Expansion draft

Welcome to the main forum of our site. Anything and everything to do with the Vancouver Canucks is dicussed and debated here.

Moderator: Referees

Expansion draft

Postby bckev » Thu Apr 06, 2017 6:42 am

https://canucksarmy.com/2017/04/04/gaun ... ion-draft/

I think this is a good article on how we can maneuver around the expansion draft. I would not expect to see a lot of rfa signings until after the draft. This also helps explain the Megna signing a little more, we needed another body that we would don't care if we lose. As much as we need a good balance of vets, I hope they take Dorset. I expect Sbisa to be traded before the draft, so our primary bodies available will be Dorset, Megna and Biega. They might dip into our RFA but I think with only be able to take 10 rfa there is probably going to be better ones available.
bckev
CC Veteran
 
Posts: 185
Joined: Mon Jul 29, 2013 9:53 am

Re: Expansion draft

Postby Blob Mckenzie » Thu Apr 06, 2017 6:49 am

bckev wrote:https://canucksarmy.com/2017/04/04/gaunce-and-the-expansion-draft/

I think this is a good article on how we can maneuver around the expansion draft. I would not expect to see a lot of rfa signings until after the draft. This also helps explain the Megna signing a little more, we needed another body that we would don't care if we lose. As much as we need a good balance of vets, I hope they take Dorset. I expect Sbisa to be traded before the draft, so our primary bodies available will be Dorset, Megna and Biega. They might dip into our RFA but I think with only be able to take 10 rfa there is probably going to be better ones available.


Lol I don't think the Canucks have much to worry about. A better question is can they protect ten decent skaters. Anyone they lose in this draft will be of little to no consequence in the long term. Teams with actual depth on the other hand......
TELL ME HOW MY ASS TASTES
User avatar
Blob Mckenzie
CC Legend
 
Posts: 7876
Joined: Wed Aug 11, 2004 12:34 pm
Location: Oakalla

Re: Expansion draft

Postby Reefer2 » Thu Apr 06, 2017 7:01 am

Blob Mckenzie wrote:
bckev wrote:https://canucksarmy.com/2017/04/04/gaunce-and-the-expansion-draft/

I think this is a good article on how we can maneuver around the expansion draft. I would not expect to see a lot of rfa signings until after the draft. This also helps explain the Megna signing a little more, we needed another body that we would don't care if we lose. As much as we need a good balance of vets, I hope they take Dorset. I expect Sbisa to be traded before the draft, so our primary bodies available will be Dorset, Megna and Biega. They might dip into our RFA but I think with only be able to take 10 rfa there is probably going to be better ones available.


Lol I don't think the Canucks have much to worry about. A better question is can they protect ten decent skaters. Anyone they lose in this draft will be of little to no consequence in the long term. Teams with actual depth on the other hand......


Agreed, even if we lost Sibisa or Sutter no lose except for what we could of received for them in a trade.
User avatar
Reefer2
CC Hall of Fan Member
 
Posts: 2685
Joined: Wed Jan 04, 2012 8:47 am

Re: Expansion draft

Postby Tciso » Thu Apr 06, 2017 7:17 am

I quit reading the CanucksArmy site a few months ago, as their coverage of the expansion draft just keeps getting crazier and crazier. Our top 7 forwards that will be protected are all a lock (including Sutter), and Sbisa will be exposed, unless the team exposes Edler instead, or manages to trade Edler.

Gaunce isn't even in the team's long term plans, unless he figures out the NHL game in a big hurry. On a team starved for offense, a mediocre 4th line forward with exactly ZERO goals is not a valued commodity. Skille, Cramarossa, Dorsett and Virtanen are all miles ahead of Gaunce for the 4th line, just to name a few.
The Cup is soooooo ours!!!!!!!
User avatar
Tciso
CC Hall of Fan Member
 
Posts: 1557
Joined: Thu Sep 25, 2008 9:44 am

Re: Expansion draft

Postby SKYO » Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:22 am

Should expose Sutter and protect Gauncy, they are polar opposites in the advanced metrics game. Sutter is a poor possession player, always has had bad analytics and makes his wingers worse thanks to his poor passing game.

Brandon was once rated one of the most overrated players in the game.

On a strong possession team, Sutter’s 47.5 percent rate is nearly the worst among regulars. Depth that can tilt the ice has become crucial in the NHL. At least he’s won 50% of his faceoffs.


It's no wonder Rutherford kept trading him.

http://thehockeywriters.com/brandon-sut ... -six-wing/

While Sutter might be a fan favorite, he is also a tremendously overrated player. He’s weak along the boards, ineffective at generating shots and usually lowers the level of play of his wings.

In fact, Sutter was ranked on Jimmy Hascup’s six most overrated players in the NHL today.


You can see that Sutter is given almost second-line time on ice, but his production and shot differential is not adequate for his position. Additionally, he has a reputation of being a strong player on the penalty kill, but when utilizing advanced metrics he is one of the worst in the league.

His Fenwick Against (4v5) per sixty minutes played is 75.42, that ranks 110 of 139 players who were on the ice for over 200 shorthanded minutes.

Whether or not you agree with advanced metrics, he is a over-hyped player..


Vegas would love to snap him up.

HOWEVER if the team and new coach can view these metrics and we do keep Sutter I really do hope they convert him to RW full time (just not with the Sedins as they played worse with him on their line) - but use him as a faceoff specialist.

STILL I hope they just let Vegas have him, we could use Sbisa as a #6/#7 guy, and the team needs to find a new #3C that can generate a strong possession game and be a great playmaker, whether that guy is drafted or traded for a guy like Johnson from TB, or a college ufa in mid-august.
Canucks 2017/18
A NEW HOPE
User avatar
SKYO
CC Legend
 
Posts: 7988
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2011 10:34 pm

Re: Expansion draft

Postby ESQ » Sat Apr 22, 2017 10:34 am

I would be okay with throwing a pick at Vegas to take Dorsett.

I really don't think he has a spot on this team, and that type of surgery on that type of player could be the end of his NHL career.
ESQ
CC Hall of Fan Member
 
Posts: 1279
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2011 6:34 pm

Re: Expansion draft

Postby Hockey Widow » Sat Apr 22, 2017 2:39 pm

I think Dorsett will be fine. In his end of year presser he said he will be 100% before camp. I don't mind Dorsett on a team almost void of aggression. What we need is someone like a Cramarrosa to learn the mean mans game and be ready to take over that role.

I really think, I know I've said it a million times, Benning needs to deal one of Sbisa, Tanev or Edler rather than risk losing one for nothing. Losing Trymakin doe a strong change that for me.


Losing Gaunce is no big deal. Really.

I don't see them exposing Sutter but if they do then I can see Vegas taking him. They should ask the twins for permission to be exposed. And Eriksson. Now that would be a hoot. :mrgreen:
The only HW the Canucks need
User avatar
Hockey Widow
CC Legend
 
Posts: 11588
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2011 8:52 pm

Re: Expansion draft

Postby Island Nucklehead » Sat Apr 22, 2017 3:25 pm

Hockey Widow wrote:I really think, I know I've said it a million times, Benning needs to deal one of Sbisa, Tanev or Edler rather than risk losing one for nothing. Losing Trymakin doe a strong change that for me.


I guess it depends on the return. Any team acquiring those guys would then have to protect them, so values will be lower. It might make more sense to send Vegas a draft pick to take a guy like Biega or Dorsett and then trade them for a bigger return post-draft.

Either way, losing one year of Sbisa is not a big deal. Use his money and go into UFA looking for a mediocre guy like Stone or Del Zotto. Or try to get a bonafide top-4 like Alzner. For shits and giggles, kick the tires on someone like Deryk Engelland. Actually give this team some stones.
User avatar
Island Nucklehead
CC Legend
 
Posts: 7315
Joined: Wed Sep 07, 2005 2:27 pm
Location: Ottawa

Re: Expansion draft

Postby SKYO » Thu Apr 27, 2017 5:38 pm

Back to Sutter - a two time winning General Manger has traded Sutter twice away from his teams, Canes and Pens.

Analytic's are not on Sutter side, 5on5, everyone on his line suffers due his mind and skillset, imo he can't multi-task, he's either gung-ho on trying to score & then his defense suffer's, not to mention his wingers suffer as he can't pass.

Sutter is at his best just defending, but he's paid to score.

In the perfect world he'd be on the 4th line, so he can scrum it out with Gaunce and Dorsett leading a energy line, and they don't need a playmaker just a rambunctious energy guy, which Sutter can be.

OR we let Vegas have him, and we can continue to use Chaput as the #4C.
Canucks 2017/18
A NEW HOPE
User avatar
SKYO
CC Legend
 
Posts: 7988
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2011 10:34 pm

Re: Expansion draft

Postby Island Nucklehead » Thu Apr 27, 2017 6:39 pm

If Sutter is to be pencilled in as 4th C, then we should give him away.

Benning brought him in and signed him to be a 2C, and he hasn't been that. Lots of debate around the "foundational" potential of this guy, but after being "stuck" behind Crosby and Malkin, he hasn't been about to take the 2C job on one of the worst teams in hockey. Telling.

He's a straight-line player who doesn't distribute well and isn't physical or intimidating. He's a decidedly average player. That said, he's an adequate 3C, and we're not about to need the cap space anytime soon, so I don't see a massive need to flush him for nothing.
User avatar
Island Nucklehead
CC Legend
 
Posts: 7315
Joined: Wed Sep 07, 2005 2:27 pm
Location: Ottawa

Re: Expansion draft

Postby Madcombinepilot » Fri Apr 28, 2017 7:20 am

It would also be interesting to see what his numbers looked like if he played with wingers with any skill..

No offence, but this team had guys on it who actually made other good players worse (ahem* Megma, Chaput)
Sutter looked ok when playing with Grandlund or Ericson.. perhaps if we are healthy enough he can get to play with actual NHL players this year and not some of the scrubs he was stuck with last year.
The 'Chain of Command' is the chain I am going to beat you with until you understand I am in charge.
User avatar
Madcombinepilot
MVP
MVP
 
Posts: 2428
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2004 9:54 am
Location: Saskatoon, Sk.

Re: Expansion draft

Postby ESQ » Fri Apr 28, 2017 9:18 am

Island Nucklehead wrote:If Sutter is to be pencilled in as 4th C, then we should give him away.

Benning brought him in and signed him to be a 2C, and he hasn't been that. Lots of debate around the "foundational" potential of this guy, but after being "stuck" behind Crosby and Malkin, he hasn't been about to take the 2C job on one of the worst teams in hockey. Telling.

He's a straight-line player who doesn't distribute well and isn't physical or intimidating. He's a decidedly average player. That said, he's an adequate 3C, and we're not about to need the cap space anytime soon, so I don't see a massive need to flush him for nothing.


Yeah I don't know that he was brought in to be the second-line centre. I saw him as a highly-paid, "elite third-liner". Much like when Malhotra was signed for what seemed at the time to be too much money under the 2010 cap, he was brought in to play a role at a high level.

Here's a quotefrom the time of the trade:
Benning said it will be up to Canucks coach Willie Desjardins where Sutter fits in the lineup this season; it's possible he could become the second-line center.

"I hope so; I think with [Henrik] Sedin and Bo Horvat, I'm not too concerned with my role," Sutter said. "I just want to do what is asked of me. I hope to play an increased role and it sounds like a good opportunity to be a second-line center."

Looking at last season's UFA signings, his contract is far from the worst and is sort of middle-of-the-pack for market value. Considering he was 4th on the team for goal-scoring and 5th for points on a team with former Ross Trophy winners not cracking 50 points (with a broken wrist), he's not been all that bad.
ESQ
CC Hall of Fan Member
 
Posts: 1279
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2011 6:34 pm

Re: Expansion draft

Postby Island Nucklehead » Fri Apr 28, 2017 9:45 am

ESQ wrote:Looking at last season's UFA signings, his contract is far from the worst and is sort of middle-of-the-pack for market value. Considering he was 4th on the team for goal-scoring and 5th for points on a team with former Ross Trophy winners not cracking 50 points (with a broken wrist), he's not been all that bad.


Quite telling we're defending Sutter's non-UFA contract by pointing to inflated UFA contracts.
User avatar
Island Nucklehead
CC Legend
 
Posts: 7315
Joined: Wed Sep 07, 2005 2:27 pm
Location: Ottawa

Re: Expansion draft

Postby Strangelove » Fri Apr 28, 2017 11:01 am

Island Nucklehead wrote:Quite telling we're defending Sutter's non-UFA contract by pointing to inflated UFA contracts.


UFA years are UFA years.

Sutter's contract was essentially a UFA contract...
____
GO CANUCKS GO!!!
User avatar
Strangelove
CC Legend
 
Posts: 14152
Joined: Sat Dec 18, 2004 1:13 pm
Location: Lake Vostok

Re: Expansion draft

Postby SKYO » Fri Apr 28, 2017 2:59 pm

I suppose Sutter will be of use when the Sedins retire, he'll be the wily ol' vet on the 3rd line, but for sure he needs a young whipper snapper on the right wing that can crash & bang, plus more importantly an outstanding playmaking LW that can play a two-way game like for instance Palat.

A Palat - Sutter - Virtanen would be an ideal solid 3rd line moving forward, where Palat would have to carry it as the point man.
Canucks 2017/18
A NEW HOPE
User avatar
SKYO
CC Legend
 
Posts: 7988
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2011 10:34 pm

Next

Return to Canucks Corner Chat

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], Google [Bot] and 6 guests