Canucks Contracts

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Uncle dans leg
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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by Uncle dans leg » Mon Apr 29, 2019 3:11 pm

Leivo can walk...I'd rather a younger kid with some wheels. Hes joe average
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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by Hank » Mon Apr 29, 2019 3:32 pm

Leivo has been a really good pickup. But he is a placeholder, not core. Pump n' dump.

Buy an unwanted run-down from a Dumbass property manager for little to no cost, fix it up, re-sell it for a tidy profit.
Try to focus on THIS year...

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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by Cherry Picker » Mon Apr 29, 2019 3:45 pm

Leivo is okay, but yah, if you can package him with Hutton for a top six winger, do it.
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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by Todd Bersnoozi » Tue Apr 30, 2019 6:53 pm

I like Leivo and I thought he was one of JB's better pickups. He has a great shot, decent skillset, some dangle and moves well for a guy with his size. Wish he had a bit more nastiness/edge like Kassassian, but he's willing to stick up for a mate if need be. With some of our great young talent going forward, I think Leivo has a couple of 20G seasons in him and has the potential to be a regular in our top 6. Brockstar is really our only star winger. I'd lump Shotgun Jake, Lester Pearson and Leivo as guys I'd like to keep around as they seem to have potential to be core players or even just great supporting cast players going forward. I'd keep these guys over Bearcheese/Golds, etc.

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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by SKYO » Tue Apr 30, 2019 8:31 pm

I wouldn't mind if Leivo was our 3rd line LW tbh.

Leivo - Sutter - Virtanen would be a decent energy line.

At Leivo has some size at 6'2 210lbs and likely chip in 15+ goals
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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by SKYO » Mon May 13, 2019 9:48 am

Satiar:
NHL teams can't walk away from arbitration awards that are less than $4.39M, which could make the Canucks think twice about going down that road with Hutton. Chance he's not qualified if Van doesn't work out a trade or extension beforehand
4x4 ish?

or trade him + a forward for a top 6 winger.
A long time ago, a baseball player remarked: "If I owned a ballclub, I'd hire a $5,000 coach and a $15,000 scout."

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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by Island Nucklehead » Mon May 13, 2019 11:16 am

SKYO wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 9:48 am
Satiar:
NHL teams can't walk away from arbitration awards that are less than $4.39M, which could make the Canucks think twice about going down that road with Hutton. Chance he's not qualified if Van doesn't work out a trade or extension beforehand
4x4 ish?

or trade him + a forward for a top 6 winger.
Why would they just let him walk? Stomach the arbitration award and either work towards a longer term deal or a trade.

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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by ESQ » Mon May 13, 2019 2:06 pm

Island Nucklehead wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 11:16 am
SKYO wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 9:48 am
Satiar:
NHL teams can't walk away from arbitration awards that are less than $4.39M, which could make the Canucks think twice about going down that road with Hutton. Chance he's not qualified if Van doesn't work out a trade or extension beforehand
4x4 ish?

or trade him + a forward for a top 6 winger.
Why would they just let him walk? Stomach the arbitration award and either work towards a longer term deal or a trade.
Ya walking away or not qualifying doesn't make any sense - arbitrators can only give out 1 or 2 year deals anyways.

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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by UWSaint » Mon May 13, 2019 2:15 pm

Todd Bersnoozi wrote:
Tue Apr 30, 2019 6:53 pm
I like Leivo and I thought he was one of JB's better pickups.
Did you intend this to be a stinging indictment of JB?

Granted, he was "free" in terms of it being a no-prospect trade -- AHL vet for the AHL vet happy Marlies. But there are always waiver players who can do what Leivo did: eat up a spot on the top 6 because they have some surface level offensive skills (but make the Canucks less potent), kill plays by skating themselves into a corner, be too slow in the head to keep up with Boeser and Pettersson and too slow in the body to add to a straight ahead attack of Horvat. Boucher could have done this just fine.

I don't know what the arbitration award is expected to be for a guy like Leivo, and given that I'm not paying the bills and the Canucks aren't going to hit the cap, I don't really care if he gets paid too much on a one year arbitration deal. But I don't want to see him in a top 6 role.

As for Leivo in a bottom 6 role, he has neither speed nor tenacity nor physicality. And he doesn't kill penalties. Other than that, how was the play, Mrs. Lincoln?

And as for getting value from Leivo, I don't care too much about 6th or 7th rounders. That's the most he would ever bring back.
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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by micky107 » Mon May 13, 2019 2:54 pm

Wow! You really don't like the guy.
From my chair his skills seemed better than you from yours.
Sorry, I thought it was a good pick-up.
Not part of the long term plan but certainly not a scrub either.
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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by UWSaint » Mon May 13, 2019 8:18 pm

micky107 wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 2:54 pm
Wow! You really don't like the guy.
From my chair his skills seemed better than you from yours.
Sorry, I thought it was a good pick-up.
Not part of the long term plan but certainly not a scrub either.
I am a little more strident about Leivo than most because his shortcomings are more hidden. People see Goldobin try an ill-advised cross ice pass that gets broken up and possession lost. It is less conspicuous to stall, miss the window for a play, and go from having the defense on their heels to having them be organized and then gang up on you before you have any idea what to do. Both result in a dead play.

Most of Leivo's good plays are when he escapes those situations with a nice dangle and good drive towards the net. And that's great when he does it -- he has individual puck skills and a decent shot. This gets applause. The problem is that he put himself into that position to begin with. And that he missed the opportunity to use his better linemates -- and that underutilization is really what gets to me. He thinks and plays the game at AHL speed. His stick is where plays went to die, or if not die, s l o w d o w n.

I thought there was a noticeable decline in the sharpness of the Canucks offensive game when Leivo was playing in the top 6. From a goals scored perspective, the Canucks went from 2.82 goals per game without Leivo to 2.69 goals a game with him. Obviously, he's not all to blame for that -- injuries, fatigue, yada yada yada. And when the Canucks were really wrecked with injuries, it was good to have Leivo. He was better than the available alternatives. That's what AHL top 6 guys can do better than many NHL bottom 6 guys -- fill in to an NHL Top 6 role for temporary stints. That doesn't make him a top 6 player.
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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by Madcombinepilot » Mon May 13, 2019 8:59 pm

ESQ wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 2:06 pm
Island Nucklehead wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 11:16 am
SKYO wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 9:48 am
Satiar:
NHL teams can't walk away from arbitration awards that are less than $4.39M, which could make the Canucks think twice about going down that road with Hutton. Chance he's not qualified if Van doesn't work out a trade or extension beforehand
4x4 ish?

or trade him + a forward for a top 6 winger.
Why would they just let him walk? Stomach the arbitration award and either work towards a longer term deal or a trade.
Ya walking away or not qualifying doesn't make any sense - arbitrators can only give out 1 or 2 year deals anyways.
I would take 4million for 2 years from the arbitrator for Hutton. We don't need the cap this year or next, And he expires at the perfect time.
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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by Madcombinepilot » Mon May 13, 2019 9:05 pm

UWSaint wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 2:15 pm
Todd Bersnoozi wrote:
Tue Apr 30, 2019 6:53 pm
I like Leivo and I thought he was one of JB's better pickups.
Did you intend this to be a stinging indictment of JB?

Granted, he was "free" in terms of it being a no-prospect trade -- AHL vet for the AHL vet happy Marlies. But there are always waiver players who can do what Leivo did: eat up a spot on the top 6 because they have some surface level offensive skills (but make the Canucks less potent), kill plays by skating themselves into a corner, be too slow in the head to keep up with Boeser and Pettersson and too slow in the body to add to a straight ahead attack of Horvat. Boucher could have done this just fine.

I don't know what the arbitration award is expected to be for a guy like Leivo, and given that I'm not paying the bills and the Canucks aren't going to hit the cap, I don't really care if he gets paid too much on a one year arbitration deal. But I don't want to see him in a top 6 role.

As for Leivo in a bottom 6 role, he has neither speed nor tenacity nor physicality. And he doesn't kill penalties. Other than that, how was the play, Mrs. Lincoln?

And as for getting value from Leivo, I don't care too much about 6th or 7th rounders. That's the most he would ever bring back.
Generally agree with this, except to point out that if 'Boucher could have provided that' he would have. We have seen Boucher plenty, And when all coaches agree Leivo is better, then Leivo is better. (Boucher would never have scored at the same pace. Boucher has been given ample opportunity and simply can't get his shot off in the NHL. His release is too slow).

Still, Leivo is an upgrade on Carcone, so the trade is still a 'win' in that our talent pool got deeper.

Now, after that, keep in mind we traded an AHL'r for a 13th forward. :) keep it all in perspective.
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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by UWSaint » Mon May 13, 2019 9:53 pm

Madcombinepilot wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 9:05 pm
Generally agree with this, except ... Boucher would never have scored at the same pace. Boucher has been given ample opportunity and simply can't get his shot off in the NHL. His release is too slow.
Leivo: GP -- 133, G -- 24, A -- 22
Boucher: GP -- 133, G -- 20, A -- 22

And Boucher rode shotgun with a Pettersson or a Horvat how much?

These guys are the same age, by the way.

Goldy has about the same NHL numbers (124, 19 G, 27 A) and is 2 years younger. Sure, he's got different challenges, but also a superior skill set in terms of translation to the NHL.
Still, Leivo is an upgrade on Carcone, so the trade is still a 'win' in that our talent pool got deeper.

Now, after that, keep in mind we traded an AHL'r for a 13th forward. :) keep it all in perspective.
Yeah, he was basically a waiver pickup. Only thing it hurt was the Comets. And the Comets might just play vets too much, so hurting the Comets could be good for the Canucks in a weird way....
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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by Meds » Mon May 13, 2019 10:10 pm

Leivo was this year’s Mason Raymond.

Raymond has a lesser shot and dangle ability and was half as physical, but he had great speed and knew how to back check on the wing. Oh and he had a mean button hook along the half-boards to avoid a hit.....always followed by a backhand dump around the boards in hopes that a line mate coming into the zone had bigger stones than him and could gain possession.

Leivo has some size and a good shot, sporadically above average hands, but not overly useful defensively.

The play died on both of their sticks more often than not.

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