly did indicate 'playoff performance is relevant'. :eh:

What round they make it to in their first taste of playoff action... is what I called irrelevant.

Purposely obtuse Cliffy?
Ronning's Ghost wrote:
Strangelove wrote:But I already "quantified" plenty. :eh:

(time-frame, how good the team will be, how big of a role young players will play)
1) Time frame: 2018-2019 -- check
2) How good the team will be:
a) good enough to make the playoffs -- well, that establishes a minimum
b) "look good" -- not so quantifiable
3) how big a role young players will play -- sorry, I seem to have missed that one. Would the Master of the Archives care to provide a link ?
2a) :roll:

2b) How about "look good enough to get everyone on this board excited about the future"? :hmmm:

3) I've said it many times and I'm not on trial... try re-reading my last dozen posts in this thread. :scowl:

(also it should be obvious that young players would play a huge role in any success in that timeframe)
Ronning's Ghost wrote:
Strangelove wrote:They may accuse you of making your prediction only because you want to brag about being right one day.
Now please be fair. I acknowledged that your motives were pure (and, more importantly, relevant); that is, you mean to address the question of how we will assess the success of Jim Benning's rebuild. As do I.
True, but you also seemed to (twice) lend credence some of 5thhorseman's accusations.

Ronning's Ghost wrote:
Strangelove wrote:In that case Cliffy, would you kindly stop nipping at my heels like some deranged chihuahua? :D
If my questions annoy you, you needn't respond...
Tried that.

You persisted.

And you continued to complain to others that I hadn't answered your questions to your satisfaction.

*swats Cliffy with rolled-up newspaper* :D
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Re: Competitive and/or Contending

Post by Ronning's Ghost » Mon Jul 31, 2017 11:23 pm

Strangelove wrote:Purposely obtuse Cliffy?
I honestly, sincerely, just want to avoid any leaps of inference that could be construed as putting words in your mouth. If you spell it out, then that doesn't happen, even by accident.
Strangelove wrote:But I already "quantified" plenty. :eh:

2b) How about "look good enough to get everyone on this board excited about the future"? :hmmm:
Well that's just setting yourself up for failure. Even if you polled everyone on this board (even though, as you [patiently] explained to me, you hate polls) about whether they were excited about the [Canucks'] future, you would need only one sourpuss holdout to fail.

Some might be interested in the question of whether creating excitement in the fanbase is one of the measures of GM success, though. Not me, as it turns out, but maybe some other posters want to toss that one around.
Strangelove wrote:3) I've said it many times and I'm not on trial
Certainly not ! Though perhaps, feeling a little guilty ?
Strangelove wrote:They may accuse you of making your prediction only because you want to brag about being right one day.
Ronning's Ghost wrote:Now please be fair. I acknowledged that your motives were pure (and, more importantly, relevant); that is, you mean to address the question of how we will assess the success of Jim Benning's rebuild. As do I.
True, but you also seemed to (twice) lend credence some of 5thhorseman's accusations.
I accuse you of nothing beyond refusing to give measurable answers to questions, and I acknowledge (here, again -- as before) that that is certainly your right.
Strangelove wrote:
Ronning's Ghost wrote:
Strangelove wrote:In that case Cliffy, would you kindly stop nipping at my heels like some deranged chihuahua? :D
If my questions annoy you, you needn't respond...
Tried that.

You persisted.

And you continued to complain to others that I hadn't answered your questions to your satisfaction.

*swats Cliffy with rolled-up newspaper* :D
I was not aware my questions carried such force. But as you may certainly ignore (or prevaricate upon -- whichever your preference) my questions, I may continue to ask, and to point out when we don't have answers.

TL/DR-vulnerable poster start point:
But really, all this chasing after predictions is just overture to the real question, namely: whatever the results, how do we interpret them ? That is, what kind and degree of Canucks on-ice success will indicate that Jim Benning has done a masterful [Genius-level] job of the rebuild to that point, and what level will indicate that he has not ?

For my own part, (as previously offered), I believe that six playoff victories in 2019, of whatever sort, would indicate success. I also believe that zero playoff victories would indicate failure.

I would be interested in The Great Strangelove's more weighty opinion on the matter, but if he declines to offer it, that is, of course, his prerogative.

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Re: Competitive and/or Contending

Post by Reefer2 » Tue Aug 01, 2017 8:00 am

Canucks will become serious contenders after the 2020 season.

By this time the prospects we have now will be at the right age with the right contracts, the vets can be UFA and they help bring in leadership.

My hope is that the Nucks pick top 5 again this year to give them the depth they need.

If you look at the stats from 10 years ago a lot more players have over a point a game, now it is only a handful. Our top point getters should be 60-80 points and we will be ok. Because I'm such an old guy I still have problems paying a lot of money to someone who only gets 50 points.

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Re: Competitive and/or Contending

Post by micky107 » Tue Aug 01, 2017 9:06 am

Reefer2 wrote:Canucks will become serious contenders after the 2020 season.

By this time the prospects we have now will be at the right age with the right contracts, the vets can be UFA and they help bring in leadership.

My hope is that the Nucks pick top 5 again this year to give them the depth they need.

If you look at the stats from 10 years ago a lot more players have over a point a game, now it is only a handful. Our top point getters should be 60-80 points and we will be ok. Because I'm such an old guy I still have problems paying a lot of money to someone who only gets 50 points.
Reef, get over the big 50 man. Your still young enough to concur whatever you want to.

I am like so totally dun, dun, dun with hoping for shitty seasons for a top 10 pick, fuck it!
I'm going to root like hell for a playoff birth this year and the only lottery I want to hear about is the 6/49 or
Lotto Max that I am going to win...........
Damn Straight :drink:
Better chance of that, IMHO. :devil:
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Re: Competitive and/or Contending

Post by SKYO » Tue Aug 01, 2017 10:49 am

micky107 wrote:
Reefer2 wrote:Canucks will become serious contenders after the 2020 season.

By this time the prospects we have now will be at the right age with the right contracts, the vets can be UFA and they help bring in leadership.

My hope is that the Nucks pick top 5 again this year to give them the depth they need.
I am like so totally dun, dun, dun with hoping for shitty seasons for a top 10 pick, fuck it!

I'm going to root like hell for a playoff birth this year..
How about a compromise, try to make playoffs...

but to add to Reefer's hope to get another high pick, how about we move one dman for a 2018 1st + prospect, that way we have two 1st rounders in what should be a deeper draft next year.
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Re: Competitive and/or Contending

Post by micky107 » Tue Aug 01, 2017 11:11 am

SKYO wrote:
micky107 wrote:
Reefer2 wrote:Canucks will become serious contenders after the 2020 season.

By this time the prospects we have now will be at the right age with the right contracts, the vets can be UFA and they help bring in leadership.

My hope is that the Nucks pick top 5 again this year to give them the depth they need.
I am like so totally dun, dun, dun with hoping for shitty seasons for a top 10 pick, fuck it!

I'm going to root like hell for a playoff birth this year..
How about a compromise, try to make playoffs...

but to add to Reefer's hope to get another high pick, how about we move one dman for a 2018 1st + prospect, that way we have two 1st rounders in what should be a deeper draft next year.
Disappointing the fans another year for one--Boo, hiss....
The appropriate trade for one-- :rockin:
"evolution"

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Re: Competitive and/or Contending

Post by Reefer2 » Tue Aug 01, 2017 12:12 pm

How about a top 5 pick and another 20-25 puck Skyo.

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