The Official Dave Ayres CC "All Thing Leaves" thread

[Strangelove]

How are they miles ahead with Seguin and Hamilton and no Kessel?

And Kessel isn't just a goal scorer. He gets a lot of assists every season. He's a fantastic all around offensive player.

I will say this, it's a lot harder to get a top sniper than an offensive minded centre and/or a good 2-way D man. There's only a few top snipers in the league (not every team even has 1), while there's a bushel full of offensive centres and 2-way D men (just about every team has a few of those guys).

RICKDONKULOUS!!

Only a Leaf fan would insinuate Kessel > Seguin + Hamilton.

You're not fooling anyone Todd, remember:

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Sure, I like to see the Laffs do well.

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For what it's worth, I do like the Laffs.

I'm not saying the leaves are a Cup contender, but they're going to make some noise in the next few years. They're a darkhorse team, mark my words.

(don’t worry Todd, there is no blacklist).

So what Leaf board do you post at... and what's your handle over there?

Do you post "thoughts" here... and "thoughts" over there?

TALK DAMN YOU!!

WHAT'S YOUR GAME MISTER??!!

(green smiley means there is no blacklist)

[Meds]

Phillys is a naturually talented scoring winger. One of the best scoring wingers in the league.

Does he back check? No.

Does he hit? No.

Does he forecheck? Well, he skates around the offensive zone without the puck.....

Does he block shots? Accidentally.

Does he appear to have a ton of heart? Not overly.

Is he dedicated to his physical fitness?

Is he worth a 1st round pick? To a top-5 team that needs scoring help.

Is he worth a top 15 pick? Only if Garth Snow is your GM.

So a guy in his prime who is never hurt and can be PPG with Bozak as his centre and has the second most points of any player in the NHL the last 3 seasons is not worth a first round pick? Kessel is the exact same player as Patrick Kane. Only Kessel has scored more. Instead, you're trying to sell me to the idea Kessel is exactly like Michael Grabner.

You're so hung up on this thing about how he's been the second highest scoring player over the last 3 seasons.....but whenever you say that I remind you that if you look at his points per game played he drops off.

So congrats, Phyllis stays healthy and scores, but that's because he's a perimeter player who makes almost as much as Crosby but doesn't have near the heart, nor does he lead his team in the same way.

[Todd Bersnoozi]

RICKDONKULOUS!!

Only a Leaf fan would insinuate Kessel > Seguin + Hamilton.

*LOL*

I never said Kessel > Seguin + Hamilton. I said the trade is pretty fair for both teams atm (at the moment). This may change if Kessel dips in his goal production and Seguin + Hamilton continue in their upward trend. Or it may go the other way and Kessel starts pushing 50G reguarly and Seguin/Hamilton peak off. Still too early to say on this trade really, but both teams have got their moneys worth so far. TO got a top goal scorer to be the face of their franchise, help them win games and fight for a playoff spot. Bruins actually won a Cup with Sequin (albeit he was in a minor role), but they moved him on for other assets.

One thing about Seguin though, which was the knock on him with the Bs management. Sure, he can put up points in the regular season with a good player like Jamie Benn, but can he deliver in the playoffs? The Bs obviously thought no and were willing to cut him loose. Hell, they even cut Phil Kessel loose.

Can Kessel deliver in the playoffs? He did score 4G + 2A in 7GPs for TO that year. He actually scored 9G + 6A in 15GP for the Bs in the playoffs too, so overall he seems to show up when it matters most. U can also say this about Kessel though, he scores most of his goals playing with a guy like Bozak who most consider not to be a top centre, more of a 2nd line guy.

[Aaronp18]

Kessel just finished with the 3rd best fitness test on the leaves.

Is this actually true?

Seriously?

Is this based on some sort of bell curve?

This is actually great news!

[BurningBeard]

Kessel just finished with the 3rd best fitness test on the leaves.

I hope Ovie got a picture of that to add to his collection.

[mathonwy]

Nobody is uncoachable. You just need a coach that is smarter than the player

And comparing Phaneuf to Shea Weber is comparing apples and kiwis. Phaneuf commands ZERO respect in this league. He's a joke. I saw it in the 24/7 series and I've seen it in All Star games which leads to my rotten apple core hypothesis about the Laughs.

Ummmm.....I've met, and played with, plenty of people who are uncoachable. It has nothing to do with how smart or stupid a coach is. It comes down to the player being willing to accept advice. If a player thinks he knows better than everyone else, then nobody can tell him what to do.

To say nobody is uncoachable is a bit naive.

Special Olympics don't count..

[BigTuna]

The funny thing is, Seguin is himself bad defensively and his playoff numbers are terrible, yet that does not matter one bit.

[Island Nucklehead]

So won more trophies because of the team he is on. That point has been made.

Marcel Dionne is one of the greatest players ever BTW.

Sooo Phil Kessel is one of the greatest players ever? Jesus...

Do you think that Chicago's success has anything to do with Kane? Maybe a bit?

Point being, Phil is the best player on a team that consistently finds a way to let their fans down. Paired up with Neon Dion, he forms probably the worst leadership group in the entire NHL. Did he also have heart surgery when they took his rotten testicle, or has he always lacked that aspect of his game?

The leaves don't deserve any respect. It needs to be earned. That's a team full of runway models riding Canada's biggest ego train up and down Bay street believing their God's gift to Canadian Hockey. Phil's there for the money and the Tim-Bits, and Dion is there for the walk-in closet collection.

It's quite telling, and extremely sad, when the biggest waste of ink coming out of Toronto these days concerns wether they'll get Babcock next season, and Stamkos in 2016. You poor bastards wouldn't recognize a quality hockey player unless they're lighting the lamp behind your under-siege goaltenders, and you haven't had one on your roster since Sundin left for the West Coast.

[BigTuna]

RICKDONKULOUS!!

Only a Leaf fan would insinuate Kessel > Seguin + Hamilton.

*LOL*

I never said Kessel > Seguin + Hamilton. I said the trade is pretty fair for both teams atm (at the moment). This may change if Kessel dips in his goal production and Seguin + Hamilton continue in their upward trend. Or it may go the other way and Kessel starts pushing 50G reguarly and Seguin/Hamilton peak off. Still too early to say on this trade really, but both teams have got their moneys worth so far. TO got a top goal scorer to be the face of their franchise, help them win games and fight for a playoff spot. Bruins actually won a Cup with Sequin (albeit he was in a minor role), but they moved him on for other assets.

One thing about Seguin though, which was the knock on him with the Bs management. Sure, he can put up points in the regular season with a good player like Jamie Benn, but can he deliver in the playoffs? The Bs obviously thought no and were willing to cut him loose. Hell, they even cut Phil Kessel loose.

Can Kessel deliver in the playoffs? He did score 4G + 2A in 7GPs for TO that year. He actually scored 9G + 6A in 15GP for the Bs in the playoffs too, so overall he seems to show up when it matters most. U can also say this about Kessel though, he scores most of his goals playing with a guy like Bozak who most consider not to be a top centre, more of a 2nd line guy.

Boston ruined the trade by trading Seguin. Bad call. Erikkson looks like a 3rd liner. He best years are behind him.

People do forget that Kessel is far better than anyone thought he'd be. When the trade was made EVERYONE said he only scored 36 goals because of Marc Savard. He'd never do anything without a top playmaker. He now is PPG with Tyler Bozak...

[BigTuna]

Phillys is a naturually talented scoring winger. One of the best scoring wingers in the league.

Does he back check? No.

Does he hit? No.

Does he forecheck? Well, he skates around the offensive zone without the puck.....

Does he block shots? Accidentally.

Does he appear to have a ton of heart? Not overly.

Is he dedicated to his physical fitness?

Is he worth a 1st round pick? To a top-5 team that needs scoring help.

Is he worth a top 15 pick? Only if Garth Snow is your GM.

So a guy in his prime who is never hurt and can be PPG with Bozak as his centre and has the second most points of any player in the NHL the last 3 seasons is not worth a first round pick? Kessel is the exact same player as Patrick Kane. Only Kessel has scored more. Instead, you're trying to sell me to the idea Kessel is exactly like Michael Grabner.

You're so hung up on this thing about how he's been the second highest scoring player over the last 3 seasons.....but whenever you say that I remind you that if you look at his points per game played he drops off.

So congrats, Phyllis stays healthy and scores, but that's because he's a perimeter player who makes almost as much as Crosby but doesn't have near the heart, nor does he lead his team in the same way.

So Kessel being healthy and playing every game is a negative? Maybe the guys who are missing games would see their PPG drop if they played 82 games every season. Ever think about that.

You guys are seriously saying a PPG player in his prime can't fetch a first rounder? Seriously?

[Meds]

You're so hung up on this thing about how he's been the second highest scoring player over the last 3 seasons.....but whenever you say that I remind you that if you look at his points per game played he drops off.

So congrats, Phyllis stays healthy and scores, but that's because he's a perimeter player who makes almost as much as Crosby but doesn't have near the heart, nor does he lead his team in the same way.

So Kessel being healthy and playing every game is a negative? Maybe the guys who are missing games would see their PPG drop if they played 82 games every season. Ever think about that.

You guys are seriously saying a PPG player in his prime can't fetch a first rounder? Seriously?

And yes, I considered that, but I dismissed it. Phyllis is streaky. He scores in bunches. Other top players are more consistent night in and night out.

Nope. Nobody said that he wouldn't fetch a first rounder.

Just that he wouldn't fetch a top-15 overall pick. He would get a 1st rounder in return from a contender.

[Tciso]

Mëds is right. Most of the uncoachable people, regardless of the sport, or life in general, are deep down, pretty stupid. Thinking you are smarter than everyone else, including the people who pay your salary, and hired the coach is usually a sign that you are stupid.

Good teams are built around coachable players. I run my own business and coachability is the main attribute I look for.

[mr perfect]

Pierre LaRouche
Michel Petit
Petr Nedved
Peter Schaefer
Sean Avery

There's five uncoachables off the top of my head, if I took the time I could add plenty more. Oh yeah, Phil Kessel.

[Strangelove]

TO got a top goal scorer to be the face of their franchise

Nice to see you finally admitting you're a Leaf-loving you-know-wot!

Now doesn't it feel good to be fully out of the closet, centre stage, hand-in-hand with Mr Tuna?

You're welcome....

[BigTuna]

You're so hung up on this thing about how he's been the second highest scoring player over the last 3 seasons.....but whenever you say that I remind you that if you look at his points per game played he drops off.

So congrats, Phyllis stays healthy and scores, but that's because he's a perimeter player who makes almost as much as Crosby but doesn't have near the heart, nor does he lead his team in the same way.

So Kessel being healthy and playing every game is a negative? Maybe the guys who are missing games would see their PPG drop if they played 82 games every season. Ever think about that.

You guys are seriously saying a PPG player in his prime can't fetch a first rounder? Seriously?

And yes, I considered that, but I dismissed it. Phyllis is streaky. He scores in bunches. Other top players are more consistent night in and night out.

Nope. Nobody said that he wouldn't fetch a first rounder.

Just that he wouldn't fetch a top-15 overall pick. He would get a 1st rounder in return from a contender.

A complete myth that is completely untrue. He's actually been one of the most consistent players the last few seasons.