Canucks Contracts

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micky107
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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by micky107 » Fri Jul 20, 2018 1:01 pm

Adios, Ben. What do ya bet?
"evolution"

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Jovocop
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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by Jovocop » Fri Jul 20, 2018 1:11 pm

Is Virtanen the only unsigned RFA now?

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vic
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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by vic » Fri Jul 20, 2018 1:23 pm

ESQ wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 11:35 am
Strangelove wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 1:25 pm
Lol, yeahno, you don't get to dis-include Draisaitl my friend!

McDave got $12.5M X 8... but he's at least 50% better than Boeser.

Eichel got $10 X 8... but he's 25% better.

Draisaitl got $8.5 X 8... we're getting warmer.

Your boy Pastrnak only got $6.66M-per but that's only a 6-year contract... YUGE difference.

Now... in regards to Boeser and your list, show me a single similarly-aged/similar-stats forward lately to sign anything like your:

"$6.5-$6.9M per x 8 years" :mex:
Ehlers, 7 years $6 mil, after 2 25+ goal/60+ point seasons.

Barkov, 6 years x $5.9-mil, after 59 points in 66 games.

Forsberg, 6x$6 mil, after 2 60+ point seasons.
All three, when signed, were ~8% of the total cap hit for the upcoming season

So if those three are comparables, that puts Brock in at about 6.35 per

If Pastrnak is the comparable, his 9% equates to 7.15 per

If Draisaitl and his 11.3% is the comparable, then Brock is looking at 8.9 per

^ Those numbers if he signs today, if/when the cap goes up next year, the numbers rise.

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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by ESQ » Fri Jul 20, 2018 1:39 pm

vic wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 1:23 pm

All three, when signed, were ~8% of the total cap hit for the upcoming season

So if those three are comparables, that puts Brock in at about 6.35 per

If Pastrnak is the comparable, his 9% equates to 7.15 per

If Draisaitl and his 11.3% is the comparable, then Brock is looking at 8.9 per

^ Those numbers if he signs today, if/when the cap goes up next year, the numbers rise.
Thanks for doing the math, that's a very good way to look at it.

I think Pastrnak is the high-end percentage for a winger, particularly on a 6 year deal. Brock was on a similar pace (72 points) before the injury.

I think I'm more in favor of going for am 8 year deal if Brock maintains his pace this year. It will cost more, as the Doc says, but won't carry an NTC until he's 26 and in his UFA years.

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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by Hockey Widow » Fri Jul 20, 2018 3:09 pm

Jovocop wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 1:11 pm
Is Virtanen the only unsigned RFA now?

Yes
The only HW the Canucks need

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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by Madcombinepilot » Fri Jul 20, 2018 5:14 pm

I am not upset by this. It shows that Benning can learn. I was worried that Stetcher would get Hutton money, which is too much.

This is not a bad signing.
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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by Strangelove » Fri Jul 20, 2018 5:58 pm

Island Nucklehead wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 11:19 am
micky107 wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 11:03 am
Canucks resign Troy Stetcher to a two year contract worth 2.325 million per year.

https://twitter.com/Canucks/status/1020367495637524480
What a fantastic deal!
You can't go against Blobby... Blobby hates everything!
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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by Strangelove » Fri Jul 20, 2018 5:59 pm

Island Nucklehead wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 12:35 pm
Blob Mckenzie wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 11:36 am
Island Nucklehead wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 11:19 am
micky107 wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 11:03 am
Canucks resign Troy Stetcher to a two year contract worth 2.325 million per year.

https://twitter.com/Canucks/status/1020367495637524480
What a fantastic deal!
Not sure if serious ? :scowl:
No, I don't think it's a great deal, but I'm trying to look on the bright side! :drink:
Ahhh there we go, the world makes sense again...
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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by Strangelove » Fri Jul 20, 2018 6:06 pm

Blob Mckenzie wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 12:48 pm
Topper can’t go against Doc. Doc loves the deal
I shat upon Stecher quite a few times last season

... but he looked solid in his last 10 games or so.

(you weren't watching, I know)

(22.5 MPG over last 10 games - 2 assists, plus 3)

Actually, for maybe even 10 games before that he was okay as well...

I think Green was very tough on both Stechy and Hutts.

Hutts wilted under the pressure, but Stecher never quit

... and near the end he won Green over.

I do like the contract for a few reasons.

The contract ending in 2020 is good timing.

(expansion draft, RD woo and Tryamkin likely added)

If Stecher hasn't improved by then, he's gone IMO, one way or another.

Who knows, he might be an offering to the new team in Seattle...
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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by Lloyd Braun » Fri Jul 20, 2018 9:42 pm

I think Stecher has a bit of an identity problem on this board. People see him as an offensive defenseman who hasn't figured out a way to put up points reliably, but that's not what he is. His under-rated smarts, quickness, excellent positioning, top notch gap control, and tireless work ethic, combine to make him an excellent defensive D. Stats seem to back up this eye-test impression.

An ability to put up some points along the way is an upside, but he'll never consistently post large point totals in the NHL, and he doesn't need to.

There's an antique idea that an undersized defenseman cannot be defensively strong. But an ability to efficiently close gaps, to win battles with quickness, and to transition the puck out of the defensive zone are more than enough benefit to outweigh any issues "clearing the crease". These are the qualities that will make Hughes a top-notch all-situations player, and they also make Stecher an excellent depth piece. In particular, quick & efficient transitions is an aspect of defensive play that has been under-rated historically. In the modern NHL, Stecher's a guy you want playing tough minutes against opposing scoring lines.

This is a terrific contract. He's a better much player than Hutton, on a significantly cheaper deal. Not counting the potential rookies, Stecher is easily our third best defenseman after Tanev and Edler. On an strong blueline, he's a decent #4 or an excellent #5. We do not have a strong blueline, but Stecher will be a big part of building one in the coming years. His leadership qualities should also stand out as his career progresses.

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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by Uncle dans leg » Fri Jul 20, 2018 11:27 pm

Lloyd Braun wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 9:42 pm
I think Stecher has a bit of an identity problem on this board. People see him as an offensive defenseman who hasn't figured out a way to put up points reliably, but that's not what he is. His under-rated smarts, quickness, excellent positioning, top notch gap control, and tireless work ethic, combine to make him an excellent defensive D. Stats seem to back up this eye-test impression.

An ability to put up some points along the way is an upside, but he'll never consistently post large point totals in the NHL, and he doesn't need to.

There's an antique idea that an undersized defenseman cannot be defensively strong. But an ability to efficiently close gaps, to win battles with quickness, and to transition the puck out of the defensive zone are more than enough benefit to outweigh any issues "clearing the crease". These are the qualities that will make Hughes a top-notch all-situations player, and they also make Stecher an excellent depth piece. In particular, quick & efficient transitions is an aspect of defensive play that has been under-rated historically. In the modern NHL, Stecher's a guy you want playing tough minutes against opposing scoring lines.

This is a terrific contract. He's a better much player than Hutton, on a significantly cheaper deal. Not counting the potential rookies, Stecher is easily our third best defenseman after Tanev and Edler. On an strong blueline, he's a decent #4 or an excellent #5. We do not have a strong blueline, but Stecher will be a big part of building one in the coming years. His leadership qualities should also stand out as his career progresses.
Holy fuck Lloyd you need to stay out of the giggle jar more than i do even. No offense but i pretty well disagree with your assessment of tiny troy word for word.

Hes fucking brutal defensively and coughs up more pucks than any dman Ive seen in canucks colours in a long time. He is consistently pushed off pucks, dumps pucks onto his D partners under pressure and juggles pucks at both blue lines with authority.

On the 3rd worst team in the league he was arguably the worst damn dman dressed. It really doesnt get much worse than that bro.

I'm not trying to be a dick...hope i dont come across like that just feel fairly strongly that TS sucks
nobody forks...with the jesus

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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by micky107 » Sat Jul 21, 2018 12:33 am

Uncle dans leg wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 11:27 pm
Lloyd Braun wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 9:42 pm
I think Stecher has a bit of an identity problem on this board. People see him as an offensive defenseman who hasn't figured out a way to put up points reliably, but that's not what he is. His under-rated smarts, quickness, excellent positioning, top notch gap control, and tireless work ethic, combine to make him an excellent defensive D. Stats seem to back up this eye-test impression.

An ability to put up some points along the way is an upside, but he'll never consistently post large point totals in the NHL, and he doesn't need to.

There's an antique idea that an undersized defenseman cannot be defensively strong. But an ability to efficiently close gaps, to win battles with quickness, and to transition the puck out of the defensive zone are more than enough benefit to outweigh any issues "clearing the crease". These are the qualities that will make Hughes a top-notch all-situations player, and they also make Stecher an excellent depth piece. In particular, quick & efficient transitions is an aspect of defensive play that has been under-rated historically. In the modern NHL, Stecher's a guy you want playing tough minutes against opposing scoring lines.

This is a terrific contract. He's a better much player than Hutton, on a significantly cheaper deal. Not counting the potential rookies, Stecher is easily our third best defenseman after Tanev and Edler. On an strong blueline, he's a decent #4 or an excellent #5. We do not have a strong blueline, but Stecher will be a big part of building one in the coming years. His leadership qualities should also stand out as his career progresses.
Holy fuck Lloyd you need to stay out of the giggle jar more than i do even. No offense but i pretty well disagree with your assessment of tiny troy word for word.

Hes fucking brutal defensively and coughs up more pucks than any dman Ive seen in canucks colours in a long time. He is consistently pushed off pucks, dumps pucks onto his D partners under pressure and juggles pucks at both blue lines with authority.

On the 3rd worst team in the league he was arguably the worst damn dman dressed. It really doesnt get much worse than that bro.

I'm not trying to be a dick...hope i dont come across like that just feel fairly strongly that TS sucks
This exchange is tough for me to tackle.
Should just call it a night and forget it
But I can't.
LB; Your assessment is along the right lines. Some frustration has crept into his game which has altered the desired affect of exactly what you describe are his strong points. When the entire team starts playing a cohesive system, that frustration will be gone.
His speed on the puck, (the play), is the fastest on the team.
His battle level is very good. When he's stripped of the puck, he strips it right back. Sometimes those long gated battles, buy time.

Dan; I'll just say try not to hate. If it were as bad as you think, he wouldn't be playing, anywhere.
"evolution"

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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by Lloyd Braun » Sat Jul 21, 2018 1:49 am

Uncle dans leg wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 11:27 pm
Holy fuck Lloyd you need to stay out of the giggle jar more than i do even. No offense but i pretty well disagree with your assessment of tiny troy word for word.

Hes fucking brutal defensively and coughs up more pucks than any dman Ive seen in canucks colours in a long time. He is consistently pushed off pucks, dumps pucks onto his D partners under pressure and juggles pucks at both blue lines with authority.

On the 3rd worst team in the league he was arguably the worst damn dman dressed. It really doesnt get much worse than that bro.

I'm not trying to be a dick...hope i dont come across like that just feel fairly strongly that TS sucks
Me calling him a 4 or 5 on a good team is hardly the same as going giddy with praise.
"An excellent depth piece" is how I described Stecher, and I stand by that.

He does cough up the puck sometimes, and can skate himself into trouble. But that's not unusual for a player who, more often than not, is able to create a controlled exit. In fairness, he could benefit from choosing a few more safe plays when in doubt, but that should come with experience. 100% of the time, I'd take what Stecher brings over somebody who lacks the skillset to exit in a controlled manner.

One way analysis of the game has changed over recent decades is that these days, most analysts place higher value on the difference between a controlled exit with possession and an uncontrolled exit that clears the zone but hands puck control back to the other team. Less mobile defenders like Gudbransson, for example, will flip a lot of pucks out into the neutral zone, surrendering possession but not committing "a giveaway". On the same play, Stecher might try a controlled exit, and will succeed a lot of the time but also sometimes fail in a way that looks really bad.

When stats-inclined people have tracked zone exists and transition data, Stecher has consistently been right at the very top of the Canucks' defenders. He is very good at successfully converting controlled exits, and also at successfully entering the offensive zone. By the numbers, he's our best defender at both of these things, and very good compared to his peers league-wide. You might be suffering from a wee case of confirmation bias when you see him "cough up pucks", because people who try to objectively track exits do not agree with your take in the slightest.

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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by Meds » Sat Jul 21, 2018 3:05 am

Madcombinepilot wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 5:14 pm
I am not upset by this. It shows that Benning can learn. I was worried that Stetcher would get Hutton money, which is too much.

This is not a bad signing.
Hutton gets $2.80M per year.

Stecher gets $2.33M per year.

The difference really isn’t that much.

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Re: Canucks Contracts

Post by Topper » Sat Jul 21, 2018 6:31 am

Island Nucklehead wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 11:19 am
micky107 wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 11:03 am
Canucks resign Troy Stetcher to a two year contract worth 2.325 million per year.

https://twitter.com/Canucks/status/1020367495637524480
What a fantastic deal!
It's only $2.325 too much and two years too long.
Over the Internet, you can pretend to be anyone or anything.

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