If it took Horvat + 6th to acquire 2014 1st pick, would ya?

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If trading Horvat + 6th pick was the only way to acquire the 2014 1st pick, would ya do it?

Poll ended at Fri Jun 27, 2014 9:43 am

YES! YES! YES!
9
18%
NO means NO.
37
76%
Other (Please explain in post)
3
6%
 
Total votes: 49

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herb
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Re: If it took Horvat + 6th to acquire 2014 1st pick, would

Post by herb »

Betamax wrote:You seriously think a prospect in Horvat is worth more to the Canucks than Tanev and a 2nd?
With zero reservations.

Horvat is our best forward prospect in a decade. Tanev is a nice fifth or sixth defenseman at this point, with the potential to move into the top four in a year or two. Guys like Tanev can be replaced in free agency. Prospects like Horvat cannot.

Second round picks are easily acquired by trading away guys like Hansen at the deadline, if need be.
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Re: If it took Horvat + 6th to acquire 2014 1st pick, would

Post by Betamax »

herb wrote:
Betamax wrote:You seriously think a prospect in Horvat is worth more to the Canucks than Tanev and a 2nd?
With zero reservations.

Horvat is our best forward prospect in a decade. Tanev is a nice fifth or sixth defenseman at this point, with the potential to move into the top four in a year or two. Guys like Tanev can be replaced in free agency. Prospects like Horvat cannot.

Second round picks are easily acquired by trading away guys like Hansen at the deadline, if need be.
Disagree. Cody is/was. Now the wonky back injury suffered while under supervision of the Canucks and the off-ice issues was a set back. But he was someone that had the pedigree and distinguished junior career that Horvat hasn't even come close to matching.

I personally like Shinkaruk over Horvat and if it came to either one + 6th overall for No.1 pick, I'd move Horvat. :mex:
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Re: If it took Horvat + 6th to acquire 2014 1st pick, would

Post by Rumsfeld »

Betamax wrote: via: https://twitter.com/VanCanucks/status/4 ... 7496694784
Vancouver Canucks Verified account ‏@VanCanucks

“We won’t be afraid to approach players and ask them to waive their no-trade.” - Benning

11:38 AM - 23 May 2014
Ummmmm, H-dubs is already well aware of this thanks to her sources, TSN and Daren Dreger. She also apparently has a mole high up in the Orca Bay S&E hiearchy.
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Re: If it took Horvat + 6th to acquire 2014 1st pick, would

Post by Chef Boi RD »

Island Nucklehead wrote:
If I were the Leaves, I would 100% not be trading a 25 year old, 30 goal player with a cap hit of $4.25M. His longest pointless streak this season was 5 games (take that Daniel Sedin). Imagine a JVR-Horvat-Kassian line in the future... Anyways, I can't answer for sure why the Leaves would want to trade the guy, maybe they've got a wicked-big hard-on for Ekblad? Maybe they're just retarded... it is the Leaves, after all. Regardless, I'd GLADLY take him on my team any day.
My respect for your 3rd eye hockey insight is waning.
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Re: If it took Horvat + 6th to acquire 2014 1st pick, would

Post by Island Nucklehead »

RoyalDude wrote:
Island Nucklehead wrote:
If I were the Leaves, I would 100% not be trading a 25 year old, 30 goal player with a cap hit of $4.25M. His longest pointless streak this season was 5 games (take that Daniel Sedin). Imagine a JVR-Horvat-Kassian line in the future... Anyways, I can't answer for sure why the Leaves would want to trade the guy, maybe they've got a wicked-big hard-on for Ekblad? Maybe they're just retarded... it is the Leaves, after all. Regardless, I'd GLADLY take him on my team any day.
My respect for your 3rd eye hockey insight is waning.
It's all good, bud. You lost me at David Booth is the next Patrick Sharp.
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Re: If it took Horvat + 6th to acquire 2014 1st pick, would

Post by ODB »

Betamax wrote:
Horvat also has the potential to be the next Bolland (which would be just OK) or Denis Pederson or worse.

IMO, Tanev is Duncan Keith in terms of hockey IQ and defensive awareness but without the offensive acumen.

Now, if Michael D. Gillis and the former regime did a Hell of lot better "sell" job to Justin Schultz a couple of years back, they could have gotten a "Duncan Keith split into two players" with Tanev and Schultz. IMO, beside how they completely mismanaged the Goalie Situation, the failure to land Schultz, I would rate as a bigger fail than the trades for either Booth or Ballard. :mex:
Holy fuck-a-doo! Useless troll you are! How long until you get banned and the adults get to talk? :mex:
BTW, NOT A FLAME ... JUST AN OBSERVATION ... :P
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Re: If it took Horvat + 6th to acquire 2014 1st pick, would

Post by Betamax »

herb wrote:
Betamax wrote:You seriously think a prospect in Horvat is worth more to the Canucks than Tanev and a 2nd?
With zero reservations.

Guys like Tanev can be replaced in free agency. Prospects like Horvat cannot.

Second round picks are easily acquired by trading away guys like Hansen at the deadline, if need be.
On this point:

Well, Tanev was one of the few gems their pro scouting department managed to unearth and I think it had a lot to do with Gagner who knew him as a kid. It's not like that's going to happen on a regular basis.

I mean for every Tanev, how many college UFAs have they signed that you feel are going to have a decent/good/excellent NHL career? I can't really think of any other in their system I think will be impact players or even NHL caliber players.

The key word you mentioned is "prospect" when describing Horvat. I might be in the minority here, but I don't see him as a "slam dunk" can't miss 2C. He might end up being a 3C like a Bolland, which would be OK ... or worse. Tanev have proven himself at the NHL level ... I'd take a "sure" thing with plenty of room for growth, given his age, over that potential we might or might not see realized with Bo. :mex:
Last edited by Betamax on Thu Jun 19, 2014 5:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: If it took Horvat + 6th to acquire 2014 1st pick, would

Post by Betamax »

ODB wrote:
Betamax wrote:
Horvat also has the potential to be the next Bolland (which would be just OK) or Denis Pederson or worse.

IMO, Tanev is Duncan Keith in terms of hockey IQ and defensive awareness but without the offensive acumen.

Now, if Michael D. Gillis and the former regime did a Hell of lot better "sell" job to Justin Schultz a couple of years back, they could have gotten a "Duncan Keith split into two players" with Tanev and Schultz. IMO, beside how they completely mismanaged the Goalie Situation, the failure to land Schultz, I would rate as a bigger fail than the trades for either Booth or Ballard. :mex:
Holy fuck-a-doo! Useless troll you are! How long until you get banned and the adults get to talk? :mex:
Let me guess, you also believe like Herb that "Horvat is our best forward prospect in a decade."

If that's the case, that's some pretty sad commentary on Canucks drafting. As I said previously, there's no doubt it was Cody prior to him entering the NHL. :mex:
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Re: If it took Horvat + 6th to acquire 2014 1st pick, would

Post by Art Vandelay »

Betamax wrote:
herb wrote:
Betamax wrote:You seriously think a prospect in Horvat is worth more to the Canucks than Tanev and a 2nd?
With zero reservations.

Horvat is our best forward prospect in a decade. Tanev is a nice fifth or sixth defenseman at this point, with the potential to move into the top four in a year or two. Guys like Tanev can be replaced in free agency. Prospects like Horvat cannot.

Second round picks are easily acquired by trading away guys like Hansen at the deadline, if need be.
Disagree. Cody is/was. Now the wonky back injury suffered while under supervision of the Canucks and the off-ice issues was a set back. But he was someone that had the pedigree and distinguished junior career that Horvat hasn't even come close to matching.

I personally like Shinkaruk over Horvat and if it came to either one + 6th overall for No.1 pick, I'd move Horvat. :mex:
So you obviously have no time to watch the games due to all the puppet shows, so I will forgive you for saying that Hodgson has some higher pedigree. Hodgson is too slow and too weak defensively. He has always been these things but then again some fans just look at stats and have such little knowledge about the game that they can only point to stats.
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Re: If it took Horvat + 6th to acquire 2014 1st pick, would

Post by Betamax »

Art Vandelay wrote:
Betamax wrote:
herb wrote:
Betamax wrote:You seriously think a prospect in Horvat is worth more to the Canucks than Tanev and a 2nd?
With zero reservations.

Horvat is our best forward prospect in a decade. Tanev is a nice fifth or sixth defenseman at this point, with the potential to move into the top four in a year or two. Guys like Tanev can be replaced in free agency. Prospects like Horvat cannot.

Second round picks are easily acquired by trading away guys like Hansen at the deadline, if need be.
Disagree. Cody is/was. Now the wonky back injury suffered while under supervision of the Canucks and the off-ice issues was a set back. But he was someone that had the pedigree and distinguished junior career that Horvat hasn't even come close to matching.

I personally like Shinkaruk over Horvat and if it came to either one + 6th overall for No.1 pick, I'd move Horvat. :mex:
So you obviously have no time to watch the games due to all the puppet shows, so I will forgive you for saying that Hodgson has some higher pedigree. Hodgson is too slow and too weak defensively. He has always been these things but then again some fans just look at stats and have such little knowledge about the game that they can only point to stats.
I'll bold the parts which I feel are significant achievements:

duh, Bo Horvat:

via: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bo_Horvat
Awards and honours
Honours Year
Ivan Hlinka Memorial Tournament Gold Medal 2012 [32]
Wayne Gretzky 99 Award - OHL Playoffs MVP 2013 [20]
Memorial Cup Most Sportsmanlike Player 2013 [21]
duh, and he's a nice guy on he ice. Swell!

versus Cody Hodgson:
Awards
Award Year(s)
Major junior
OHL Player of the Week November 2–7, 2008[36]
January 25–February 1, 2009.[37]
ADT Canada-Russia Challenge Player of the Game Game 3, 2008[34]
OHL Player of the Month November 2008, March 2009[35][45]
OHL All-Star Classic Player of the Game 2009[38]
William Hanley Trophy (OHL's Most Sportsmanlike) 2009
Red Tilson Trophy (OHL's Most Outstanding Player) 2009
OHL First All-Star Team 2009
CHL Player of the Year 2009
NHL
Rookie of the Month January 2012
All-Star Game (rookie) 2012
International
World Junior Championships All-Star Team 2009[117]
Other
Brampton Sports Hall of Fame May 27, 2009[120]
So Cody was also a nice guy on the ice but the hype that Cody had as a prospect was much higher than what it is for Bo as was his forecasted upside at the time.

He was named the best player in Junior hockey in 2009 and was actually an impact player on the WJHC on Team Canada's Gold Medal Winning team, which you couldn't say the same with Bo. :mex:
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Re: If it took Horvat + 6th to acquire 2014 1st pick, would

Post by ClamRussel »

Betamax wrote:So Cody was also a nice guy on the ice but the hype that Cody had as a prospect was much higher than what it is for Bo as was his forecasted upside at the time.

He was named the best player in Junior hockey in 2009 and was actually an impact player on the WJHC on Team Canada's Gold Medal Winning team, which you couldn't say the same with Bo. :mex:
Did Bo fuck your gf or something?
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Re: If it took Horvat + 6th to acquire 2014 1st pick, would

Post by Chef Boi RD »

Benning says he has no problem asking a player to waive his NTC. I wonder if they are still trying to convince Edler to waive or their are others he is trying to get to waive. Am I right, does the prototypical - Tweener Chris Higgins, the nicest guy in the world, have a NTC? Fuck Gillis, were you ever magical.
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Re: If it took Horvat + 6th to acquire 2014 1st pick, would

Post by The Brown Knight »

Few thoughts:

1) I would absolutely do Tanev and our 6th for Reinhart if it meant keeping onto Horvat.

2) Royaldude - you're out to lunch if you think Tanev is worth more than both Gardiner and JVR! He's certainly worth more than Gardiner, but I think JVR would be considered a better hockey player at this point.

3) I hope Blysma ends up being our coach. Also - I am absolutely NOT a fan of bringing back Crawford.
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Re: If it took Horvat + 6th to acquire 2014 1st pick, would

Post by the Dogsalmon »

RoyalDude wrote:Benning says he has no problem asking a player to waive his NTC. I wonder if they are still trying to convince Edler to waive or their are others he is trying to get to waive. Am I right, does the prototypical - Tweener Chris Higgins, the nicest guy in the world, have a NTC? Fuck Gillis, were you ever magical.



Twenty years from now we will still be calling players agent mike gillis the WORST gm/players agent in Canuck history!

I would do Tanex and the 6th pick for Reinhart in a second. He is a franchise centreman.
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Re: If it took Horvat + 6th to acquire 2014 1st pick, would

Post by Betamax »

ClamRussel wrote:
Betamax wrote:So Cody was also a nice guy on the ice but the hype that Cody had as a prospect was much higher than what it is for Bo as was his forecasted upside at the time.

He was named the best player in Junior hockey in 2009 and was actually an impact player on the WJHC on Team Canada's Gold Medal Winning team, which you couldn't say the same with Bo. :mex:
Did Bo fuck your gf or something?
duh, I think you've missed the point. In terms of assets I least want to be traded in this order:

On the roster:

1 and 1a) Tanev and Kassian (due to age and growth potential the fact that they've have soon they could play at the NHL level)

I would be open to trading pretty much every one else that was on last year's roster, including those with NTC with the exceptions of the Sedins and Bieksa since they have verbalized they would not waive it under any circumstances and the fact that you need to have some good quality veterans on the team that can still play at a high level to give the younger players direction, so you don't get into the situation the Oilers have right now.

Prospects:

1) Shinkaruk
2) Horvat

The fact of the matter is I'd rather do a lower level prospect like Gaunce + 6th overall for 1st overall instead of Bo of course, but if you call Tallon with that offer he would verbalize a LOL and quickly hang up the phone. Anyway, they appear to be looking for a defensemen that can play right now, so if the Canucks can move one of their veterans with NTC i.e. Garrison, add a Jensen/Gaunce or the 10th pick (if they trade with the Ducks) and the 6th overall, I'd rather do that than trade Bo + 6th overall. :mex:
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