Forwards - 2014/15

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Hank
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Re: Forwards - 2014/15

Post by Hank » Sat Jul 05, 2014 2:01 pm

mathonwy wrote:
Hank wrote:
duh, learn to read before you get all emotional as you are normally are.

I said David Booth was a better player than Alex Burrows last year... and he was. David Booth will likely be a better player than Alex Burrows going forward.

Nowhere did a say Booth was a good player. I said Booth was a bad fit for this team... because he just wasn't very good at what he was supposedly paid to do. So it would be a bad deal to keep a guy like that around even though his term with 1 year left is much better than Burrows.

So if Booth, with his more suitable skill set for the western conference, his better offensive game at this stage, his better productivity with 3rd line minutes than Burrows... still is deemed to have a contract that is bad value, why on earth should "heart & soul" with his age and diminishing game be kept for another 3 years when Jesus Booth himself (a better player at this stage than Alex Burrows) should have been bought out or traded much earlier?

I'm not saying Booth was/is a good player or had a great contract. I'm saying Booth was/is a better player and had a better contract than Burrows. And that is a sad, sad indictment of Alex Burrows and his current game. Comprendez?

Who gives a shit about Burrows injuries? Did you not notice that lots of Canucks had catastrophic injuries? When Burrows was out, the team was probably better. When others were out, the team was catastrophically bad. Burrows just sucked when he was healthy... in every role he was in, whether it be scoring or checking.

Alex Burrows may be the salt of the earth and I don't give a shit about his real or perceived rat-like reputation. His contract is BAD for the value he has been providing. Management would be wise to divest themselves of his contract like they did with Booth's.
Who gives a shit about Burrows injuries...

Probably the same guy that chose to buy David Booth out and not Alex Burrows.

Name me one other Canuck that broke two bones last season.

And I don't know what game you were watching last season but it wasn't the Canucks. Burr went on a scoring tear late last season when he got healthy.

March 12, 2013 versus the Jets - 2 goals
March 16, 2013 versus the Cats - 2 assists
March 17, 2013 versus the Bolts - 2 goals, 1 assist
March 19, 2013 versus the Preds - Weber CHOP... Burr wasn't the same after that but we DID have a mini little run with Jensen and Kassian leading the charge. :thumbs:

You can be honest with me Hank. Did you actually watch any of the games when Burr got healthy or you just making your observations based on the earlier in the season games?
So what? Lots of Canucks had injuries last year. Is having a broken bone easier to come back from than a concussion? Is a broken finger worse than a shoulder or rib? A healthy Burrows was still not very good and his contract is still bad. It was bad the day Gillis offered it.

Woo! Big fuckin' deal. A bunch of goals against crappy teams when the season was pretty much decided. Wow look at those stats! That projects to Burrows scoring 50 goals a season for the next 3 years!

There was stretch where Richardson, Kassian and Booth was doing all the scoring as the 3rd line. Does that mean we should have kept Booth, make Richardson the 1st line center and play Kassian 20+ minutes a game now?

Cherry pick any stretch and a player will look good.

If you were the owner who spent that much money on ex-employees already, would you buy out 1 year or 3?

That doesn't mean management hasn't approached the long-term core with the NTCs. From all accounts, they all refused with Garrison finally giving in.

Yes we all honestly watched Mathowny. This team was bad and needed drastic changes. Keeping what looks to be a role player, while there are better and younger alternatives, for $4.5 million for 3 more years is a BAD investment.
Try to focus on 1 year from now...

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Strangelove
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Re: Forwards - 2014/15

Post by Strangelove » Sat Jul 05, 2014 2:04 pm

mathonwy wrote:
Strangelove wrote:
mathonwy wrote: Actually.. IN did... lol

Carry on.
Actually he was laughing at you not with you. :hmmm:

And that was to do with an entirely different matter. :hmmm:
Strange.. stick with what you know.
UMMMM.... so you think IN was laughing with you here:
Island Nucklehead wrote:
mathonwy wrote: I'm not sure how much you watched this season's Stanley Cup playoffs but if you want to talk about whining, diving and embellishment, look no further than Drew Doughty, or Sidney Crosby, or NBA's LeBron James.
:lol: These players are all incredibly talented. Please don't tell me you're putting Burrows in that same category?
:hmmm:
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Canuck-One
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Re: Forwards - 2014/15

Post by Canuck-One » Sat Jul 05, 2014 2:14 pm

Please start the season and get irritating children into bed and off of the internet!

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Island Nucklehead
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Re: Forwards - 2014/15

Post by Island Nucklehead » Sat Jul 05, 2014 3:04 pm

mathonwy wrote: These are subjective observations of yours IN based on Burrows play 4 years ago.
Sure, just as your emotional attachment to his big goals is clouding your assessment of his abilities today.
Very few on this board has given Burr any credit for cleaning up his act and keep on wanting to crucify him for past sins (and you call yourselves Canuck fans :P). I just hope to jebus that Burr has a bounce back year and even then... I don't think folks like you will forgive him for his biteyness and hair pullyness.
When I played hockey, I hated having guys like Burrows on my team, because I'd be the guy having to defend them against other players and rationalize their behaviour to referees. It was embarrassing. So yeah, I didn't like how Burrows went about it, but you can't argue with success. Basically: He got a pass, because he was successful. Cleaning up his act or not, he has been less successful in recent seasons. THAT is my main motivating factor here. I can put up with his garbage when the team is winning and he's scoring.
Ill ask you the same question I asked Hank. Did you watch the late season games where Burr finally got healthy? Or did you tune out like the rest of Canuck nation?
The games I could, I watched. I saw a guy consistently snake-bit, trying really hard, and not having much luck. So yeah, he could bounce back, or all that can be a product of an aging, declining player. One step slower, a half-second too hesitant etc. etc. These things happen. I'm hoping he bounces back, but at his age it's very questionable. If he doesn't, he needs to go. That's it, that's all. I'll reiterate it has nothing to do with his hair pulling/biting/diving etc., and everything to do with his lack of production relative to his salary.

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Hockey Widow
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Re: Forwards - 2014/15

Post by Hockey Widow » Sat Jul 05, 2014 7:25 pm

If Burrows doesn't have a respectable bounce back year he may be un tradable until the tdl of 2016' at which point he will only have two years of term left. And at that point the return would be minimal but he may be more willing to waive for a chance at the cup.

If he has a good year he may be moveable next off season if that's the direction the team wants to go in. I am fine keeping him around this year and only advocate trading him now if we need the cap space OR if at camp he loses his spot to a player or players that we really want to keep on the big club. Otherwise he isn't preventing the team from getting better.
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Re: Forwards - 2014/15

Post by RoyalDude » Sat Jul 05, 2014 7:32 pm

Why do we need the cap space? We got enough of that.

Burrows is going to get the Hodgson treatment, and will have a great bounce back year and the 33 year old will get traded at the 2015 trade deadline to a contender as Benning stealthily continues with the rebuild
"I just want to say one word to you. Just one word. Are you listening? - Plastics." - The Graduate

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Re: Forwards - 2014/15

Post by Island Nucklehead » Sat Jul 05, 2014 7:39 pm

RoyalDude wrote:Why do we need the cap space? We got enough of that.

Burrows is going to get the Hodgson treatment, and will have a great bounce back year and the 33 year old will get traded at the 2015 trade deadline to a contender as Benning stealthily continues with the rebuild
A viable possibility, and likely the best one for the franchise moving forward.

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Re: Forwards - 2014/15

Post by RoyalDude » Sat Jul 05, 2014 7:57 pm

Island Nucklehead wrote:
RoyalDude wrote:Why do we need the cap space? We got enough of that.

Burrows is going to get the Hodgson treatment, and will have a great bounce back year and the 33 year old will get traded at the 2015 trade deadline to a contender as Benning stealthily continues with the rebuild
A viable possibility, and likely the best one for the franchise moving forward.
Thank you
"I just want to say one word to you. Just one word. Are you listening? - Plastics." - The Graduate

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Island Nucklehead
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Re: Forwards - 2014/15

Post by Island Nucklehead » Sat Jul 05, 2014 8:08 pm

RoyalDude wrote:
Island Nucklehead wrote:
RoyalDude wrote:Why do we need the cap space? We got enough of that.

Burrows is going to get the Hodgson treatment, and will have a great bounce back year and the 33 year old will get traded at the 2015 trade deadline to a contender as Benning stealthily continues with the rebuild
A viable possibility, and likely the best one for the franchise moving forward.
Thank you
You are welcome.

Do you drink less in the summer, Dude? Or has ridding yourself of the Mike Gillis cajun chicken voodoo broth had a significant impact on you psyche? Either way, your posts are much more enjoyable these days.

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Re: Forwards - 2014/15

Post by RoyalDude » Sat Jul 05, 2014 8:19 pm

My mission was completed the night the 18,000 fans at Rogers Arena chanted "Fire Mike Gillis". It was music to my ears. Gotta admit I've been out of sync a bit now with how fantastically the new regime is doing, Im just so conditioned to ragging on Gillis sometimes I feel I need to rag on somebody or something

I'm a happy Canuck camper right now
"I just want to say one word to you. Just one word. Are you listening? - Plastics." - The Graduate

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Re: Forwards - 2014/15

Post by Island Nucklehead » Sat Jul 05, 2014 8:40 pm

RoyalDude wrote: I'm a happy Canuck camper right now
Glad to hear that, bud.

Image

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Hockey Widow
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Re: Forwards - 2014/15

Post by Hockey Widow » Sat Jul 05, 2014 10:06 pm

RoyalDude wrote:Why do we need the cap space? We got enough of that.

Burrows is going to get the Hodgson treatment, and will have a great bounce back year and the 33 year old will get traded at the 2015 trade deadline to a contender as Benning stealthily continues with the rebuild

Well that is my point. I'd only trade him if we need the cap space and since we don't I don't what the rush is trade him.
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Re: Forwards - 2014/15

Post by ukcanuck » Sat Jul 05, 2014 10:11 pm

RoyalDude wrote:My mission was completed the night the 18,000 fans at Rogers Arena chanted "Fire Mike Gillis". It was music to my ears. Gotta admit I've been out of sync a bit now with how fantastically the new regime is doing, Im just so conditioned to ragging on Gillis sometimes I feel I need to rag on somebody or something

I'm a happy Canuck camper right now
If I knew the difference between happy RD and unhappy RD' I'd have screamed for Gillis head sooner...

Happy RD is way more fun to read :)

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Re: Forwards - 2014/15

Post by Southern_Canuck » Tue Jul 15, 2014 7:39 am

Lineup as it sits today:

Daniel - Henrik - Vrbata
Higgins - Bonino - Kassian
Burrows - Matthias - Hansen
Dorsett - Richardson - Sestito
(Vey)

Edler - Tanev
Hamhuis - Bieksa
Sbisa - Weber
(Stanton)

Miller
Lack

The players that might show they belong in the NHL with their performance at camp are probably LW Shinkaruk, RW Jensen, or C Gaunce, Horvat...

The five most likely veterans that would be on the move: Burrows, Higgins, Hansen, Matthias, or Richardson.

Higgins, Hansen and Matthias seem the most marketable - with Vey and Bonino, I wonder if Hansen is expendable.

S_C
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Re: Forwards - 2014/15

Post by ORCA » Tue Jul 15, 2014 9:06 am

I'd have asked for a do-over on letting Santorelli go. I dunno if it is just a bit of Kool-Aid talking from back in the early season last year... but I think the guy is a fire cracker and completely pumped to play in his hometown. This was a mistake I think.

I'd give Hansen until Christmas to rebound. He was on pace for 50-55 points in the Lockout half season, and looked ridiculous most of last season. (Like everyone else).

I'm optimistic for everyone to be better than last year, but if that rebound everyone is expecting just doesn't happen... a couple of slippery moves at the deadline for more youth would go a long way.
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