2017/18 Canucks head coach search

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vic
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Re: 2017/18 Canucks head coach search

Post by vic »

I don't think there has ever been an NHL coach that has won a cup with his team after 4 years of coaching.

What I mean is if your coach can't win a cup in his first four years on the job, he'll never win you a cup. If he does win a cup on those first four, he may win another in year 5 or 8 or 10 ...etc. The point is the FIRST has to be won in the first four years.

Green has two years.

John Cooper is in year 5 ... he could buck the trend.
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Re: 2017/18 Canucks head coach search

Post by 5thhorseman »

vic wrote: Mon Mar 04, 2019 2:42 pm I don't think there has ever been an NHL coach that has won a cup with his team after 4 years of coaching.

What I mean is if your coach can't win a cup in his first four years on the job, he'll never win you a cup. If he does win a cup on those first four, he may win another in year 5 or 8 or 10 ...etc. The point is the FIRST has to be won in the first four years.

Green has two years.

John Cooper is in year 5 ... he could buck the trend.
That could be because they are more often than not fired before 4 years are up. The average tenure of an NHL head coach is less than 3.5.

Take a look at the list of current coaches. Only 3 of 31 have been around more than 4 years.
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Re: 2017/18 Canucks head coach search

Post by UWSaint »

SKYO wrote: Mon Mar 04, 2019 1:42 pm But man Quenneville? he's an awesome coach!
I think that over the course of the season, we have seen the Canucks pressure the play (both offensively and defensively) less and less. If this team wants to play a "new NHL game," that is Quenneville's. He's the godfather. And Green has a wavering commitment to it, and we are back to lots of cross ice passing, quasi-trapping, and a style built for slow and/or unskilled teams. And goodness knows that they can't make a tape to tape pass with speed. Possibly this is really the result of injuries -- you can't play a pressure game if your personnel can't play the game. (Pressure means taking away time and space, but it also means moving the offensive game in a way that prevents them from countering with form). That personnel problem is both due to injuries (No Tanev and Hutton to start or skate the puck up ice, noticeable lack of down-the-lineup speed with Sutter and JV injuries) and also personnel decisions (Leivo, for example, may give you the hands and the shot for a top 6 player, but he doesn't play a new NHL transition game).

Perhaps this is the result of the team trying (and failing) to play a game that has the most chance of getting them wins and that was the downside of having been in a playoff race banged up. But that comes at the sacrifice of continuing a process -- and it hasn't helped win games at all.
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Re: 2017/18 Canucks head coach search

Post by SKYO »

Yeah I'll cut Green some slack as the main players were injured quite a bit, as when the team was fully healthy this team played better.

I'd like to see what he can do if this team can draft another quality forward, hopefully with a EKarlsson + Q Hughes.
& maybe trade for another top 6 scoring winger + if can't sign EK, maybe trade for a right shot QB.

But I think we need some new coaching juice by letting Newell Brown go, and getting someone more tactical & fluid who can adapt to any defensive strategy thrown at them.
A long time ago, a baseball player remarked: "If I owned a ballclub, I'd hire a $5,000 coach and a $15,000 scout."
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Re: 2017/18 Canucks head coach search

Post by The Brown Wizard »

If quenville is available we have to move green to assistant or something. Its not like he accomplished enough to buy himself another year over a legend coach like JQ
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Re: 2017/18 Canucks head coach search

Post by Madcombinepilot »

But I think we need some new coaching juice by letting Newell Brown go, and getting someone more tactical & fluid who can adapt to any defensive strategy thrown at them.
when players cant send or receive a pass, its not on the coaches.
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Re: 2017/18 Canucks head coach search

Post by SKYO »

Madcombinepilot wrote: Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:46 am
But I think we need some new coaching juice by letting Newell Brown go, and getting someone more tactical & fluid who can adapt to any defensive strategy thrown at them.
when players cant send or receive a pass, its not on the coaches.
Which is why I'm cutting him slack, and like to see what he can do if we do indeed sign Erik Karlsson.

Between Q Hughes and Karlsson that's two machines that can precisely help with the breakout and transition much more effectively into the opposition zone.

& hope to god we get another sniper or two in the top 6.

Uncle dans leg wrote: Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:45 am If quenville is available we have to move green to assistant or something. Its not like he accomplished enough to buy himself another year over a legend coach like JQ

It would probably cost about $6M per to sign the great Joel Quenneville, similar to Babcock.
A long time ago, a baseball player remarked: "If I owned a ballclub, I'd hire a $5,000 coach and a $15,000 scout."
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Re: 2017/18 Canucks head coach search

Post by Micky »

Madcombinepilot wrote: Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:46 am
But I think we need some new coaching juice by letting Newell Brown go, and getting someone more tactical & fluid who can adapt to any defensive strategy thrown at them.
when players cant send or receive a pass, its not on the coaches.
Not at all ?
Why is it getting worse as the year goes on ?
We don't have a team full of stars but the style of play that the coaches are implementing, I think, can have something to do with
players not being or getting to a position to make or receive passes fluidly.
I will admit this has been one of the toughest schedules the Canucks have ever had and "GOOD", practices have been a luxury, not the norm.
It has hurt.
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Re: 2017/18 Canucks head coach search

Post by Madcombinepilot »

micky107 wrote: Mon Mar 11, 2019 11:09 am
Madcombinepilot wrote: Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:46 am
But I think we need some new coaching juice by letting Newell Brown go, and getting someone more tactical & fluid who can adapt to any defensive strategy thrown at them.
when players cant send or receive a pass, its not on the coaches.
Not at all ?
Why is it getting worse as the year goes on ?
We don't have a team full of stars but the style of play that the coaches are implementing, I think, can have something to do with
players not being or getting to a position to make or receive passes fluidly.
I will admit this has been one of the toughest schedules the Canucks have ever had and "GOOD", practices have been a luxury, not the norm.
It has hurt.
any stats to back that up? and get some individual stats as well as team while your looking :P

I would say that it hasn't gotten worse as the year has gone on, just as the injuries piled up - and our skill level dropped - it was more apparent. Individuals are most likely hitting their regular averages, just the team averages got worse as the skill level dropped. Now, I would be interested to see if there is a corresponding drop in the last 4-5 games as the players have come to realize there is no playoffs this year.. anybody know if there is someone tracking that kind of stuff??
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Re: 2017/18 Canucks head coach search

Post by Micky »

There is much love for TG, here. the media, not many want to blame anything at all on him.
I wouldn't be so stubborn to just outright say, HE, is our biggest problem. I do, however think he takes the tough love thing to far
at times. I would like to see a little less authority given to the assistants.

Whatever, if Quenville was an option I would take it.

No, it's not the time of year now that we are going to see the best play from the roster we have, but;

If our four best players are; Horvat, Pettersson, Boeser and Markstrom, I cannot give Green and his staff credit for their success,
Horvat was already good and Boeser and Pettersson arrived good, real good. They have all been slumping for well over a month.
Ian Clarke gets big time credit for turning Markstrom's career around!!
In regards to Jake. I think Jake is fickle. As a matter a fact, I'm guessing a few of his team mates have helped him out quite a bit
this year. Maybe Green too, but too much tough love can hurt a Jake or a Goldy too.
Sorry, Mick needs a lesson in how to not say too, too much.
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Re: 2017/18 Canucks head coach search

Post by The Brown Wizard »

SKYO wrote: Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:48 am
Madcombinepilot wrote: Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:46 am
But I think we need some new coaching juice by letting Newell Brown go, and getting someone more tactical & fluid who can adapt to any defensive strategy thrown at them.
when players cant send or receive a pass, its not on the coaches.
Which is why I'm cutting him slack, and like to see what he can do if we do indeed sign Erik Karlsson.

Between Q Hughes and Karlsson that's two machines that can precisely help with the breakout and transition much more effectively into the opposition zone.

& hope to god we get another sniper or two in the top 6.

Uncle dans leg wrote: Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:45 am If quenville is available we have to move green to assistant or something. Its not like he accomplished enough to buy himself another year over a legend coach like JQ

It would probably cost about $6M per to sign the great Joel Quenneville, similar to Babcock.
Fucking rights offer him 10 so he cant refuse. Its not our money skyo. I dont take pity on billionaires spending a couple more million on their amusement
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Re: 2017/18 Canucks head coach search

Post by Doyle Hargraves »

You’ve stated your opinion Mick. My point is that Green is probably an average to decent coach. He has gotten a hamburger roster that people expect him to turn into prime rib. There’s a lack of talent and depth and speed and tenacity once again. Rinse, repeat. Elmer is NOT going to be gassing a coach again this quickly. He will be called on the carpet to answer for his abortion of a roster before he gasses another coach. Hoping for Joel Quenneville is a dream. And if they do land Coach Q, Elmer will have gotten the boot.
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Re: 2017/18 Canucks head coach search

Post by Micky »

Blob Mckenzie wrote: Mon Mar 11, 2019 12:00 pm You’ve stated your opinion Mick. My point is that Green is probably an average to decent coach. He has gotten a hamburger roster that people expect him to turn into prime rib. There’s a lack of talent and depth and speed and tenacity once again. Rinse, repeat. Elmer is NOT going to be gassing a coach again this quickly. He will be called on the carpet to answer for his abortion of a roster before he gasses another coach. Hoping for Joel Quenneville is a dream. And if they do land Coach Q, Elmer will have gotten the boot.
Would you at least upgrade the special teams coaches?
We have seen this team play well this year and when they play that way, it almost seems like their playing for each other.
I admit though, haven't liked a couple of the recent additions to the team.
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Re: 2017/18 Canucks head coach search

Post by SKYO »

Uncle dans leg wrote: Mon Mar 11, 2019 11:56 am
SKYO wrote: Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:48 am It would probably cost about $6M per to sign the great Joel Quenneville, similar to Babcock.
Fucking rights offer him 10 so he cant refuse. Its not our money skyo. I dont take pity on billionaires spending a couple more million on their amusement
Aha well if this team was savage and ruthless they'd do that, & couldn't blame em if they did - I mean Babcock and Barry Trotz have turned their teams around with astute and veteran savvy coaching experience.
A long time ago, a baseball player remarked: "If I owned a ballclub, I'd hire a $5,000 coach and a $15,000 scout."
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Re: 2017/18 Canucks head coach search

Post by Doyle Hargraves »

Absolutely an assistant or two is going to walk the plank
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